Hey guys. I am thinking about doing some intake work on my car. I found this guy on youtube that does TPI intake porting. Have any of you guys used this company before? If you do have a modded TPI intake how much did the porting job give you in terms of power and torque over stock?

Right now my L98 is all stock except for a 52mm BBK throttle body, high flow cat, 3'' flomaster catback, and 1 5/8'' ceramic coated hooker headers and y-pipe.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cywj0Z8Uc2I

http://www.facebook.com/pages/High-F...62540657151556

http://myworld.ebay.com/high_flow_fuel_injection

 

Is only so much you can do on stock TPI parts esp the runners and it doesn't yield a lot
Most upgrade to the larger aftermarket stuff like he shows in his pics as a starting point for mods;
then porting on top if required

(Would be interesting to see if the guy has any before / after flow numbers to see what he is achieving)

 

"This auction is for porting of your base only".

put that $250 into an aftermarket system. like this

http://losangeles.craigslist.org/sfv...833915127.html

 

Yeah thats what I was kind of afraid of, that the work done to a stock intake set up wouldn't give me too many gains. I don't want a high-winding race motor. My car is a 100% street car. I am looking for more gains in the low and mid-rpm range than anything else.

 

ever thought about a gear swap then? maybe 3.27's or 3.45?

 

?

 

I have thought about it before. 3.27 or 3.45 is the lowest I would go. I have had good results when I put in my 2200 rpm stall level 2 trans from bowtie overdrives though. I do a lot of highway driving so I don't want the freeway rpms to be too much and cut a lot in to my mileage.


I still am running the stock bw 9 bolt though. Besides the intake that would be my next round of modifications. I would like to rebuild the 9bolt at some point. I know its not the strongest rear in the world but at my power level it should be able to handle my needs.

 

TPI and high winding are NEVER used in the same sentence

TPI is a bottom end torque intake due to the long runners;in any form ; even with big tube aftermarket versions
they will flatline @5000 -5500 rpm max

 

Even on a stock L98, any intake porting that increases some flow will give gains across the entire rpm range. L98 responds well to intake mods but I'd rather put money towards aftermarket base. You can find used bases for under 300.

 

Thanks for the help guys. I'll look at aftermarket bases and some intake runners. How much do you gain by porting the plenum after you put on an aftermarket base and big tube runners?

 

With aftermarket don't you lose low end tq i heard that a good port of the base. runners . And plenum would flow better then aftermarket intake and you wouldnt lose low end tq as much compared to aftermarket and gain improvement past 5000

I'm looking for intake to use but it's difficult cause my car is a DD and still needs to pass Ca smog

I'm looking not to loss but not to lose low end maybe gain little improved mid range and off course improve the drop in power after 5000

 

Runners are still kept long. Bigger base with long runners will only gain power everywhere.

When you shift to a short runner intake like a siamesed runner or stealth ram, miniram, superram, pro flow xt, etc, you change intake harmonics and shift torque curve higher in the rpm range. So you lose torque down in the lower rpm ranges and gain torque in the higher rpms ranges. You also have less "peak" tq numbers but gain more average tq across the rpm range. More average power usually means faster car provided the gearing takes advantage of it.
People often get afraid of losing low end torque but to be honest, its hard to notice when the car picks up acceleration higher in the rpm band. These cars already have enough low end to move around, but lack the midrange and high rpm power. Alittle bit of gear and converter will make for a much better driving experience IMO and negate the effects of low end torque loss with intake mods.

 

True you make a valid point there I already did full exhaust and upgraded the gear and put a comp cam in intake is next been doing a lot of reading and that my issue is keeping emissions in place due to smog .
I was going to Siamese and port everything due to the emission police here in San Diego lol most of other intakes run a pretty penny but I do like the super ram and also the lt1 intake conversion And stealth ram
But you have to take into account what are you actually going to use your car for as for me I occasional autocross and drag so need a all around good intake setup so I'm leaning towards working with stock intake thats modified or the super ram ... but depending what gears and torque converter

 

I'm reading up on lt1 intake now kinda like that setup but it's have to modify intake

 

If you got smog police, then you need to keep TPI based products. Lots of California guys making big power with TPI here on this site and remaining smog legal.

Talk to them for ideas.

 

Oh yea ive did my research just Cali sucks lol I'm originally from Florida so smog stuff is new to me makes want to move back lol but can't got orders here

Oh nice build with the twins t.

