lordmalice76

Hey all. I've been a member for a while but this is my first post. I know most of us love to modify the hell outta our cars but I've never come across this one. Would it be practical to change the ECM in our cars out for a PLC (programmable logic controller)? I mean, we do all of these add ons and module build ups and prom burning, but what if you could change the parameters off of a touchscreen and not need a laptop to do it? all of the signals from sensors and such are either digital or analog, all going back out to valves and solenoids. We could do this with a good PLC program and some knowledge of ladder logic. you could control the whole car (including security, lighting, other toys) with 1 controller instead of 20. Subroutines could be written to handle the various calculations, and the CPU's can run faster than a microprocessor. Wanna go from tbi to tpi? a 30 second program dump, an output card and some wiring would fix that. aside from size, which most of us find creative ways to hide things anyway, what would be the drawbacks?

Stryder

it would be simple if u were willing to learn electronics,
and VHDL to program ur FPGA and ASSEMBLY to run ur simulated processors
one plus is instant hardware changes
flexability of parallel processes
all kinds of input\output pins
redundancy
bad points complexity
some really good points you could make bucks selling all the various simulated ecms for any car any motor and u would download it right thru the SDR(software defined radio ps they are awsome) from my satellite server hahahah no really
just kidding not really
i have a 100000 gate altera fpga board and i am gonna meld it to the camaro maybe in the radio since that it what started this hobby madness some years from now yea

lordmalice76

now i've gotta sit down and actually figure out the code. it'd be badass if i could get a touchscreen radio to act as the HMI. hmmm...

Rolling Thunder

Well it would be nice for a lot or reasons. PLCs are very reliable pieces of equipment which is great in a car eventhough you dont typically think of it as being a "harsh" eviornment. There reasonably cheap. There easy to program without a lot of the real expence or time consuming efforts that go into programming proms. Some of them can even run on 12V lol. Theres really a lot of plusses. The problem is space because to add on enough I/O cards will take some room abouve and beond a factory ECM. The programming part can be very expencive as the trial programs that you get for free only allow for like 100 "words: and a program like that is way over that a the programs are kinda pricy. Then theres the speed factor. PLCs are relatively slow and although they may be fast enough they may very well not be. Lastly and evem more importantly is well it has to be done. What i mean by that is the programming has to be worked out. Once its basically done it could be modded for just about anything but to figure out the stocr programming turn it into ladder logic is a decent task. Even once its done it would be a very complicated program that hardly anyone would have the understanding about to be able to begin to modify. Even if they knew ladder logic theyd still have an emence task in front of them to try and make since of things. Although i think it would have some serious advantages concidering youde have to buy the PLC and the programming software your in the cost of the stuff you would need to program your factory ECM. Granted you would have alot more freedom and it would be easier thats only after someone has paved the way the first time and did this all and did the write up on it lol. I would be interested in something like that though you could really modify for anything. Use whatever sensors you wanted (like LS1 MAFs or cam positioning sensors for sequential injection). You could even generate signals for driving electronic speedometers and such. I could be very versital.

RED_DRAGON_85

ive thought about this before and i remember one member mentioning that he was going to try it in the future... no idea if it ever worked out. i believe it was the same guy that put a ramjet 502 in his bird though.
it would be an interesting project and not too difficult if you could somehow figure out the exact parameters and the required signal voltages ect

im sure that everything would be pretty much the same once you got the hang of it

Stryder

one problem for FPGA's is that they have to "boot" so
if u wanted to use its power u would still need to "meld" it to the Camaro! (maybe thru the test edge connector giving u access to the bus and chip select addressing)
Melded to the Camaro would allow u to start up with ur main
computer then once the Field Programmable Grid Array was
booted then u could run its state machine
one thing for FPGA's is they are fast very fast
they can emulate any processor or any electronic circuit for that matter
only the latest lab processors are faster not by much though
but u can bet they were modeled on the fastest FPGA's first

FPGA"S are a designer's dream do all ur layout there
and run ur simulations
and then u transport(which is a separate task, takes some finesse ) to an ASIC and do a burn there
to make a final circuit that doesn't have to "boot"
but u lose that ability to make hardware changes
FPGA's are very tough they have been running on the Mars Rovers!!!! they gave them only 90 days still kicking it years later

Also the SDR runs from the FPGA always as it should
so it can be any type of radio u wanted from a glorified Walkie Talkie (that's a cell phone to u kids out there) to XMS
or HD FM you know whatever which is the main reasoning of my insanity

As far as "booting" i guess you could just leave it on all time in a sleep mode(maybe throw in a few solies and some lithium Bats just for ur favorite new toy)
if you did lose power like disconnecting the battery it would be "booted"
before u had the nut tightened

You could do hardware changes(called "booting") from a USB drive
also install a biometric print reader to engage the ignition
i have heard some guys have even installed RFID's in their own bodies
can u imagine that
just kidding I am not that naive
Actually u could make that work with ur U.S. PASSCARD it has an RFID in it

I guess it is all really simple
injector pulse length
spark timing
air volume (lets see throw away the MAF , SD and install a doppler laser in the intake hmm)
increase the bandwidth of the oxygen sensor
run some simulations on the NOS injector plate

next thing u know the Camaro would be ALIVE
which would make me happy
it could get a job
buy its own gas and tires
and for all that time i spent on her
she could get me a 2010 to tear up LOL