Blaze of Glory

Something is up with my steering and it's starting to become a safety issue.

A while back I noticed my car was pulling to the right. I need to keep the wheel at about 11 o'clock to keep it going strait. The tire pressure was fine and a rotation didn't change anything.

I took it in for an alignment and they told me that based on the current alignment the car should actually be pulling to the left. They told me my idle arm was bad (idle arm, center-link, tie-rods, and ball joints were replaced 2 years ago). I ended up replacing the idle arm, center-link, and wheel bearings. No change.

At this point it's getting difficult to keep it going strait. It almost feels like there's a dead zone with a hump in the middle of steering. It tends to veer one way or the other depending on which side of the hump I'm on. Also, if i'm taking a long turn, the car keeps steering in the direction of the turn (i.e. it doesn't tend to go strait if I take my hands off the wheel).

Could it be the steering box? Any ideas what might be causing this?

W.E.G.

Could be lots of things.

You need to get the car up on jack stands, and get under there and check for play in every joint of the steering assembly and every joint of the suspension. Stop by Harbor Freight and get a good-sized pry bar so you can really put some pressure on the connections.

Look at your strut-tower mounts too. If the rubber that holds the strut-bearing is rotted/torn, and the top of the strut is just ka-lumphing around every time the weight shifts, you have a bad situation.

Unless its collision damage, or you've driven 100K on rough roads since installation, it is highly unlikely an idler arm or center link has gone bad in only two years. Big surprise that Parts-Cannon-Pablo's recommendation for "a fix" didn't change anything. Don't do any more business with that guy.

The guys who do alignments at most shops are only a half-notch above loobies. So, anything those guys tell you, you better take with a shovel of salt.

Reid Fleming

iTrader: (2)

Do you have a printout of the alignment settings?

Did you replace the idler arm with the proper arm? Check the "Beware Moog idler arms" thread here. There are a few brands that have the wrong size.

Have you ever changed the upper strut mounts? These are almost guaranteed to be worn out. If these are worn out, the strut is going to bounce and zig zag in all sorts of directions, rather than being fixed where it should be.

Blaze of Glory

The idle arm is a Mevotech. The upper strut mounts have never been replaced but they look okay, at least when I look at them from above.

​​​​​​One of the first things I looked at was the steering shaft in the engine bay.

There's something like a bushing where it comes through the firewall. With someone rocking the steering wheel back and forth the bushing wobbles pretty good.

Also, I can grip the steering shaft in the bay and easily rotate the column with my hands between about 11 and 1 o'clock. None of the movement transfers to the pitman arm, so it seems like the slop is in the steering box. If that's the case, is it possible/better to rebuild or replace?

whitedevilTA

iTrader: (8)

You say you can grab the steering shaft that goes from the box to the firewall and spin it freely that much without the wheels turning?? Is this with the key on accessory and engine off? I will say that on my old steering setup I could not physically move that shaft even a mm by hand. I would assume that's your issue. The question is if it's in the box, the shaft itself, or the steering column. But I believe you most likely found the problem area at least. Dive into that area and start checking things closer. Remove the shaft and check it out for excessive wear/slop, especially at the rubber rag joint. Maybe also try disconnecting the shaft from the firewall connection but leave it attached to the steering box and then try turning it. If the shaft has no play but it turns the splined connection on steering box that much without moving the pitman arm, your issue is in the box itself.

One other thing even though it's completely unrelated is to make sure the 2 big strut bolts that attach the strut to the spindle are nice and tight. If these loosen at all and the strut moves around on the spindle while driving, it'll cause some major play.

tealman92

There is an adjustment on the steering box to tighten up the slop inside the box. Just like when you shim a ring and pinion in a rear end. There's a nylock nut on a shaft on top of the box the shaft has an Allen hex head. You loosen up the nylock and tighten down the Allen while checking your steering wheel for free movement but not sloppy. Once it feels good tighten down the nylock

Blaze of Glory

I rotated the part of the shaft on the steering box end. The shaft goes up to some kind of boot (is that the rag joint?). The play is not between the two sides of the shaft, they rotate together. The car was off and I was able to move the shaft very easily.

There's a plastic cover at the steering box end where the shaft goes in, I'll have to take a look tomorrow.

I've actually adjusted the steering box before. It was at the point where the steering hung up in the middle, but it was still totally loose.


