GTA88

My car is an 88 GTA with the fuel pump in the tank. Only getting 25 PSI at the rail now, and having occasional bucking in first gear, and bogging sometimes in second and third.

I got an estimate from an independent shop. $533 including taxes.

He said it was 4.8 hours labor. Includes draining and refilling the tank ( so I guess draining one gallon costs me the same as draining 10 gallons).

The brand of pump would be Spectra. 2 year warranty on the pump. No labor warranty stated.

Includes new filter sock.

I'm in eastern Pa.

I've heard about people only paying $300 to have a new fuel pump installed, but I guess they are in different cost of living areas.

What about the brand of pump? I want to be sure the pump lasts a long time.

I know Airtex is horrible.

How is Spectra?

Is any pump not made in China?

Good pumps are supposedly Walbro, AC Delco, Delphi, Bosch? But AC Delco is now made in China. Is it still as good as before?

Is Bosch made in Germany?

Thanks

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Seems high but idk what book would be

I just know i would order a genuine walbro 255 from racetronix. 100$ or so and their install kit

88IROCvertZ

iTrader: (1)

Sounds a little high, but it is not a quick job..my guess would have been $375-425

A lot of the good, reputable shops with experienced certified mechanics are pretty much charging dealer rates up my way but dealers won’t touch anything older than 2004 these days..

wayshegoes

Seems like a good deal to me, 4.8 hours labor here in my neck of the woods would run more than your total with tax

tealman92

$533.00 includes the pump?

Camaro247

I'm going through the same problem on my 92. I just got quoted 400 dollars (3.8 hours labor). He was putting the AC Delco pump back in it. If any thing he might be charging you an hour to much labor.

Tuned Performance

iTrader: (92)

Do it yourself. The hardest part might be dealing with the exhaust even after it’s dropped from the hangers.

Go Blue

The problem is that you have to drop the muffler and tail pipes as well as mess with the rear suspension just to get the fuel tank down to get the fuel pump out. It's not a quick job and if your tank is full, the job really sucks. Your price seems a bit high but not completely out of the range. I generally like to go back to AC Delco since that's what the cars came with unless I know of a known issue with them or another brand with a better reputation for about the same price.

maroe624

Delphi. 500 bucks to change a fuel pump....... Not that hard to drop the tank. Just a hassle.

dmccain

iTrader: (2)

If I were to do it for someone id charge 500. Its a freaking job.

rdhanded2

iTrader: (3)

Seems in the right ballpark to me

Bob88GTA

iTrader: (2)

If you don't have the time, space ,tools, and a buddy to help, just pay and be done with it.
I would check on a AC Delco or Walbro pump though. Done mine years ago with a friend on my garage floor...yeah not hard...but it's a 4-5 hour job.

mmadden55

Easy job just tedious.

kentuckyKITT

iTrader: (4)

Back in 2001, I had this done on my 91 Camaro RS and it cost me 450.00 then.
I would probably do it myself now and eventually will have to on my 89 Firebird since it needs a new gas tank, but I'm waiting for the pump to go out before I do all of that. My filler neck is loose at the base and has been since I bought the car in 2012, so I only run 7 gallons at a time in the car which prevents it from leaking.

Also, if the tank has a lot of gas in it, you can drain it by disconnecting the line at the fuel filter under the body and quickly put a hose over it into a gas can. It will drain a lot of the gas out. It works best with the car jacked up level and high enough for a gas can to slide under. Have a few 5 gallon gas cans on hand ready to swap out. Figured that out when I went to swap in a new filter one day and had a new one with bad threads and couldn't get the line threaded in. Of course, found out later there is a way to relieve the pressure so it's not draining all over you, but live and learn!

sonjaab

Repairs ain't cheap anymore!
They want almost $600 for a exaust midpipe/muffler/tailpipe on my old Buick rat.
Parts cost under $100 bucks.
Did it myself in a hour!

GTA88

Thanks for the replies. Yes, that $533 estimate includes one Spectra pump.

I went over to a different independent shop and he looked it up in the computer and said it was a 3.8 hour job. (The first shop said 4.8 hours). The 3.8 hour guy is $97 an hour. He said the labor would be $380 and parts might be zero if I brought my own pump. He said a new sending unit would be $300 if I wanted one. I said no thanks.

He said it would be OK with him if I brought my own new pump. He recommended AC Delco, which has become Delphi, apparently. I said "those are made in China!' He said he didn't know where they were made, but he has never had a problem with them.

