The rotor looks to be an 8 x 7.00'' bolt circle.

The two areas i've had rubbing problems are:

The outer perimeter of the rotor (where the vanes are) coming in contact with the center of the caliper. After discovering that problem, my fix has been to slip a flat blade screwdriver in between the rotor and caliper on both sides to effectively leverage up on the caliper, and then torque the caliper to bracket bolts. Basically, using the little bit of slop that is there, I torque the caliper down as high off the rotor as possible. (poor solution, but it has worked for now) which also further lifts that pad surface off the top edge of the rotor, a problem you are all too familiar with

The second location, is the lower caliper to bracket bolt contacting the rear of the rotor. In my pictures above (poor quality Iphone pics) you will see the area where the pads don't sit on the rotor, there is a freshly rubbed stripe around the rotor. That is from the lower caliper to bracket bolt, where the bolt extends through the bracket. I initially believed this was due to the looseness in the one bad hub, but it is on the other side of the car as well (where the hub is still good). Basically it's a very tight tolerance right there and having some play in the wheel bearing will cause it to rub for certain. I cut a thread or two off the bolts to where I still have full thread engagement, but not additional bolt sticking out of the bracket, and that seems to have cured that.

I'll have to give some more thought as to which direction I want to go. I know I could go C4HD through you and have an excellent fitting kit, I just hope the performance will be up to par. I dont feel like i'm very hard on my brakes even on the track, and have heard other road racers having success with the comparable c5/c6, so it might be worth a try.

I appreciate all the info

 

As we talked about in the PM's, the C5/C6 rotor is an option as well. I'll see if I can come up with a cad model of the design and send it over this weekend.

 

For those of you who appreciate the details. Some pictures of the brackets and hardware.

Right click - view image for larger





These holes are only 0.01" oversized to ensure there is minimal slop in the connection. This also helps prevent pad to rotor misalignment due to excess bolt play.

 

That... is some good stuff.

 

damn man, those are going to be some really hi class kits!

 

Only the best for my third gen friends.

 

Crappy weather today, but here are some pictures of the brackets. They are in various state of completeness. All have some finishing work to do before I would send them out to customers.

Right click - view image for a larger picture.







This is a machined finish.


Left to right, sanded, machined, bead blasted. Bead blasted is the standard finish.

 

Looking good. When the time comes for my brake upgrade, I'm definitely going to get them through you.

 

Not bad coming along nicely. Is perdoch brake going to have a website soon ? or just word of mouth now..

 

Thanks for the kind words.

I will have a website eventually. It turns out I'm better at making brake kits than websites.

In other news. I did some basic testing of the ARP bolts over the weekend. A standard grade 8, 7/16-20 bolt has a torque spec of 75 ft-lbs. I maxed out my 150 ft-lb torque wrench without damaging the bolt or the internal thread. So I'm really happy with that result. The ARP is a good bolt for this application.

 

Is this the kit you are making up for my GTA?

 

It is the same fitment but those are not your actual parts. The parts in the pictures are all mock up parts. I got your spindles and brackets done last night. Everything came out great.

 

wow 150 ft-lb and not even damage threads thats pretty impressive

 

are you using 7/16-20 for the bracket to spindle attachment? I know the kit I have through Ed uses a smaller 3/8-16.

If so, how do you feel about that larger 7/16 on the top hole in the spindle, enough meat up there?

 

Yes, for the Wilwood kit, all bolts, bracket to spindle and caliper to bracket are 7/16-20.

So far I have been using all of the later spindles that have more meat on the upper hole. So in that case, there is plenty of room for a 7/16" or even a 1/2" bolt.

The earlier spindles have a smaller upper boss and taping to 7/16" does make the edge margin quite sporty. My mock up spindle has the smaller upper boss. I am not yet sure how I feel about this. As a result, I am trying to use only the later spindles. It is a pain and more costly doing it this way, but I feel better about it.

Now granted the further down into the hole you get, the more meat there is. So in reality I don't expect any problems.

