The ground strap that goes to the passenger side head is a copper like strap right? I think mine is off now that i think about it, i will have to double check that, but would that be the actual cause of my problem being that the other ground straps are attached?

 

Its a basic kind of relay, nothing special. Look in the general electronics section of an auto store where they sell lightbulbs, switches, wire, those kinds of things.

 

so, im totally embarrasses....... i hooked up the starter wires incorrectly. I have a duralast starter w/ a lifetime warranty. the new one i got had a threaded stud on the starter housing and i thought maybe they changed the design for the "s" terminal so it would be easier to hook up....... umm no, it goes the same place as it always did. I cut out and replaced all fusible links today and replaced them, bought a new iginiton switch, didnt install it, put in a push button starter system and still wouldn't f.ing start. neighbor looked at it said i must have something wired wrong, took a look at the book and sure enough i screwed it up. So...... double check your wiring, and also check your ground to the block, mine was rusty as hell. I can't find a starter enable relay anywhere, i think it's dealer only, it is behind the kick panel under the hood release behind a bunch of goo, pop the top and use the key, see if it is working. I will keep up with this thread, I'm curious what your fix will finally be.

 

it could definitely be the cause of your trouble, if the one ground is rusty and corroded and the other isnt working, you may have this worked out

 

well I am almost certain my starter is hooked up correctly, the 3 larger red wires go to the one terminal and the smaller purple wire to the other terminal. Aside from the one ground strap in the back of the passenger head, the other straps are all secure and cleaned thoroughly to ensure good connection. I dont think it is at my starter where the problem lies because I am only getting like half the voltage i should be getting, so it is almost certainly a problem before there.
I have found the starter enable relay, but need to check for proper operation, I am hoping it is faulty and is the cause of my problem.

 

get it out from under the goo, and pop the top off via the tabs, be careful not to break them, use th key to start, the relay should click right over, if it doesn't push it with your finger, maybe it is jammed up, yup three wires to one terminal, one purple to the samll terminal ON the soleniod lol, check all your fusible links by pulling on each end, if it is blown or corroded it will separate, good luck even finding replacements though, mine cost 46 bucks for like 7 today, were not even all the right rating, the other fusible links are on the side of the radiator near the battery leading into a terminal block, if u have one blown, this could definitely be your problem.

 

I visually checked my fusible links and all looked to check out fine, but if the relay isnt the problem i will have to go back and check them all again. its just a matter of figuring out where I am losing the voltage between the battery and the neutral safety switch.

 

Back to the drawing board, it is not the starter enable relay, it works everytime. I hooked up the other ground strap as well with no results either.

 

If the 2 larger wires (green and purple) that go to the neutral safety switch are hooked up backwards, would it cause problems or does it not make a difference?

 

bump

 

No it's just a switch it doesn't matter.

A clicking sound and 12v at the output contact of most low current relays can be accepted as working, but relays that control large current devices like the solenoid/starter need to be bypassed to test unless you now how to do voltage drop measurements. Apply 12v to the NSS green wire contact, this will test the NSS if the car starts consistently then NSS is good and the starter enable relay needs to be replaced. The remote starter relay (solenoid) mentioned by Five7Kid can be used as a replacement for the starter enable relay. but a relay rated for 50amps will do.

 

so the fact that the starter relay clicks closed everytime is not a good indicator that it is working 100% or properly? I will have to do the bypass test and see what happens.

I am very frustrated at this point, i have half the underdash ripped apart, wires all over the place trying to trace wires. The problem is probably something stupid and simple but cant seem to track it down. When i first started this post the car would occassionally click but would eventually start, now I cant even get it to start without the battery charger hooked up.

Does anyone have a picture of under the dash where the purple and green wires to the neutral safety switch go/come from, I cant seem to track them down.

 

bump

 

Well, for me the problem definitely has to be NSS's. I've gotten 3 different ones, from 3 different sources, and none of them work. However ALL 3 are the same manufacturer, with the same markings in the same locations.

When I turn the key, I ALWAYS get 12v on the green wire running IN to the NSS, so it's NOT my starter enable relay.

EVERY NSS I try, I only get 8v coming OUT on the purple wire when the key is turned. But when I test continuity on the NSS, I get no resistance between the green wire tab and the purple wire tab when it's in the park position, so this make no sense to me - no resistance should mean 12v in and 12v out - but it doesn't happen that way.