I saw an AC Delco pump kit online somewhere for $38. Might order that one. If I got an AC Delco pump from a retail store, anything risky about that?

One red flag thing with this guy, though. He wanted me to swing by so he could test my fuel pressure to verify that he would get the same reading I got (my gauge says 25 PSI at the rail) . Just to be polite, I asked him how much that would cost, expecting him to say it was free, but he said $35. Wow. 30 seconds to hook the gauge to the Schrader valve = $35. If I decide to use this shop, I'll just ask them to check the fuel pressure when I bring in the car, and I won't expect to be charged for it. (I've used 2 different gauges and they both say 25 PSI, so it's probably right).

So this shop would be $380 labor plus whatever parts they want to charge me for. Hangers, maybe. Bolts, spacers, whatever. Hopefully less than $20 in miscellaneous parts.

If it comes out to $400 plus my cost of $38 for the pump kit, that apparently would be a good deal, from what I'm hearing here.

Jbuchanan

I just did mine, and I am a mechanic. It took me about 3-3.5 hours at our shop but I also did a test drive with a customer and his car and I had almost 14 gallons in the original tank. I replaced tank as well. Since I don't own the shop and they let me use it for side jobs I charge $50.00 per hour when im working for myself. Our shop rate is $80 per hour. I will post what Mitchell and all data calls for on a fuel pump.

Jbuchanan

Jbuchanan

I'd go with shop that told you truth about what the book calls for(3.8 hours). Other shop added 1 hour to their estimate which im sure alot do. I don't agree with that. The goal of any decent tech is to do the job right and beat the time it calls for. Btw, the only materials I needed was a 2.75 inch i.d. exhaust coupling I welded in where I cut my exhaust. I have plans for a slp exhaust soon and I will have it flanged just before rear axle because of the fuel pump.

GTA88

Thanks for the info!

My tank is currently only a quarter full, which is about 4 gallons. I wonder if they just put the same gas back in the tank when done. Hope they don't tack on a fee for draining. They guy said $380 labor and no parts except the pump.

Your chart said $115 for the pump. Sounds like a lot. What would your shop charge for a new AC Delco or Delphi pump? I see them online for $38, including a kit with sock. I forget what the guy told me the cost would be for the pump, since I was planning on getting my own.


This job would take me days to do. I don't have anyone I'd be comfortable with to assist me with it, either. So I don't mind paying for it, but I will admit to being paranoid about having the price get bumped up somehow when I show up to pay the bill. But, the online reviews of this shop are good, so.... gonna have to roll the dice.

Jbuchanan

The first time I did my pump I had very little gas in it and I didn't drain it at all. Im guessing the extra hour is what they want to charge for draining and refilling. Wish you were close to Anniston Alabama lol. I'd fix you up tomorrow. I hope you do supply your own pump, most shops mark parts up 20%. Here's an example, our tickets from Oriellys has a list price to charge customers and has our price listed beside it.


Most shops charge list and pocket the rest.

scooter

iTrader: (11)

Not sure where in Eastern PA you are, but JS Performance may be able to give you a good price on replacement and he doesn't cheap out on parts.

He never disappoints when I bring my stuff there, I only bring jobs I don't have time for or need the lift. He is in the Bensalem area

Jbuchanan

I never have understood all data's part pricing as it is way out of line. As far as my shop goes we are limited to working on 1996 and later vehicles (owners personal preference) My GTA is the only one that sees the inside of our shop lol. Oriellys is our part supplier and we all know that is hit or miss when you're dealing with aftermarket parts. The sell precision pumps and we have never had a problem with them. I had a precision in the GTA but it died due to a crusty tank. I bit the bullet and ordered a walbro.

BadHabit

iTrader: (1)

beths91camaro

iTrader: (35)

I would go to your GM dealership- and get a Delphi or Delco pump. Well worth it, IMO. At least the pumps are cheaper than my 06 Escalade- I was just quoted $516 for JUST the pump!

TylerSteez

iTrader: (3)

Pretty sure I remember seeing threads of spectra pumps failing on people after a year,

GTA88

The guy I'm thinking of taking it to was acting like Delphi was the same as AC Delco, but O'Reilly website showed one AC Delco and one Delphi and they had different kits with them and different costs. I plan on calling a GM dealer nearby to see what they have.