I'm not sure how I feel about a 3/8" bolt either though. I would need to do some analysis. Obviously you are running them with no issue, and you test them better than most. With a quality bolt like the ARP you may be able to get away with a size smaller.

Mounting boss size comparison. That is a 1/2-20 hole on the left spindle. And an unmodified early spindle on the right.

 

thanks, I like the sounds of the 7/16'', maybe I need to go to the pick 'n pull and look for some later spindles.

On a side note, got my hubs from Kore3 as well as the bearing pre-load spacers. Good stuff!! I'm starting to mock up and get some stuff put back together, i'm looking forward to seeing how it all turns out.

Your kits are lookin real nice by the way, I wish they were an option when I bought mine a couple years ago. Once this one is tired, i know where i'll go

 

Excellent. I knew you would like the Kore3 hubs.

The large boss spindles are 90-92. If you are unsure of the year, it is hard to tell the difference until you remove the rotor dust shield. And if you find an extra pair, let me know.

 

Very nice kit!

 

Do the Wilwoods in your kit use an off the shelf pad? I remembered that back in the day, sometimes when you bought a wilwood caliper, you had to go back to wilwood to buy a wilwood pad. This made it harder for me as I live in Canada and it sucks waiting for parts before you can do maintenance. (That's another reason why I chose to stick to the stock mediocre brakes rather than upgrade.)

 

The 7420 pad is probably the most common brake pad plate out there for aftermarket calipers. They are used by Wilwood and AP.

I however am not aware of any OEM application of the pad, so you will not likely find the pads at your local parts store. You MIGHT find them in a speedshop in Nascar country.

I don't see this as a huge problem however. The pads are 0.8" thick and should last forever on a daily driver. If you take care of your stuff, you will have plenty of warning that the pads need to be replaced.

Remember its not just a Wilwood pad. And many many companies make compounds for this plate.

John

 

Here are some updated pictures on Paul's kit. Again this is the Wilwood FSL caliper on the C4 HD rotor.

As always, right click - view image for a larger version.

 

Can't wait until I get them!

 

Does that dust cap fit a stock hub?

 

Wow talking about a complete package and no annoying trips to the auto store

 

No. There is an o-ring groove cut in the aluminum hub to accept the o-ring on the cap.

 

A few assembly pictures.

 

That is super clean, awesome to see someone who is proud of his stuff and shows it!

 

Thanks.

 

Do you have access to the new ZL1 Brake kit to see if it will fit?

http://fastlane.gmblogs.com/2012/12/...e-customizing/

 

The ZL1 fitment is identical to the '09+ CTS-V. This is the setup that started this whole brake adventure for me. This setup is going on my car.

The only difference is the color of the caliper and the ZL1 uses the same 2pc rotors like the '13+ CTS-V.

There are some complications on the fitment that I am working on making easier. For now this kit is special order only.

 

Here are some completed pictures. Again, right click - view image for a larger version.

 

That is some top notch workmanship.... I have been eyeball'n wilwoods brake kits for some time now. But they don't offer 13" rotors.

The kit you have put together for Paul look awesume....now what kind of $$$$ will that set someone back....and does the customer supply the spindles.

 

Shoot me an email.

For complete kits I supply the spindles and you return your old ones as a core.

Or I can supply just the brackets and hardware and you supply the rest.

John
john@perdoch.com
610-554-6503

 

Email shot....

 

finally made it out to the junkyard, there were probably about 5 thirdgens, only 1 in the 90-92 range so i snagged them for myself. If I come across more in the future i'll let you know. Removing spindles at the junkyard without a spring compressor or floor jack is fun!

 

Excellent, I'm glad you found a set. You know why I pay people for the spindles rather than pulling them myself.

Are you going to drill them for 7/16 hardware? You could also drill them to 1/2" but I don't really see the point since the calipers use 7/16" hardware.

John

 

7/16''

 

John, was there any progress on this? I'm looking at buying 2 kits. A 14" SS using a 1le hub setup for my streetcar, and a Wilwood/C5 setup using a 1le hub. Sent you a more detailed email and it bounced.

On topic, one of the guys I race with in CMC has these CTW's. They're performing well so far. I may eventually get a set, but other upgrades have priority first, like brakes and shocks.

