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Transmissions and Drivetrain Need help with your trans? Problems with your axle?

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Old 07-14-2003, 03:13 AM   #1
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swiching to a t56 -- can't find answers

im going to buy a 97 trans am parts car with the manual 6 speed.
im going to put the seats, console, t56 transmission and the posi rear end with 3.73 gears into my 1989 formula firebird i have a stroker 383 running around 520 horses and i keep blowing automatic transmissions. so i figure if im nice to the car it will last and my tires will spin on the street alot sooner then i can get enough torque to the ground to brake a t56. my question is do i need a special flywheel becuase i have a 383 or can i use the one off the lt1 and can i use the clutch and brake pedal assembly from the 97 or do i have to find one from a 3rd gen manual? my crank is a eagle stroker crank with a 1 piece rear main seal and it have 350 sizeds mains on the crank what flywheel should i use?


also ive been told i have to cut a hole for the clutch to go through the firewall. and i read that there might even be a dimple in the firewall to mark how to cut it and there is a cut in the insulation under the carpet in some cars. but my car has always been a automatic and when i looked for the hole in the insulation the only one i can find is the 2 inche or so hole in the firewall that i have 8 gage amp wire and my braided nitrous line. i remember when i got the car it had a rubber cork type thing covering it. it exits in the engine bay behind and bellow the brake booster. is it possible it came with a pre-cut hole or has anyone heard of this before?

need help soon im going to get the car and stop tomorrow


also is there anything else i can use from the parts car that is a close to direct bolt in other then the dash

can someone make a list of parts that im going to need to make this conversion from an automatic to manual t-56 my drive shaft came from a 700r4 (9inch tailshaft on a th-350 is the same lenth as a 700r4 driveshaft) can i use the bellhouseing and tranny and driveshaft and torque arm and rearend in my car or should i use my 700r4 driveshaft and torque arm?

Last edited by formula89383; 07-14-2003 at 03:21 AM.
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Old 07-14-2003, 04:49 AM   #2
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The 4th gen flywheel should work fine, though you may need to speak with your engine builder on the balance of it, since normally our motors are internal balance on the front, and external balance on the rear, but the wheel will bolt up, that hole you found was probably the one for the cruise control wiring, the master sits a bit to the left of it, you can bolt in the manual pedals and tell where to drill the U bolt holes for the master, and just cut the actual main hole right in the middle, the 700R4, T5, and T56 driveshafts are all the same, you're going to need an aftermarket T56 crossmember of course, and you'll be using the 4th gen T56 bellhousing, along with clutch assembly.
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Old 07-14-2003, 10:07 PM   #3
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Quote:
since normally our motors are internal balance on the front, and external balance on the rear
Umm... I think what was meant by this statement is 400 motors are externally balanced motors that require a specific harmonic balanacer and flywheel and a 350 is an internally balanced motor.

You need to know if your crank is setup as an internally balanced motor or externally balanced...Its pretty easy to tell if its externally balanced due to the really huge harmonic balancer that is required. There is also usally a flat spot machined out of one of the sides.

My guess is that being that its a one piece seal crank is that its an internally balanced setup and if thats the case then all the 97 'maro parts bolt in. Use an aftermarket x member like stated before and your all set... Good Luck that 6 is what was missing in these cars from the factory.
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Old 07-15-2003, 09:36 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally posted by Chris B
Umm... I think what was meant by this statement is 400 motors are externally balanced motors that require a specific harmonic balanacer and flywheel and a 350 is an internally balanced motor.

You need to know if your crank is setup as an internally balanced motor or externally balanced...Its pretty easy to tell if its externally balanced due to the really huge harmonic balancer that is required. There is also usally a flat spot machined out of one of the sides.

My guess is that being that its a one piece seal crank is that its an internally balanced setup and if thats the case then all the 97 'maro parts bolt in. Use an aftermarket x member like stated before and your all set... Good Luck that 6 is what was missing in these cars from the factory.



The rear does not have a counterweight like the typical internal balance 350's etc, the flywheel has the balance weight, thus the "external " balance, but the front is normal neutral balanced.
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Old 07-15-2003, 09:58 PM   #5
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the 400 SBC is externally balenced. it has a weighed harmonic balancer and a weighed flywheel/flexplate.

early model (2pc rear main) SBC have internally balenced. it has a nutural harmonic balancer and a nutural flywheel/flexplate.

late model (1pc rear main) SBC have are mostly internally balenced. however im not sure if its in the harmonic balancer, flywheel, or both.

some stroker conversion cranks require 400sbc stuff

some are nuteral balenced...




i would check with whoever made/sold the crank and see what they say.
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Old 07-16-2003, 01:56 PM   #6
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do keep in mind a 383 uses a 3.75" stroke, same crank as a 400, whether has anything to do with the balence, i have no idea.

but its just a thought
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Old 07-16-2003, 07:04 PM   #7
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Here's the deal with 1-piece RMS engines:

Early model (2-piece rear main) engines have a rear crank flange (where the flywheel bolts on) that is oblong. It's sort of extended on one side to balance the back crank throw. When they went to the 1-piece main, the rear flange had to be round so the seal could slide onto it, so the "weight extension" had to be removed, and a weight added to the back of the flywheel in order to keep the crank in balance. 1-piece RMS engines are still considered internally balanced (there's a technical and long-winded reason for this,) but they have a weight on the back of the flywheel.

MrDude is right about the 383 crank. It could be internal or external balance depending on the manufacturer. Chris B is correct about the balancer....if it's large and has a chunk missing out of one side then you have an externally balanced crank and need an externally balanced flywheel. If this is the case you'll also have to get your new flywheel "match balanced" to your old one or risk destroying your main bearings.

Hopefully it's an internally-balanced crank, in which case the LT1 flywheel works fine.
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Old 07-17-2003, 03:50 PM   #8
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He already said its a 1 piece seal crank, the counterweight isnt there, he will be fine.
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Old 07-17-2003, 07:26 PM   #9
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You are correct....I guess I skimmed over a few lines.
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Old 07-18-2003, 11:57 AM   #10
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The six-speed rocks!! It's a pain to do the master cylinder. You'll need a SPD or a spohn conversion x-member and mount. The 4th gen pedals should work, but I used 3rd gen pedals.

Here, just read this:

click here
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Old 07-18-2003, 01:18 PM   #11
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Here is another helpful article:
http://sethirdgen.org/t56.htm

Also, I didn't see anyone else mention it, so I will. I think you MUST use the flywheel that it came with. The 4th gen T56 uses a special flywheel and clutch, which also means it uses a special clutch hydraulics setup. The clutch is a pull-type, and the flywheel, so I've heard, is thicker. I've never messed with a regular flywheel, but the flywheel that came with my T56 (from a 97 Camaro) didn't look like the pics of flywheels I've seen. It's got a raised friction area, rather than being flat across from gear teeth to center. If I'm wrong, someone slap me and I'll shut up
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Old 07-18-2003, 01:18 PM
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2pc, 400, 57l, balanced, externally, front, internally, lq9, lt1, rear, sbc, t56, vortec
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