I am swapping intake manifolds and I decided to check my 15 year old lifters. 15 of them looked perfect but this one had a little pitting and what looked like a casting defect. What do you guys think? I measured the lifer length and its right on spec and there is no dishing using a straight edge to check. I am going to boroscope the cam soon but should I replace it and do another break in or toss it back in and send it? I am worried about the quality of newer lifters.

 

Yeah that doesn't look good. While you have it apart, you could put a set of Comp Cams DLC lifters in there...

 

It's been rotating properly at least...

Still, looks like it's not long for the world. No doubt the cam has similar weird marks too. I don't think I'd run that.

 

Was that engine run with some kind of magic elixir oil fortifier in it, such as STP or Lucas?

 

I didn't know those existed they seem like they could be a cool solution if the cam looks okay

I'm going to check it today see how it looks


No magic elixir I bought the car about 15 years ago with the engine in it for the first five or so years I ran rotella for the last 10 years Lucas hot rod oil. I'm guessing that something happened when a couple of my valve spring dampeners disintegrated about 10 years ago

 

Pull another lifter and put the faces together, they should rock as they are not supposed to be flat. What does the cam lobe look like?

 

Did the lifter test and I got a little rocking but I don't think it matters. I checked out a few cam lobes at the top of the lift a lot of them looked pretty shiny but I also saw all this pitting around the sides and base circle . Think it's time for a new cam.

 

Yeah if that's the one with the fornicated lifter, then the lobe is obviously equally fornicated. Time for a new plan.

 

Yes that is the matching lobe and there is another that looks like that. I already have my plan just replace everything and be done

 

Got the car apart today and the new cam in still waiting on the lifters to come in the mail. But I found this lovely surprise very happy I decided to do this project

 

Wow...

 

Good thing that you decided to replace the cam. You caught that broken timing chain just in time.

Fred

 

That sneaky little sucker was just WAITING to ruin your day!!

 

Whose cam and lifters did you decide on?
Do you have a plan for break-in?

 

XE274 DLC flat tappet.

I got a jug of Lucas breakin oil I have the comp assembly lube my plan is to get everything together then prime the oil before I put the distributor in. I'm going to reset my sniper back to factory settings so it should start up no problem then I'll do a normal break in per the comp procedure and change the oil

 

Not sure who Comp sources their parts from these days. Aside from what the flat tappet circle track guys are running (USA made) they're better than any of the economy stuff.
Lucas SAE 30 is a solid choice. So is running a higher ZDDP synthetic for a daily engine oil. Something like Mobil High Mileage or Extended Performance has a reputable mix of ingredients to help with all of the metals in the engine long after the break in is done.
The 274 doesn't require a heavy spring so the option of switching to a lighter break in spring may not be necessary. Otherwise it's a well practised maneuver to ensure things don't die on the initial run in.

 

According to comp COMP Cams produces its cam cores in-house in Memphis, Tennessee, or procures them from specialized suppliers like CMC and EPC.

I am going to run single springs on the break-in and I'm really hoping the DLC lifters are worth what the internet says about them.

I will probably run Lucas hot rod oil after I've had pretty good luck with that

 

Those timing chains do not have a long life span. Install a quality OEM style chain on it.

 

The chain I took off I think was genuine GM at least looking at the markings

 

The cam sprocket may be GM; doesn't mean all the other parts are. For example, I see a triangle timing mark on the crank sprocket, and multiple keyways. Tells me, that sprocket has the 3 settings for "straight-up" and 4° advanced and retarded: the mark for "straight-up" is a circle, and the others are a square and a traingle. AFAIK yerbasic typical GM truck timing set (which is what that cam sprocket would be part of) don't have any such, only one keyway and one (circle) mark. IOW, given that the crank sprocket is CERTAINLY NOT OEM, who knows whether the chain is OEM, or not. I can't identify it one way or the other, maybe somebody else can, I simply don't bother with those things regardless so they're outside of my experience. It's a TOTAL ***** chain anyway, typical of cheeeeeep "bushing roller" or "truck roller" GARBAGE; just look at how the "rollers" are nothing but stamped sheet metal, and how weeeeeeeenie the ends of the pins are staked (the feature that failed). This is the literal POSTER CHILD for why NOT to buy those cheeeeep POSs. An OEM style (Link-Belt) chain is FAR better than that CRAP.

