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Re: 3rd Gen Born Again Great looking car! Your efforts and attention to detail really paid off. |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again The attention to details is what it's all about even if I'm the only one who can see it. I've done things twice many times because it wasn't good enough. Such as problem #2 on the list " The excessive amount of heat coming from under the passenger side floor" I always kind of knew what it was from but didn't know why. The exhaust runs right underneath the floor there. When I got the headers I had a muffler shop weld up the pipe to fit the collectors and this is where the problem lays. It's sad that shops don't take care for quality, it's get them in and out fast. They simply followed the existing pipes and dumped the passenger side pipe straight in. Nasty! No flow. https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...51cb110e5c.jpg |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again So now it's time to redo the exhaust and I'm going to attempt it myself. I looked at going true dual but I was also wanting to keep everything tucked up as much as I can and man is it tight. So I ended up going dual to where the cat was and go single 3" from there to keep it up. Got it fabbed, painted it up and it turned out great. Went with the Flowmaster 80 series 3" in 2 1/2" out. It's a little louded than what I was expecting but It's awesome. https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...977de935f4.jpg https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...2167da12c1.jpg https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...668860d922.jpg |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again 1 Attachment(s) Here's a sample of the rumble. Please keep in mind that it's recorded from my phone. Attachment 452633 |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again Nice job. What did you use for paint? I ask because I just coated the "rusted" stainless pipes on my truck after wire brushing with POR-15 High Temp Aluminum and it's like aluminum powder mixed with a solvent. But the difference between it and spray can aluminum paint is that after the POR-15 dries, you don't get your hand covered in aluminum if you touch it, like with the spray can stuff. It also has a curing procedure which I have not had a chance to do yet. But so far it looks promising. |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again It's all in the prep. I sanded or scuffed the exhaust which was aluminised tubing. Used an acid base cleaner to etch it then I used VHT high heat header primer, then high heat header VHT silver paint. I knew a guy who work at a manufacturing facility which had an autoclave where I could bake it for a couple hours. Came out solid. I've read about people using a torch to heat it up but I wanted to make sure it was even heat. All said and done it tucked up nicely under the car. https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...bbe550c36e.jpg https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...a468a3c519.jpg |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again Like you said, it tucked up nicely under the car. And I love your ramps. I bet they really come in handy. I think I will have to do something like that when I rebuild/double my garage. |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again The ramps are extremely handy, I was tired of jacking the car up and putting it on stands. I spend a lot of time under the car and as for jack stands, I don't feel that safe under them especially when I'm on the creeper and bump them. The ramps gives me a rise of 12" on the wheels and a total of 18 -20" clearance under the car. The center sections between the wheels pull out so I have easy access all around and I'm safe. I was wanting to start attending car shows so you gotta be picky about the appearance, even under the car, even if it's just me looking at it. The paint on the car is in good shape but the gold trim was a little marred from regular driving so it's time to detail the appearance. I decided to paint the trim and renew the paint, detail the emblems and bring it to a quality of show I can be proud of. I removed the trim and emblems, sanded all the trim down, used high build primer to smooth things out and gave it a fresh coat of gold to compliment the wheels. https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...80dfb9f34e.jpg https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...a7a0b1baee.jpg |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again I touched up the black but the worst part was the door sill where the trim meets the black. I didn't want to paint it for a brush would be ugly and spraying may cause over spray in the interior or the body so I decided to vinyl it with a carbon fibre vinyl. It actually turned out way better than I thought and for pretty cheap. All the gold turned out awesome and I would be proud to take it to a show. https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...093fa74dd2.jpg https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...b1e3295a04.jpg https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...e07683c8c8.jpg |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again
Originally Posted by NoEmissions84TA
(Post 6205741)
Like you said, it tucked up nicely under the car. And I love your ramps. I bet they really come in handy. I was just about to type the same thing! :thumbsup: |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again
Originally Posted by Sleeper Z
(Post 6205787)
I touched up the black but the worst part was the door sill where the trim meets the black. I didn't want to paint it for a brush would be ugly and spraying may cause over spray in the interior or the body so I decided to vinyl it with a carbon fibre vinyl. It actually turned out way better than I thought and for pretty cheap. |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again I just went to my local parts store and it's just a .02mm vinyl stripe which has it's own adhesive. Basically it's a peel and stick. It went right under the GFX and the step plate no problem. It did detail that area nicely. The paint on the car is still in really good shape and I didn't want to try to match or blend it. This was a good way to go about covering that little area. |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again
Originally Posted by Sleeper Z
