Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

ZZ3Astro

no new tires I do still have it.. That cluster currently has the gauges installed that I pulled out of the newer cluster. I could separate just have to decide if it's going to reduce how much I can sell the gauges for.

no new tires

I only run Atmr Cobalt gauges.

no new tires

Sell me that inlay.

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

Cast kit?

I think I got lost in the thread.

-- Joe

ZZ3Astro

Well that Amazon experiment did not go well. The Amazon seller never sent the item. I sent a message to inquire on the status and was met with an error from Amazon saying the email was rejected. I'm working with Amazon now to get a refund. Meanwhile I have been reading up on this Hooker kit and it seems everyone complains about its extremely poor layout, which is in the way of everything. I think I remember seeing there was one other similar but better laid out cast manifold for a single turbo on an LS. Anyone know of anything? The last option is stock manifolds but then I'm stuck with plumbing a Y or building one into the manifold. I'd prefer a bolt-in option personally. I'm not risking any headers and the potential leaks which have plagued this car even back when I had the old original cast manifold.

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

Can you link me to this 'hooker' kit ?

-- Joe

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

maybe its the car but my friend has no issues with his but its in a buick regal ex hot air car lol. 5.3 and a gt4202 everything fits great, has room everywhere. But thirdgens can be a pita

ZZ3Astro

It comes in several versions.. this being the most complete but you can also purchase it without the crossover pipe and without the drive side manifold if desired. https://www.speedwaymotors.com/Hooke...saAi7GEALw_wcB

Well I know it blocks the low mount AC compressor option. Also have read it's in the way of the engine mount. And doesn't leave enough room for a downpipe on the thirdgen. Haven't seen a lot of love for the design in other forums.

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

Interesting spot for the crossover... And as you mentioned, the downpipe would have to go through the fender.

I think if I ever did another turbo in a thirdgen I'd just do twins right over the valve covers and integrated waste gates. Both single setups I had were a pain in the ***.

-- Joe

ZZ3Astro

I'm thinking about maybe trying to see how these STR manifolds fit mine. I don't think AC will be possible with them though. If I could move these LS coils significantly closer to the plugs I think I'd get rid of the problem I'm having right now. And with the cast STRs I won't have to worry about thick Remflex gaskets to blow out. I can just throw together a cheap forged bottom end with a different cam and that eliminated every possible link to the old setup from a year ago but still be gen1. Otherwise I'll have to modify some stock LS manifolds if I go to LS. I really want to go LS but I'm not in the mood to put a lot of effort into the turbo system again.

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

Cast manifolds definitely seal the best. I made some out of some fbody LT1 manifolds. The setup worked, I just didn't like how hot everything was under the hood. Cross over was a pain in the ***.

Turbos in general seem to be a pain in the ***. Can make stupid big power but it seems like everyone struggles with blown gaskets, heat, compressor sizing, etc. I'm on a bunch of car groups on Facebook and it's a lot of griping yet they won't give up lol.

I think you need to lay down the pros and cons of the SBC vs LSx, and figure out how to best meet your goals. You've had a lot of unusual problems. Sometimes a fresh start makes everything better.

-- Joe

ZZ3Astro

Every time I want to throw he towel in on turbos, I am forced to acknowledge that Nissan made it all work together and one can double the power and still have AC and cruise. I know I cam somehow make this work without the leaks. Somehow! Anyway I know I keep coming back around to gen1 every time I start on the LS pathway. I just don't want to switch and have an equal set of problems on the other side. Maybe I should just buy a gtr and.... oh, wait.

DIGGLER

iTrader: (1)

STR manifolds should put things pretty similar to these banks manifolds.

no new tires

Sell me that inlay.

DIGGLER

iTrader: (1)

inlay?