 

The chain is a cloyes 9-1100 the shape of the key ways, marks on the lower gear, part numbers and use of a GM upper gear all match.

https://cloyes.com/part-finder-single/?partno=9-1100

On the plus side got the engine broken in, changed the oil, found no disco ball in the used oil and the car sounds really good nice and quiet no ticking or tapping after the oil change I can't wait till it stops snowing and I can actually do stuff with it

 

'Glad you fixed it...

 

So maybe not a GARBAGE ***** chain? I looked up the Cloyes info through your hyperlink: made in USA, based in USA, pretty long history, pretty standard chain for an SBC and actually marketed as a "high performance" part. Yours probably suffered a manufacturing defect, which shouldn't happen in an ideal world, but happens sometimes even with good manufacturers. BTW the link-belt chains are manufactured with the same pin staking as your roller and can have the exact same thing happen with a random pin, so I wouldn't hesitate to put another roller on there.

 

Manufacturing defect would make some sense. That chain has been on the car for at least 16 years of my ownership plus however many before me. It does have Japan stamped on it for whatever that's worth.

Either way I have a new chain and gear now and I just opened up my oil filter and it looked nice and clean inside

 

I run that same cam in my 350. I do run 1.6 rockers on mine. I think you will be very happy with the power and torque.

 

Years ago they removed zinc from oils.
Now there is no protection for flat tappet cams.

 

There have been improvements in that regard so it's not as dire as it might seem. For example, Mobil 1 Extended Performance or High Mileage has increased levels of ZDDP. The race engine builders that I chat with all like to see 1000 ppm (or so) of zinc/phosphorus in the daily oil. This is especially true with flat tappet cams but also of significance in a roller cammed engine. It's all of those dissimilar metals that need the surface wear protection for a long service life. Or race season to race season as the case may be.
The Mobil 1 fact sheet is attached. Hard to find that data for other oils though. That said, the specialty brands like Joe Gibbs, Lucas, VR1, etc all have that documentation somewhere.

The Oil Geek has a recent video on this too, Very insightful.

 

^True.
^That is not quite true. They reduced the amount of zinc, not removed. and there is way, WAY more to cam protection, than "zinc".

THIS is an incredibly good read, Jim Rogers does some fantastic digging, reports back on all of it, and has excellent citations. Definitely very much worth the time it takes to read it all.

 

If you shop around you'll find large variances in the ZDDP too.
As for WAY more to it...that's true too. It was explained by a tribologist on another forum how the detergents in the oil, mainly calcium, IIRC, and the zinc/phosphorus both compete for the same real estate. The ZDDP is trying to add wear protection whereas the detergent is trying to strip it away. The amount of calcium becomes less important is the oil is changed frequently. The Oil Geek also touches on that in the above video.

 

Still plenty of oils available that do have higher levels of zinc though. You can get Valvoline VR1 off of the shelf at just about any Walmart.

 

It's the amount that's important as well. Too little and we all know the results. Too much, as in something like Lucas SAE 30 Break-in oil, while excellent for break-in when the surfaces are fresh and the boundary layer protection can be laid on. It's that ability of the zinc to penetrate the surfaces that also makes elevated levels of zinc, say well above 1500 ppm, make it unsuitable for a daily driver as the acidic component of the anti-wear qualities will do more harm than good.
FWIW, I'm no expert but I can hope to offer some insights by repeating what I've been told by experts.
Take it as you will.
Speedway Motors has a handy zinc/phosphorus guide which is linked below.

https://www.speedwaymotors.com/the-t...2fFAHVC0rQJZxD

 

I did a lot of research on this topic back when I had my '69 Chevelle. Most everyone recommended VR1 or Lucas Hot Rod oil for higher zinc levels in older flat tappet engines. Oil topped out around 1400ppm zinc in the 70s and 80s and currently VR1 is 1100-1400ppm depending on weight. Mobil 1 Classic wasn't available back then but it has 1400ppm and that's probably what I will switch to from now on.

 

Break in went well, I pulled the intake manifold and checked the lifters after. Not a scratch on the DLC snowed last weekend hoping to get more driving in this weekend. So far my test drives felt good just need to test and tune now.