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LTX and LSXPutting LT1s, LS1s, and their variants into Third Gens is becoming more popular. This board is for those who are doing and have done the swaps so they can discuss all of their technical aspects including repairs, swap info, and performance upgrades.
There's still a lot left to do to make it a driver. Next on the list is to order up permanent battery cables. I found a place that will make cables to your specs with a quick turn around time.
This is really nice because I can have them make the crimps at battery terminal with as many cables and of any size I want. I just can't do that kind of thing at home. They will finish off the ring terminal ends to my specs, or I can have them ship the terminals loose and I finish the crimps after final trimming to fit my car. I'm going to take some cable length measurements and make the order in the next few days.
I also notice my tachometer won't budge off zero. I don't know what the problem is there. I guess I will use an O-scope to verify the Holley ECM is sending a signal. If so, then the next move in my list of trial-and-error is to add a pull-up resistor to the tach signal input wire. I don't really have a plan beyond that so suggestions are welcome.
You always wonder what it is going to sound like and so far I'm happy with the exhaust note. Even that short sound clip gives indication that it is going to scream and howl without any "brap". I hate a brappy exhaust and so many cars end up that way. I've had one car in the past that had a high pitch howl and it was awesome. Hoping that I got that elusive sound again.
The saga continues. Engine has a massive oil leak in the rear. I can't deal with this because I have no way to get that engine back out because it has to come out the bottom. Everything comes to a halt now.
Gonna have to find somebody to finish this for me. I'm done.
The saga continues. Engine has a massive oil leak in the rear. I can't deal with this because I have no way to get that engine back out because it has to come out the bottom. Everything comes to a halt now.
Gonna have to find somebody to finish this for me. I'm done.
Congrats on getting her running!
Sorry to hear about the oil leak. I ran into this too when I built and installed my LS1, so I understand the deflation. In my case, it was simply the addition of more silicone in the corners where the oil pan meets the back engine plate. There are only a few locations it is likely coming from, which most likely can be repaired without pulling the engine, but the tranny may have to be removed.
Have you determined where the oil leak is coming from? We're not going to let you have this sit around for ten years after all the excellent work you have done!!!
I felt around the oil sender and it is oily. I'm not sure that is my primary leak though because there is not an ounce of oil on the outside of the oil pan or bell housing. I've got a $1200 clutch that can't get contaminated so that has got me worried, you know.
I've been sitting here contemplating this over a bowl of chocolate ice cream. All the ice cream is gone now and that means it is time to make a decision.
I decided I'm tired of laying on my back under a car in a 19x19 garage. I'm not doing this any more. Somebody else with the right equipment can have this done in 2 days or less. I'm going to finish up some things that only I know what to do, and then the car is taking a trip somewhere to be completed.
I had that exact same leak when I rebuilt my motor.
At first I thought it was the rear seal. I replaced that, same leak.
Then I pulled the rear cover and lowered the pan to put some RTV in the corners. Still had the same leak
So then I laid under the car, with the trans out and had a friend start it. Once I saw a drip I had him shut it off, pulled the flywheel and found the actual leak.
The oil was coming out from around the bolts that hold the cover on. So we put a little RTV on the threads and put it back together. Now I only have a slight leak at the front of the oil pain/front cover..... which wasn't there until I finished fixing the leak at the back of the motor.
I was in the same place you are. Tired of laying on my back under the car. I'm not a strong guy and I messed up my shoulder putting that T56 in 3 times by myself. I now have a decent trans jack...... I'd rather have a lift though.
So if you farm it out, you have the advantage of not laying on your back. You have the disadvantage of them testing the car for you..... I am too controlling for that though.
I feel your pain man... I really do. Thankfully, I've not had any leaks with this 2nd block, but I was extra careful to make sure everything was done right the second time.
Even with the trans jack helping, I still ended up bench pressing that damn thing 8-10 times off the jack to get it in. Literally had to take it off the jack and get under it to get it to seat, so I can sympathize with not wanting to do it.
Here's to hoping it's an easy fix, and they do it right so you won't have to worry about it any more!
Trying to get the car ready to go to the shop. It took a couple weeks to show up but I have been battling brake line leaks with the Ni-Cop 3/16" line at joints with SAE double flare. ISO bubble flare seems to be holding fine. I junked the Ni-Cop line at leak points and went to steel that is easier to work with. Redid lines between master cylinder and roll stop & proportioning valve. Also redid the drop leg from roll stop to the front line tee. Not as pretty as before but it will probably solve the problem. Also installed a new master cylinder just for the heck of it because it is cheap insurance and I don't want to open up the brake system again.
I have spent a lot of time trying to figure out main power distribution in a clean and neat way. I am hoping this waterproof Littlefuse MTR fuse holder will work out okay. It has an M6 stud for the main power connection, and then there are 4 wire connections where you can install circuit protection. Two of the fuses are JCASE style, and the other 2 fuses are ATO style. This little puppy is the power distribution block for my entire car.
