So I'm trying to trade my Mopar for an F-body. I'm looking at 3rd Gen Camaro's/Firebirds. My g/f has 3 f-body vehicles and after a recent F-body meet, I am hooked! I have WTT adds in the Camaro and Firebird section. Anyway.. this is going to be my post for HELP from a strictly Mopar person who wants a GM product. I have no idea what to look for, what's good/bad (except 305's suck? haha), etc.

At the moment I have a guy interested in doing a trade. Here's the information he listed for me:

"i got a 85 trans am car says its tgot 81000 miles
350 bored .030 over Forged crank
domed pistons 202 heads off 68 camaro roller rockers 500 510 lift crane cam holly street dominator intake with a rebuilt holly 650 double pumper on top MSD 6a box with pro billit distibuter
New trans with less than 2000 miles on it built by j&g transmissons in willowgrove paid 1500 for it
Shift kit with a 3200 stall car has 9 bolt posi new brake lines calipers and rotors

Recaro interior with t tops power windows power door locks and power hatch was painted 3 years ago the paint is in ok shape still shines got some chips and 2 runs on it

Car went 13.2 all motor

The car runs good i can see it going to need rings soon (no big deal if you know what your doing) Car has shorty headers with flowmaster exaust no cat, comp cam vaccum pump to assist in braking, the t/a has stock gears in the rear but hey put some gears in there and go even faster. The car sat out in front my house for a couple years cause i am not able to get it to pass emmisions"

Does this sound like something I should look into getting? It definitely sounds good to me... But what about you experts? Thanks so much for the help! If this is the incorrect forum section for this, please move it to the proper one. Thanks again!

That car sounds like it moves! Although I would think you could squeeze a high 12 out of that setup.

These cars will last forever if treated well. 81k is not high at all for an 85 really, so I would bet she's in decent shape. The trans rebuild is a plus too. I bet if you put in some suspension mods, you could really really get that thing to cut into the 12's easily. The ONLY thing that I raised my eyebrow at in taht description was the fact that he is still running a 9 bolt in the rear. They are probably the weakest OEM rears out there, and will not last very much longer on that setup if you drive that car like it's meant to be driven. I would start looking into a beefy 10 bolt (around $1000 to build), or if you have the money, a 12 bolt (over $2000).

Make sure you check the car out thoroughly before you buy though. One of the biggest PITAs is rust, so check that out, and knock down price accordingly.


EDIT: how much does he want anyhow?

Thank you very much! I wouldn't mind putting a Dana 60 in the rear or even a Ford 9" or something like that. I work for an aftermarket parts company (Mainly for Jeeps and domestic trucks) so we have accounts with all the big name manufacturers. Alloy, Superior, K&N, AEM, lots of etc.'s lol. I also have another guy wanting to trade:

Rick,
The car went 13.4@104 on a street tire in the Fall a few years ago

Here is a small vid of the crop duster..
3rd gen ta - kev 006.avi @ ZippyVideos.com - Free Video Webhosting

I had alot of pics somewhere, here is one:


No idea what they are asking price wise. I just put up the WTT post and got these replies. Both cars are 15 mins from my g/f's house.

From what I've been told, he wants $1500 for it. The white one pictured and the writeup are the same car. On his MySpace comments someone asks if he got the car running right yet. That was back in November of 2005 though.

I am also thinking, being an '85, the mileage he is showing needs to have a 1 on the front of it? I may be wrong, but that's a possibility since there are only 5 digits for the speedo? Or is this incorrect?

Not a bad price for what he is offering. Just make sure you thoroughly check it out before you buy. Drive it around first, park it, check for leaks, start it again, listen for strange noises, etc etc. Great price, but you never know. Hell even if there is something wrong, it might be worth it just to pick up at that price (maybe try to haggle a few hundred off if it is the case).

Going to see it this weekend. I can't wait. I dropped the price of my Dakota in the WTT adds I have on here and will let it go for $3500. I REALLY want this T/A! lol.... He added more pics:

85 Trans Am - Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting

It's a shame that he didnt clean that motor up, would look nice.

I agree. But hey, that just gives me more to keep me busy Still worth the $1500 right?

I went to drive it on Sunday. It was slipping (trans?) a bit... He said it was due to the 3500 stall.. and it has a B&M Megashifter.. which I had no idea how to get into 1st gear? So I'd hit the gas and it would rev up high and start moving... I think that's just 'cause I don't know how to use the B&M.

Idea's? Also, it has a piece of the ring in the #4 piston that cracked and came off... They took the upper end off, took the piece out, and then it ran fine. It has a SLIGHT tap from that cylinder, but it sounds fine aside from that.

It could use some work.. I was thinking of offerring him $900-$1000, or $500-$600 + my motorcycle as a trade. I'll see what I can do.. I am going to see it again this weekend with the owner, as he's in Pittsburgh at a Tech College right now.