ALL my grounds are good. ALL my fusible links are good. I'm going to check them one more time - although after checking them 3 times already I don't know what good it'll do.

Then - I'm going to bypass this POS system and install a push button starter switch where the cigarette lighter hole is in the dash, and call it a day. Maybe get a cool looking one from a newer model car. Then me, the sock monkey, teddy bear, robot, and one-eyed monster are gonna blast the "How Ya Like Me Now" song as we cruise down the road!

 

I am going to see if i can find the problem one more time this weekend and if i dont then i will go to the remote mounted solenoid and see if that solves it.

 

Today, after having the battery on the battery charger for 2 days at a 10 amp charge, I went to start the car and bang it starts right up, wtf? Started it up 4 times with no problem. Dont understand what is going on or why all of a sudden it is working as if nothing was wrong, the true test will be to see what happens when i drive it and if i get the problem again, im crossig my fingers at this point.

 

OK - think mine is solved. Against my will, kicking and screaming, I reread this entire post again for the millionth time. And as much as I didn't want to believe, I decided there was one thing I hadn't done, and that was to replace the starter enable relay even though I had tested it 15 times, and I was always getting 12v on the green wire coming off it to the NSS.

And low and behold, that $10 part was replaced and I have a starter again! I cranked and shut off, cranked and shut off, about 40 times, and no problems at all, cranked every time.

I figured if I was getting 12v from the relay it must be good, but who knows. I've spent $30 (NSS) + $90 (starter) + $10 (relay) + $80 (battery) = $210 to fix a $10 problem But that's about par for the course for me! But, I replaced a 5+ year old battery, won't have to worry about the NSS anymore, and the mini starter was well worth every penny!

 

Ooops! Jumped the gun - started 6 times today no problem, then went back to no start! Fricken Fracken Fugger Ruggin' Ricken Racken Tragger Duckin' Son of a Sailor!

So now, I have replaced EVERYTHING! There's nothing left to check, replace, test, or hit with a big hammer! I give up - time for a cool lighted custom push button starter solution!

 

tried mine twice today and it started both times. I am skeptically hopeful but time will tell. As for your situation, being that you have changed the parts it might be time to look into the wiring more closely. Do you know what your voltage is at the purple wire at the solenoid when the car doesnt start? is your voltage the same at your nss as it is at your battery? As for me, if the problem comes back i will go to a remote solenoid system.

 

After some cussing, I took my console top out again to find that the tab from the NSS that inserts into the gear lever had popped out. I bent the bracket some to hold it in farther, and everything is good to go again! But, like you, I'll keep fingers crossed!

 

well unfortunately I am still having my problem. started it up today no problem let it run for a little bit then turned it off and tried to restart it and "click ". $hit now what do i do. I am going to replace the relay and see what happens.

update: went out there just now to start it up and bam 3 times straight no problem at all.

 

have you tried starting it at the starter when this happens...?

 

as in attaching a wire directly from the battery to the solenoid?

 

no no ... with a jumper wire you jump the starter... don't remember which two they are as it's been a very long time since I've done it... ...

 

oh you mean by touching the solenoid post to the other post, correct?

 

nevermind i know what you are saying now

 

have you guys found the problem yet?

 

In the end, my original issue was a bad starter enable relay. After I replaced that, it started every time, but after a few days the neutral safety switch lever popped out of the slot in the shifter, so it acted up again (since the switch wasn't in 'park' when the shifter was) - once I fixed the the NSS by bending the bracket a bit, everything is great again.

 

i have yet to find the cause of my problem yet, havent look at it in a few weeks. i am going to have a friend come over this wekend to help me find the problem

 

The vats is turned off in the chip. I already replaced starter, batt. cable, ignition switch, clutch safety switch, starter enable relay. problem still there. last nite i tore out the fusible links from the starter and ran the wires straight to the batt. this morning, NO GO!! as soon as i get home i try it, and it fires right up.

 

have you replaced the ignition lock cylinder? you know at this point I would just start changing the wires that go to the starter... chances are the problem is at the ignition lock cylinder or nearby... when you don't get a go, try adjusting the tilt steering column...

 

i know in my situation i have replaced everything except the relay and the positive battery cable as well as the smaller fusible link wires going to the starter. all else has been replaced including the lock cylinder.