 

I'm guessing you are talking about Sean, right?

 

Yup. I think you said it in a post earlier, the black look 10x better in person than they photograph.


Taken a few weekends ago at Texas World Speedway.

 

What would be the minimum amount of clearance between the wheel and the outer part of caliper that would still make the wheel usable? The internet seems to think 2(ish)mm is the right amount, just curious if you guys agree.

Thanks
Chuck

 

The black does look better, but the silver is the better of the two - it has a great shine and is great for contrasting on dark cars.



uote=GMan 3MT;5912112]Yup. I think you said it in a post earlier, the black look 10x better in person than they photograph.


Taken a few weekends ago at Texas World Speedway.[ quote]

 

Brembo recommends 3mm. I would not hesitate to run it at 3mm. Do you have an application where you are trying to run it at 2mm?

 

Hi Gary,

Sorry for stringing you along. I have not worked on this. I am not touching production kits with the 14" SS stuff. I am curious about the desire to use the 1LE hub. Specifically speaking, I do not use 1LE hubs. Rather I use aluminum hubs that have the larger bearings of the 1LE but with the offset of a normal hub. In this case building a kit around the C5 rotor should be pretty easy, but would be a one off custom job.

John

 

Shame to hear about you not making the SS kits. Your work looked top notch with attention to deail.

When I said 1le hub, (what I really meant was an alum hub with the same specs as the 1le), it was for three reasons, the bearing size, the offset and spares. I could never verify if the Kore3 hubs used the larger bearings or not, but sounds like they do. That's good.

May not be the correct line of thinking, but the +.316" offset in the hub would mean a slightly reduced thickness of wheel adapters since I'm planning on vette wheels on both cars for the time being.
For the racecar, it's already going to be 2-2.25" adapter to try get the max legal trackwidth. Every bit I gain from the hub/rotor, the less I have to use on the adapter. Even Sean with the CTW wheels still uses a spacer that that little bit extra trackwidth. <-- On topic part of this post
For the street car, it's purely cosmetic. A thinner adapter (I think it should be around 1.5") looks better behind the wheel, and brings the purty calipers closer to the wheel face.

I thought I read somewhere the SS kit required a 1le offset hub. This page shows that, tho utilizing a different rotor, so may not be accurate.
http://lukeskaff.com/?page_id=333
So if that has to use a 1le hub, it would be nice for the racecar to use the same, so worst case if something failed, I could borrow the streetcars hub for the racecar. I've also got a pile of cracked 1le rotors that could be cut down.

Prefer the C5 rotor over the C4HD because I'd rather have the extra thickness than marginal diameter. I'm tired of repacking the bearings every time I cracked a rotor. I do have ducting, tho it's not the greatest shape anymore. C5 rotors also have the upgrade-ability from companies like GyroDisc and StopTech.

All that said, I realize the Wilwood/C5/1le combo may not be possible. The hub simply may just have to be the std offset.

Big thing with both setups, I really want to avoid having to modify the calipers themselves.

 

Thank you for that info. I see Tirerack also recommends 3-4mm.

I have 17x9 OEM 10 spoke SS wheels that I test fit over my gen 1 CTSv setup. They cleared, but I never measured because I put 18" C6 wheels on.

Now that the car is in good enough shape to start autox'ing again, I think I'd rather run the 275s on the front I can fit on the 17" SS wheel vs. the 245 on the 18" C6 wheel.

I am away from home for the next week, when I get back I'll measure and see what clearance there is.

 

Man that's exciting to hear they might clear. I have a set of 10 spokes in the garage I'm trying to sell but if they clear I can actually use the ctsv calipers I got a smoking deal on.

 

quote=Chuck!;5912714]Now that the car is in good enough shape to start autox'ing again, I think I'd rather run the 275s on the front I can fit on the 17" SS wheel vs. the 245 on the 18" C6 wheel.[ quote]

You will see a night and day difference in moving up to a 275 front from a 245 in the autocross.

 

Your pictures are beautiful.

 

So..... is this still a thing?