(Post 6205874)
I just went to my local parts store and it's just a .02mm vinyl stripe which has it's own adhesive. Basically it's a peel and stick. It went right under the GFX and the step plate no problem. It did detail that area nicely. The paint on the car is still in really good shape and I didn't want to try to match or blend it. This was a good way to go about covering that little area. |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again Absolutely! It's a good way to cover or improve small areas. This is a fairly inexpensive product but my application was straight forward, no contours that required stretching. If your needing something more flexible then I would get some better stuff that will stretch better. It was like $16. https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...067ea19056.jpg |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again I was wanting to attend some car shows for a lot of the shows I went to I very rarely saw 3rd gens displayed. Last summer I spent a lot of time on the paint, cutting it and lots of polishing. Got the black almost to a mirror finish. My first show I went to I was a little nervous about the receptiveness of the 3rd gen Z. However to my surprise it's presence drew quite a bit of attention. It made the effort worth while. Didn't win anything but the people I talked to and met was awesome. Here is a couple pics of the first show I attended. https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...4aaafff06d.jpg https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...761828c4f0.jpg https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...504d1d41b9.jpg |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again After having a good summer last year and attending a few car shows, the want to improve was still in my mind. The car is fast, but the final problem #3 still needs to be addressed. The steering is sloppy and the suspension is starting now to suffer. It's all stock or at least stock replacement from in the past. So the investigation begins as to how and where I want to go. After researching steering problems and suspension related problems I came to the conclusion that I wasn't going to be chasing after the rabbit holes looking for the problem. Everything in the steering could affect it as well as suspension could also cause steering and handling issues. I now decided this winter it's all going to be replaced. The question now is do I replace to stock or go all out. Well I know that I won't be happy with stock and I'm only going to do this once so It's going to be all out after market. So after a lot of research on TGO with what others have done I came to a conclusion. I'm about to spend a lot of money on the largest of my winter mods. Full suspension and steering replacement. |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again Rack and pinion? The miles of give either way on the recirculating ball is one of the best things about these cars imo. :) |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again I ordered all the parts at one time and after some research there's not much out there for performance steering part's so I ended up going all Moog steering components to try to keep costs down because the suspension parts aren't cheep, rebuilt close ratio steering box. and rebuilt power steering pump. To maintain a clean appearance I painted all the related moog parts. The centre link, tie rods, pitman arm and Idler arm for looks as well as to prevent rusting. https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...4ba5f07717.jpg |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again
Originally Posted by SirReveller
(Post 6206203)
Rack and pinion? The miles of give either way on the recirculating ball is one of the best things about these cars imo. :) Ya I looked at that but what I saw was that it was the whole assembly complete with K member, A arms etc. Very expensive. I wanted to spend more of my money on the suspension. Rack & pinion is the ultimate but Ouch! |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again The choice of suspension parts were abundant and required a lot of research and thought. The thought to go coil over was appealing however I read on line a statement in which made me think about it differently. Simply stating that maybe the strut towers at the top of the fender wells weren't engineered for the full weight that would be put upon it with coil overs. I'm sure the engineers who designed them took that into consideration but after looking it over I decided I wanted to stick to the configuration in which the car was designed with the coils being at the frame. I also took into consideration having to order things online which I'm not fond of for if parts don't work out the return of items is time consuming and a pain so what was available through my parts store I deal with also played a part in what parts I ordered. Here's the list of parts I decided to go with Energy Suspension A-arm polyurethane bushings Mevotech Ball joints Eibach pro kit lowering springs QA1 rear lower control arms QA1 adjustable panhard bar QA1 single adjustable rear shocks QA1 single adjustable front struts QA1 strut mounts c/w spherical bearings Total Price for all $2,700.00 can after taxes |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again After waiting a few weeks, I get the parts in and as I always do I inspect for problems and test fit as much as I can before taking things apart to do the install. Sure enough the QA1 single adjustable struts don't fit the QA1 strut tower mounts. :doh: I guess the QA1 strut tower mounts are only for the QA1 coil over set up and not the stock replacement struts. :hmmm: The spherical bearing is to small for the shaft of the strut to enter. All the other parts look awesome and should bolt right in. This is why I don't like to order online. LOL I brought the strut mounts back to the parts store and ordered the Founders Performance strut tower mounts instead as they fit the stock replacement struts and let my Parts store deal with the return. While I was now waiting for them to arrive I started on the rear suspension. Everything bolted right in with no issues. Good quality stuff. https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...7f7719ed34.jpg https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...61f682ab1a.jpg |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again Rockin. People seem to have