cannot clear the new motor
 

I am doing a 383 swap for my old 305 tbi in my 91 RS. I have the stock flat hood on right now, but want to know if I can clear this new set up with the stock hood?

A little information:

It's a 383 with dart heads and a dart intake (tall intake, like a victor jr.).

I am running a 800cfm holley DP.

Can I clear a low profile cleaner?

If not, I was thinking about the butterfly scoop (for single carbs) with a hole (perfectly cut) in the stock hood coming out the top, would this look okay>?

How many problems would I run into with this air cleaner? Would I have to worry about s-h-i-t going inside the carb with this intake mod?

Any pics of something like this?

Thanks

Can anyone photoshop something like this?

I think you may have hood clearance issues with the tall intake.
I think it'd be better to use a cowl hood and regular air cleaner than use the scoop. And, yes, you'll suck in all kinds of debris with the scoop, that'll wear on rings and valves.
My 2 Cents.
-Rich-

I too have a Victor Jr. intake and a holley 750dp and my stock hood wouldn't clear the carb without an air cleaner not to mention with one. I have solid steel mounts and they may have set the engine up a little higher and I would think you would have them too with that kind of engine. So this is just on instance that there was for sure a clearance problem. I went with a 3" Harwood cowl hood and now I can fit my 2" spacer on it. Hope this helps.

So looks like I will have to wait and see what type of hood to get. I don't want a huge cowl hood like my last 5" one. I hope I can get away with a 2.5" cowl.???

You said 3" cowl with a carb spacer, but what size air cleaner did you use?

Thanks

which dart heads did you go with. Im thing about going with them also. Seems like a good head for the money. Iron eagle and pro 1's

Pro 1's, (alum).... Picked them up new for under $1000. Match them up to the dart intake and your talking flow and HP like a mother!

under a grand!! where? in ky?

I am definatly looking at the 215's. Was that under a grand assembled or bare?

I was thinking about using a team G intake. The regular base is about the same hight as the stealth ram. I compared both a a speed shop. but you still get the Team G runners.

I run one of those triangular edelbrock aircleaners. I would have to say its around 2 or 3 inches. I know with the 3" cowl hood i have about a 1/4 to 1/2 inch clearance between the top of the breather and the hood. The clearer I use doesn't have that wing nut and all tread rod either. I know if by chance the stock hood was to work, you would have to use a drop base air cleaner and remove all that insulation from the hood and then it may fit. I just know that when I laid my stock hood up on the car with no spacer and no breather, the hood laid on top of the carb or was too close for comfort.

If you want me to take a couple of pics to show you the clearance, I probably could do that....just let me know.

2laneblacktop: Yes post pics if you can. I am almost sure my set up will not fit.. Time for another cowl, and paint!

bluegrassz: Yes, I got them bare for $1000. I am using crane 1.6 RR's for my set up. The guy in Louisville that is doing the motor build up and swap gets SMOKING deals on aftermarket parts because he builds so many motors and cars to race, that he gets a group discount everytime.

oops, I forgot to mention the heads are the Dart Pro1 227's

They flow over 300 out of the box!

Once I get more funds, I will remove them (next spring maybe) and have them ported and polished (another $600). But, they will provide me all the HP I am looking for ported. I should be happy with them not being ported anyway. Dart makes GREAT HEADS! And the dart SB intake ($210, great intake, flows like a holley domonator or victor jr, even better I believe).

Go to www.dartheads.com and look at the flow charts for the heads (227's) and the intake..

GOFASTER, are you sure those 227's are going to kill your low end torque? Damn, those are some big runners!!

I like dart products too. What is the RPM range on that intake?

Oh yeah, I already have darts website marked as one of my favorites!:D

I don't think the heads will kill my low end power that bad.. Hope not, but compared to my mechanic I know jack s-h-i-t about this set up. He is doing all the work and I just slap money on his desk when he is done.

I believe the RPM range on that intake is 2000-6500.

