I'm going to be changing my lifters when they come in this week, because they are tapping pretty bad and some of them are barely oiling at all. I prety much know the procedure and have a couple books to help me out if I got stuck, but I wanted to know if there are any trouble areas or tricks to make the job easier. Thanks.

------------------
82 Camaro:350, Erson cam, ported heads,Comp Cams 1.6:1 rocker arms, Edelbrock Performer RPM intake, Holley 600cfm, Crane Hi-6 ignition,
TH350 tranny with 2500 stall, Eibach Pro Kit, SLP 1 3/4" headers with 3" Flowmaster exhaust

 

i measure from the top of the rocker stud to the top of the rocker nut with the depth rod on my dial calipers before i remove the rocker nuts and then replicate the measaurement when it goes back together. it'll save you a lot of time and trouble adjusting the rockers. i also try to pump up the lifters in a oil jug and use moly lube on the cam lobes.

------------------
ICON Motorsports
1st & 3rd
MM Black Diamond 538 F&AM

 

When you take off the manifold put a paper towel or two on top of the distributor hole to make sure nothing falls down in there.

------------------
'86 IROC
T-TOPS, TINTED WINDOWS, BRAKE LIGHT BLACKOUTS
GM GOODWRENCH 350
EDELBROCK TES HEADERS
3" Hooker CatBack w/Aero Chamber muffler
EDELBROCK 600CFM CARB.
KN AIRFILTER
ACCEL HEI DISTRIBUTOR
160* Stat
3:73 Posi
Rebuilt 700R4
B&M Megashifter, 5" Autometer Tach w/shift lite

 

Good idea about the paper towel. That would have been something I forgot until something fell down the hole. By pumping up the lifters by putting them in an oil jug, do you mean letting them soak in oil for a few hours?

 

If this is a flat-tappet motor, I would watch out for more or less instant destruction of both the cam and the new lifters. That's a very bad idea, full of risks. Lifters almost never go bad and cause ticking in and of themselves; it's vitually always something else making the tick. So the odds are that you're barking up the wrong tree in the first place. Then, the real problem with what you're doing, is that the cam is ground at a slight angle, and the lifter bottoms are slightly convex; when you first put a new cam and set of lifters in. over teh course of the first few hundred miles they wear into each other's shape a little bit. So the cam is no longer exactly as it came out of its box. The chances are very high that at least one lobe of the cam will be worn far enough that it won't turn its lifter in its bore, in which case the lifter will sit still and get a slot worn into the bottom of it.

I think you're making a mistake by doing what you're doing. More than likely, the thing that is causing the ticking is push rods hitting the heads wrong. Did you use a Louis tool to lengthen your slots, or drill them WAY out and use guide plates? If not, then that's probably where the ticking is coming from.

------------------
"So many Mustangs, so little time..."
ICON Motorsports

 

I should have been a little more specific with what caused the problem. A few weeks ago, I broke the number 8 rocker arm stud. It also broke one pushrod and bent the other on that cylinder. Apparently the lifters also got damaged. I should have replaced the lifters when I got that fixed, but we felt they would be ok. They never pumped back up, so I'm going to go ahead and change them now before it's too late.

 

Good luck! You're going to need it.

So, how did all this damage occur? I'd still bet money that (a) the lifters aren't at fault, (b) changing them won't make any difference, and (c) the cam and new lifters all wipe out within 5000 miles.

It would make more sense to figure out what happened than just do some knee-jerk thing like that. It sounds to me like maybe you over-revved the motor, in which case you probably have other bent push rods and pulled studs and possibly damaged rockers, all of which of course will cause lots of ticking. You can't tell anything how lifters "pump up" from outside anyway.

In case you can't tell, I think you're doing the wrong thing...

------------------
"So many Mustangs, so little time..."
ICON Motorsports

 

Thanks, RB, you saved me a bunch of typing.

If you hurt one cylinder, very likely you hurt another.

Time for a full set of push rods, rockers, springs, and maybe studs, retainers, keepers, cam & lifters.

Note lifters are the last mentioned, and go with cam...

------------------
82 Berlinetta, orig V-6 car, now w/86 LG4/TH700R4. 2.93 limited slip. 2-1/2" cat-back, ZZ3 intake, Accel HEI SuperCoil. AMSOIL syn lubes bumper-to-bumper. Daily driver, work-in-progress (LG4 CC system w/'87 LB9 block, ZZ3 cam, ported World 305 heads, Hooker 2055 headers, 3" Catco cat & 3" catback, restalled TC, Spohn SFCs).
57 Bel Air, my 1st car. '66 396, 9.7 CR forged TRWs, Weiand Action+, Holley 750VS w/4150 conversion, GK 270 cam, Magnum rockers, Jacobs Omnipack, 1-3/4" Hedders & 3" Warlocks, TH400 w/TCI Sat Night Special conv & Trans-Scat shift kit, MegaShifter, 3.08 8.2" 10-bolt w/Powertrax, AMSOIL syn lubes bumper-to-bumper. Idles smooth @ 600 RPM in D. Best 15.02/95.06 @ 5800' Bandimere (corrected 13.93/102.4 @ sea level).

