Kiwallo

I had a machine shop put together my 383. I've got all forged internals, 850 hardcore series carb with 80/80 jets and a 4.5 power valve, patriot freedom heads 64cc, .555 lift comp cam, super victor intake, roller rockers, Holley mechanical fuel pump 110gph, headers, And 3 inch exhaust. Car is built for the strip but I'd be embarrassed to take it there currently. I have a full msd ignition and my initial timing is set at 20 and I'm all in at 36. The car lacks power. I had the same set up before besides my new heads and a bigger cam. Can't figure out what the problem is. Fuel ratio is 14:1 at idle 12.5:1 at light accelerating and 11.8:1 when I punch it. I know I might have a small header gasket leak but don't think that can account for all the power I'm missing. I think my Silverado would come close to beating this car currently. Any ideas out there? Thanks guys!

kevwalt22

Make sure no vaccum leaks at all first. Is transmission good or questionable?Auto or manual? Does engine die or is it just not getting power to wheels?

Kiwallo

transmission is a th350 that was rebuilt about 2 years ago to withstand 600hp. I was looking for vacuum leaks but am wondering where is thebmost coming place to check? I have obviously checked the carb ports and one goes to my tranny and I plugged the brake booster port. Is there any easy way to check for vacuum leaks besides a smoke machine?

Kiwallo

Engine doesn't die and sounds very healthy

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

11.8 is rich. Go more like 12.8 for starters

Do a proper break in on the rings?
Whats the cam specs and what valvesprings

Kiwallo

Yes the rings were broken in properly.

Kiwallo

I'll probably rejet the carb too. 80 might be on the high end I guess

kevwalt22

My method to check for vaccum leaks: spray bottle with water..I spray on intake gasket areas and listen for engine to stutter slightly...where ever I squirt water and I get engine response is the leak..or u can see positive pressure leak if water bubbles(head to block area)

TTOP350

iTrader: (8)

cam timing ok?

Kiwallo

See I don't know much about cam timing. I've never done it. What should I look for? Or ask the builder?

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Thats a good size solid flat tappet deal. Its gonna want to spin some rpm. Will need a fairly good stiff spring in those heads. Would be nice to know the springs that came in those heads to be sure.

Whats the plug gap?

Whats the compression?

Kiwallo

Plug gapped at .35 I'm using ngk heat range 8. I will check on the springs tomorrow to see what they have for sure. I really appreciate the help guys!

Kiwallo

12:1 compression. 100 octane fuel right now but will switch to e85 whenever I get t figured out. 7.50 a gallon is rough

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Heat range 6-7 would be better in that motor. 8 is alittle cold imo. Thats more for nitrous and boosted cars

E85 will like the hotter plug as well

Rancid87

You may want to fire the engine up at night with no lights on and pop the hood. Issues like this are often caused by bad plug wires. If you see a light show than you know may want to replace the wires.

NoEmissions84TA

iTrader: (1)

Was the camshaft actually degreed in?
Is there any easy way to check for vacuum leaks besides a smoke machine?
Spray carb cleaner, but it eats paint. Even better propane torch (not lit).
When you find the leak, the engine will smooth out.
A flat tappet camshaft can have the lobes wiped out in 20 minutes without proper break procedures and oil additives.
It should have been broken in with weak break-in springs, or reduced ratio rockers.
Without actually looking it up, that cam will begin to pull at about 4000 rpm.
With a combination like that, your rear gears need to be in the 4s, possibly even 5s.

NoEmissions84TA

iTrader: (1)

You will have to rejet for e85 - it takes nearly double the amount as gasoline.

Kiwallo

Joe Gibbs break in fluid was used and the cam was broken in properly. That's coming from the builder. Im thinking I'll pull the cam if I can't figure this out soon. If the lobes are wiped out I'll take it down to his shop and beat him over the head with it.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Just pop valve covers off and either crank it over off the starter or turn by hand off crank bolt. Watch the rockers and see if each makes a full lift cycle. If one is wiped it wont be moving as much. If thats the case the motor is likely shot and gonna require rebuild and cleaning. Metal in oil passages needs flushed. Bearings likely taken out.

But if it sounds good and seems to drive fine then it sounds like it isnt a worn lobe. Plugs would also likely show it. Pull them and check. Make sure they are all looking same.

Kiwallo

Ok I will do that also , the only thing odd I noticed also is that my spark plugs were fouled before. Put brand new NGKs in and the strap looks white??? I've checked the oil ton make sure nothing crazy was happening. No metal or anything other than oil. It looked really good. I would think white means too lean but my fuel to air ratio is rich.

NoEmissions84TA

iTrader: (1)

ANY glitter in the oil and YOU HAVE a problem.
I hope not for your sake.
The slight bit of oil that is sitting under the valve covers will tell the story.

Kiwallo

i looked in the valve covers and no glitter whatsoever. Oil looks great. Interested in starting the car at night to see the spark plug wires. They are newer wires but hey you never know. I hooked the timing light up and checked each wire that it was at least firing and they all were.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

I think there may be potential that you are floating the valves. If those have the .575 lift hyd flat tappet springs they probably float the valves over 5800 rpm. You need one of their upgrade springs. They have a 143 lb seat 325 open spring that would be better, but i'd prefer to see more open pressure. But not sure how much pressure a mech tappet core cam can handle

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

It's more like 1/3rd more.

