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History / OriginalityGot a question about 1982-1992 Camaro or Firebird history? Have a question about original parts, options, RPO codes, when something was available, or how to document your car? Those questions, answers, and much more!
In all reality guys,having a fiero duke myself, the list of things you can do to modify them starts with swap it and ends with swap it. It is a motor that can't take crap. They leak oil like crazy, and are very very very underpowered even in at 2700lb car. After driving my camaro and then getting in my last fiero, with a 2.8, I had to look under the wheel to make sure my foot was really on the gas, and the 2.5 is much worse. There is no need for a 2.5 thread when the only things you will ever do to these motors is r&r maintenance and those topics are universal to almost any IC engine. Some might say "well what about the SD4's", well they aren't stock they aren't availible in anything stock, and their is no meaningfull interchange between them. Your either, not all there, or you have so much money you should pm me about where to send a check to fund the rest of my life if you want to spend 10k building a monster 4cyl street motor when a 2k v8 build can beat it. Then their is the most important point of them all, a blind man might just call it a honda. If you have a 4cyl in a third gen please make sure it is really really quiet. I think the penny pinching bastard that had that idea at gm should be shot and burried...dug back up and shot again for good messure. Hell, do it to em all, and get some real car guys working for us, and not goldman fn sucks I mean sacks.
1982: 78,761
1983: 63,806
1984: 127,292
1985: 97,966
1986: 99,608
Total: 467,433
Almost 1/2 million camaros were built with a 4 cylinder engine during the 5 years they produced them.
Unless I'm reading it wrong your numbers you posted here are for sport coupes at least that's the numbers that are posted on this site, you could also get the sport coupe with a v6 or 305. Also in 1986 there was no 4 cylinder engines, and I think I read at one time that in 1985 the option was scrapped mid year and there was less than 200 4 cylinders made for the whole year. But I'm wondering if there is any record at all of how many iron duke 4 cylinders were made.
maybe its because probaly alot of the original 4 banger cars had engine swaps or most were scraped but i really dont belive there are to many left and i think it would be cool to have a low mile, clean, original iron duke f-body. I dont know why but i just think it would be cool to have one.
Unless I'm reading it wrong your numbers you posted here are for sport coupes at least that's the numbers that are posted on this site, you could also get the sport coupe with a v6 or 305. Also in 1986 there was no 4 cylinder engines, and I think I read at one time that in 1985 the option was scrapped mid year and there was less than 200 4 cylinders made for the whole year. But I'm wondering if there is any record at all of how many iron duke 4 cylinders were made.
Your right my numbers are for sport coupes. The Camaro White Book had it wrong, they listed 4 cylinders being built in 1986 which is not correct since none were built that year. Nobody listed the total number of just 4 cylinders built but they do give you the numbers for all other V-6 and V-8 production each year. I took the total Camaros produced each year and subtracted all the V-6 and V-8 cars. Here are the numbers I got. Thanks to hardon85.
Your right my numbers are for sport coupes. The Camaro White Book had it wrong, they listed 4 cylinders being built in 1986 which is not correct since none were built that year. Nobody listed the total number of just 4 cylinders built but they do give you the numbers for all other V-6 and V-8 production each year. I took the total Camaros produced each year and subtracted all the V-6 and V-8 cars. Here are the numbers I got. Thanks to hardon85.
The revised numbers I got during the 4 years that 4 cylinder Camaros were produced is only 46,183 cars.
Cool thanks for the clarification I thought I was losing my mind. Anyway it looks like about 10% of all sport coupe camaros were iron dukes and there was 225,832 base firebirds built from 1982-1985 so assuming (and we all know what happens when we assume ) 10% of all base firebirds were iron dukes there were only about 70,000 iron duke f bodys built. With the newest one being built 25 years ago and this probably being the least desirable f body ever built I think (as stated above) with engine swaps lack of maintenance and rust (it costs the same to fix a Z28 body as it would a sport coupe body and we see people parting Z28s all the time) there can't be many left at all I would have no idea of how you would know or even guess. I think this says why there is no need for an iron duke forum.