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Build a header log hybrid using 1/2” thick flanges. Weld up and when finished have the flange milled flat

customblackbird

iTrader: (15)

I was going to go with the hooker cast turbo kit to replace my CX racing hotside but decided in the end it wasn't worth it. The hooker is nice bc you can use all the factory stuff (coils on VC and wires etc). The cross over is in the back so that keeps it from heating the front of the motor between the rad and engine which also helps with air flow and cooling. I dont think the log (pass side) would clear my racecraft moly Kmember as the motor mount plate sticks up kinda high. There are pics of them installed on stock kmember thirdgens and they clear, but my SBC solid motor mounts are shorter than stock I believe. I also run cheap $20 ebay 304SS LS header studs and remflex gaskets.

I decided against it but I modified my CX hotside instead and saved some money. When I first installed the kit last year I modified the original 3" crossover to clear the truck accessories. I wrapped everything and installed and ran it for a summer and it worked well. I pulled the system to modify it and found under the wrap that a primary cracked 3/4 the way around at the weld. I rewelded the primary and then removed all the wrap and did my own creakote ceramic coating ( I hated the wrap). Then I removed the 3" crossover (bc its too big and it gets super close basically touching my fans ) and made my own 2.25" crossver and coated it. This alone opened up so much space between the motor and fans that I'm sure airflow has improved and I'm sure the smaller crossover helped with spool as well. I threw it all back together and replaced the VS 78/75 cast for a billet version. Originally I kept the coils on the valve covers but made my own wires that go around back and under the engine so I dont burn any wires (cost less than premade LS stock wires). I just drove the car yesterday for 90miles and it worked great, got it good and hot and no leaks etc and the motor ran cool. It was nice to cruise with the cutout closed and enjoy the car and then open it up and get rowdy. I prob wouldn't drive the car as much if it had a fender dump.

Here's what I heard and read which ended up killing the hooker purchase for me. The Crossover has a tendency to destroy the flex bellow... alot of guys have cracked and broken bellows. The crossover is also 409 SS and not 304SS. The cast manifolds are great for keeping the heat in for helping turbo spool but you also need to remember how much cast iron expands! Its the main reason sooooo many manifold bolts are broken in the LS motors, its due to the different expansion rates of the aluminum heads and cast manifolds. Eventually the cast manifold will warp and snap a stud or bolt, hence the OEM occurance... and guess what, the turbo manifolds will get even hotter and make the issue worse. Another reason is no real room for a down pipe... I heard you can snake it down by the firewall but its super tight if you can even get it, otherwise its easier to run a fender dump. I run an electric cutout and with it open the exhaust is decently loud which would be even more annoying dumping out of the fender and not being able to turn it off ever lol... and my car only sees street time/daily driving when nice.

So the hooker negatives are:
cracking leaking bellows on the crossover
manifolds eventually breaking bolts
No easy DP to go out the back of the car
gotta figure out Tstat waterneck
Still need to fab exhaust and hotside to turbo

Hooker Positives are:
bolt on, decent setup and hugs the motor
Keeps coils on VC and stock style wires
Should work well with spool and make lots of power
spark plug access from engine bay

CX negatives:
chinese 304SS, welds can break
Crossover is super big
need to relocate coils or make custom wires
no way to access spark plugs from the engine bay
Limited to a 3" DP

CX positives:
Bolt on no changes needed to car (if you run car accessories, can be made to fit truck accessories)
Connects to the stock exhaust or lets you run a full exhaust
Only limit is the 3" DP, but should be able to support 800-900hp on 3" or you can clock the turbo and run a fender dump or larger DP without issue
304SS flanges shouldnt break bolts or studs

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

That's the type of setup I'd shoot for if I was to do a turbo again. Clean, straight forward. Could probably fabricate an air/water intercooler like the WRX to mount on top of the intake.

-- Joe

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

Bingo. Can't believe guys are willing to sacrifice their builds in certain areas, no to mention their cars themselves, just to run an existing system. Build your own the way you need it to be and call it a day. Hell, I like what Torched did to his turbo LSX third gen, makes great power, but I cringe whenever I see his fender dump because it is so unnecessary if you build your own system. But I get it, some guys don't have the time, or the means. That Hooker crossover is a joke though...