 

Seriously, just order some porting supplies and do it yourself. Eastwood's porting kit comes with 2 6" Mandrels and 20 regular cartridge rolls and 20 tapered rolls too. They even have a kit that comes with a cheap die grinder if you have an air compressor. You'll also need some cross buffs made by either power house or standard abrasives. The mandrel and kit start from about $12 off summit racing. Us some layout blue, scribe your old gaskets and port and smooth away the intake and the lip of the runner. I've read that an extrude honed stock runner and stock base can flow 260 cfm and it was published in a DFI 6 book by Ray T. Bohacz. So I suppose porting would get close. Eventually you're gonna want to port your heads too yourself. You'll need the three carbide kit do cast iron on your heads. Personally, it took me 100 hours to port both heads following David Vizard's book. And about 4 hours per runner/intake. So if you're just going to do the runners and intake, you're looking at 32 hours of work at least and $50 worth of cartridge rolls and cross buffs. (You don't need carbides to do the intake. That's why it's cheap. Heads are another story.) I noticed on his videos that he opened up the entrance of the port-where the runners meet the manifold so much that I'm not sure if the stock Fel-Pro gaskets will seal anymore. I'm saying this because my SDPC intake was ported and was at the limit of the gasket and still didn't look that big! But I liked the work done inside the manifold. Where the EGR valve bolts on top, there's a stupid turn inside the manifold and I was too chicken to straighten those ports out for fear of breaking something or porting into the EGR bolt holes. But it's not hard. Just a lot of time and make sure you wear ear plugs, a mask and have a shop vac sucking up the shavings from the other end of the port. And eye glasses too! Aluminum shavings are sharp and go everywhere! And make sure you clean the manifold after too. I vacuumed, used the air gun and ran white paper towels all over to clean up the grit afterwards. I suppose you could use solvent, but every time I do that to virgin metal, rust seems to form after right away. Try intake manifold cleaner or something. The guys price seems reasonable, but I would spend my money on porting supplies and save the rest. The stock runners are really too small for a 350 anyways, but if you're tight on cash I would just port away the inside lip.

 

You'd be amazed at the gains a properly ported stock TPI base with large tune runners and ported plenum can provide.
Check out High Flow Fuel Injection on Facebook.

 

99% OF POST ARE NOT CORRECT. STOCK MANFOLD CAN PRODUCE SAME NUMBERS AS AFTER MARKET .IF PORTED.And you save 700$ or more

 

its alot of work i can be done from what ive seen

 

so what would you rather do spend 700$ plus or spemd 4 hours on a better intake and the Satisfaction that you did it yourself and saved a boat load of money?Just think your saveing 200 dollors a hour!!!

 

think its going to take more then 4 hours to fully port base runners and plenum
im going to be running lt1 intake and heads that are converted already i might not do the heads will see to much going on right now to be doing a project like that as i need a cam with more duration then the one i have now among other stuff so going to use intake for now

and i agree you will save money any modifications to tpi intake you will see gains but its alot more then 4 hours of work and to make a tpi engine fast your going to spend more money then you would on any other intake system just the nature of the beast with tpi

 

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/tpi/...owing-tpi.html

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/tpi/...be-runner.html

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/tpi/...ifold-slp.html

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/tpi/...ified-tpi.html

these intakes didnt take 4 hours to port or improve

 

Was just a ballpark number

 

how did them plem/runners turnout on the dyno. I will post in that tread

 

but its good to learn the skill IMO

when i swap my lt1 intake ive got and IDEA i thought about and toying with that seems easier and cheaper and hopfully get performance on par with accel superram and beable to keep emmsions for under $250 or less maybe less then $150

 

 

The ones that are wide open?

 

on which thread they should have dyno chart in the tread but depending on your mods cam and heads it just depends they are making the runners shorter to increse the peak hp and flatten the tq curve to make less peaky

 

tpi runners are i believe 17"
miniram are 3.5"

big difference in turn different tq/hp curves
theres alot more then just porting
when you siamese the runners you are inturn shortning them incresing peak hp

 

I always have to chuckle when I hear this. My long runner TPI, extremely modified as it may be, pulls hard to 6,500 and I shift at 6,800. Every now and then I miss a shift but my MSD digital 6 holds it from going past 6,900. Otherwise it would shoot right past 7,000. You really need to do your own homework and don't get caught up in the limits people put on these engines without testing it out first.

In 1998, Myron Cottrel, the founder of TPIS, built a stock headed TPI for racing his Corvette. Along with the stock heads, it ran a ported stock base, stock runners, and a stock 48mm throttle body with an airfoil. He used his ZZX cam(240/240 @ .050, .560/.560), the same cam that I run with alot better heads and everything else. His 350cid engine made 408hp at 5,750rpm and pulled hard to 6,200.

