BlackTopKing

iTrader: (1)

Hey guys, I've had great luck over the years so I figure I just for some ideal/advice and information.

Have 87 TA GTA TPI w/ T 56
I'll start with, I would like to keep the TPI but this one seems so moody and I'm sure there is more then one issues at work

I did search but I've only found one or the other issue (followed both with no difference) but both on one car.
And I'm sorry for the loaded posted, just a 101ADD thoughts on this.

First, when it starts and running, it runs.
Just getting to do this when I want to...is different.
Over the last year I've really only moved in and out of garage as u worked in the body til this past month. When I started on a tune up.

Plugs
Wires 10mm
Diaz looked good and ordered a coil (waiting to to Holiday)

After these items it sound great, but plugs confirmed the way over top rich fuel mix.

At this point it'll run at 850-1000rpm fine.
But I ideal should be at 650rpm
Once its running, it seems fine although still seems too high on gas.

What I know of fuel system
340 stealth pump (haven't actually pulled to confirm)
Filter is new
22lb injectors
After market chip installed with 9th injector delete ( I did swap stock chip to see if any difference was there, none)
FPR has no fuel in vacuum and don't think its the issue ( wouldn't it be an issue all the time, not just at >800rpm)

So question is....could the pump (30% more as noted) be too much fuel?
Would FPR still control the extra 30% if so? FPR looks to be a OEM replacement.

I don't think chip is doing it cause stock chip with 9th is the same.

Next thought is MAF? Although uninstalled, still the same!?

So it is def rich, too much gas for a reason? Could injectors do it? Leaking? My #3 plug was the worst of all.

Can you test for a leak with out removing ( already know its no)

Last question for the moment is....what if I just jumped the ideal up (screw)... it'll ideal high but any reason I should run ideal at 850 vers 650 other then manual trans.?

vetteoz

iTrader: (13)

Pulled the codes to see if anything showing?

For example ;
something like a faulty CTS giving the wrong engine temp indication to the ECM will cause it to run rich

BlackTopKing

iTrader: (1)

Yeah, I do have that code (#15) ordered replacement should be here with coil, but would that also effect the not starting with out an inhaler ? ( starting fluid)

Might add that's a recent issue

vetteoz

iTrader: (13)

Didn't mention that fact;
just that So it is def rich, too much gas for a reason?

As noted if the engine temp indicated is low ,the ECM will richen up the mixture because it thinks the engine is cold
Would also pay to check the CTS wiring , a DTC 15 is a problem SOMEWHERE in the circuit , not just that the sensor itself is ( may be ) faulty

http://www.chevythunder.com/cts_diagnostic_pg2.htm

alex91z28

have you check your tps voltage?

BlackTopKing

iTrader: (1)

I haven't checked that yet,but good point...could be off. I did do minimum air and adjust tips last year when I first got it and all seemed fine since.

Just got the CTS in today and fuel pressure test gauge so I'll spend some time looking at that. I want to check that ICM too....was thinking since it cranked slow...maybe its not actually picking up, it started? Any advice on that.

BlackTopKing

iTrader: (1)

Well looks like I am back to the war, sort a speak.
I have this week pretty much set to the side to primarily work on getting GTA drivable.
This is where yesterday got me.
Update:
Flue pressure good, injector test good, tps test good. So I'm leaning towards spark.
I put in new plugs (coil new) and set base timing. Originally timing was upside down, meaning mark on balancer was facing floor. Re stabbed dizzy and set base @ 8* ( I did this because no matter how many times I rotated the motor, it blows compression on 4BTDC, not 0).

I also now finally replace knock sensor pigtail, as before the car would not advance timing or retarde timing threw rpm range.

On intial fire up: I slightly rotated dizzy until TPI started, this was a fine retarded direction. And seemed to be very much that one spot. Anymore advance=nope or anymore retarded=nope.

Once it fired, I advanced almost the same slightness, I was happy at the time. It was smooth and sounded great compared to the recent running condition.

Plug esc back in and it took 2or3 cranks to fire. Once it did it idle well. Let car run for a while until I was gonna pull out of garage, of course it stalls when I do. I started it again and simply drove in and out of garage about 12times.