Try and find me a buyer for my Dakota and I'll be set for mods and fixes to the engine if required

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/fire...akota-3rd.html

A peice of the piston ring broke off? Thats not good as that means you are going to be losing compression on that cylinder, as well as burn some oil as well.

Not sure about the 3000stall slipping, I have a stock stall so I don't know what it would feel like.

The price is definately in the right area though. The only thing that scares me is the piston ring issue. The only way to fix that is to have to pull the motor and take apart the bottom end and pull out the rotating assembly. Not pretty. I would try and talk him down based on that alone, and if there are any other quirks, then you can talk down more accordingly.

Yes, a piston ring piece broke off. I know it'll be burning off oil due to that and I know it'll be a pain in the *** (requiring a motor removal) to fix it... Definitely good if I want to talk down the price. Thanks for the help/info. Here's another Firebird I JUST came upon on one of my Jeep forums:

"86 firebird 5.7, 700r4 trans with new b&m vavles and shift kit, weiand intake edelbrock 600 cfm carb, hooker headers and flowmaster exg. and a cam (i forget the specs on it) also eaton locker, this car is FAST, with a car full of people and doing 30mph if you mat it to the floor it brakes lose. im asking $1800 o.b.o give me a call"

That thing sounds nice as well and is only about 45 minutes from my house. I plan to go look at it with my g/f this weekend since she is the F-body know it all of the couple .. at the moment If it's got less problems, that may be good as well. I have a motorcycle I can use as collateral and maybe throw some cash in... or just sell my bike cheap, etc.. I dunno, we'll see how nice it looks if her and I end up checking it out this weekend. I'll post pics and more info once I get it.

OK, slowly now......... breathe....... breathe. Feel more relaxed? Good. Can't make good decisions when emotions get involved.

I'll try to point out a few things that you might want to consider:

1. There are good deals on 3rd gen Camaros/Firebirds every day of the week in every town across this great land. DON'T think you'll never find another car like this. You will, trust me.

2. Body and interior work are expensive and time consuming. Engines are, comparatilvely speaking, cheap and easy. Buy the car that's in the best shape as far as paint, body, interior. Oh, and make sure the car is straight- not tweaked in an accident or with banged up suspension stuff. That can get expensive, too, if you're talking frame damage. Also- how badly hacked up is the wiring under the hood?- that can be nightmarish to figure out, especially if this is your first Chevy. Do the electrical bits all work (power windows/locks, gagues, lights, etc.- that stuff can drive the average guy nuts to fix)? Would you care if they didn't work?

3. That engine is toast. I know what the guy's telling you- he damaged the ringLAND above the top ring of the piston. That's detonation that does that, which means the motor's not tuned right or just a bad combination of parts (I saw "domed pistons" and "late sixties vintage heads" in the same sentance- I will take a guess and say that motor's got WAY too much compression for todays' pump gas- hence, the detonation and piston damage). If you buy this car you know you're replacing the motor at least, right?

4. Tranny I have no idea. High stall converters act like a slipping tranny, but you can't really say that equals the tranny itself being in good shape.

Unless you are buying this car with intentions of re-doing basically the drivetrain anyway, I doubt this is the car you want. If it needs to take you to work every day absolutely forget about it. This smells like the typical 3rd gen that's been hacked up, rode hard, put away wet and gets sold as soon as the owner tires of fixing the problems. Am I being harsh? Maybe. But you've got serious stars in your eyes right now and I think you need to consider the downside for a minute.

What are you really trying to do with this car? There may be a better car out there for you.

Wow, thank you for the writeup. First thing is first.. this vehicle is something I only want to use to race at the track, take to car shows on weekends, and maybe drive it a couple times a week MAX, in summer. I have a Jeep that's my currently daily driver, which I am fine with for the time being. This is going to replace my Dakota which has been sitting for a month now.

This will be my 2nd GM product if I do find a T/A to purchase. I had an '88 Caprice with a 305... what a nightmare that care was... it eventually blew up and someone broke into it at the shop where the repairs were getting done. I made a police report and the next day the car vanished.. That was 5 years ago. I haven't seen it since.. and really didn't care.

In regards to the '85, I was thinking about passing on that unless I can talk him down quite a bit. The '86 sounds like it's in better condition than that of the '85, but I am waiting on replies to my questions I sent via PM. We'll see how that goes.

I can do SOME engine work. I've done a couple engine/trans swaps on Mopar vehicles (never on a Chevy), and some minor bolt on mods. The most of the engine I've had apart is the valve cover(s) off and the oil pan off. That's about it. I do have friends who can tear about and completely rebuild an engine with their eyes closed, so that's not a huge worry. I also don't mind putting time into interior work as well as body/exterior. I have wired a lot of things from stereo's to home electrical crap, computers, lighting, etc. So I'm okay with that sort of thing. My g/f is going to school for body work/collision, so I am sure pretty she doesn't mind helping me with any of that work that needs to be done if I do find an F-body. Is that right baby? lol... (*wait's for her to post*)...

