jcllgo

yes im about to change heads cam and intake out on my 87 iroc and dont know where to go tranny wise will my 700r4 be able to handle new modsplanning on making 400-450hp

Lurbie

iTrader: (3)

ONLY if you build it right. Call Dana at Pro-Built Automatics and he will get you the right information.

kaos420

Check out http://www.monstertransmission.com/

red rock

iTrader: (2)

Depending on the mileage on the transmission, 400-450 HP will eventually burn up the stock clutches. You will want to either rebuild it or replace it with a stronger built transmission. And also, if your thinking on replacing the 700r4 with a T5 manual, you will run into the same issue with it not holding up long under more power. HP cost money and the more you mod an engine the more money it's going to cost in other area's. Like say, the rear end for example, and then maybe brake upgrades, and then if you haven't already, sub frame connectors. Think this through before you spend a bunch on just the engine.

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

With the power goals you have in mind, swap out the 700r4 for a TH400 with good clutches, a shift kit, and decent converter. Save the money you will keep in your pocket from SEVERAL failed 700r4s and buy you a Strange 12 bolt or Strange 9" rear-end housing as your 7.5" 10-bolt will soon fail as well.

red rock

iTrader: (2)

See, why? Why would you tell someone some bad information like that. A built 700r4 can handle as much HP as any TH400 that is built, plus you get OD on the 700r4.

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

Because it is truth!!! Your statement alone is BAD information. You can spend $6K building a 700r4 with all the best parts and a stock TH400 with a few small additions will still be 10x more durable

Guys are spending wads of cash building 4L60E/4L65E/4L70E (very similar to a 700R4) transmissions and destroying them in no time in trucks and swapping to 4L80Es.

Will also add that I pulled the POS 4L60E that went out at 38K miles behind a stock 350 and was upgraded to 4L65E spec out of my Express van at 78K miles and put a stock 100K mile 4L85E into is place. The 85E has close to 150K on it now and I beat the crap out of it and it is still going strong. FWIW the 4L80E/4L85E is basically a TH400 with an extra planetary set to give it OD and electronic controls.

I actually just swapped a 3rd gen to a TH400. The TH400 itself was built to withstand an 600+ HP engine. The swap was less than $2,000 start to finish. Car has a Hotcam and 2.73 gears, so no real reason to run an OD, especially with the 9.5" 2,800 stall converter. The "built" 700r4 died twice in less than 10K miles on this car and the owner was fed up.

red rock

iTrader: (2)

You do realize a TH400 was the predecessor to the 700r4/4l60 and with much of the same parts and upgrades to the 700r4 most of which was overdrive. Now as for your comment about spending $6K on a rebuild, yes you can spen a lot if want to, or you can spend $1000 from Dana at Probuilt Automatics that will support 700hp and do it yourself. If you or somone you know happened to have an issue with a "built" transmission, unless you yourself built it, how do you know what or was not built into it. Don't go around bashing something that you may have had an issue with, that probably wasn't built to begin with.

jcllgo

yes I know it is a chain reaction with upgrading and the $$$$ side of it I already have headers exhaust sub frame connectors and tower brace I need a new torque arm and have just got a lt1and rear end out of a 97 z28 the guy owed me not sure how helpful it will be but all in all I have had the car for a yr and just figure I can keep dreaming or just bit the bullet and jump in that way I'm not here a yr from now saying oohh I want to start on modifying my car yall know what I mean just wondering if I can keep my over drive trans or not because I do drive it back and forth to work on Monday and back home on Friday about 70miles one way and thanks everyone for input I appreciate it

jcllgo

I will try and load a picture of my car in a min

jcllgo

here it is nothing special its a solid car

red rock

iTrader: (2)

That's a nice looking Camaro. If you don't beat the snot out of the tranny, it should last a little while until you decide what way to go with it. I ran mine for a summer with close to 500 hp at the crank, and when i tore down and rebuilt the tranny, the clutches and the band were burnt and slipping some. I also had a Transgo kit in the valve body at the time. Now I have a Probuilt Automatics kit in the 700r4 and it works great. A lot more line pressure and great clamping on the clutches.