- Rob

.

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

I believe he made a few sets of turbo manifolds and he was blowing gaskets out.

I think the cast iron manifold is a good idea. Production turbo cars have cast iron manifolds. Lingenfelter did cast iron.

-- Joe

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

I think there is more to the story of when he blew the exhaust header gasket open. I'm willing to bet the injector for that cylinder is bad, or the tune was way off. If the turbo header was at fault, he would have heard something suspect way before that particular incident leading up to it. He continually pushed the limits of boost pressure too, always pushing a tad below 20-psi. It was just a matter of time when you don't have your injectors inspected every few weeks, not to mention test the pump gas you're using, just to be on the safe side. Hell if I remember correctly, he heard the loud pop at moderate throttle. Just takes a fraction of a second being too lean, he's lucky if was just an exhaust gasket that blew out. Same thing would happen to an LSX in the same scenario, a newer engine fixes nothing when something faulty is at play.

Dig the inlay he's talking about is for the cluster that he wants to buy from him.

- Rob

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

Who knows what happened. He's remade the headers, changed the megasquirt for a holley, went from dizzy to DIS, and a bunch of other things.

I don't think cast iron manifolds is a bad idea.

Or an LS swap. Or whatever builds confidence in the car.

-- Joe

ZZ3Astro

In my case I have two issues with the headers.. 1> the leaking/blowing gasket out in same area, which can be mitigated with some milling on the flange. In fact I'm probably going to do that when I take it off whether I ever use it myself again or for the benefit of the buyer. 2> Extreme radiant heat.. this is much harder. The upturned header with lots of surface area has baked everything around it. It prevents me from mounting the coils where they should be. It's cooked my AC system o-rings, hood insulation, oil cap and everything else around it. Too much tubing, up in the wrong area. I don't think any amount of coating/insulating it really going to fix this problem. The header and merge pipe are both phenomenal in flow and performance potential but for a street car I don't think I made the best choice in routing. Plus it's just unbalanced looking to the casual observer, fwiw.

Since I have the STRs laying here anyway it's worth a test fit. If I can get the problems down to just the backfire issue, I can resolve that. I just don't want to be fighting gaskets, leaks, melting parts and troubleshooting like I've been doing for a while now. If they don't fit good then I'll just work with LS and some stock manifold modification. I just want to stick with cast, compact and low hung. No more of this upturned (heater) crap. LS makes it easier than gen1 with decent flowing stock manifolds so if the STR doesn't fit then LS is the only choice.

customblackbird

iTrader: (15)

cast iron is not the best. OEM's use it bc its super cheap, easy to mold, retains heat and its strong. Its cost per hp is a good ratio. But as I've stated OEM motors now have aluminum heads and depending on the exhaust manifold bolt design/DIA its always going to be a leak from a broken bolt. LS motors are not the only motor with aluminum heads and cast iron manifolds with broken stud/bolt problems... the OEM's are littered with them. Specifically my RAM with the 5.7 HEMI has cast iron manifolds and aluminum heads and its common to have 2-3 broken manifold bolts on each side before you reach 50-75k. Alot has to do with the bolt DIA as some manufactures use smaller bolts (M8 like on the LS and HEMI's) and they seem to pop often. I heard toyota trucks have larger M10 bolts and don't have the same issues. It also has alot to do with gaskets... MLS style exhaust gaskets don't flex or absorb the different expansion rates of the aluminum head vs cast iron manifold. Ive had three 5.3LS motors and 2 of them had 2-3 broken bolts on each side. On the HEMI's they pop so much they happen in 3-5 years of a new truck and usually covered by the warranty. The only fix they have come up with (besides repair and plan to have it happen again) is to mill the manifold after its warped (if its warped) to help take some of the stress out and pray the stock 10.9 hardware holds out. Otherwise you have to swap to shorty headers/LTs and then normal bolts don't pop bc of the different header material. I also think volvo has issues with the cast turbo manifolds popping studs if I remember correctly. $450 is alot for cast iron hooker manifolds, plus you have to spend $175 for 409SS crossover just to have a leak from a broken bolt if you put the miles on the setup.