Now there's a lot of opinions on the iron duke f body some think it's a disgrace that there was ever a 4 cylinder in a camaro, but just remember what the times were like in the late 70s (or in my case what you've heard or read and that's when I'm assuming the 3rd gen was being designed). The dependence on foreign oil was as strong as it is now and people really thought that gas was gonna hit $3 a gallon back then. I think back then engineers thought 4 cylinders were gonna be a big part of 3rd gens since they were a big part of a lot of cars of the 80s, and well they probably weren't totally satisfied with the iron duke performance they probably knew better 4 cylinders were coming and they probably thought the iron duke performance was ok since the 3rd gen was 500 lbs lighter than the 2nd gens. Fast forward to 1985 and times were much better and gas prices were stable (due to the oil found in Alaska) and performance or horsepower started to become a little more important. However if gas had hit $3 a gallon in the early 80s who knows what would have happened the quad 4 probably would have probably made it into the 3rd gens (even though now we know what a ticking time bomb it is) and there probably would have been a lot more 4 cylinder development. But it never did and now the iron duke f body gets no respect but times sure could have been a lot different and I commend GM for being prepared if they had.
Had a 83 Iron Duke for several years. Mileage was 25 at 60 mph straight highway driving. It was a 4 speed, no overdrive. Fun to drive around town. Snappy out of the hole, picked the front end right up in second and third. Then you put it into fourth, looked at the speedo, and you were doing 45. Had to replace the starter once per year as my son was a real estate photographer in college and would start it 25 times in 2 hours when working. (The starter is on the wrong side, the drivers side. I believe it was Rambler that also had a design that way and all the old mechanics tell you they also burned up starters.)
hey thats not a bad idea...i sent jt a message about it, never really even noticed we didnt have a duke forum, there arent many around but it would at least bring the ones that are to the site a bit more
Been proposed a few times. There simply does not appear enough interest or demand to warrant it. We only have forums that show, and can support, usage. Simply, there doesn't appear to be many Iron Duke owners that still have the powertrain.
I'd like to see an Iron Duke forum too. I mean this is the internet, it's just electrons. It's not like it'll cost bricks and mortar. It can be pre-populated with all the random Iron Duke threads all over the place.
it is a very specific platform but the iron duke info in one place would probably be helpful to the people that do still have that motor in a car. being a part of a group(v6) that is mostly frowned upon or overlooked i understand the importance of having any area just for us
unlike the crossfire motors that share v8 qualities the duke really is all its own
I'd like to see an Iron Duke forum too. I mean this is the internet, it's just electrons. It's not like it'll cost bricks and mortar. It can be pre-populated with all the random Iron Duke threads all over the place.
I would not oppose giving it a try if you and others think there's support for it. Would need a moderator - someone that has an interest in them and would also oversea the section.
I would not oppose giving it a try if you and others think there's support for it. Would need a moderator - someone that has an interest in them and would also oversea the section.
I'm certainly no expert on them, but I'd be willing to lend a hand.
Not sure why there is a need for another forum specific to the iron duke. As JT mentioned, there is a general engine tech section already. It encompasses the LU5, LG4, LO3, L98, LB9, L69, LC1, LQ9 and whatever else is out there. Engine tech is engine tech and is already a section devoted to engines of all sizes.
Not sure why there is a need for another forum specific to the iron duke. As JT mentioned, there is a general engine tech section already. It encompasses the LU5, LG4, LO3, L98, LB9, L69, LC1, LQ9 and whatever else is out there. Engine tech is engine tech and is already a section devoted to engines of all sizes.
You bedazzle me sir, with your spew of engine or platform codes or whatever you have there.
What is a 82Duke?
How do I know?
What do I search for to mine productively?
How will other "Duke Friends" know that a thread requesting help has been buried in these holes you write of without searching the labyrinth of this forum?
I wouldn't mind seeing an Iron Duke board...I'd rather surf that board than a V6 board
I nominate Charlie to be the moderator. I know he has other online obligations, but no one around here besides him carries the torch for 90hp Camaros quite like he does
As I just PM'd JT, I'm in!
Iron Duke folks need a place to congregate before all these cars are gone or any desire to save them is gone. We're probably pretty close to that point now, as most of these cars have either been junked or have recieved amatuer mystery smallblock swaps - which essentially makes them now worth nothing.