I run that same ZZX cam in my 355 with fully ported Twisted Wedge heads and fully ported and matched intake including the Superram Base, TPIS Large Tube Runners, ported plenum and 58mm throttle body. This thing screams.

 

I agree if you put the hard work in it will pay off

 

I'm a newbie and worked slow and carefully. It took me 4 hours per runner, but I gasket matched the inlet and outlets of the runner. Bolt your gasket on, take a sharpie and draw an outline. Port until there is only a thin outline of the maker left to account for the gasket shifting when you install the manifold.


I took Mr. Gasket super ram gaskets so my inlets are 1.75" and I bell mouthed my inlet link a velocity stack to speed up the air. It necks from 1.75" to 1.67" a half inch into the port. One day I've got to take a velocity probe and flow it.


But High Flo fuel injection aka 385in2005 is right. The stock manifold does seal up better than most and they can make very good power ported and attached to long tube runners. If you don't want to do it yourself. high flo fuel injection's prices are reasonable.

If you want your stock manifold to flow 300+ cfm, then you're going to have to weld the roof of the runners and port it. Dr. J's can do it and flow it before and after but it's pricey! Even Jerry Who said he would not do it again in that quest for better flowing TPI thread. The SDPC vortec manifold sucks because the injector bung protrudes into the port and cuts flow. You can port it down a little bit, but it still won't be as good as the stock manifold's design. If you're using Vortec heads, unfortunately that's the only intake you have (Edelbrocks Vortec TPI manifold is the SDPC manifold except Edelbrock provides a EGR block off plate with theirs and charges more because it says Edelbrock on it.)

But you should pick up 10-20 HP with a ported intake manifold. Combine that with bigger runners and you could have a combine improvement of 20-40 HP. (Stock is 240, so 270-280HP on manifold and runner improvements).

You can still get SLP runners for under $300. I think it was WS6store or something like that. There was a post on cheapest place for runners on the board that linked to it. Cam, heads, headers, cold air intake and tune is what it takes to go over the 300 and possibly 400HP range .

 

Note, the reason I took so long is that if you can port that stupid bump where the EGR is. Most of it was done with emery rolls but it would go faster with a carbide. I would be very careful with a carbide though, it cuts fast and you can't add back material if you screw up without welding.

 

oramac91, im not sure where you get most posts are wrong
without huge mods, the factory intake system can not match up to most of the aftermarket parts.
the factory runners are very thin walled and have nothing to remove.
the aftermarket bases are also beefier and can be opened up more than the stock base.
mod for mod, aftermarket is the way to go.

then there is the FIRST, right out of the box it starts out where the other aftermarket bases & runners end with porting. but sadly, it isn't emissions legal.
if you absolutely must have a LTR system, and if you can run it, the FIRST is the way to go,... unless your name on here is 1989GTATransAm

 

The Vortec intake does have huge injector bungs, but you can remove all but about a 1/4" bump.

I think your horsepower estimates for a ported intake and runners is very optimistic. If you can gain 40 horsepower from just those mods, I'll eat my shirt. I'm doing a head swap, 1.6 rockers, porting my base and my SLP runners and I'm hoping I see 25 - 30 horse for all of it.

 

So after market your gainning 25 to 35 hp. With porting a stock tpi is the same numbers,so how is after market better?Unless your going 600plus hp.

 

Keep a firm grip lol

 

[QUOTE=oramac91;5320652]So after market your gainning 25 to 35 hp. With porting a stock tpi is the same numbers,so how is after market better?(elderebrock vs stock tpi)((((Ported stock tpi about the same )Unless your going 600plus hp.Ya frist is the chit.But if your limited on cash you cant beat porting a stock tpi.I would not buy anything but frist on after market.

 

Stock ported base runners pelneum is = to FIRST intake unported
Stock ported base = aftermarket stock
Stock ported runners '= aftermarket runner stock I could be wrong on that

Aftermarket can be ported larger due to improving where stock left off
That's why aftermarket is better if you have the budget if not stock intake you will see gains just not to the extent as a aftermarket
I haven't seen 600plus LTR setup unless it had power adders
Highest I think is around 400 that's having good flowing heads and good cam that can support the LTR

To reach 400 it's going to be a lot off work and Money put into most of it will be in the intake

But you will see gain on a stock engine but below 5000 and it will drop off after that at the end of the day everybody likes something different especially when it come to there engine setup

 

Lol I would eat my shirt to what heads your running and cam ? You using stock or aftermarket base

 

For those that don't believe me on the gains of a ported stock manifold, go to the library and look at Hot Rod January 1988. "Tuned Power Therapy"

High flow fuel injection's facebook has it on their page. But it's very hard to read the numbers. (I zoomed in with my iphone)