 

Hello camarorsssss. I know how frustrating this is. I had a Ford once(only once) and had a simiular problem. I replaced the starter, generator, regulator, battery. Cables looked good. Spent alot of money to find out that a good looking cable does't mean anything. The area you can't see usually is where the problem lies. Mine was the ground cable. Looked like new. But inside the grommet that bolts to the engine was corroded. I replaced that and behold, started right up. Might be worth a try.

 

as you said shelad, sometimes the problem lies in places that look fine but in my case that only leaves the positive cable, relay, and fusible links. I have a friend coming over one of theses days to track down the culprit. eventually when i solve the issue i will post it.

 

I already replaced the lock cylinder. I have a new pos. wire and the o.g. ground wire plus and additional new ground wire. i thought about going with a remote button, but we got the L.A. invasion coming up and I dont think the tech insp. would approve of that.

 

what about the electronic spark control? not sure if that would cause a no start, but worth a try and test it...

 

no i dont think the ESC has anything to do with it

well i changed the negative and positive battery cables. removed the starter relay and jumped the yellow and green wires and still the problem persists. running out of possible solutions.

 

bump

 

Hey Camarorsssss, I went back but didn't see, did you actually have your battery tested? Like load tested at an auto part store? Seems to me that if you have a bad neutral safety switch, or relay, a boost from a charger wouldn't fix it. You did say that if you put a charger on it, it starts right up. Right? Weak battery? It may have voltage, but not enough amps.
Ooops, I didn't see the beginning where you replaced the battery. Sorry.

 

lol thats ok, i had thought about bringing the battery somewhere to get tested but even when the battery was new the problem was still there. It might be time to bring it to a professional as much as i dont want to.

 

Sorry you need to do that. There is so much experience here, but sometimes its hard with out actually being there. Best of luck to you, and keep us posted.

 

I think i have figured it out the cause of the problem, after doing many tests and jumping the nss and relay. it looks like the relay is the culprit. I am replacing it tomorrow and will give my results.

 

Try swapping your fuel pump and your starter relay. They are both located on the drivers side fire wall. Sounds to me like your relay is acting up. Ive had a couple that would work some times and not others. An easy way to test your system is to test the system one components one at a time. Start by putting 12v directly to the starter, if that checks out go to the relay, etc...

 

Man i keep doing that. I read a little and post my idea just see that im late to the plate. SORRY

 

I also have a similar problem. In the morning or after my car sits for 3-4 hrs it will start up no problem, no hesitation. After driving for 30 minutes or so it won't start at all, won't even click. After some waiting it will eventually do the "click" you are hearing and after a few tries it will engage fully to start my car. So you're not the only one in this boat. I have put a heat shield around the starter itself with no luck. Going to do some more work today to see if I can fix this problem and will post anything productive.

 

I ran into a little wall, it seems the starter realy is a little hard to come by. for the time being i am going to just by pass the relay, but i would like to get another one. Does anyone have one lying around or know where i can get one?

 

try rockauto.com or eBay... do you have a P/N off the old one? the relay should be a common relay, I think... ...

 

Your fuel pump relay and starter relay are the same. Try switching them around and see if that fixes your problem.

 

hey fellas please do not give up I am having the same prob I fired up my $600 beast and brought it home from the shop running after he changed the plugs, temp control module, antifreeze, and 2.5 qts tranny fluid, replaced shift cable,and new rotor button. fired up and sounded like "RELEASE THE KRACKEN" Got it home after I found out that the motor wasn't locked up. Put it on a set of ramps to get ready for the tranny switch since it wouldn't come out of 2nd. $400 tranny 63k miles with warranty.
Go to start it for my father and nothing not even a click. took off the starter looks like the original test it and it works. my father said could be fusible links. but now I know that it could be: relay, cable, nss, switch, vats, battery, alternator (which was showing low while I was driving home with it) but it started that day each time I hit it. let's keep digging we'll find the answer or we'll all have push buttons lol!! ohh, all the elect. stuff works. 89 rs 305v8 700r4 stock and yes someone did try jumping vats (two small wires inside of big yellow wire)

 

the fuel pump relay and starter relay have different connectors unfortunately they wont be interchangable. the fuel pump and fan switch are the same however that doesnt help me.