So far so good....shut down and came back to it a few hours later. Same thing 2short and 1long crank and it started, slightly stubbled, but started and idled. I noticed from valves cover little smoke...so I reved a few times to make sure it was coming from gasket and not just oil on headers (did valve covers a week a go).

I also noticed headers where extremely hot time it was running....now I'm thinking, too retarted.
This is begining to be retarted.

So today I am going to try to do this with a fresh mind and afterwards I thought, if the balncer sliped at all and 4btdc =tdc for me, then in order to get 6*btdc, I need to bump up to 10*btdc.

Any additional advice is appreciated although I will post back later after trying that.
Question though, if valve cover gasket isn't seated fully wouldnt that create a vacuum leak for crank case? Could that effect running?

Thanks

BlackTopKing

iTrader: (1)

Ok, re did timing for the 100th time, trying 10* with in the therory that 4btdc* is zero.
Started with est off no issue. With est hooked up it takes 2 trys atleast.
Now feel like its starting lean, so adjust iac. (With ecu jumped, iac chatters-guess its opening)
Tps, problem one...top hex bolt broke at head....that'll be fun to get stem out, maybe double nut to pull?
Problem two is the tps will turn down to about .560 before metershows it going to 5xx.x or higher....so with it left at .560, starting, 2x minimum and watching tps voltage, wide open is like 25.0

I thought it would only go to 4.0v ?

Anyway I am going to try to pull that stem and get new bolt. Because I don't want it viberating into different positions.

BlackTopKing

iTrader: (1)

Nevermind, It wason millia volts it looks like(great multimeters have autocorrect, wth) now on volts it 2orks much better....
Set to .545 and it will go up in 4v.

Fired over on one long crank (shorter then it has) and so far hasn't stalled when gas has been applied.

Gas in tank is old....? Wondering how much crap that'll play?

Bob88GTA

iTrader: (2)

BlackTop....you been working this since Dec 13?? What is your fuel pressure KOEO? Have you checked you FPR for leak/gas? And did you do a leak down test on the injectors again? Dead spots on TPS? You say IAC Chatter....did you pull it and clean it?

Just throwing things out there

BlackTopKing

iTrader: (1)

Dec 13...lol yes and no.
I've been bouncing around car and up until two three weeks ago...just didn't want to create a thread when all the info is in here. In Dec I still had 1/2 car in pieces and now that its fully back together. I'm focusing in getting it drivable.

This week its my goal atleast hoping so.
To answe the questions.
No leak down test or compression test has been done.
As for injectors, they tested ok, fuel pressur ok, pump new (2yrs) filter new (1yr). Don't think its a fuel issue.

Really leaning to spark, dizzy was pulled and went to test- mechanism is good and store says icm is good. Rotor and cap ok.....maybe the pick up isn't (kinda a grey area with store techs) plugs were black, from running rich so they were replaced yesterday. Wires are new (2yrs) and seem ok.

Going to assume the ecu and chip are ok until I'm sure everything else is....

As for starting, I am kinda going back to the dizzy and pick up, maybe store boys are wrong....
Cause Im not getting anything else low. Battiery and starter test ok alt test ok...

Idk.

I guess we will see when I get home in a few...see what it does.

BlackTopKing

iTrader: (1)

Oh....iac chatters when aldl is jumped...didn't know if that is normal
Fpr, is new...pulled line and no gas?! No smell?!

Bob88GTA

iTrader: (2)

The reason I comment on the IAC Chatter, when I set my min Idle routine, I heard my IAC buzz or extend and then quiet. Not sure if it should be chattering. The pintle could be sloppy and vibrating against the seat. IDK....

BlackTopKing

iTrader: (1)

Well by the days end...I'm a solid 50 $ poorer and really no further then I was except one it starts, idle now sounds really good...
Still haven't been able to get that upper stem out of the TB.
And wouldn't you know, freak valve cover still smoking...same spot so now Im trying to figure if its the old oil on exhaust gaskets, blowing upwards or if it is valve...almost no way...I rtv the crap outta it....

Anyway I washed it all down and figure we see in the am. definitely fusterated at this point...this long crank or cranks to start has to be the pick up, everything else is new.