I think its prob a moot point as we don't rack up miles on our "hotrods" like we do on normal cars. So more than likely no one will get time/usage necessary for a cast iron manifold to warp/pop a bolt.

Street Lethal

iTrader: (16)

In my opinion, just reassess what the goal is. Shooting for a particular amount of horsepower with no ET in mind kind of defeats the purpose. Putting a newer engine, with newer technology... in a vehicle that isn't a daily driver, and will make an occasional run at the track, also defeats the purpose. That '49 seems like it will be the vehicle of choice for the car shows, and for the cruise nights. Don't mean to sound so glum about the Iroc, but to go all out in a vehicle that will hardly be used. Well, you get the gist of what I'm saying. Dig has inadvertently gotten me to watch the Faster Proms channel, which I now enjoy, but so far his father's old SBC has taken more abuse and lived during the last twenty years than any of the LSX engines he's built during the last five, if even that. Says a lot in my book. Anyways, continue on fella's...

- Rob

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

I know what you are saying, and when I owned stake in a construction company we had a lot of problems with the Ford 4.6 and 5.4 trucks with broken manifold bolts and such. But those are vehicles that are driven in the rain - cold water splashing up on hot exhaust, snow, year round, etc. Not babied hot rods.

And sure, cast iron manifolds crack. I have a few sets of LT1 corvette manifolds in the shop with nasty cracks:





But I still think for turbo manifolds, I like what I've seen of the Banks (and knockoff) and others. I actually had one briefly but it required a odd rayjay turbo with an offset housing so I couldn't use it.


When I had a turbo thirdgen, the heat was just too much, and the cross over was a pita. Maybe twins over the valve covers or just in front of the head would have worked.

I don't want to nitpick on the turbo routing but some of the builds I've seen look like a bowl of 3 day old pasta. I'm sure they make stupid power but I think it can be way more clean with cast manifolds. Again, the Banks and lingenfelter stuff from the 90s / early 2000s all looks clean.

A company called STR or something used to make like a knock off banks SBC cast manifold too but I've not seen a set for sale in years.


So I dunno.

-- Joe

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

Didn't the LS motors break into the 5's this past august/September ?

It's a good platform. I wouldn't do it in a thirdgen because I think the supporting hardware negate the cost/performance benefits. But it's definitely a better platform overall.

The ET argument I think is kinda bust. Unless you're gonna go all crazy and certify the car, almost any forced induction build is gonna be in the low 11s or faster. I know in previous years members have gone stupid times without proper safety but from what I understand the tracks have been cracking down on that lately.


-- Joe

DIGGLER

iTrader: (1)

i spent most of last year working on a c5 with a tti-x twin turbo setup on it. cast manifolds with turbos tucked low on each side of the block. painfully hard to work on, but pretty much zero trouble with leaks or cracks and it made just a hair shy of 1k whp through a full exhaust on 19" street tires which were very possibly spinning on the dyno. ~16psi on a 434ci lsx.
not my pic, but this is the tti setup.

RS Chris

No more turbo Iroc or videos according to latest vid from Steve.

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

He's not wrong.

-- Joe

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Shame that one couldn’t get ironed out

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

Years and years of problems and he's frustrated.

-- Joe

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

I can understand that but not understand why it was having issues

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

I dunno. It's a lot to follow. He had timing issues and thought it was the megasquirt, then went holley and CoP and I think he had issues with coil wires maybe? I think the last issue was blowing out header gaskets.

-- Joe

customblackbird

iTrader: (15)

Man that sucks... I would have not been able to get rid of it without figuring it out honestly... $hit like that bugs me!!!

Didn't be mount the coils under the front bumper? lol... 4ft+long plug wires seems like a step backwards.

