well i just i put in my timing chian and after i was done it did not want to start after it was all done. then some guy came over that knew about cars i did not like him touching my car since he said he does rotary cars then i read that we need to have every thing at TDC and the distributer at number 1 piston and have the compression ect. after we did this the second time right then the timing chian the 2 little dots were not meeting each other back up and i dont know whats going on

i dont know what to do

does the cam gear dot has to be at the top or the bottom facing the crank bolt ?????????/

please help

 

Assuming it's a standard one position timing set, there is a dot on the cam gear and a dot on the crank gear. These need to be facing each other with #1 piston at TDC.

The crank gear dot needs to be at 12 o'clock (straight up) and the cam gear needs to be at 6 o'clock (straight down).

Use a ruler or other straight edge to ensure that the dots, the center of the cam, and the center of the crank all form an *EXACTLY STRAIGHT LINE* with all four points lined up against the ruler.

While you're disassembling your engine, repeat the following out loud continuously:

"Next time I'll read the manual."

 

What if its like a tiny hair off whould that make a big difference or what and the dots are facing each other nware they supposedto meet up after cranking ?

 

if both dots are not in a straight vertical alignment, then your valve timing will be off and your car will never run worth a damn and may risk putting a valve into a pistion. as for the timing marks, the crank should always be straight up and the cam could be either straight up or down. you will hear much contention. i have always been tought down, but in the worse case scenario you will only be 180 degrees off because the crank turns twice for every cam revolution. so if you put the dots facing each other and turn the crank around twice, they will both be facing up.

what type of timing chain did you put in there?
i just read a post saying that some double rollers won't work in our car and will bind.
i don't know how true that is and hope someone will come along and either vindicate or dismiss this bit of info.

if it cranked over fine, then reset your timing marks how they should be and set your timing. if you never turned the distributer then you probably had everything set 180 out.
jess

 

I have used both Cloyes and Speed-Pro double roller timing sets in GM roller cam engines with no problems. Current engine has a Speed-Pro set in and over 20K miles of street and racing service.

Align the dots as I originally said, drop in the dist w/ the rotor on #1, and fire it up with a timing light ready to dial it in.

 

WELL guys after doing some more reading me and my partner found something that was bad and did not cross are minds


the harmonic balancer slipped and was throwing us off so we bought a new 1 and now every thing is lined up the crank on tdc the the rotor pointing to number 1 and the dots are perfect any thing eles
??????????

 

NEOMASTER,

Just so we're all on the same page, let's get some items listed. Feel free to correct me wherever I'm mistaken, or fill in any additional imformation:

1. The new timing chain is installed with the crank gear and cam gear markers in alignment (either top/top or top/bottom - it doesn't really matter);

2. With the engine at TCD on the compression stroke of the #1 cylinder, you installed the distributor with the rotor pointing at the #1 cylinder plug wire on the cap;

3. The marker on the outer ring of the damper was out of position from ring slippage, and you installed a new damper;

4. The timing sprocket pointers are now in alignment and the distributor is installed.


I don't see a problem. Once you finish reassembling the engine, it should run just fine.

As a hint, some aftermarket timing sets are marked 180° out of position from the original. It just doesn't matter for valve timing. If you installed the sprockets and chain so the marks were in alignment (eitheer top or bottom on the cam sprocket), the valve timing will be correct. The DISTRIBUTOR may be 180° out of position, but that's very easy to change by removing and reinstalling it.

Rotate the engine by hand until both of the valves on the #1 cylinder are closed and the piston is at TDC as indicated by the timing marks on the damper outer ring.


NOTE: This should coincide with the keyway in the crank snout pointing toward the #1 cylinder. The keyway in the crank snout and the valve timing indicator dot on the crank sprocket are NOT necessarily in alignment, and don't have to be. Inspect your old sprocket to see what I mean. What this means is that the valve timing marks probably aren't in alignment when the engine is at TCD on the #1 cylinder - and that is perfectly acceeptable.


Install the distributor with the rotor pointing at the #1 cylinder spark plug wire. Snug down the distributor clamp bolt and start the engine to set the base timing with your light.

Easy enough?

 

This is how me and my dad changed my timing chain... if you're not taking the cam out, you don't really need to line anything up. Just take the timing gear off the cam and the tension on the valvetrain won't let the cam move. So just take the old gear off, and put on the new one. But just to be sure, we lined up the marks to go up and down so that in case the cam did move we could align it... but if you're not taking the cam out and just doing the chain, top dead center for cylinder 1 doesn't really matter ... does it?

 

ok well thankx for the help but there is a new problem how far should the balancer go it if it band new ?

and the problem is that the crank screw is stripped and also the the tread in the crank is also and we already tapped it a lil and still stripps

i dont want a new crank any what to do

 

Neo,

Drill and tap the bolt hole of the cast crank snout and install a thread insert:



THEN, use a pulling stud, washer, and nut instead of the crank bolt to install the balancer.

 

WELL AFTER 5 HOURS PUTTING EVERYTHING TOGETHER the bit*h did not start again im tired of this and dont know what to do

but hey i got the screw to work in the blancer but it wont start it makes some backfireing noise like it wants to start but it wont i dont know

new eng ???????