The picture above shows the boot thing on the left and the firewall bushing thing on the right (disassembled).

tealman92

Time to replace the steering box

Blaze of Glory

Any difference between rebuilding and replacing?

tealman92

Is there a rebuild kit out there for them?

t/aws61985

iTrader: (2)

I was in your same situation. Well still am Technically. After rebuilding my whole suspension, Replacing every part of the steering rack, and every bushing. I noticed that my steering was still not were I wanted it to be. Last time I was home, I replaced my Rag Joint with a Astro Shaft from Walter Racecraft. It was a great upgrade to eliminate slop. Also would recommend A Astro Bearing swap while you are at it. I believe Walter also sells them. If not Chris Hendron On facebook sells them for $40 IIRC.

whitedevilTA

iTrader: (8)

Any reason you took the firewall bushing setup apart? I didn't catch your last sentence in your post and originally thought it fell apart and was going to say thats your problem lol. But either way, if all else looks good, new steering box time. They aren't too expensive either. I believe you can get the quick ratio IROC box from the parts stores for around $125. Just make sure you have your old one for the core. I think the core charge is pretty steep on them.

QuentsIROC

Good info in this thread.

My 86 IROC that I've worked on over winter has a similar issue. When driving, it'll take off either direction, it steers like it's binding, and, when I turn the steering wheel in either direction, it will not self correct. I've replaced everything under the front (pads/calipers/rotors, MOOG ball joints, MOOG tie rod, MOOG tie rod ends, sway bar bushings); did NOT replace idler arm nor pitman arm, but assume they're okay as the guy who just did the alignment didn't indicate they weren't. When replacing what I did, I obviously didn't anticipate running into this issue. And, after a front end alignment with a guy I do actually trust, same issue. Steering wheel is centered now, though.

One other issue that I'm getting is a clunk under the front over any rough road, i.e. pothole, change in pavement level on/off a side street, etc. I did not replace the upper strut mounts which i didn't realize are the camber/caster adjusters until just looking them up. This may be part of my issue, but not sure if the guy who did the alignment knows this, but, again, I do trust him so assume he did. He did indicate that he saw I did not replace those. I'll talk to him about that to see what adjustment he made on those and if they looked okay.

I also need to pull everything out of the upper steering column to tighten down the 4 bolts as the upper column has some slop, so will be working on that over the weekend. In addition, I'm going to check the shaft bearing at the firewall and everything else including the slop in the box to see if some of that can be adjusted out.

Input appreciated and I'll post updates later.

obeymybird

iTrader: (4)

Sounds like the first part of your problem is that someone has the steering box adjusted to tight back off the adjuster a little at a time to see if steering stops binding up.

QuentsIROC

After posting the other day, I was driving the car and in the middle of a turn, something cracked inside the column and the auto signal turnoff stopped working. Was planning on pulling everything to tighten the lower four bolts, anyhow, so did that over the weekend.

Pulled the steering wheel and the first thing I noted was the crack sound I heard was the snap ring that held the steering shaft lock had popped loose. At some point (someone had installed an aftermarket steering wheel and the dumbasses replaced the original "on/off" wiper switch with some POS out of a pontiac, i think, with delay . . .like it was going to automatically make the wipers delay by replacing the switch only) the original snap ring had been replaced with the incorrect snap ring. It wasn't the "c" type snap ring, but one with the ears/holes that a snap ring removal tool would be used on. Seems perhaps this might explain my issue . . . time will tell.

Anyhoo, I got it the rest of the way apart and tightened the four bolts, all were a little loose, but not bad. Think I've stripped one, pulled it and put some teflon on it and put it back in. Tightened to the point it felt as if I went any farther it'd strip, so stopped. Upper bearing fell apart when putting everything back together, so, today I ordered new bearings, upper and lower, and going to replace those before putting back together.

obeymybird, you may be on to something, but I'm not sure, especially with what happened with the above. At any rate, I raised the front of the car off the ground and twisted the steering column by hand back and forth and there's about an inch, if that, of play before the wheels start to move left/right. So, I was thinking that it may have been adjusted a bit tight, too. However, all the same, I bought this car from the original owner in 1992, sold it in 1996 then bought it back in 2008. From the time I sold it until the time I bought it back it had been sold once more. However, the guy I sold it to trashed the engine that was in it after putting around 5,000 miles on it and the guy he sold it to didn't do anything with it, and I bought it back less the engine. The car had around 86K on it when I sold it in 1996 and it has 92K on it now. So, while what you're saying makes sense, I KNOW the box wasn't messed with prior to 1996 nor after 2008, and with the mileage that was put on it between that time, and knowing who was driving it, I have my doubts the box was messed with.

However, it is a possibility and I may back it off 1/4 to 1/2 a turn to see if that helps IF it's no better one I put the column back together . . . which I'm hoping it is MUCH better. Knowing there's only been 6K miles put on it since I sold it in '96, 1K of which has been miles put on it by me, if they had messed with the adjuster, perhaps it hasn't totally annihilated the box as of yet.

Wish me luck . . .

QuentsIROC

Update on the above. Got column back together, adjusted steering box, replaced a-arm bushings, another front end alignment which was way off, and car drives absolutely great. I'm really hating to give it to my son to drive at this point. Ha. Now, if I can just get fan running properly which I've posted about in cooling forum.