i have been saving some money and have been thinking about buying the SLP siamesed runners i have a 305 tpi got a exhaust and headers and 3.73 gears. stock tpi. if i just got these runners and added them to my stock tpi what results would i see,.thank you

 

Honestly don't expect much with the stock Cam and base manifold.

My car had the SLP runners when I bought it so I can't compare them to stock, but what I can tell you is with a stock base and the Plenum port matched to the runners my motor would quit pulling around 45 or 4600ish.

After I installed a ported base and ported the living crap out of the runners it pulled strong to about 4900 but I still have the stock Cam holding everything back.

 

i.don't want to spare my torque though

 

Say what?

 

Then drive a diesel.

Torque is the measure of force.
Horsepower is how fast that force can move.

When you say torque, you mean horsepower in the lower RPMs. Most every performance mod people make is a trade off, sacrifice low end torque, gain high RPM torque (horsepower). If you just want low end torque, leave it stock.

Regardless, with a TPI and a baby factory cam, you're not gonna have any shortage of torque unless you really go out of your way to do it with big cams and minirams and so forth.

 

Something else to consider that no one ever thinks of is that mods like this, if done properly, can provide a sufficient enough increase across the whole powerband to negate the powerband shift.

You would think with the modifications I did to my SLP runners, I would expereince a dramatic decrease in "around-town" power. What I experienced was just the opposite. I noted a 400RPM increase before the motor quit pulling along with a very noticable increase in bottom end torque.

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/post...09-post93.html

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/post...12-post94.html

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/post...25-post96.html

Now this story might change some when I do a cam swap, but for your application you will loose hardly any bottom end. Keep in mind to get the most (Dare I say anything at all) out of SLP runners you are going to have to portmatch the plenum to them and get a ported base manifold. By themselves they aren't going to do much but as a package they can move a decent amount of air.

 

those things are ugly. not sure if the Edelbrocks work as good, but they're not as ugly. Accel, TPIS, AS&M look nice (stock appearing) but are pretty damn expensive.

 

Edelbrocks look the same minus the heatsink like castings on the sides.

Not sure where you get the word ugly from. Definitely better than the wimpy appearance of the stock runners.

 

Accel's are not too expensive. I picked up a set a while back for $75 and just picked up a set for $265 priced all over the place. They are identical to the edelbrocks but without that heat sink fins.
The slps need to much work to flow better

 

so with just keeping it stock and adding the SLP runners, i should save my money?
Would i see some better results out of a cam? I have no problem doing the work to put a cam in. I do not want to remove my heads though they are LB9 and have 65,000 miles on them, anyone have a sugessstion of a cam i can put in without touching my heads

 

In order to put in anything other than a very mild Cam, you are going to install new valvesprings so one way or another you have to mess with the heads.

You can't expect much out of just larger runners when the Cam and the intake is still stock and you can't expect a much higher peak with just a Cam either and the stock TPI setup (Although power will be increased across your existing powerband).

Everything has to be properly matched as a whole package.

 

With that being said, I've read the comp cans XE268 Cam is a great choice for TPI. That with a full exhaust and intake will really make the L98 sing.

 

if very mild is what i need to not touch the heads then that is what ill do, which one of those comp cams will be my best one.

 

for a LB9 a Lt1 cam is a real cheap way togo for a decent upgrade.

 

If mild is what you're after you could do what I'm about to and install a set of 1.6 roller rockers. This will put you very close to the lift of a mild Cam (The lift on my stock LB9 Cam will increase to .430/.441) and all you have to do is remove the valvecovers.

The trade-off here is price. A mild Cam will run in the $100 - $150 range while a set of (reliable) roller rockers will start at $200.

 

with these roller rockers i would see a difference?

 

Rocker arms multiply the actual lift of the Cam.

Look up the specs on any Cam and you will see a number that says "Lobe lift". That's the actual amount of lift the Cam lobe itself operates the lifter at. The rocker arm multiplies this number to achieve total valve lift.

Stock SBC rockers are 1.5, which gives my stock LB9 Cam with a lobe lift of .269 intake and .276 exhaust a total valve lift of .403 intake and .414 exhaust (Multiply lobe lift by 1.5 rocker arm ratio).

