draco

Is it possible to do away with the stock icm and install something like a MSD 6AL ignition control. I'm really getting tired of having to replace ignition modules.

coolrimsatleast

I don't know, haven't really heard of this until now.

How often do they go bad?

I've gone through a few ICMs, and a year ago I added a ground straight to the firewall vs it's stock ground path.

I've also heard of adding a diode to a wire somewhere too to prevent a possible AC spike somehow getting to it.

ItstillaV6

I haven't found too many places, including Summit Racing, that makes a "performance" replacement ICM to fit in your stock distributor.

I do know, that the stock V6 distributors are a "problem" item. They have two very big problems: the reluctor coil and the o-ring seal.

The reluctor coils are ceramic coated and crack, from heat. The o-rings deteriorate and cause oil to leak down the block onto your starter.

Excessive heat will fry your ICM, fast! The Autozone reman distributors are pricey, but come with high-quality OEM-replacement modules already installed and they have the heat-sink grease, plus a lifetime warranty. The design for the reluctor is better too. In the 2 1/2 years, since replacing my distributor, I have only replaced one ICM(warranty covered), and no oil has been leaking at all. I have not had to modify my electrical system at all.

As far as the ground? Well, I have heard you can do that, with older GM HEIs, but I have no exp or tried it, so you may need to try more research. I hope some of this helps.

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

It is very easy to add in a 6AL. I just did that 2 weekends ago and with the harness kit that you can get from summit or a place like that, any beginner can make it work in a few hours.

Gumby

go to radio shack for the better silver thermal paste, heat is what kills them.

clean the spot it sits with brake cleaner n scotchbrite pad though.

draco

i go through one icm a year for the past 3 years, and always after i leave the house lol.the last icm was AC, got a clean mount surface, a new pick-up coil in the dizzy, and artic silver thermal paste. i even cleaned where the dizzy meets the block to improve ground.

my 91 has been down for almost 6 months now, cranks, stumbles, if it does start it spits sputters and backfires into the intake.it will not take fuel. fuel pressure is perfect, timing is ok, the only red flag right now is orange spark from the coil, which i know is weak. coil is new, along with new ground straps. coil harness is getting a solid 12v. i am leaning towards icm but i suppose a pcm is possible.
someone give me ideas and i'll get results asap.

fasteddi, which adapter are you talking about? can you get me a part#?

Gumby

must be an electrical problem then, will suck if you fry a $200 box before checking everything you can, as ICM do not go bad like that with out a reason.

draco

The last time the car laid down on me it was sudden. I was driving about 25mph and it just died, like someone shut off the key. It hasn't ran since. I don't think its an electrical issue because the harness is in very good condition, I've been all over the under-hood moving wires and probing and inspecting. Everything seems well. I'm thinking about going with the new distributor. At least that way the ICM is lifetime warranty.

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

How old is the ICM? Ittermittanly dieing like that then working again just sounds like the ICM is going again.

draco

Well, 6 months ago the ICM was about 5 months old, and this one was the AC icm with artic silver.

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

hmm. have it tested if all else fails. Id use the electropast from radio shack or something similer though. Its better IMO for the base of the IAC to dizzy. Basically second what gumby said a few post back

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

I had my adapter given too me with the 6AL. It was a used 6al so not much paper work with it. Google it or something and you will find the part number pretty quick.

project89

iTrader: (1)

6al still hooks up to the icm , if the icm is bad the 6a or 6al box will not work

Gumby

It replaced the ICM on my V8.....

fasteddi

iTrader: (2)

I kept my IAC i just used some harnesses that plugged into my coil harnesses

Six_Shooter

iTrader: (2)

You can do that with a carbed engine, but on an EFI engine, you would get no timing control and would need to make a circuit to convert the tach output to a proper reference input signal to the ECM, just to run.

Gumby

ahh yea that why I put it on there and not the Bird,

34blazer

you can do what some ford guys do with the TFI, mount the ICM externally on a heat sink. ive done that and havent had a problem in 2 years, 40K miles.

draco

ordered the dizzy from zone today, $103 bucks. hoping this will cure the issue. i think the only remaining culprit would be the ecm. what are the typical symptoms of a faulty ecm?

Six_Shooter

iTrader: (2)

What's the problem?

You can have spark without the ECM even installed in the vehicle, so if it's a lack of spark issue, it won't be the ECM.

draco

i have fuel, air, cranks but wont start. spark from the new coil is orange. grounds are good. iat, iac, tps, map, coil, cap, rotor, plugs and wires, o2 and cat are all new. Egr is blocked off but still plugged in. motor is still in correct time.

if i do get it to start and ¨run¨ it spits and sputters. giving it gas kills it and sometimes it pops in the intake.

