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Help with faulty clutch/linkage t-10 4 speed

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Old Jun 4, 2010 | 10:54 AM
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Philly89Iroc's Avatar
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Help with faulty clutch/linkage t-10 4 speed

I've been having problems with my borg warner super t10 lately. It is extremely hard to get the car into any gear when its warm, most of the time it will simply not go into first when warm from a start either. The pedal does not feel right (hard to push down, doesn't feel smooth, noticeable noise even with car off) and as soon as the clutch pedal is pushed all the way down, the car starts rolling without the gas pressed down. I had a trusted mechanic get in the car and told me the clutch is probably bad. However, I'm having a really hard time believing this though because the car only has 27,000 miles (82 MSE trans am) on it with the complete stock drivetrain and have driven this car gingerly (1 150 mile shore trip, 5 other short 10 minute drives, experienced driver). The previous owner had a 60's camaro and a 1980 turbo trans am both with 4 speed manuals and drove this car on the weekends to the shore, not as a daily driver in the 1980s and never to a drag strip.

Not happy with that diagnosis, I had another mechanic at a different shop look at it while I pushed the clutch in and the linkage barely moves at all, with nothing really moving under the car. He said the linkage is definitely at fault, its twisting when the pedal is pushed, the bushing on the under hood linkage is bad, and its pretty much hitting the brake booster every time the pedal is pushed down. The linkage is not moving under the car either or not enough that its noticeable from what I could tell but I haven't really been under the car to look at it. Unfortunately, I was told he would have to remove the master cylinder to fix this problem and he can't tell if the z-bar is at fault until everything is apart.

My worry is two-fold, that I've possibly damaged the clutch/flywheel or pressure plate and that the z-bar is broken. Now, even with the car cold, it is hard to shift it into any gear and worse once its warm. It basically "crunches into gear" cold then when its warm becomes near impossible to shift. The pedal is definitely worse than it originally when the problem first occurred. The problem first occurred last friday while sitting in shore traffic, again on the way home Sunday, and its been driven a total of 4 times for 10 minutes or less in the city this week. The car is not a daily driver and has only moved to be driven to repair shops this week. I was told the clutch is probably ok as long as I don't drive it until the linkage is fixed. I also have no idea what parts, z-bar, or bushings I should buy or where to get them or if I should wait to purchase a new z-bar. I was told b&m makes a replacement now for this setup and if the bar is welded, it won't last.
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Old Jun 4, 2010 | 01:45 PM
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Re: Help with faulty clutch/linkage t-10 4 speed

new bushings and possibly the ballstuds and bushing clips were available from the dealer last I checked; they fit back to the 1960s at least.

Look under the dash at the upper rod for wear or damage.

Reach down and feel for slop in the z-bar. It should be pivoting on a ballstud that's bolted to the stubframe / wheelwell and another stud that's threaded into the side of the block.

If it's not sloppy, adjust the lower pushrod.

If it's sloppy, un-fasten the upper rod (pedal to z-bar) and lower (z-bar to clutch fork) rod, unfasten the outer ballstud of of the z-bar from it's bracket and slip the Z off the engine ballstud to remove it.

Take it to a welder. A little reinforcement metal and quality welds will have you all set, more than likely. The holes in the arms of the Z may be worn, as may be the rods. This can be fixed with welding or new pieces.

Once you have the z-bar and lower pushrod out, you'll have everything figured out as to what to replace. I might have a tiny number of spare bushings or clips but they're cheap at the dealer and might be in the Motormite Help! line (I haven't looked.)
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Old Jun 5, 2010 | 03:51 PM
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Philly89Iroc's Avatar
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Re: Help with faulty clutch/linkage t-10 4 speed

Thanks for the great info, it did help a lot today as I checked out a few things. Here's what I checked and observed:

I opened the hood and checked the z-bar at the pivoting end that bolts to the subframe, no damage (no cracks or missing pieces) and it has no play at all. I'm going to have someone help me check it again because I was by myself when I was working on the car. I had to use a steering wheel club to hold the clutch pedal down to check it with pressure applied.

I did discovered that on the ball end that connects to the subframe, there is a piece of metal that has a small hole in it in which I guess the notch on the arm from the pedal linkage slips into to. The little notch on the arm was not in the hole, it was just pushing against the flat piece of metal on the subframe end of the z-bar. I reconnected it and used some grease on the z bar.

I did not adjust the linkage yet on the lower pushrod. I also cannot find the upper push-rod under the dash in the car? Is it under the dash or is it under the brake booster? I'll look again for it, at the time I was more concerned with whether or not the z-bar was broken.

I look underneath and the z-bar had no play, springs were fine and the linkage seemed ok. However, I noticed that the transmission was completely covered in oil (mostly around the cover) but neither the engine or the bell-housing were covered in any oil, the entire engine was completely dry. The oil reached as far as the tail shaft. Its possible some seal had blown, the car sat in a garage unused for a majority of its life. I had only driven it maybe 5-10 miles until I attempted to drive it down the shore, which probably wasn't the best idea especially for memorial day weekend.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Then I decided to start the car and take it for a short drive. The clutch worked perfectly (did not adjust just yet), smooth operation even into reverse but then the original problem returned after 10-15 minutes of driving. The car did not move forward in either first or second with the clutch pedal pushed all the way in, even when the same problem started again. It wasn't as bad as it was before but it became increasingly difficult and I promptly returned the car home to prevent drivetrain damage.

I noticed that all gears smoothly engaged with the car off prior to starting it after checking/fixing the z-bar. After the 10-15 minute drive, it was rough trying to select any gear with the car off.

So, is a clutch adjustment necessary or is the transmission the source of this problem? I did not check the level of the fluid in the transmission because I honestly don't know how to fill it properly. I'm going to glance over it again and hunt down a chilton's manual for this car, I have a feeling I'm going to need it.

Thanks again for your help and your time.
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