1.6 rockers will give me a total lift of .430 I take and .441 exhaust without ever touching the Cam. Not as much as an actual Cam swap would yield, but depending on your goals/budget/abilities it might be a nice tradeoff.

From everything I've read you can expect about 10HP out of it, give or take depending on other mods.

 

so , no bigger than a 1.6 ratio? not a 1.7

 

and this would be fine with my lb9 cam as well? but i wont see as large of a lift

 

You could do 1.7, but this would put the total valve lift around .457 intake and .469 exhaust. This would be putting you dangerously close to the limit the stock valve springs can handle, not to mention I would strongly advise against using a 1.7 rocker with stock press in rocker arm studs.

With a 1.7 rocker there is also a strong chance you will run into pushrod clearance issues where they go through the head.

Your best two options are mild Cam or stock Cam with 1.6 rockers if you don't want to do any headwork.

 

3/8" or 7/16" stud on my 1988 LB9 heads?

 

3/8.

 

Also if you go with 1.7 rr, you will change the geometry of the valvetrain. When dealing with rr, the roller must roll right on the center of the valve stem. If the roller rolls too far up or too far back from the center of the valve stems butt end, you can end up with a catastrophic vale train failure. Just something to think about. Even with 1.6 rr's, you still have to test to see if the geometry is right on mark. So beware that when you change rr's, you may need to buy a new set of pushrods.
http://www.carcraft.com/techarticles...h/viewall.html

 

How do I test this before the fact

 

If you have stock rockers which are not rollers, there is no need to test. But if you do get rr, you WILL need self aligning rr. The

 

I thought the self alinging bit only had to do with keeping the rocker tip centered over the valve stem and not the geometry?

 

Self aligning keeps the roller from wobbling from side to side during high RPM's. The geometry is the way the roller tip "rolls" on the butt end of the valve. Not having the roller tip on the middle of the valves butt puts too much pressure on the sides of the valve stem as it travels up and down the valve guides (hole in the head where the valve goes up and down).

 

how are these here? http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CCA-1418-8/

 

I think you got that slightly confused.

The alingment part is what keeps the arm centered on the valve stem tip from a left to eight perspective. Without some form of alignment you are going to run into some big problems.

Geometry is how far along the valve stem tip the rocker arms travels in a back and forth perspective.

 

Good set of rockers. Do still verify the geometry though prior to install.

I myself am going for the full roller aluminums.

 

being COMP i felt they were good, how would i verify the geometry

 

Yeah. That was a better explanation. But I've read bad things about those types of rr. I've read that those "washers" sometimes break. But then again the ones that broke are the ProComps. I don't know if the compcams are of better results.

 

I already posted the link on post #23.

 

ill have to buy that adjustable pushrod, is there a larger chance i will need different PR's or or that i could keep mine

 

I would buy the PR checker first to see if you will need different pushrods. But you WILL need new pushrods if the roller tip is off center. But its up to you to take the chance of destroying your engine. I have a massive upgrade but Im waiting till next year to due the instal. My list of parts to install are : AFR 1040 heads, TES Edelbrock headers and y-pipe, zinc anode, Summit Aluminum Roller Rockers, Ported SLP Runners, Ported Plenum, relocate AIT sensor, Edelbrock HiFLow TPI Intake base, and a Hypertech ThermoMaster MemCal. I need to buy new PR's but there is no sense to install everything when I dont have money to buy new PR's once the lenth has been measured. So inorder to keep my engine from failing due too using incorrect size of PR's, Im just gonna wait till I have to oney to do the job correctly. Dont rush things and cut corners. Its best to do the job right. The car will last you longer if you do the job correctly plus itll keep you from repairing something that costs more than what you had bargained for.

 

PR length checker with marked gauge,,,, http://www.summitracing.com/search/?...A-7702-1&dds=1

 

Procomps are the full set of 16 for $150 and generally regarded as a cheap set.

If procomp can't even earn my 4 out of 5 star quality rating on a $50 shift light, what makes you think I'm going to trust them with a component as critical as rocker arms?

Chevy86. If I were you, I would seriously reconsider on that set of edelbrock headers.