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...type=3&theater

They featured John Lingenfelter modding the Stock TPI.
Test 1 is the stock L98 with no accessories and 1-3/4 headers 263HP@4500 RPM
Test 2 is with the larger Porsche Bosch Maf 271HP@4500 RPM
Test 3 same as Test 1 with ported STOCK intake 288HP@ 4700 RPM
Test 4 with ported intake and Lingenfelter Cam 313HP @ 4700RPM
Test 5 same as test 4 with pocket ported heads 325HP@4700RPM
Test 6 same as Test 5 with enlarged runners 341HP@4700RPM

 

I don't anybody is denying that it can't make power your going to see gains on any stock intake mods and of course with head mods and a cam your going to see a gains from that but if you look closely peak hp is all at the same rpm 4700 and it drops after that in the 1/8th you would be strong but hurt in 1/4 due to hp dropping off after 4700

 

Unfortunately, with the long tube runner setup, especially stock, you are RPM limited. The ported stuff raised the RPM peak numbers by about 200 and that's it. It was all about fattening the HP and TQ numbers in the L98 with every company. That was until TPIS decided that the miniram was the only way to get significant HP out of the SBC. Spin it up past 5500. (They even say on their website with the big mouth intake and runners that no matter how big they made the runners, they could not get the motor to spin past 5500.) This has been debated on the board many times. The only people that were able to do it (Spin the motor past 6000) with an LTR system was with a FIRST, The Super Ram and possibly the Holley Stealth Ram.

http://xtremecarzone.com.au/index.ph...?showtopic=386

Look at all the HP curves in the Ten Times the Torque article. The common bottleneck is the intake manifold and the length of the runners....

 

Agreed
Depends on what you want and what you use car for and Wat intake best suits that and your personal needs
People are going to be bias on what they run cause it works for them
I IMO both intakes long runner and short runner are both good intakes especially LTR for which it was design for to produce beloww 5000 and I think it makes more fun car around town cause of the tq but majority people want faster cars so they get disappointed by the LTR and a lot off people drag race so they want to run higher rpm
I've seen the debates and I just think it's funny sometimes
It's all what you want and both can go fast

 

If you want real fun with a 305 LB9, dump in a single pattern cam 268 Advertised Duration on 110LSA installed advanced 4 degrees with 1.6 rockers, port match the intake, runners, plenum and heads, port the stock heads, and 1-5/8 long tube headers and you CAN spin the motor to 5500RPM (The engineers at Chevy designed the TPI system for the 305.)

As for 400+ HP from a 350 TPI,

http://www.gmhightechperformance.com...k/viewall.html

416HP @ 5000RPM and 487 ft lbs of torque @4000RPM. They used Vortec heads, the CRAPPY SPDC intake, and Accel Runners along with a special grind cam and long tube headers. It CAN be done, with the right combination. The machine shop still has that motor the last time I contacted them about it a few years ago. They wanted $7,000 for it.

 

I'm going from a set of 461 heafs with an unported accel base, unported SLP runners and port matched plenum to SDPC vortecs with a ported SDPC base, ported SLP runners, port matched plenum and 1.6 rockers. The 214/224 cam is being retained.

Regardless of the Lingenfelter results, nobody is getting 40hp from porting their TPI unless it's bolted to a high power large cube motor that has no busuness having TPI on it in the first place.

 

Ugh...I hate seeing people wasting their hard earned money and time.

Dont mean to be a wet towel but youll never see big gains from just using cartridge rolls in fact you use very little if any 90% is carbide work. Smoothing flash out will get you...well a mess on your bench and a slightly lighter wallet. not much else. Summit sells a whoooole those (I call em sucker kits) roll kits to the beginner who may be ill informed on how its really done.
I bought one over 10 yrs ago. lol One.


Ported L98 plenum will never give you a gain you can feel period.

It is merely a finishing touch to compliment aftermarket bases and runners that have had work done. Dont expect a gain you can see on the dyno or sotp by this alone.

Ported stock base can pick things up some but as said for the same money you can get an aftermarket base. THEN work that one over seriously and youve got a good start.


Plenty of people out there making outrageious claims wanting to take your money.
Ask them for facts...they have gained if they cant substantiate it then move on. "My friends friends blah blah"...prove it.
Dyno track results flow sheets, put you in touch wiht their customers to ask for references, real stuff. Just know what youre getting thats all.

 

explane same number from a ported stock tpi to a elderblok?

 

The point he's making is that ANY claims need to be proven, otherwise they're just stories. If somebody claims that their services will get a stock base to outflow an aftermarket one, they should have flow bench or dyno results to prove it. Otherwise, it's just a story.