Big&BadGTA

iTrader: (1)

My old/previous GTA had 450 hp. I had a Rossler-built trans from Carl Rossler Transmissions in Girard (Youngstown OH)

It lasted years, lots of time on the track and street. Zero failures.

Was about $1,800 but that was 20+ years ago. He's still around. But prices are surely more.

I hope this helps.

Big&BadGTA

iTrader: (1)

http://www.rosslertrans.com/700r4.html

jcllgo

yes that's what I was hoping to be able to beef this trans up or get one already built just wasn't sure about this model holding together but from what yall said I think I will give it a run with a new built 700. also will this rear end I have from a 97 z28 be any better than the one I have in it already or be the same. and again thanks so much for input greatly appriciated

red rock

iTrader: (2)

The 97 is a little wider rear than the 9 bolt in your IROC. It will swap out okay, but a lot of opinions out here are that the 10 bolt 4th gen isn't any stronger than the BW 9 bolt. 28 splines are about the same on each. You probably have a 3.27 gear in the 9 bolt, this is all assuming you have a true IROC, otherwise you may have a 10 bolt underneath. All depending on your engine build and RPM range, a 3.70 gear in the 9 bolt or 3.73 gear in the 10 bolt might be a better fit.

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

For the record, my 700R4/4L60E/4L65E failures have not been slipped/burned clutches and bands. They have been broken hard parts. Input shaft/drum shattered, broken planetary sets, and even stripped the case lugs off the case that hold the low/reverse clutch pack. When you start making any kind of torque and have traction the internals become fairly glass like.

red rock

iTrader: (2)

That may be all true. Also don't think that a TH400 can't be tore up. But the Op already has a transmission. Its a 700r4. If he wants to build it, for $1000 he can build a transmission that will hold extreme HP and still have overdrive and a wider gear ratio. It's his choice. There are plenty of people running a built 700r4 on the street and strip with out any problems.

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

They will not survive over about 350-400 TQ unless you upgrade the hard parts and I am not talking clutches/steels/band. I am talking about the gear train itself. GM themselves say a 4L65E with 5 pinon planetaries is only rated to 360 ft/lbs and puts massive amounts of torque management into the tuning on the trucks to keep them alive. STOCK TH400s lived behind big blocks making 550+ ft/lbs of torque in stock form without torque management. Try putting that 700r4 "built to hold extreme HP" behind said 500 Cadillac and it might make it around the block a time or two at 1/2 throttle. The second you went into the secondaries it would let go and something would snap. An aggressively driven 350 making 400-450 ft/lbs of torque will DESTROY a 700r4 or 4L60E or 4L65E for that matter in less than 50K street miles. The wide gear ratio is actually also not an advantage. Put a stall in the TH400 to put the engine into its powerband sooner and the tighter gear spacing of the TH400 will actually make you quicker in a drag race.

red rock

iTrader: (2)

Well here it is Fast guy. I had a '73 Grand Prix in 1976 with a hopped up Pontiac 400 and a TH400 behind it that got squashed. They can break also. To get back to topic, the OP wants to know if the 700r4 will handle his HP goals, it will stock for a while. If he wants to build it to handle more HP, he can without breaking the bank. He never mentioned making his Camaro into a full out drag racer. He uses it as a daily driver. Now you can have all the opinions you want as to what YOU think someone should do, but there is absolutely nothing wrong with a street/strip built 700r4. Do some research on here and find out what others are doing with their 700r4's. So why would someone want to run 3200rpm's in drive depending on their rear gears to work on a freeway?

IROCThe5.7L

^What he said. My 700R4 is still holding up behind my built 427 four years later.

articwhiteZ

iTrader: (56)

study the parts made today...they are a lot better then the parts made just 2 years ago.. and a lot better then the parts made 20 years ago...the good stuff cost money...so shop.and get to know what your paying for...