 

I know. The welds are inside the flange, the collector is pinched as well as the y pipe. But I assume they are better than the oems. Besides, they have the AIR tubes which is critical for emissions. I do live in Cali, which has the strictest laws. Other than that, the headers where free. :-)

 

Marginally better at best. DynoDon claims they are actually worse than stock.

Not only is all the above true, but those headers are just a raging POS. I have every right to say that since I just junked mine last fall.

I noticed a considerable difference after switching to a set of Hooker 2055s (Which BTW have the AIR tubes) and ditching my flowmaster catback. We're not talking adding an airfoil and "feeling" for the 1HP to the wheel. When I first went to test drive the car I didn't expect much of any difference and gave myself that mindset so I wouldn't get hit with the placebo effect. However I noticed the difference immediately as soon as I stepped on the gas leaving my neighborhood. It was almost like I had put a slightly lower set of gears out back.

Other than that, I'd reconsider the hypetech thermomaster (You can accomplish the same thing by bumping the distributor timing and going to a 160° thermostat with a lower fan switch) and the IAT relocation does not a damn thing on a MAF car. Something interesting I actually did was attempt to drive around with mine totally disconnected just to prove this point. Other than a CEL that would turn on at idle and go off once at speed I noticed absolutely nothing.

Do reconsider those POS headers. They are going to seriously bottleneck the intake and heads you have planned. Since they were free, I'd sell them and put the profit towards the 2055s.

 

Thanks for the info man. Perhaps we can do pm'ing so that we won't be hijacking the thread anymore, if it's okay with you.

 

PM away.

 

i ran the 1.6 roller rockers on mine witha mild comp cam and have seen a good increase in power... my next step is bas and runner since i jumped the gun with a larger throttle body already... dont do what i did... build it right.. i also upgraded my vavle springs just to be on the safe side to match my my comp cam.. i have the spec sheet on it around here i can post up if you want....

 

Hey everyone

I read this thread and just wondering with my stock L98 (1989) I have the stock rocker arms if i go with full rollers will i need to change pushrods or have any clearance issues or is just bolt on and go?

Thanks

 

Doubtful
With a mild cam the most Id splurge on is a set of 1.6 stamped roller tips
Dont really need a full roller til you get into some decent spring pressures imo.
Just dont buy some chinese brand and youll be fine.

 

Yes. If you change to full rr, the geometry will be off. The roller tip will not roll on the center of the valve stem. Continuing to run with the roller tips of the roller rocker "off center" will cause the valvetrain to fail. What you would have to do is get an adjustable push rod such as those by Comp Cams to measure the appropiate length of the permanent pushrods. Be advised that with Roller Rockers, there are 2 types, self aligning and non self aligning. Non self aligning will need pushrod guide plates and the new push rods need to be of hardened steel. below is a link to the adjustable pushrod and a link to figuring out the length of pushrod needed.

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CCA-7702-1

http://www.carcraft.com/techarticles...h/viewall.html

 

 

I have to chime in here. I would never recommend stamped rollers. They are not accurate Any stamped rocker arm will have a variance , Stock 1.5 can be 1,48 to 1.52 even comp cams 1.6 has a variance both up and down, Were a true roller rocker is more accurate. I can't remember which magazine it was , maybe car carft, but they compared stamped 1.5 and full RR on a SBC and showed a gain in HP. then they Did 1.6 RR and in total the HP over stock was like 20+ hp And the same in TQ.

 

A set of Comp roller tips should do him fine imo;meaning they are strong enough to get him by for what hes doing
Im a fan of full rollers and see your point but he will never ever notice a difference of a few hp if there was any between the two. I dont believe half of what I read in magazines; See your point though.

 

from what i have read from tpis!i would go w/a tpis mini ram,update your valve train & heads!Think You Will Better Results That Way!Yet A Bit More Expensive.But The Outcome Should Please You More.Also Make Sure Your Bottom End Will Support The Extra H/P & Torque!(depending on ur build ofcourse)!Have Fun & Be Safe!!!

 

The good thing is that TPIS is now selling the TPIS MiniRam again. WwoooooooHooooooo!!!!!!