Overall a great intake, compared to the domonator and victor jr IMO.

I would think that you would loose some low end with that big of runners and a single plane intake. On the other side of things, the 383 is torque happy anyway. I would be interested to know how it turns out. Are you going to have it dynoed?

Ben

I will have it dynoed before going in the car. Correction to the heads, I call my mechanic and made sure, I guess the heads are the 215cc Pro1's. Should be more in line of what I am building. After long, I will have the heads ported and polished to get some extra HP... So far, plugging the numbers into dyno desktop if looks about 547 HP... and about the same numbers in TQ!

I am so excited to run this motor, I cannot sleep at night.. Like a kid before christmas..


PS Everything inside is forged, so I am going to bump the NOS to 275.... that should see 10's I would think?

Looks like the same motor Im going to build. Except I will keep it 355 proably. Dart 215 pro 1's, Team G intake, Holley 750 DP, comp cam .560-.580 lift, scat crank, manley h-beam rods, and je pistons. Hopefully this combo will be good.

Let me know how you do on the dyno. Also how much longer before you get the motor in?



P.s. My dad was stationed at FT KNOX after he was wounded in vietnam. Also there should be a draw hunt coming up down there."deer season".

later
bluegrassz

GOFASTER,
What kind of tranny are you going to be running? I hope its not stock. I dont see any stock tranny living very long behind that setup. I was also curious when you plan to have this done.

Ben

The motor will be done in about 2-3 weeks and totaly installed. AT the same time (as the swap) I will be installing a 3500 RPM stall. The tranny (said to say) will remain stock (besides a shift kit, and new stall). Nevertheless, I will run that tranny until I break it, or can afford a new rebuilt 700R4, but until then I must stick with it as is (money permitting). Plus, you must realize that I have to drive this new motor some 500 miles before I can really race it, and in winter time, that could take me months to acuire that many miles. In Kentucky snow is not as bad as my home state, so I am hoping that I can still drive the f-body until X-mas. Then only have it out for the winter for a few months.

The block is at the machine shop RIGHT NOW! I went and looked at all the parts last night. *Another correction to the heads, they are 220's, with 10:5.1 SRP forged pistons. This set up should screem....

sounds good, let us know what the dyno shows.:)

Re: cannot clear the new motor
 

Im curious. For instance, if he was doing a swap with a 350, could his stock hood be able to clear the carb? Is the size difference between a 383 and a 350 much different, or does it go both ways?

A 350 and a 383 (and a 305, 400, 327...) are the same physical size. The difference in displacement comes from differences in bore and stroke.

The big concern is what intake would you be running? I am going with a very tall intake, however, I have seen pics of people clearing small blocks with the performer and RPM version intakes and Q jets. Not as tall as a say victor jr. with a 800 cfm Holley DP. your talking much more clearence problems then.

Here are some of the pics of clearance of my victor jr. and holley setup. And just a reminder that I do have a 2" spacer on there. But even without that you can see that it would be a real struggle to get it to fit. I know I couldn't.

Here's another.

Here's one of my hood.

Nice pics! So with out the spacer, you still think you would have had problems? That sucks, because I want to keep my stock hood, you know like a sleeper look... he he, maybe catch me a mustang and wip his little a-s-s! LOL...

Nice car BTW 2laneblacktop!

Even without it I wasn't able to use the stock hood or I would have because I am on a fairly tight budget. I tried to use the stock hood without the spacer and a aircleaner and the stock hood when laid on the car sat right on top of the carb. There was just no way I could get it to work.

Looks like it's time to order Harwood's 4" lift off cowl for $209 out of summit then. Guess the mustangs will smell me coming now... lol.

naw, they will be to occupied smelling their self.:D lol j/k

Lift off? Is it a complete hood that just "lifts off" or is it just the cowl section?

Ben

I've heard bad things about that filter from reading this board, just a heads up

You've heard bad things about a normal foam element filter. Like what? I know if you back fire through your carb it will melt it or blow a hole in it. But thats why you time your car with it off. Just wondering what could actaully be bad.

