Crazy high idle. HELP!!
 

WARNING!!! lots of info below. Sorry in advance.

I am (still) working on my 89 Camaro named Hellion. Last year I did 2.8 to 3.1 long block swap. This summer I (mostly)completed a '302 to '7730 swap. I also swapped out the 2.8L upper plenum and fuel rail with the 3.1L parts. The lower Plenum and intake are still 2.8L.
Before the intake swap I had a high idle issue that I thought was either the IAC or TPS sending a different signal than the new computer wanted. After the swap, same issue. I replaced the IAC( and set it to idle roughly at 900 with the throttle plate screw) and re-calibrated the TPS to .57 volts with the throttle plate closed.
Now at start up it revs to 2500-2800 then falls to about 1000-1500. After you start driving and closed loop takes over the IAC stops moving and the car starts idling at roughly 2000-2500.
Any thoughts on what could be the issue?

Also if anyone has any information regarding how to make the 2.8L VSS work with the '7730 I would greatly appreciate it.

Re: Crazy high idle. HELP!!
 

Current Mods:
EGR delete and disabled in chip
Canister Delete and disabled in chip
AIR pump delete and disabled
1.6 roller tip rockers
16 degrees timing
headers
cat delete
2.8L CAI intake
3.1L serp. belt accessory set up

Re: Crazy high idle. HELP!!
 

Update! Vacuum gauge reads a rock solid 19-20 inches both at the fpr port and at the HVAC controls port at the back of the intake.
Anyone have any other ideas?

Re: Crazy high idle. HELP!!
 

More updates. I installed a 3.1l lover intake as the cold start injector was broken and causing a vacuum leak. I also replaced all the gaskets above. I've replaced the IAC and the TPS. I tried a new ECM this weekend and ran through the idle relearn found here: https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/v6/235452-idle-adjustment-procedures.html

I let the car sit 2 hours it started fine and idled at about 900 rpm. I fired it up this morning and its back to 2500 rpm idle.
anyone have any other ideas to check?

Re: Crazy high idle. HELP!!
 

the big vacuum line that runs from the lower intake to the IAC might have slipped off.

Re: Crazy high idle. HELP!!
 

the car has been switched over to a 3.1 intake. The only vacuum lines left go to the MAP sensor, the fuel pressure regulator and the brake booster. All the other lines have been capped.
I figured it was a vacuum leak but all the hoses are new and all the gaskets from the intake against the heads on up are new

Re: Crazy high idle. HELP!!
 

Can an exhaust leak between the headers and heads cause a rich running condition and high idle?

Re: Crazy high idle. HELP!!
 

i had a high idle that nothing seemed to solve. new IAC , new tps, checked all vacuum lines. eventually I had megasquirt installed on the car and it hasn't been back.

Re: Crazy high idle. HELP!!
 

it could mess with your 02 readings and thus your A/F ratio. not sure how it would affect idle.

Re: Crazy high idle. HELP!!
 

Try exposing the throttle body and with the engine idling, put your finger over the IAC inlet. It should stall quickly. If it doesn't there's a vacuum leak or the throttle is adjusted too far open. Try to do this while it's having the fast idle issue, just in case it's an intermittent leak.
The throttle adjustment screw should just be used to keep the throttle from sticking in the bore. It shouldn't be used to adjust the idle speed. You might have it open too far, but I don't think that explains your problem since it isn't consistent.

Make sure you aren't getting any check engine codes while the issue is occurring (and make sure the light works). I've had a syndrome like this before on a Fiero but I got a code from it. What happened was my IAC electrical connector was broken, and after messing with it, I had the pins plugged incorrectly.

If you're not getting an error code, and you've confirmed that the air is going through the IAC and not a leak, then it implies the ECM is intentionally opening the IAC to run that fast idle. Otherwise you should get a code complaining that it can't control the idle.

The most likely reasons I can think of that it would intentionally run such a fast idle is if there's an issue with the coolant temperature sensor, or something isn't quite right about the ECM install or configuration. Is this a stock chip, or one you programmed?

There might also be other scenarios where it would run a faster idle, like if it thinks the battery voltage is low or maybe if it thinks the engine is overheating, but I don't think it would ever speed it up that much.
If you have the means, try looking at all the sensor data on a laptop as it's idling and see if anything looks wrong.

Re: Crazy high idle. HELP!!
 

The only thing I saw weird the last time I dataloggged is when idling too fast the IAC will stick at a certain point. Say 70 steps. It will climb from this point but always drop back down to it. The only code I had last time was vss low(its not hooked up).
ill check the other things you mentioned this weekend when I go to where the car's stored. Thank you

Re: Crazy high idle. HELP!!
 

are you running the stock injectors?

Re: Crazy high idle. HELP!!
 

No it has 16lb aftermarket injectors. The chip I made accounts for that. I noticed yesterday that while at about 2000rpm the MAP sensor is reading in the 70-80 range. It makes out at 97.17 with the key on engine off. It also won't read anything but 97.17 unless the car is running. I tried to pull a vacuum on it with the key on engine off.

Re: Crazy high idle. HELP!!
 

So I believe I've narrowed the issue down. I pulled all 6 plugs yesterday and 5 plugs were a whitish grey. The #1 plug was wet with gas. So that explains why its seeing rich while running lean. This morning I removed the injector rail and left the injector in question pointed into a cup for an hour with nothing leaking out.
could just this cylinder be getting poor spark or (hopefully not) could this be a compression thing? Or do I simply have an injector tat flows more than it should? Last time I checked all injectors had about 16 ohms resistance

Re: Crazy high idle. HELP!!
 

Still no luck. I found the cam had multiple flattened cam lobes switched it out with a stock replacement hoping that would change things. It did but not for the better. I can get it to idle sometimes now but above 2000rpm it stumbles and pops. Computers reading super rich. 100 to 110 in the history tables but the plugs are clean and dry.
I replaced the magnetic pickup and ignition module while I had it out.
any ideas where to go next? I'm stuck up against a wall with no ideas left.

Re: Crazy high idle. HELP!!
 

BTW if you have lost cam lobes you're not running enough zinc in your oil. you need to switch to Driven oil.

Re: Crazy high idle. HELP!!
 

Ok thank you for that. Ill get some when I install the new motor this winter. What weight do you recommend? I usually run 5w30 high mileage.

Re: Crazy high idle. HELP!!
 

I have figured out almost all the issues behind this post. Only one left is the cold idle.
When cold the car idles 11.5-12 on my innoventive LC-2 wideband regardless of engine temp. If you shut it off and restart it warm the idle drops to around 1000rpm and around 14.9-15.3.
Anyone have any idea what to look at for a cause? I've tried reducing the "idle air volumetric efficiency" table but it didn't make and difference.

Re: Crazy high idle. HELP!!
 

I stick with the 5W30 myself. Driven Oil is made by Joe Gibbs. There are others you can use but make sure it has high zinc. FYI not even Rotella has the zinc content it used to. People used to use it as break in oil but they don't know the EPA made them take it out. The zinc tends to ruin catalytic converters.

Re: Crazy high idle. HELP!!
 

Ok. I might be finally headed in the right direction here with the idle.
At start up the heated o2 will stick around .80 to.90(rich I think) yet the wideband mounted next to it reads about 12.0 to 12.5.
Any thoughts on whats causing the different readings? The sensors are about 8 inches apart and clocked so both get a free flow..