After gutting and sorting through a lot of the original wiring in the car I was kind of surprised to find out that all the chassis electrical is powered by these two 12 AWG wires. Fusible Link 'A' runs most the lighting and such, and Link 'B' runs the dash, HVAC fans, and other things. I cut off the links and tied the wires directly into my new power distribution.
I am using one of the JCASE fuses (boxy looking fuse) for the underhood fuse/relay center that I installed (10 AWG wire for all engine functions, radiator fans, and fuel pump). Fusible Links 'A' and 'B' are on the ATO fuses. And the other JCASE is currently open right now. I will probably end up connecting the Holley HP power wire to that slot. I am not sure if the ATO fuse will hold up on Links 'A' and 'B' without nuisance trips. If not, then I will connect those wires using ring terminal to the stud and install in-line Maxi fuses on each wire. And I'm not sure why my hand looks so small in this photo!
Here is a parts list for those people that are interested.
* MTR fuse block (p/n BPDMA104HXF1)
* Metri Pack 280 series, 10-12 AWG female wire terminals (p/n 12077413). These are for the ATO fuses. You will also need appropriate size wire seals.
* Delphi Ducon 6.3, 10-12 AWG male wire terminals (p/n 15344631). Used with the JCASE fuses.
* Wire seals for use with Ducon connectors (p/n 12052668)
Went to check on my car today and it was on the lift and progress being made. Real happy about that!
The real surprise though is my impression when I saw the car out of my garage for the first time..... it is dated, man! Those wheels are a time warp to the '90s. And being a base model Firebird it looked so unimpressively stock, especially since the rear exhaust pipe is hidden away. Other than being shiny, I don't think this car would even get a 2nd look driving around town. I'm trying to figure out whether that is good or bad.
The time has passed where these cars are always recognized. I drive mine around all (no salt on roads) season long, and I'm sure the vast majority have no idea. The crew that was in high school in the 80s…..they know!
Your's should be a great car. Enjoy it. Post pics of it in your driveway ;-)
Visited the shop to check on progress. Car is back together and running! Dyno tuning will begin next week.
They did a great job on the torque arm. Got it welded to the round-tube subframe connectors and added gussets for more support. They also painted the subframes flat black so it all blends into the shadows under the car. That was a nice touch!
So it turns out the engine itself didn't have an oil leak. I just forgot to tighten the oil sender. Oops. Well, if that's the worst mistake I made then we should be in good shape!
The real surprise though is my impression when I saw the car out of my garage for the first time..... it is dated, man! Those wheels are a time warp to the '90s. And being a base model Firebird it looked so unimpressively stock, especially since the rear exhaust pipe is hidden away. Other than being shiny, I don't think this car would even get a 2nd look driving around town.
Originally Posted by RamIt
Who was president last time you drove your car?
Originally Posted by Flip 2
The time has passed where these cars are always recognized. I drive mine around all (no salt on roads) season long, and I'm sure the vast majority have no idea.
Visited the shop to check on progress. Car is back together and running! Dyno tuning will begin next week.
They did a great job on the torque arm. Got it welded to the round-tube subframe connectors and added gussets for more support. They also painted the subframes flat black so it all blends into the shadows under the car. That was a nice touch!
So it turns out the engine itself didn't have an oil leak. I just forgot to tighten the oil sender. Oops. Well, if that's the worst mistake I made then we should be in good shape!
Very good to read! I've been hit with that pesky oil sender (not on my car thankfully.. one I was trying to diagnose). I actually need to replace mine as I think my high pressure pump blew it... that, or it blew the gauge lol.
Car is being tuned right now. Still working on idle so no dyno time yet, but the car did drive around the parking lot today! I got to hear it and all I can say is there isn't an ounce of sleeper left in the car. It is a lovely kind of nasty.
After gutting and sorting through a lot of the original wiring in the car I was kind of surprised to find out that all the chassis electrical is powered by these two 12 AWG wires. Fusible Link 'A' runs most the lighting and such, and Link 'B' runs the dash, HVAC fans, and other things. I cut off the links and tied the wires directly into my new power distribution.
I'm doing the same thing seeing as the top end is off the engine and there's plenty of room for access.
I don't care much for the fusible links either.
Did you connect directly to the large starter lug?
If you did, where have you mounted your new distribution block?
My battery and alternator is on driver side so all the power distribution is right in that area. I mounted the power distribution to the fender (next to window washer tank).
All the cable runs are really short except the starter B+ which had to cross over to the starter. Starter ground is on the driver side cylinder head next to the coolant temp sensor. The chassis ground is on the underside of the vehicle frame, I think it was one of the old bolt holes for the crossmember brace.
Store bought battery cables are smaller cable size than I wanted so I had cables custom made by CE Electric. It was very expensive so most people probably won't go that route.