GeneralDisorder

iTrader: (1)

Having seen some failures.... you basically have to replace everything but the case with aftermarket. And at that point you can't really call it a 700R4 anymore. It is a 700R4 clone with no GM parts inside. It's like saying you have a 350 small block - but you have replaced everything but the block. Yeah it's *of the same basic design* but is it what the engineers at GM designed? Sort of. And then to make real power you get a Dart block and have no GM parts at all.

GD

red rock

iTrader: (2)

The only real "weak" part in a 700r4 is the sun shell and maybe the sprag. You can make some great power with a upgraded sun shell, sprag and heavier clutches. So unless you have taken one apart and rebuilt it yourself, or have talked to Hi Perf. transmission builders, your barking up the wrong tree. In you scenario, rebuilding a tranny is the same as rebuilding a engine, well it all depends on the power your going to make. Do any of you guy's realize these transmissions are up to 35 years old? And you have seen some failures? Really? Lets up grade the engine first, (like I did), and then expect the tranny to hold up. I knew I was on borrowed time and was planning to rebuild it in the spring, and after beating it one summer all i had was burnt clutches. Not bad for an old tired transmission. My sun shell and sprag were just fine, but yes i replaced and upgraded them anyway. BTW, how many guy's buy a car and the previous owner tells the guy, the engine or the tranny has been rebuilt, only to have it fail, and then find out they were lied to. So have you seen stock transmission failures, or so called rebuilt transmission failures.

GeneralDisorder

iTrader: (1)

Mine blew the retainer lugs off the forward clutch snap ring in the drum. I'm told "fatigue"..... It's still weak aluminium to me if it fatigues behind a 190 HP LB9. To me that means the drum is a poor design or garbage casting. Only mod to the car was 370 gears. Trans was original with 150k.

Then you have the sun shell known weakness.... There isn't that many parts inside these transmissions. The sun shell and the main drum - that's like 50% of the bulk inside there. And all the stock clutches are weak. It's not a bad trans but the guts weren't meant for drag racing.

GD

red rock

iTrader: (2)

[quote; There isn't that many parts inside these transmissions.] I beg to differ.

red rock

iTrader: (2)

These are the hard parts I replaced. They were all within spec. but i replaced them anyway.

jcllgo

I think I'm buying a built one after hearing from every one and not gonna try and make mine work with my local trans shop building it can anyone recommend a company building badass 700r4s

red rock

iTrader: (2)

Here are a couple; http://www.monstertransmission.com/7...ts_c_3792.html, https://www.transmissioncenter.com/product-category/gm/ Or if someone else has any ideas.

Lurbie

iTrader: (3)

I'll say it again, call Dana at Pro-Built Automatics and he will get you exactly what you need. I'm pretty certain he is selling whole units again, built to his tested and tried specs, as well as selling all the parts you need to build one yourself if you want to. I do not have experience with Monster, but I can say with confidence you'll find a lot more negative reviews on Monster than you ever will on Dana.

red rock

iTrader: (2)

Dana is whom I went with when i rebuilt mine. The guy is top notch and an encyclopedia full of information, and just a great guy to talk to. http://www.700r4l60e.com/store/help....us&mode=update

articwhiteZ

iTrader: (56)

to buy all the after market hard sold today. will run over $2000.(just hard parts) knowing a lot of guys would never pay that for just parts..some guys will just add a few parts. and leave the other parts out saying ya don't need them.. put 700hp to it and see if it lives.add a trans brake..add $400.. below every aftermarket part sold..installed...

trans brake installed

ya get what ya pay for..