That's actually exactly what I was wondering.. I saw a thread on here in which some people testified that the 2.8 and 3.1's in the Thirdgens are actually as fuel inefficient as the 305's, because they have to work so much harder to power our fairly heavy cars. I imagine the Iron Duke would be even worse, so I'd be inclined to think its mpg would still be around the same area; however, I have no idea. Anyone who owns/owned one got any actual numbers?
That's why I've always wondered why anyone buying one of these cars new would choose the 4 or 6 cylinder because the 305 got very decent mileage.
It's not all about mileage guys... How bout cheaper insurance?
The insurance couldn't be that much more where it would be overwhelming to the point of buying a 4 cylinder.
If you want something bad enough there is always a way.
4 and 6 cylinders i imagine where about the same on insurance but the v8s are astronomically higher if you are young(which i was 16 when i got my first) or have a bad driving record. so yeah insurance can play a big factor and probably did for some buyers at the time
i mean look how many 4 banger camaro/firebird/mustangs sold through the years
Last edited by Pillsbry10; Mar 25, 2011 at 09:25 PM.
In all reality guys,having a fiero duke myself, the list of things you can do to modify them starts with swap it and ends with swap it. It is a motor that can't take crap. They leak oil like crazy, and are very very very underpowered even in at 2700lb car.
bone stock iron duke swamp buggy, built with it for all the opposite reasons.
You have to know what your doing.
Think of the original Jeep, tiny inline 4 that won the war.
Or the guys in 80HP 4x4 trucks with spoke wood wheels that made the first ice roads of Alaska.
People who bought them new with an iron duke did so as it matched their needs. Only a dumb --- would expect vette performance from a 4.
i started reading this topic to see if the four cylinder cars got great mileage.apperanty not.it seems to me if you want a 40 mpg camaro,its time to swap in a last model engine.
The iron duke is know for having a weak block and weak crank.
If you have the super duty iron duke block and the right internals then it might hold 500hp.
Or if they're anything like a civic 4cyl you could just shoot a rod out of the side of the block, seen this first person, almost hit my buddy in the face if my other buddy didn't tell him to move. Honestly, it could have been very tragic.
Or if they're anything like a civic 4cyl you could just shoot a rod out of the side of the block, seen this first person, almost hit my buddy in the face if my other buddy didn't tell him to move. Honestly, it could have been very tragic.
Sad thing is a civic block and crank are stronger and the old A series accord blocks are worlds stronger.
I don't understand how these little guys got such a bad reputation. Great engines if they are built right and taken care of. Keep them under 5500 RPM's. Balance the internals. You're not going to get V8 power, but who cares. My next 2.5 is going to get 40 over pistons w/ steel sleeved cylinders. We race these little guys every Sat night. Lots of fun.
My buddy had an iron duke firebird with a 4 speed. It wasn't a dog at all. It didn't feel much slower than my 82 LG4. He loved that bird and drove it everywhere. I just remember thinking that his firebird sounded funny because I was used to hearing them with a V8.
This is wonderful! I’m so glad that people have held on to their 4 pots and haven’t torn them out to thrown them away. They had their place and it seems, looking at the figures, that there wasn’t much of a bhp difference between the early V8’s and 4pots. Torque and drive ability maybe, but people bought what they needed.
I think a Duke section would be very beneficial to the owners and prospective modified owners. You can’t exclude a section based on activity having not done a study into viability ie testing the section!!
Anyway just wanted to pop in and add that I love that these are now gaining suppprt and appreciation for what they are.
Just bought this 1984 Iron Duke Camaro in February for $1000. Have done some work to it since then (catalytic converter, radiator, starter). 84k original miles. I've driven it almost 1k miles so far, and drives great! Since this picture I've replaced these mirrors with the original type mirrors. Even though it's a 4-cylinder it does have a lot of power and can easily cruise at 70mph. Paint was very oxidized but after 12 hours and using rubbing compound and 3-stage wax system I got it to look like this now. Original paint as well.
) 10% of all base firebirds were iron dukes there were only about 70,000 iron duke f bodys built. With the newest one being built 25 years ago and this probably being the least desirable f body ever built I think (as stated above) with engine swaps lack of maintenance and rust (it costs the same to fix a Z28 body as it would a sport coupe body and we see people parting Z28s all the time) there can't be many left at all I would have no idea of how you would know or even guess. I think this says why there is no need for an iron duke forum.
