Caballero83

Hey all.

Got a quick query, and here seemed like the place to ask - hard to get a more knowledgable bunch of people about a subject in one place!

Long story short, my father was a huge fan of Camaro's and owned a number of second and third gen models - I remember him having a couple of third gens when I was a kid, and I fell in love with them. Anyway, he passed away recently and, as a sort of tribute, i'm looking at getting hold of a third gen myself to remember him by. I'm based in the UK though, so finding the right one isn't easy!

Basically, i've found one I love the look of, but isn't the exact car I know much about so wanted some advice. All the one's i've driven/seen in my past were 5.7L Z28's, ranging from about 1984-87 and this one isn't - it's an '89 Camaro with (I think?) the 305 5.0L engine rather than the juicer (but possibly more fun!) 5.7L.

What I really wanted to ask is - and appreciate it's a hard question to answer - are these engines any good? I know to steer clear of the weasley 2.5/2.8 models but unsure about this one. I've done some research, but it seems there are a confusing number of engine's out there - this appears to be the carbureted version rather than the fuel injected (from a photo of the engine bay) but trying to get an idea of HP or performance is tricky. Would just be great if anyone with knowledge could help narrow down which cars were available in '89! (there's some photos if they'd help...)

To any mods - if this is in the wrong place, sorry and feel free to move. Just a young guy trying to get on the Camaro ladder and hoping for some enthusiast help!

86LG4Bird

iTrader: (1)

Welcome to ThirdGen!
Honestly, I really think you're better off with the carb'd V8 than with the TPI. It's so much more mod-friendly, and a lot simpler than chasing electrical/sensor problems on a 30+ year old TPI car.
With the age of these cars, most that you will find for a reasonable price will have a long block that's pretty much used up. With the carb'd version, when the time comes for an upgrade, all you have to do is throw a more modern 350 cube roller cam motor under it, and it will run great. (see my sig for before and after). With TPI, especially the speed-density versions, you'd better have a good EFI tuning resource handy.
Even though the LG4 (CCC-305) had only 150-155 hp factory, all it takes to get up near 200 is to replace the ENTIRE exhaust system (manifolds to muffler) with the better version for a TPI car, let the engine breathe through more than that pathetic little opening leading to the air cleaner, and bump the timing up slightly. I also saw an improvement by richening the secondary side of the carb with a hanger/rod swap.

84 1LE

iTrader: (9)

305 (5.0) is as good as a 350 (5.7), both are reliable with the proper maintenance.In terms of HP, 5.7 is a better starting point over 5.0, as is F.I over a carb.If its an 89 & original, it is probably TBI, not carbed.TBI's use an air cleaner very similar to a carb engine.So if your unfamiliar with either, a look under the air cleaner may be necessary.

Whether carb is "better than F.I is a matter of opinion, but being in the UK you're probably more familiar (& used to) w/ EFI than carburetors.

TBIs made around 170HP & its a wet system, so they're not as good at making HP over a TPI set-up.Id personally would rather have F.I over carb, but in the end its your choice.

UltRoadWarrior9

Welcome to TGO and sorry for your loss...

I've had 2 1986 Camaro's. My first was a carb'd 305 SC. Then I put in a 350 with shorty headers, and a roller cam from a '91 firebird. It was pretty fast and I really liked driving it. Crashed it a couple times (I was young and dumb). My second is my current car. It plopped into my lap for $500. It's a 305 with TPI, IROC Z28. The engine and manifolds are OEM. I just recently addded a 3" cat-back exhaust.
Comparing the 2 is difficult, but the throttle response on the TPI makes it more enjoyable to 'race'.
If I had a choice now I'd go with a 350 TPI later model year, like a 1991 or 1992 hardtop, no T-tops. Definately IROC Z28 model.

Good luck finding your car!

Dr34m

Don't talk to me i understand (since i own a 2.8 V6), but if you can find a cheap 2.8 V6 i would advice you getting that, if you can. Obviously if you have loads of cash lying around, don't mind me and get a 5.0 or 5.7 V8. Like previous guys have said it here, get a carbed version. Why? It costs a lot less (i think i can get one for 300 bucks around here) compared to TPI which can get to 500-800 bucks depends. The carbed ones are cheaper, because there are more of them and people "Think" they are sh**tier because they are not TPI... I argue that it doesn't matter, you can always modify your car with turbos and intake if you want.

Getting back to my 2.8 V6 point. Parts are cheap and if you are a beginner like i am (well i can say i am now a level above beginner), it is really fun to work on a V6, because its like a risk-free project. If everything goes haywire, just buy a 5.0/5.7 V8 . With the 2.8 V6 you can test a lot of things first, intake, turbos, chips etc. Also for an example i got my bird 50% less of the price on the market compared to V8 and auto tranny (i got myself a man tranny, because i only like manuals). The 2.8 V6 versions are a looooooooooot cheaper (ofc it depends how good of a salesman you are and where you buy).

Just my 2 cents, i bought my car because it was in excellent looks condition (the body has no rust places basically), newly put colors, the inside of the car looks fresh and it had low mileage (110k miles, ofc this can lie...). Bought it from a guy who told me that the car was in Germany. Prolly a rich guys car, since the USA history says it drove there only 5 miles. Germany didnt give me any car history. The only minus was the 2.8 V6, but its so fun to work around it and in the future, putting in a V8. If you have loads of cash, dont look here.

"EDIT" - Just to clarify, i live in Europe and firebirds dont cost 300-1000 around here. The usually go 4-5k average market price.

Caballero83

Amazing, thanks all! Interesting point about the air cleaner, I just assumed carbed from the photos.

The car is apparently an RS from Germany (speedometer is in km/h) - again from my meagre research, it seems that the 305 could either be an LO3 or an LB9. What's the quickest way to tell?

86LG4Bird

iTrader: (1)

LO3 is TBI (would have a circular air cleaner on top, just like carbed).
LB9 is TPI (would be easily recognized by the TPI upper plenum and runners).

Caballero83

That's fantastic, thank you - LO3 it is!