Yeah, I have heard of those triangle filters getting the foam sucked right out into the carb. Sometimes pieces get into the motor. This is just what I have been told by some people that have used them. Nice motor though

Yeah I can see that....I haven't had any problems yet and it flows really well. Anyway, I thought i would add one more pic on so you can see the whole engine instead of just the top....i'm pretty proud of it and to say I built it myself. It runs good too.:D

I had better attach it...haha

Is that about as short as Carbed Intakes can be, or are there possible shorter ones to perhaps clear the stock hood?

That is actually a quite tall carbed intake. It is a high rise manifold, with a 2 inch spacer and a holley. You can run several dual plane manifolds and fit a carb under the hood, especially if you use a drop base air cleaner.

Ben

"Lift off? Is it a complete hood that just "lifts off" or is it just the cowl section?

Ben"


That is a complete hood, with pins. Unlimited Products also makes a 4 3/4" "lift off" style hood for around $270, that one I have used before and loved it.


2laneblacktop: Are your running dart heads? Dart intake? I seen your dart valve covers and thought I would ask.

I just put a 350 in a 1992 camaro and did not have any hood clearance issue. I am using stock style motor mount and I use a victor jr intake with out a spacer. I am also using a very low profile aircleaner. I think it would be better to have a little clearance so if you have the extra money get a cowl hood.

Yeah, be sure to let us know how the 383 turns out. I'm building a similiar one right now as of fact. All 4340 forged steel assembly except for pistons there TRW forged aluminum and full float. It's all in the shop right now getting balanced. I'm also using some monster heads.... 210cc AFR Race Ready (1500 bucks assembled and shipped) plan on polishing the ports up a little bit. I got a Victor Jr. intake already that I've shined the outside on. Going to use a Solid Roller cam with pro magnum roller rockers. I'm very interested to seeing the dyno sheet on your motor.

Sounds like you have the same set up as mine.. Solid cam, forged, everything... I am running the dart heads and intake, but almost the same. I am hopping to have my motor in and running in no more than 2 weeks. I will post the numbers when I get her back.

Dude, I cant wait til you get that motor in!!! Im excited about it to... LOL!!!!

GOFASTER: Yes, I am running pro 1 215 angle plug heads. I am also running a victor jr intake so no it is not Dart. I'm not one to put the valve covers on just for show, I own the real thing..haha

Wow, how do you like them heads? I have the 220 PRO 1'S with the matching dart intake. I love them covers, they look great! Thanks Grease Monkey for the support, I am just as excited as you to get this thing running, trust me!

I will let you all know how it goes...

PS Anyone found that with the square port after market heads (e.g., the dart pro 1) that the only headers you can run in our 3rd gens is the hooker Super Comp, which cost almost $400????

That sucks. I ordered the headmen $109 headers (street) and they have the oval port that hook up to stock type heads, I have to send them back or sell them and get $400 to get the super comp headers... ANYONE KNOW OF ANOTHER STYLE HEADER THAT FITS THE SQUARE PORT HEADS LIKE ON DART, SOMETHING CHEAPER?

PS I AM SELLING MY HEADMANS FOR $100 NEW IN THE KENTUCKY AREA BECAUSE I DON'T WANT TO PAY THE MONEY TO SHIP BACK TO SUMMIT.

hehe
 

this post is about my car lol:rockon:

Sweet setup man! Hows that Tremec workin out for ya? I want one of those real bad.

383backinblack I have a few questions for ya. Maybe you could e-mail me this information, since your car is set up so darn close to what I am doing. First off I LOVE YOUR RIDE... NICE

1) How is that T5 holding up to all that power? That just blows my mind thinking about that set up with a 3rd gen 5 speed.

2) Without an air cleaner, could you have cleared your motor with the stock hood (just leaving the carb bare)?