700R4 close ratio (no RPM drop from 1st to 2nd..2nd to 3rd) 6 pinon planet..$600
hardened input shaft and front drum(bolt together) no snap ring and holds 9 clutches..$580
GM 5 pinon rear planets..shop for a good price
billet pump gears. $180
all thrust bearings
the case is made By GM.
way to spendy for most... I would do a trans brake.th400 with a gear venders over drive. for the same price I spent on this one


moroso did the trans pan. for me..as the ones they have made in the past did not fit..so they sent me one for free.. for pointing out the bad pans...tried a few..

jcllgo

I went to pro built web site and iguess they are real busys cause a lot of their trans they are not building now

IROCZ1989

iTrader: (1)

Call Cahall Performance Trans. He will take care of you. He has 4l60es in the 9s in 4500lb cars. That is his stage 3. He offers a stage 4. He can build you one to hold anything you want. Prices are fair. I paid around 2200 complete. Will handle 1000hp.if you have an old moroso pan btw send it in. I did and Ray took care of me and sent me a new one for free. He recommeds protorque convertors if your in the market.Stay away from Monster trans if no one has told you already.

Lurbie

iTrader: (3)

Dana is a one or two man show. He's on a lot of forums giving great, free advice. He handles his own phone calls, and calls everyone back (sometimes even if you don't leave a message). He's essentially a legend in the auto trans industry. This keeps him super busy. I know he has had problems with his website in the past. If you want his info and product you're best off if you call and leave a message. He will call back even if it takes a day or two. You can help speed the process along by having all of your internal engine and drivetrain specs ready as well as be able to explain your driving style, intended use of the car, etc. You'll be impressed with how he puts all of that data into a specific-built kit, or trans, just for you. From personal experience, his support before, during, and after the sale is second to none.

articwhiteZ

iTrader: (56)

this is also a top guy..
full price brake down..and or upgrades.. has parts in stock...or can be in stock with in a week..
he will also sell just parts if you want to do it your self...or have your local guy do it...

https://www.trutechtrans.com/Trutech...01-Basket.html

Fast355

iTrader: (2)

In my experience there is not a stock 700r4 that can hold that kind of power past the jab of the pedal. If it actually shifts well enough it does not slip the clutches instantly it will break some random weak hard part. There are plenty of them.

Back in 2006-2008 when I was still messing with 700r4s I had 4 different ones built up completely with 5 pinon planets and all the latest stuff. Every last failure was a hard part!!! A 350 TBI with a Weiand 177 making no more than 400 hp and 450 ft\lbs of torque in a G20 van killed the longest lasting one in about 5K miles.

I drilled out the spit welds on the transmission crossmember mounts, moved it to the rear position, rewelded it into place and swapped a gazillion mile junkyard TH375/3L8E into it out of a 1987 G20 van and beat on it with the next 383 TPI making even more torque for over 2 years before pulling it off the road for the need of a complete front end and rear axle rebuild.

red rock

iTrader: (2)

Ozz1967

iTrader: (4)

No...read up on monster, they're stuff is garbage...testimonials all over about them being terrible.

Ozz1967

iTrader: (4)

I personally went with Dana for a rebuild kit and it stood up well for 8 years behind my 340hp 355 until I spun a bearing in it.

Dana, if you can, will also build and ship one to you.

IROCZ1989

iTrader: (1)

http://cahallperformancetrans.com/#2787

Give him a call. He won't sell you bs. And I called him out of the blue looking for a trans guy. I was impressed he actually took almost an hour on the phone with me explaing what I need and what I dont. And alot of other info, free of charge with no offer on my end to buy. I liked him so much I drove 8hrs there and 8back from MA to pick up my trans so I could see his operation and meet him in person. If anyone has a passion for these trans its him. He won't sell you the latest greatest trick parts or sell you what you dont need. His customers give him plenty of feedback on what works and what doesnt. Alot of cars in the 9s with zero trick parts. When your putting a 4000+lb impala down a 1/4 in the 9s your are hitting the tires hard with alot of power.Not just one pass either. Any other builder out there can say this and that is what you need but zero to back it up. Drain your wallet and you dont know any better. I mean honestly how would anyone here know first hand what to buy and how it works and why in a 700r4 drag racing setup? You wont be dissapointed.

86LG4Bird

iTrader: (1)

jcllgo, Where are you located?
There are a only a handful of good 4L60/700R builders aross the country.
Maybe you're lucky and near one of them. ??

TeamPoisonOil

http://www.superchevy.com/how-to/tra...-transmission/

jcllgo

del rio texas