Six_Shooter

iTrader: (2)

Orange indicates weak spark, so you have poor voltage supply, weak coil, weak ICM or poor gounding of the engine, and/or components attached to the engine.

I would do a test of powering the coil directly and checking the spark intensity that way to help eliminate the coil as a possibility. I'm sure if you Google it, you can find specifics on testing a coil by itself.

I have found that sometimes ICM tests are not accurate.

draco

i used to work at advance auto (now currently lead tech at sears auto) and i see a lot of icms that test good but are bad. thats why i'm hoping that the new dizzy will clear this up. it will be in on wednesday evening or thursday morning. i'll update then. also i'll pull up the schematics from alldata for the coil and icm and do a run down of voltage, resistance, and continuity.

draco

UPDATE:

Replaced dizzy. Solved the orange spark issue. I now get a good hot white spark. The new issue is that the car still will not spark. I shot ether into the intake and it fires up and runs right until the ether is burnt up. The fuel pump runs, the filter is new and I have satisfactory fuel pressure (about 42psi KOEO). However the gas smells a little stale (at half tank about 6 months with no stabilizer) and the exhaust fumes smell off. I'm hoping fresh fuel will cure the issue. Is there anything else I shoud look over?

XxXChrisGXxX

iTrader: (1)

I hate our ICMs. I just replaced mine last summer and again this winter. This time, I put some arctic silver thermal compound on the replacement. I also replaced the harness connectors because the clips were broken and installed a MSD coil and taylor wires.

Gumby

gotta find out if the injectors are firing, fuel in the rail doesn't mean it makes it to the cylinders.

draco

i meant "start" not "spark" lol


Our injectors fire in batches right? I figure if I could smell "fuel" from the exhaust, all-be-it bad fuel, at least it is getting into the cylinder. Is there an easy way to check injector pulse without pulling the intake apart?

Gumby

no idea but fuel doesn't go bad that quick, take well over a yr, you could easily drain it by removing the hose under the hood and letthe pump run till about 1/8 a tank then stop.

sounds like its not getting fuel though

draco

Would the FPR stop me from getting fuel? OR if the FPR was at fault would that mean it would dump fuel? Either way if the FPR was at fault my fuel pressure gauge should read it. The fuel pressure fluctuates a little when I crank it so the fuel is going somewhere. The gas I sprayed from the test port smells terrible though. Also I replaced the TPS, IAC, and MAP. I was wondering what all was necessary to adjust when I do get it running. I figure Idle Relearn is in order. I miss my f-body. This damn Ford Escape makes me feel like an old man.

draco

***update***

Retested fuel pressure at 42.5psi, KOEO. Still no improvement and car is still not running. Not sure where to turn next. Vacuum line to FPR is dry and fuel free. Shooting Ether into the throttle body will let the car run. Someone point me down next road?

Stewie

It could be FPR or bad injectors. OEM injectors are notorious for premature failure. My FPR went bad at 140 K miles and the injectors were also starting to fail.

draco

I'm at 206k on stock fpr and injectors. How likely is it to lose an entire set of injectors? I'll try checking fuel pressure while pulling vacuum on the fpr. thanks!

UK Speedbird

Sorry not read this thread totally but have you tried the resistance test on the injectors?

From what I can remember you probe the injectors and any reading between 17 and 20ohms is good, anything less is a bad injector. I remember doing mine a while back and they showed 13ohms. I was advised to get in touch with South beach injectors?? Can't remember if that was their name (can find out) Anyway, they sent me FORD injectors and said don't worry they're better than the stock ones and hey presto they worked!

I'd say if you got good spark from the coil, good timing, and spark from the plugs i'd be doing that test on the injectors.

Oh, and the old fuel thing I wouldn't worry about as I've just pulled an old 92 Mazda out of storage that I've had laid up since October 2002 and it started and run fine on that!

Speed.

Henjoe

I know this is SUPPER old but for the future lol if 1 injector shorts, or goes bad or stops firing for any reason, with in a couple starts the computer will pickup on it and shut them all down for safty i guess. This happens to me, 1 injector went bad. tryed to start a few times sputtering, computer cough on and shut em all down. a fresh set later from summit and i was on the road again..

Now i have an ICM problem

Tuned Performance

iTrader: (92)

The ecm is not shutting down for safety. It shuts the injector driver down because a injector is shorted.