only good things to say about Founders. |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again The customer service I got from Founders was excellent. They were quick to respond to my requests for info and shipping was quick. I really have nothing but good things to say about all the products I purchased. Even QA1 was easy to deal with and no problems. The caster camber plate mix up wasn't their fault for I ordered the product and didn't check compatibility. I just assumed it would fit. While I was waiting for the Founders caster camber plates to arrive I started to pull apart the front end suspension and I can now see why the car was wondering. The ball joints were gone and the stock strut mount bearings were fried. (Typical of a 30 year old car) I'm sure that those two things played a very big part in the lack of controllability. The only thing that needed a little bit of modification were the front spindles needed to have some material removed to fit the QA1 single adjustable struts. But I was prepared for that prior to ordering them. And only because of the adjustable valve body at the bottom of the strut. Very minor for a awesome product. While the front end was apart I sent the A-arms and spindles off to get powder coated and get the bushing and ball joints pressed in. Once I got all the parts back including the Founders caster camber plates the install went in slick. https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...f7c5286529.jpg https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...1f72d70ed3.jpg https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...d56d2faba8.jpg |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again A lot of nice work! When I get around to doing my suspension when the weather is better I will be using some founders parts have heard some great things about their products. |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again For a second I thought I saw dirt on your car. And I was going to furiously point it out. Then I realized, it was just dirt on my monitor. Jeebus thats a clean car, congrats. |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again Thanks! I think I will have a combo of parts to compliment the power. As for being clean, I do try to keep it that way but when its in the shop getting worked on in the winter it tends to get dusty over the winter months. Hahaha But gets a good spring cleaning right when it gets out. After getting the wheels on and setting it on the blocks I realized that it dropped quite a bit. A little more than expected. It dropped the front fender 26" even off the ground and leaving only about 2 1/2" from the tire to the fender as well as 3 3/4" clearance and the k member to ground (the pic below shows a 3" bar to show comparison). My bump stops have an 1" of clearance from the frame. I'm wondering if that's going to be enough room for travel? Well I guess Ill have to set it up and drive it to find out. I don't really want the rubber stops on the A-arm bottoming out on the frame. But at the same time the stance is awesome! I likey!:) https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...9f8a7f993d.jpg https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...1eb48b3891.jpg |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again Now that the suspension is done and I'm getting excited to give it a drive but I find myself having to wait. This winter has been one of the longest ones we've had here in Kelowna. So I decided to look at stiffening up the frame as I hear a lot of people on TGO swear by it with positive results. There's a few products out there and after again doing some research I'm thinking that they may not work for me for a couple reasons. First the cold air system I have, I don't think will work with the strut tower braces that are available and 2 with the custom exhaust the way I routed it will have issues I'm sure on the passenger side. So I've decided to make custom ones myself. I got the steel from a fab shop I know and started to plan it out. I started with the strut tower brace first. I cut my pieces using 3/16" mild plate steel and 1" OD cold rolled seamless tubing and mocked it up. But before I started any fabrication the first thing I did was ensure the car was perfectly level. https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...0e77ee1fa4.jpg https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...8475fa1351.jpg |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again I was just going to make a post asking what type of tubing to use when fabricating a STB. So thanks for this. Are you going to try to triangulate yours like the QA1? |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again Cold rolled seamless tubing is stronger than mild seamed tubing but the schedule 40 mild 1/8" wall tubing would still be strong for STB's. I only got the cold rolled steel because I had to reduce the diameter of the tubing for the SFC"s to get by the exhaust with clearance. I'll be using 1 3/8" for the SFC's. It's strength is as good as 1 3/4" or even 2". Cold rolled tubing is heavy though. My STB is a hefty 8-10 lbs. I can weld but by no means am I a pro at it so I made sure the welds are strong and good then ground them down to get a good shape. I added some rear pipe support just for extra strength. Sanded it down for finish and sent it off to get powder coated. https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...1ddb264229.jpg https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...8601d8a5a1.jpg |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again The triangular STB from QA1 wouldn't work simply because the triangular part of it wouldn't get by the cold air tubing on the side. I may be able to sneak them by but it wouldn't be symmetrical so I'm not going to go that way. Just the straight bar across will be good and look good at the same time. |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again Beautiful work.:thumbsup: |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again
Originally Posted by NoEmissions84TA
(Post 6207143)