Holy Cow, $516 just for the pump. Insane! That does make me feel better, though, lol. Thanks.

Drew

iTrader: (58)

In a way Delphi is AC Delco is GM. GM is a corporate conglomerate, comprised of a multitude of smaller automotive companies. For example, Saginaw, Fisher Body, Guide, Rochester, Packard, etc are all GM companies. To make things simpler GM tried to roll several of the brands into one division. Delphi is or was the Rochester, Packard Electrical, and a few other brands I don't recall at the moment. For reasons beyond what I really want to get into, Delphi split from GM at least on paper, but it's still GM really, or in theory... Further, Delphi has been rebranded as Aptiv now, so there's a bit more confusion for you.

The Del in Delphi and the Del in Delco sound similar eh? There's also Delco Remy, Delco Electronics, AC Spark Plugs, etc etc etc if you really want to dig in.

Bottom line is that a pump is a pump, and an AC Delco pump can be anything from the exact original pump, or a third party part with a GM name on the box. Same with Delphi. A lot of times, when a company changes names, they just rebox the inventory into the new brand's name. So buy what makes you feel good, and don't worry about it.

OrangeBird

iTrader: (1)

Maybe you Drew or any other member who knows can help me with this question as it somewhat follows the theme of your post ?

My question is this , I looked on Ebay at the Walbro 255 and found folks selling (in big capital letters) a "real genuine walbro" for around $80 . I also saw listings that claimed a "Walbro" but with no "genuine" advertising for about half that . Does the "real" Walbro have some kind of manufacturer's identification on it to prove it isn't just a re labeled "airtex" in a Walbro box ?

I ask because I have no experience with Walbro but have been hoodwinked when buying a heater control valve and don't want to pay $80 for a pump only worth $40 ?

Thanks in advance for any info to help me choose ....

Wickydooda

iTrader: (1)

It may be worth the 10 minutes it takes to lower the rear seats and peel back the carpet over the fuel tank hump to check if a previous owner has already cut an access window to the fuel pump. If so, definitely do it yourself, $500 seems like a lot assuming an access door is available.

Drew

iTrader: (58)

The Chinese will gladly manufacture a production run of whatever type pump a buyer wants, complete with copied markings and logos from the real deal. For years there have been reports of Chinese copies of the Walbro pumps, duplicated to the smallest detail.

http://www.fuel-pumps.net/walbro-forgeries.html

Generally the best way I know to avoid a Chinese knock-off is to not buy off Ebay or Amazon. A reputable seller that is a licensed dealer, located in the US is a much safer bet.

http://apeusa.com/ has been around forever, and while they might cost more than other places, you'll probably get what you're paying for.

Personally, I think the Walbro 255HP pump is loud. Loud enough that I wouldn't run one unless I really thought I needed to. The new pump in my parts stash is a stock replacement AC Delco. The stock AC Delco pump for a TTA, or Sy/Ty should be a direct drop in part, with somewhat larger capacity, or if a person is building a car with hefty fuel requirements the constant whirring whine of the high pressure Walbro might not be a big deal. I'm soft, I want comfort features like A/C, and limited noise. LOL

GTA88

I appreciate your suggestion. I already checked. No trap door.

At this point, the labor will 'only' be $380, from the second estimate, and I'll provide the pump probably.

TallTim

iTrader: (2)

Not sure I saw it here but since I just had a new airtronix FP fail so down came the tank again - since it sounds like you are going to have the job done a warranty might appeal to you even if you have to have them supply the part.

Did you check if your exhaust is welded? They might have to cut pipes...

GTA88

Yes, it is welded somewhere near a muffler clamp. Is cutting the exhaust a big deal? Wouldn't they just weld it back together at the cut?

You mean they would warrantee the labor (3.8 hours) if they suppled the part? Or just the part?


After reading here and talking to some local mechanics, I was planning on buying a Delphi pump for $62 from Autozone.

TallTim

iTrader: (2)

Some don't realize a FP change on our cars can involve welding, or using a band clamp or however you want reassembly to go. Would they re-weld?

My point is if a repair warranty matters to you be clear about the details. Sometimes if a bring-your-own part fails they won't cover the part or labor.