But it takes a lot more than rejetting. So much so that it makes more sense to buy a carb built for E85.

Kiwallo

I will get the car fired up here tomorrow hopefully and give you guys an update. My throttle linkage was kinked and could have been a problem since I don't think it was fully opening the throttle. I have also went down to a 4.5 power valve and haven't run it since then. Wondering if the 6.5 was kicking on while idling? Also going to replace the header gaskets . Will update soon. Thanks a lot guys.

Kiwallo

Has anyone had luck with the DIY e85 conversion kits with a Holley?

NoEmissions84TA

iTrader: (1)

YES, that would CERTAINLY do that. You MUST have someone push the pedal
to the floor while you are looking down the carb for full throttle. Just working
the linkage by hand at the carb won't cut it.

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

"Luck", or "experience"?

I got it to run. Actually did well at the track. But driveability was poor.

I started with a used 650 Holley DP. Put a Proform 750 main body in it before starting the conversion. Not much was available in 2006 for E85, so I started with rejetting and air bleeds. Wouldn't idle worth a hoot - didn't idle well with gasoline, either, discovered the throttle body was poorly made. I tried fixing what was wrong with it with limited success, so I got a stainless throttle body made for alcohol - that helped. Not long after that Quick Fuel came out with E85 metering bodies - that helped a lot, party because I now had 4-corner idle mixture adjustability. By that time I had as much into that carb as a carb built for E85 costs new. All I had from the original 650 was the float bowls.

Which is why I say it makes much more sense to just buy a carb built for E85. Sell your current carb to offset the cost of the new E85 carb, you'll be dollars and headaches ahead.

Twin_Turbo

iTrader: (25)

First q would be has the cam been degreed or just put in straight up

MSgt Luttrell

How much stall are you running? That camshaft will require quite a bit of stall with an automatic transmission. Does it bog off the line then run stronger at higher rpms?

Kiwallo

No it is really goodnoff the line.

Kiwallo

Ok guys, new air filter , throttle adjusted properly, and embarrassing enough to say but my plugs wires were crossed..... obviously that scenario proved to fix the problem. Before you say I'm an idiot the wires crossed behind the engine and I didn't see that....yea I'm an idiot . Anyways thanks everyone!!!! One last question. What a/f ratio should I be looking to achieve for maximum power? I picked up some new jets and will mess around with it this weekend. Any recommendations on oil also?

84PontiacTA

Good to hear you got it figured out. I am dropping a fresh 383 in mine hopefully next weekend and like to read about the issues guys are having in case I run into problems. Right now trying to decide how big of a mechanical fuel pump I need. I would like to keep using the return line.

MSgt Luttrell

I used a 45 PSI Summit Racing electric pump mounted near the tank and a return style regulator for my carbed 383; it works great and keeps the fuel cooler with the return flow to the tank.

NoEmissions84TA

iTrader: (1)

and embarrassing enough to say but my plugs wires were crossed

Let me guess #5 & #7.

NoEmissions84TA

iTrader: (1)

I bought a Carter M6626.
http://www.jegs.com/i/Carter/180/M6626/10002/-1
Less than $20. You can get it even cheaper on ebay.
Specifications: Free Flow Rate 120 gph
Inlet Attachment Stock
Maximum Pressure (psi) 5.5 to 6.5

I have not had the chance to try it yet.
I also will be keeping the return line.

In the past, when I was doing 1/4 mile runs on the highway, I was running out of fuel as I shifted into drive. I band-aided that by installing a small electric Purolator #12S near the tank to give the fuel a push up to the STOCK block mounted mechanical FP.

If you are getting rid of your emissions stuff - charcoal canister, don't just cap off all the vacuum lines.
You will prevent the tank from being vented and any fuel pump will have a hard time of supplying fuel
because a vacuum will be created in the tank.

Kiwallo

You would think it was 5 and 7 but it was 2 and 4... it must of got crossed when I was changing the spark plugs out because I know I checked it at least 3 times. Prior. The car wasn't running great beforehand anyways. I honestly think the new air filter and sealing the headers and collectors improved a ton!

84PontiacTA

Thanks NoEmissions84TA, I have been looking at the Carter M6626, but it said it only has a 40gph flow rate. Was going to get it anyway because it seems like a lot of guys are using it.

84PontiacTA

Thanks for the info, MSgt Luttrell. Our engines are similar, so your setup should work good for my 383. I just had it dyno'd and it makes 425hp and 460tq.
What branch of the service were you in? Semper Fi.

MSgt Luttrell

I did 24 years as a Crew Chief in the USAF, my father was a Marine, so back at ya Brother! You will enjoy that engine, these cars are a blast with that much torque. By the way, unless that 700r4 is beefed up a lot, it won't last long behind that motor, my stock transmission didn't last two months behind my 383. I replaced it with a level three Raptor 700 and was amazed at how much power I'd been losing through the stock transmission.

84PontiacTA

I had the transmission rebuilt and beefed up a couple years ago right after I got the car. The car had a 400sbc with lots of torque. That's probably why the tranny was bad.

sprojam

70/70 probably the jet you want our elevation is similar.