Beautiful work.:thumbsup: |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again Thanks! I do try to be picky about it. Even the fab work. If it's things don't look right I'll keep trying to get it the best I can. That's how one get's better. I did get my STB back from getting powder coated and I am pleased with the way it came out. The time I spent sanding the metal down paid off for a clean smooth finish on the powder coat. Because it was fabricated in place it took all but 10 min to install. https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...33d9efe13a.jpg https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...450ea85b2f.jpg |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again Looks good! |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again Ya I'm very pleased with the way it turned out with the looks and install. It has made me more confident to pursue building my own SFC's. This will be a challenge. I want it all tucked up underneath. |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again
Originally Posted by Sleeper Z
(Post 6207538)
It has made me more confident to pursue building my own SFC's. This will be a challenge. I want it all tucked up underneath. |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again I did look at Detroit Speed SFC's and went through as many threads as I could find regarding the ever controversial SFC debate. There are a lot of products I reviewed before making the decision to make my own. If I had thought about SFC's at the time I did my exhaust I may have done the exhaust differently but none the less I have clearance issues for the SFC's that are on the market. I have 1 1/2" from the floor to the exhaust and about 3/4" from the side to the exhaust. So my plan to connect to the front is using 1"x3" rectangular tubing laying on the flat to get by the exhaust then adapt to 1 5/8" round tubing to attach to the LCR. The drivers side is not an issue. https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...215edbaa5d.jpg |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again The design and build of the SFC's has begun and I started with the more difficult passenger side. I started with the mount to go over the LCA mount. https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...506fdcbb3d.jpg All the mounting plates are made of 3/16" plate steel. It was difficult to have a design that would accommodate the exhaust yet still be strong. I used a combination of 1 5/8"x1/8" Tube steel angled down and attached to 1"x3" rectangular tubing to go above the exhaust mounted to the front rocker mount and the front frame where the tranny mount is located. |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...5a6f13443d.jpg I fabbed everything in place to ensure a good fit. Once I had it tacked in place I then pulled it out to weld it up. I did a rough grind of the welds, still have to do the final sand before powder coat but the passenger side is done. The driver's side should be a breeze for it's a straight shot with no obstacles. https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...1658a0b5e6.jpg It tucked up nice! https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...17bdfca5f7.jpg https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...bb32bc00f8.jpg |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again "It tucked up nice" IS AN UNDERSTATEMENT! Nice work. You know that everyone is now going to be asking you to make them a set.;) |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again Looks good. You're doing a great job on your Z28. |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again Yes, the tolerances are tight but you would have to get right down and look under to see it. I enjoy doing the fab work but working with metal is the dirtiest thing ever. My whole shop is covered in fine dust. Oh well, I'm almost done and then for a good spring cleaning after I get the car out. I'm going to get them weighed after the powder coating is done but I would say that the one I just did will come in right around 30 lbs. The driver side obviously requiring less metal and should be lighter. https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...8bffec5cc9.jpg Keep in mind that the exhaust is slightly dropped in that pic. It has about an 1/2" yet to go back up. |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again
Originally Posted by Sleeper Z
(Post 6204636)
Thanks Birdman_29. Yes it's not just show, It now goes! I see your partial to black and gold. Nice ride also. Black and gold is looks hot! :thumbsup: |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again Well it's been a couple weeks now since I've updated but things get busy with kids at this time of year. But I managed to get some things done in the process. I manufactured the driver side SFC and as expected it was way easier with it being open. Matched the layout with the passenger side so the geometry looks correct from underneath. LOL more for me but it's important none the less. Managed to weigh them out and maybe a little heavier than I wanted but tolerable. Passenger side a hefty 30 lbs and the drivers side just under 25 lbs. Again it tucked up nice! https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...f626ce8ca8.jpg https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...648a63ac25.jpg https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...fde0358f7a.jpg https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...3f02ca11d1.jpg |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again Now off to the powder coater to get cleaned up and done for install. |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again Absolutely outstanding work. Just a gorgeous car, love the color combo. Louis |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again Just picked up the SFC's from the powder coating. They turned out great. Now to get ready to weld them in place. Little nervous about welding to the car. Don't want to screw things up! Lol https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...f45db3e8ac.jpg https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.thi...069b53625b.jpg |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again I would say, based on the skill you've demonstrated in fabricating these, that you'll do OK. :thumbsup: |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again Thanks for the boost of confidence DynoDave. I'm mediocre at the welding part it's just gonna be a tight space under the car to do it. Welding on my back won't be the same as standing. But I'll just take my time with it. I plan on stitch welding the SFC's to the rocker edge as well. |
Re: 3rd Gen Born Again Those look really great. You should consider makin’em for sale here. |
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