If I can get that '85 for cheap ($500 or so) I wouldn't mind replacing the engine. 350's are a dime a dozen, at least with the friends I have and the business I am in.

I'll keep you guys updated. Damon.. with what's wrong with that '85, what do you think would be a fair price to pay for it? Thanks.

3500 may be a fair price, depending on what you're buying and if it fits your needs. Hard to tell much about a car just from pictures and descriptions over the internet. I sold my 92 RS, which was a VERY solid car with good body and interior. It had 200K miles but everything that moved had been replaced. You never saw such a tight 200K mile Camaro in your life- the T-tops didn't even leak! All the gagues worked, the A/C worked, everything electrical worked.

Now, it had a modified 350 I built myself with a carb in place of the FI stuff (lots of other improvements around the car like 4.10 gears, posi, subframe connectors, etc.). All emissions bits were removed. I installed it very cleanly, not cutting up the wiring or hacking anything- you could have put the original motor back in it very easily. It ran 13.5s @ 105 and had daily-drivably street manners with no bad behavior (no overheating, stalling, leaking fluids, etc.). I got $2500 for it, but might have been able to hold out for $3000, maybe $3500 at the most (had to sell to clear driveway space for another project). It probably would have brought more money with the stock motor it in. Modified cars are harder to sell becuase the're never modified exactly like how the new owner would want them modified. And it's also tough with no emissions equipment if you live in an area with tough smog inspections.

I would think if that motor was running strong and didn't have any "known" issues that will obviously require it's replacement or rebuild in the near future it might be worth $3500. But with a hurt motor? Well, I wouldn't pay that much for it, especially if you're just going racing and don't care much about the paint/body/interior. Buy a fairly clean, unmolested stock V8 car with a blown engine for much less and build it up with a fresh motor from there. Or buy a car that's already been built for racing that IS in good running condition and go have fun with it.

Thanks again for the reply. I really appreciate this. I only know what I've personally seen from my g/f's bird's, some friends birds, and what I've read online (mainly here).

What are your opinions, from what has been listed, about the '86?

"86 firebird 5.7, 700r4 trans with new b&m vavles and shift kit, weiand intake edelbrock 600 cfm carb, hooker headers and flowmaster exg. and a cam (i forget the specs on it) also eaton locker, this car is FAST, with a car full of people and doing 30mph if you mat it to the floor it brakes lose. im asking $1800 o.b.o give me a call"

"it is just a plan ole 86 firebird, there are 2 minor things wrong with it but they will be fixed before the sale. the electric choke does not work and the electric fan just took a ****."

I wasn't aware that a regular Firebird came with a 350? Does this mean it was swapped into say 6 cyl car? Does this sound like something I should pursue? I need to check mileage.. any other questions you think I should ask?

EDIT: With the '85, he said he'd be willing to trade it for my Motorycle and some cash, plus my motorcycle helmet. This I'd be willing to do as the bike was basically doomed to sit outside over this winter and probably turn to crap.

Base Firebirds never came with a 350. The 305 LG-4 carbureted engine was as hot as it got in 86. Certainly could have been replaced with an (externally identical) 350. Certainly other work has been done to it.

I can't say about any particular car over the internet. People lie. People tell the truth. People make blunderous mistakes both good and bad for the buyer. You really have to see them with your own eyes, drive them, check out the mechanicals, etc. Seller descriptions rarely line up very well with the reality you see with your own eyes.

Thanks for that info. That's what I figured on a Firebird with a 350. I'll see what I can work out on the '85 and go with it. With the 3500 stall it felt like it's slipping until it gets to right around 3500.. and this is basically correct from what my good friend told me. The '85 is in good condition for what it is. I looked it over for rust and only found some minor surface rust at the hood latch location on the front of the vehicle. Another issue is the doors are pretty hard to open/close, not a huge pain though. The center console where the shifter is is somewhat loose as well, but I should be able to remove the cover and bolt it down more if need be. I just want to figure out the shifter and I wouldn't mind owning it.

I'll give it a good look over again and take it out for a real test drive with the owner this time (it was his father last time).. let the engine warm up, etc. If I do blow the engine and have to replace it, that's fine... I can get a cheap 350 from almost anywhere. It has an electric fan that we forgot to switch on during the last test drive, and it did boil the water in the coolant bottle....

You do make some very good points. Hey, where in Philly are you? The car probably isn't too far from you It's located near Horsham, PA in Montgomery County.. lol... just wondering.