 

I don't know what you mean by this. If you're talking about something done when I put the 1.6:1 rocker arms on, I had someone else do that and new valvesprings in February, and I did not have any ticking noise until the stud broke.

Ok. I'm not sure why the rocker arm stud broke. We kind of think it mis-fired for some reason because I was having some ignition problems that are now fixed. Dunno. The motor has never been over 5800 rpm. The bottom of the stud was cracked, one pushrod was bent, and the other broke. One of the valves was messed up. That cylinder head came off and went to the machine shop to be repaired. None of the other valves were damaged. The other pushrods on that side were fine. None of the pistons were damaged. We checked the other side for damage. Rocker arm studs all looked ok. Pushrods all straight. We replaced all of them anyway. Lifters on that side pump oil all over the place. On the pass side, plenty of oil comes out of all the lifters except the ones on the number eight cylinder. As far as I know, when a lifter pumps up, it stops ticking, and it oils properly which can be checked by pulling the valve cover off and visually inspecting it. If I'm wrong on this, correct me. Valve springs, retainers, and rocker arms were replaced in February and still looked ok after the stud broke. All that's left on your list is a full set of keepers and a cam. If it's the cam, I'm f###ed. I'm back in school and have very little money or time. If you still think it's something else, let me know what to look at. I want your help, and I'm not trying to be arguementative. I'm just supplying you with as much info about my situation as I can. I came to the conclusion that it's those two lifters, because everything else was either replaced or passed mine and my mechanic's inspection except for the cam which I can't replace. We couldn't hear any unusual noise from the driver's side. It's only on the pass side. Let me know what you think now that you have this info.
Thanks,
Matt

 

OK, on the 1.6 rockers, here's the deal:

There's only one possible way to change the ratio. The "ratio" in question is the one between the distance from the rocker stud to the valve tip, and the distance from the push rod seat in the rocker to the stud. You can't change the distance from the stud to the vavle by replacing the rocker. So, when you put on higher ratio rackers, they are actually shorter from the push rod seat to the stud. This moves the place that the pushrod comes through the head closer to the stud. There is a slot in the head that serves as the push rod guide. It has to be a slot because the push rod's motion through the head isn't in a straight line, it's an arc. So, when you move the push rod closer to the head, the slot is often not long enough, and has to be lengthened in that direction. If that is not done, there is a good chance that the push rod will hit the end of the slot at either full open, or full closed. Hitting the head will produce a tick. If it hits it at full open it will usually destroy the end of the push rod, or the rocker, or both; if it hits at full closed, it might not wipe out, at leas tnot real fast, but will of course tick.

Lifter's don't "pump up". They contain a small reservoir of oil that's held in by a check valve; the oil pump forces oil into them, then the action of the cam psuhing them up causes the pressure in the little chamber to suddenly increase, which closes the check valve, which holds the oil in for the duration of the "stroke" of the lifter. The amount of oil that comes out the top of the lifter and travels up the push rod is completely random and uncontrolled; a number of things totally unrelated to lifter health will affect it, not the least being whether the hole in the push rod end matches the location of the hole in the rocker arm. That by itself does not tell you anything about whether the lifter is good or not.

The best thing to do would be to isolate the noise to its source. Replacing stuff by the shotgun method usually leads to frustration and unnecessary expanse. Get yourself a set of the little oil deflector clips to go on the rockers so you can run the engine with the VCs off and not make such a huge mess; take a piece of heater hose and stick one end in your ear, then probe around everything with the other end and try to narrow down where it's coming from. If you narrow it down toa particular valve, try just grabbing the rocker and se if you can make it quit; if not, then it isn't coming from excess lash.

Ticking can be caused by an enormous number of things. A rolled cam lobe; bent push rod; damaged rocker ball seat, or tip where it contacts the valve; valve spring parts sliding against each other (double valve springs with dampers are good at doing this); the above-mentioned guide slot issue; the retainer hitting the top of the valve guide; are all things that can cause it, besides a lifter's check valve not sealing.

It would help if you could figure out what happened that tore up whatever stuff. 5800 RPM isn't excessive, that shouldn't have hurt anything. Was there any sign that the piston had been hitting the valve? Your description definitely sounds like some kind of mechanical interfernece was (and maybe still is) going on. What's your cam lift, what heads, and what valve springs?

------------------
"So many Mustangs, so little time..."
ICON Motorsports

 

Is there a way to check if the slot for the pushrod slot is long enough?
There wasn't any sign of the piston hitting the valve. It was perfect. I don't remember what my mechanic said about how the valve was damaged.

I don't know much about the engine, because I bought from a guy my dad works with. The cam isn't very radical. "Just a little bigger than stock" according to him. You can barely hear it lope at idle. I know that information is basically useless.
The heads are a set of GM iron heads. I believe the casting number is 442, but I'm not sure. I think they're 76cc chambers. There was some minor porting and polishing done on them by the previous owner.
The springs are Comp Cams double valve springs: 1.440" diameter doule sprig w/ damper. Valve lift up to .560". 120# @ 1.800" closed, 290# @ 1.250" open, coil bind @ 1.100"

Not the greatest info, but it's what I've got.