DIGGLER

iTrader: (1)

he just never was able to get everything to fall together. was one of my favorite projects to follow as i loved the look of the stock car with turbo power. if he lived closer i would have helped him work on it.
i totally agree with his thoughts on youtube as well. i would prefer supporting a platform that is not controlled by the left in a very unamerican manner.

RS Chris

To many projects, the hurricane, life. It all adds up quick and I get it. He was one of the longest individual youtubers I had followed. It might bug me more than him that the car never got lined out.

DIGGLER

iTrader: (1)

honestly same here lol.
i would have been ok with losing the a/c and doing typical foward facing headers into that 76mm with a muffled downpipe dumping under the front somewhere. coils on valve covers or intake area. lose the 700r4 once it died and put a th400 in there with 3.23-3.42 gear or 4l80e. with the dominator system in there it is ready for anything- even ls swap.

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

He got caught up in similar stuff I did when I tried the turbo thing. I made two different manifolds and it was hot, ugly, and had exhaust ticks.

I've seen a few really good looking twin turbo thirdgens and they all used the banks manifolds. every other turbo setup I've seen (no offense intended) looks like an abortion. And this is coming from a guy who likes rat rods..

He had a lot of weird problems. Just bad luck. Sometimes starting fresh clears the mind. I've had builds over the years that went sideways too.

-- Joe

ZZ3Astro

Hey guys.. a lot going on over here with business and otherwise. Since the hurricane I have lost 4 of 9 employees and so far have no viable replacements. We were already short-handed with 9. Between trying to save the business and spending as much time in the RV as possible (our escape from the madness) there just isn't enough time for so many projects. I haven't driven the GTR more than twice since May. I still need to get busy on the 49 which is in pieces at the moment and untouched since early May. Since mom passed away a few months ago I also have her house to deal with and I have yet to touch it. Every possible idea has been on the table including relocation and trying to restart a business that I've spent 26 years building. I have no energy left to fight that Iroc. It will be a battle to part it out too so IDK how it will all play out. Don't worry though, I have other builds in mind and when the time presents itself I plan to build a Turbo LS, but in a platform with a decent engine bay. Something different, NOT possessed, sounds like it could actually be fun (for a while at least).

I know a lot of people think that Iroc means something to me, but really it's been a thorn for a long time. It was a product of a different time in my life and was never the car I wanted to build. It started out that I was building a second gen and looking for an engine. I ran across the Iroc and it was complete and cheap and so the build started. The only history with that car that I care about is the many hours I spent working on it from paint to the transmission to the turbo setup. Hours I can't get back LOL. I don't see myself missing it honestly.

As for a video platform, I'm looking around. I set up a channel on videorefuge.com but I'm not sure if I will make a permanent home there or not.

no new tires

Hey o.p., can I still get that dash inlay?

ZZ3Astro

I put the Iroc outside to - after two months of no wrenching - finally work on getting the 49 frame back together. Of course it rains within two hours when it hasn't rained in days. At least the spider webs are washed off now. I wish this car wasn't such a pain in my rear. She looks good sitting there but she is a "fighter". I'd use other words but I don't think the forum will tolerate my real names for her!

As you know I have almost $600 sitting in those generic gauges and that stupid new bezel (never was proud of having to do that but I wanted that bezel). It is nice looking at least. Anyway the same day I took the generics out of the new bezel to install the Holley EFIs, I installed the old generics in the old carbon inlay with the intention to sell them as a combo to maximize the return. I doubt I'd get $100 for the gauges alone plus maybe $100 for the bezel. I think I'll get $350-400 for the combo. I haven't sold it yet because they failed to send me the tach harness and I haven't had a chance to sort that out.

no new tires

id be good with $100 for the inlay.

ZZ3Astro

No idea how I'm going to sell this car. I don't want to part it because of the effort required. I don't think I'm going to use the Holley system any time soon so I think I'm just going to sell the car complete. We are looking to move back towards town and I'd rather have the cash and not need a parking space. This won't be easy which is why I've put it off for so long.

no new tires

Sell me that inlay already.

Aslo, #OPSNOTGUNNASELLTHEIROC

(lol)