Thomas Stahel

iTrader: (1)

I'm not a mechanic. Did the replacement in my parking lot leaving the entire catback in one piece. If the rear is dropped as far as possible you only have to hit the sweet spot twisting and maneuvering the exhaust to get it out. All in all it was quite a lot of work doing it for the first time but not too difficult. Pump held up perfect so far, no problems at all, I used a Bosch pump. Made a good impression on me. I'd recommend getting the correct AC Delco seal for the sending unit as the one that comes with the Bosch pump lacks of the "wings".

You need to drop the rear and support it as far down as you can to be able to pull the tank as well as the exhaust which also needs quite some twisting. I used my jack to maneuver the exhaust. Pulling the tank is easier than getting it back up again. If you have another person at hand, it's a big help. I wouldn't want to do it with a full or half full tank. I was lucky that my pump wasn't completely dead so I could still drain the tank by using the pump and a hose connected to where the fuel filter sits.

Concerning the exhaust: If they (have to) cut it they could use a bigger sized short pipe to connect the cut ends if welding was too difficult.

GTA88

I'm going to talk to the shop tomorrow to see if they will warrantee the labor on a redo, if the pump I buy from them fails in the first 12 months or something. I'm pretty sure they won't warrantee anything (for free) but why not ask, right? Can't remember what price they wanted for their pump. They use AC Delco or Delphi, both of which are OK with me.

Thomas Stahel

iTrader: (1)

Actually, I don't trust AC Delco and many of the so called "quality brands" anymore. Have seen quite a few items. Some of them were good and some of them were relabeled cheap Chinese parts. Often if you buy AC Delco you get Raybestos, Delphi, Spectra etc. At least the Bosch pump looked quite different and more sturdy than all the others.

GTA88

Went back to the $388 labor place. He said he would give me a 2 year warranty on parts and labor if I bought his pump, which would cost $100 (Delphi or AC Delco). No warranty at all if I provide my own pump.

So the estimate would be $488 plus tax equals $518, to get a 2 year complete warranty. I think I will go with that.

Just have to wait for the holiday week (7 days!) that the shop is taking off for the week of July 4th. That's what they do around here. That's OK, I'm not in a rush.

GTA88

One more question on this subject.

Do the bolts holding the cat converter onto the rear pipe come out fairly easily if you soak them with Liquid Wrench for a while?

I saw one guy on Youtube heating them up with a torch before taking them out. Is that necessary?

I just looked at them and they look pretty clean and uncorroded.

Thanks

Bob88GTA

iTrader: (2)

Shoot them with PB Blaster and let it sit a bit. If uncorroded, you shouldn't have an issue.

Thomas Stahel

iTrader: (1)

If I think of the right ones they came off without any problem. Didn't use any lubricant. Actually I had almost no problem with any of the bolts / nuts that I had to open. The LCAs were the hardest as far as I remember. But you don't necessarily have to remove them. I did it because I replaced the LCAs.

GeneralDisorder

iTrader: (1)

In the course of being a performance shop owner, I have occasion to install a LOT of fuel pumps. We get our pumps from Deatschwerks:

https://www.deatschwerks.com/

Their pumps are Bosch cores - they are turbine pumps and are very quiet. Their DW300 is 265 LPH and much more silent than a Walbro. I used a kit for a C4 Corvette on my 86 Trans Am. Worked great and is still working great. These pumps last virtually forever and are cheap. Most of the kit's I pay less than $100 for wholesale.

GD

Bob88GTA

iTrader: (2)

Interesting GD. Which one would work for a 88 5.7 TPI?

chazman

iTrader: (4)

As Bob said, interesting, since I'm looking at a pump replacement very soon.

Which specific kit did you used for your '86?

GeneralDisorder

iTrader: (1)

I just used this kit for a 1990 C4 Vette:

http://deatschwerks.rpmware.com/deat...i-1974849.aspx

All you really need is the pump wiring pigtail, some FI hose, and some clamps. It's just an in-tank pump. I routinely retro-fit larger pumps into pickup assemblies not designed for them. I just did one a few days ago where I installed a 420 LHP pump into a housing with an integral fuel filter and had to remove the filter and it's housing and install a 40 micron stainless -6AN inline filter downstream from the tank.




GD

GTA88

Update to my thread about fuel pump: I finally had the pump replaced at a shop. Total cost was $580. Estimate was $530 but he added $50 for cutting and welding the exhaust. He said the tech doing the job took 7 hours!

I've driven the car around a few miles with the new pump and it's back to its old self again. I forgot how fast this car is.

I got a Delphi pump and a 2 year warranty on labor and parts.