3) What brand hood is that 4"?

4) Did you have to use a whole new pully system and different style steering pump?

5) Are your fans now just on a switch to turn on manually when-ever you drive it?

6) DO YOU HAVE ANY PICS OF YOU EXHAUST? I am thinking of going with the 1 stage flowmaster (the short oval track style).. PICS WOULD BE NICE...

7) How do you like the powertrax unit in your rear end? How much did you pay for it? Would you rather have used the eaton posi unit?

8) the rear end girdle cover, worth it? I was thinking of going with one, but seen many cars running 10's without one on a rather stock 10 bolt...


Thanks a bunch...

My stock motor is totaly out of the car and waiting for the fresh 383 to return from the machine shop. I am having a 3500 stall built for me and putting together ideas for a dual 3" exhaust now. Any more pics of the car would be nice, I REALLY NEED PICS OF THE DUAL EXHAUST.

Your set up is almost the same as mine to the second, except I am going automatic and my car is red... (he he) That and your using a bigger cam than I am. Mine is deep in the 280's and around 540.

THANKS

Wish I had a digital cam to take progress pics for everyone.. :-(

If you read his sig you will realize that it is not a stock thirdgen t5.

Ben

hey
 

its great, its holding up excellent however i think i may need to have it built a little pending the 300 shot of n20.

also, to answer gofaster,

1)its not a t5 it s atremec TKO, and its awesome:rockon:

2)The carb may have barely cleared without an air cleaner with a stock hood, but by so little it would be a scary thing to do. The cleaner is off in pics cause it looks cooler, the cleaner (4"k&n) is always on for the street.

3)the hood is a harwood outlaw which is called a 4" but is actually closer to 4.75"

4)power steering pump is stock with a march pully (press on), Alternator pulley is a summit billet pulley, crank and water pump are also summit billet alum. it has a short water pump. The alternator bracket we custome fabricated to work on the passenger side of the motor. (that sucked) im gonna get a sweet bracket set up with heim joints and stuff when i have the cash.

5)It has a single stock fan (which is better than the dual setup) which is wired to be on whenever the key is on (no switch)

6)no i dont, i wish i did people have been asking for them. However, i did explain to someone on here about it and i will find that post and post it here for you guys.

7)the powertrax locker is badass i think it costs 400 bucks(i bought the rear end all together as a unit) its a little harsh at time and is a bit quirky, but it is pretty invincible. i snapped an axle splined end off inside the locker, and i hammered the piece out to find the locker was unharmed. at times it can click, or lock up suddenly making a horrific noise (its all explained in the manual and is normal) but it takes some getting used to. IT can cause the car to buck at low, low speed when turning hard (like into a parking space) but it will never wear out. i like it.

8) if cars are running 10's on a 10 bolt especially without a girdle cover, i doubt its really a 10 bolt....it is worth the money, looks slick, and its easy to work with. provides quite a bit of support

hmmm
 

well as an explanation, my exhaust is 3" tubing, comes off the collectors, bows around the tranny crossmember(lowest point) then remains fairly close together in the drive shaft tunnel as it passes through the south side machine lift bar crossmember...it passes under the rear axle, and spreads out attaching to the 2 flowtech warlock mufflers.

the pipes didnt come out on the pics, so i kinda drew the orientation of the mufflers as an orientation for robertg, this is the pic
note: pipes dont go through the bumper cover, but that is about how the warlocks are oriented in the car

383backinblack: I must say, your car is just nice. Thanks for anwsering my questions. Right now my project camaro is mostly stock, waiting on the 383 from the shop (it's actually a 388, bored over .060). After that a 3500 stall and shift kit will be installed, then off to the rear end where a eaton posi and 4:10 gears will be installed. My dual exhaust will just run right off my headers, it will sit low but will only be about 3' long under the car. It's a 90% race car 10% daily driver, if that makes sense?

I bet that 5 speed is a blast to drive..

Thanks again and if you get pics post them..