 

Time to swallow your pride and have it towed in to a shop.

 

Did you take out the distributor? (I hope not.) If so, why? Was there a reason? If you didn't take it out then you don't have a timing problem, your timing is right where it was except without the timing chain slop of a few degrees of retard.

Look for wires disconnected and stuff like that. Don't try to outsmart yourself. Keep it simple. Think of things that will keep the engine from running: compression, fuel, correctly timed spark; verify each one; go from there.

 

Well guy today im going to try out the simple things some idiot took out th edistrbiuter i dont know what he did but ??? sooo ill today see if it statrs if not i dont know what to do cause im not going to take all the **** apart again



thanks for gelping any more suggestions will be appreciated

 

Just to start from the top...if the dots are lined up (crank at 12, cam at 6) you ARE NOT on TDC #1. That is TDC #6.

When you install a timing set this way, you need to make one more revolution of the engine to then drop the dist in at #1.

As Vader said....just rotate the engine by hand till just after the ex valve in number 1 closes, this should have both valves in #1 closed...line the timing marks line up and drop the dist to #1.

If the gears were lined up, you dont need to take anything back apart...sounds like you just have the dist issue off.

 

I guess what Engineboy's pointing to is that installation procedure may vary by timing set manufacturer.

When I assembled my current engine, the instructions said crank marker straight up and cam marker straight down such that they face each other. This was with a SpeedPro double roller set.

 

This is the correct way to assemble the gears...and the way they want you to..nothing wrong with that.

But in 20 years I have never seen one that has had TDC comp on #1 with the gears like that. (maybe I just have never seen that set )

I always install them like that, then rotate the engine one more time, and then drop the dist. to #1. Never had a problem.

No matter what, as long as the dots are lined up, you just need to rotate the engine till TDC #1 comp, then drop the dist.

 

engineboy, i thought cylinders #'s 1 and 6 are companion cylinders, meaning when 1 is at tdc so is 6? also on my timing set when cylinder 1 is at tdc the cam and crank both align straight up at 12:00 and that's how the chilton's book shows it too.

 

They are..but when #1 is on compression stroke ...#6 is on exhaust stroke and visa versa.

They are both going up, but for different reasons.


And yes, if you line up the gears both at 12 o clock, you would be at TDC comp for #1....but not 6.

If you line up the gears at crank 12 o clock and cam at 6 o clock as stated above, you are on TDC ex stroke in #1 and TDC compression in #6.

 

I have seen them like that (dots next to each other = #1 firing) - the original '57 283. When they went to the smaller cam gear, both dots @ 12 o'clock is #1.

I'm usually adjusting lifters between the timing set going on and the distributor going in (and front cover's been on a long time by then), so I don't even concern myself with "were's the dots?".

 

If thats the case...cool, that explains why I've never seen one, can't remember the last time I worked on a 283...lol

I usually don't worry about it either, I do as you do, install gears dot to dot...adjust valves...then rotate till #1 compression by putting finger in plug hole...drop dist.

 

1991 for me.

First time was 1972...

 

We have a 57 283 at the shop (complete running chassis, got dumped for a vette/tube chassis combo)..I might just have to tear it apart and check it out.....

 

I think I know what wrong, you should get someone that knows about cars to help you. Maybe someone with a 385 Stroker.
The problem is that TPI sucks.

And yes I am right the camshaft DOT goes to the BOTTOM, and the crank DOT to the TOP. I talked to your dad the other days and told him.

Hey Robert was up.

NEO Master!!?1 what the fu#$.....

Hahahahaha.
Take care

 

WELL guyz i got the car to start and when it did start the valves stared to tapp i dont know why ? so we adjust them and found 2 bent rods but stilll running like sh*t and when u floor it the rpms rise so slow like a honda i hate it and plust the the thing came off timing when the guy for got to tight the screw well here i am stuck with a slow car any 1 can help

afb camro is a slow rs that i beat many times so dont pay no mind to him his car does this to me when i beat him


91 rs :hail: 85 z28

are u still scared omar beat me if u can when i fix my car lol but suvive if i let u

 

Hey Neo, I told your dad that the pushrods might be bent. You could also have some valves hurt. Since your timing chain let go. Replace the pushrods and see what happens. If your lucky you wont have to replace your valves.

Oh yeah. A broken pushrod, bent valve 305 is gonna take on a 400hp 385.

Ok then!!??!?!

Neos car goes puut puut, puut.. BOOM!

Get rid of that Tunned Crap Injection. Maybe then youll beat that elusive geo metro.

Take care man.

PS. Replace them pushrods

 

well right now u rs boy that 383 **** is not near complete so when i see it complete then talk but now u can be in for having sucky car


well every 1 the car runs stronger than before and nice so iguess all the haed aces are over thanks alot thirdgen.org

 

Come over sometime next week, ill show you how "complete" it is. Its going in, in about 2-3 months. All I need is the intake, and gaskets. Otherwise IT IS done.

Even Now your car cant beat my little 305.

DREAM ON, until your dream comes true.

 

glad to hear it's running, even if it is poorly. your friend neo rose a good point with the possible bent valve. after you get your timing set right and the adjusters set, try doing compression and leak down tests. these tests will show you if you had any damage from pistion to valve contact.
jess