Thanks for that.
In my case, the alternator is on the passenger side but that doesn't matter to me. I'll eliminate the links and put the distribution block on the fender near the battery (passenger side). I'll have to splice into the existing harness to access the bulkhead connector on the firewall with the original wiring.
Fortunately for me, I can build my own cables. Any size. Any length. The cost involved is the cost of the cable and the terminals. I figure an 8 awg from the battery to the block you posted would satisfy my needs. Might bump it up to a #6. I've already upgraded the charging conductor from the alternator to the battery to a 6 awg. Why the factory used something like a 10 awg is beyond me. That's the 80's I guess.
Thanks again.
I can build and crimp up to 2/0 cable but what I can't do is crimp a side-post battery terminal so I had that done for me. This would have been a lot easier if I had used post batteries.
That is true. The top posts cables are difficult to make. When I was in a different part of the trade, having cables made was routine (and at cost for me and my hobby). That's long gone now.
Thanks for the posts. I'm going to follow up with your p\n list. That's very handy.
I'm going to follow up with your p\n list. That's very handy.
It seems like I'm sharing, but really this thread is documentation to myself of what the heck I did!
That reminds me, it is probably time that I print all my documentation to create a "Service Manual" for the car to keep in the garage. That sounds like a good job for today.
... print all my documentation to create a "Service Manual" for the car to keep in the garage.
I've been doing that off and on over the years I've been assembling my heap. Made a list P/N's for all of the aftermarket stuff and upgraded bits. It covers a couple of pages. The latest project has been updated wiring diagrams. The new gauge cluster, electric fuel pump, fan controllers used up miles of wire and terminals with more to come. I do this stuff everyday (wiring) and I constantly have to re-visit the installation to verify what I've done. A map is very handy.
If I ever sold this car, it'll come with it's own "Service Manual" too.
Hawks LS swap trans mount, and the Hawks Sinister (UMI) mid-length torque arm. I have very little ground clearance because of the torque arm. I will explain more after I get the car back from the shop.
Actually, I have a pile of parts sitting here that you guys don't know about yet. There will be more to come after the car is back in my hands.
Checked in on my car at the shop. Been in the que for a little bit waiting for some other cars to finish up but my turn has come and the old Firebird is priority now. The idle quality is much improved since last time I heard it run. Tuning begins tomorrow for drivability, and then wrap up with tuning full throttle and it should be done.
New weather stripping is installed. A decade of dust was washed off the car and it is being cleaned and polished. The paint feels like sand paper because the dirt kind of bonded to the paint after such a long time. I'm glad to let a professional deal with that.
I am bored out of my skull without my car to tinker on. I am really looking forward to getting it back. And better yet, it won't be a roller any more, it will be a driver!
Dyno tuning has begun! Still tuning drivability at this point so no power pulls yet, but the engine already made 380 lb-ft torque at 3800 rpm at about half throttle.
Here is some video during a tuning session on a Mustang dyno. It ain't no 2.8L any more. But the engine ran out of cam!!! The power noses down at 5K some rpm. Torque curve is phenomenal as you might guess. This all explains why it made so much torque at part throttle.
Car is home!!! Big ole' finger in the shot but you get an idea how awesome the paint looks again. 12 hours by a professional to bring the paint back to life. Moral of the story is don't let dust accumulate and sit on your paint for years because the dust doesn't like to let go after a while. There is still work to do on the car before I can drive it, but I should move at a fairly good clip now.
Hatch motor stripped out so I need to fix that. But I put the plate on and took it for a spin around the block anyway. Boy, it is going to take some time to get use to this thing! It was a raw driving experience. It is loud, tinny like there is no insulation, stiff and bumpy, jerky, smelly, the clutch is more race than street and hard to operate smoothly at slow speed, and the car bucks under about 20 mph. Most people would think it sucks to drive but I say you have to drive aggressive to enjoy it.
But you know what this car has that modern cars don't have? EVERYBODY just stared and rubber necked as I went by. I have never had a car in my life that grabbed that much attention. People are fixated by the sight and sound of this car when it is on the move. Try that with your new Camaro -- ain't going to happen!
Here is one of the dyno sheets. 450 RWHP and 437 lb-ft torque on a Mustang dyno. Ran out of cam on the top end, but the area under the torque curve says this is going to be a fast car anyway. The idle needs some work so I still need to go back for some touch up on the tune. But we're in the home stretch now!
... being a base model Firebird it looked so unimpressively stock, especially since the rear exhaust pipe is hidden away. Other than being shiny, I don't think this car would even get a 2nd look driving around town.
Ya, pretty much the opposite of what I said earlier. The sound of the car is amazing and it pulls the package together. It sat in the driveway for a bit and people that passed by didn't seem to give much notice. But run it down the road and people just can't stop starring! I have never been the guy that everybody stares at. It is fun!
03-07-2016, 11:05 PM
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