Does anyone have any experience with the liquid paintable versions of sound deadener? I was hoping someone had some pics or reviews of installs that they did, and what they used. I am particularly interested in the Second Skin Spectrum and the Edead V3. The websites claim the liquids are more lightweight than the traditional mats and also more effective, so any basis for comparison would be appreciated as well. I figured the liquids would be easier to install and more comprehensive since they can fit into every nook and cranny, provided the installer doesn't mind waiting for it to dry. Additionally, any methods for installation that seemed helpful (temperature, use of fans during install; thickness and number of coats; etc.) that quickened the curing process or made it more effective would be good info as well. Also, where should I seal first for it to be most effective. I know a lot of noise comes in through the doors (I am particularly tired of the clang when my door shuts), firewall, rear wheel wells, and floor. I will probably buy enough to cover most of the car, but I figured to concentrate on the areas with the most noise.
Sorry for so many questions, but hopefully this can wind up as a comprehensive post that will help out a lot of people looking to do the same thing. I hope to get first-hand advice specifically for third-gens in the form of a tutorial, but a simple "things to watch for" would be good as well.

EDIT: The project is done! Not much for a step-by-step tutorial, but it sure is a heck of a testimonial Second Skin Spectrum, including some other ideas that worked out great! Enjoy!

Steve

 

You might try looking up redraif (I think that's her name). I believe she went through numerous cans of the stuff when she was sound-deadening her car.

Whether or not it helped, I'm not too sure. Personally I don't quite understand how something like paint could be used to deaden sound because it goes on so thin. However, I guess if you used numerous coats it could help a bit.

Let us know how it works out for you.

 

This website has a similar product - it is a liquid that you paint on. The videos definitely show that the liquids do have quite a damping effect!
http://www.stealthkote.com/

There is a pdf file called "Sound and Noise Generation" at http://www.quietsolution.com/?google. The whole article is good, but pages 18-19 explain viscoelastic compounds.

Do you have a link to redraif's thread? I'm having trouble finding it because she has a lot of posts and none of my specific searches are landing anything.

 

Ok, rather than let this post die with the lowest post/view ratio ever, I came up with a couple ideas. I will essentially do what redraif did to her car (see http://www.cardomain.com/id/redraifstereo), except I will be using the spectrum instead of the rubberized undercoating. I will use heat shield insulation from jcwhitney.com on the lid of the hood and the leftovers to cover the floor, doors, and panels that rattle (instead of the box carpet - thanks for the idea, redraif). I ordered the heat shield in bulk becuase it wasn't too expensive, and am mostly going to use it for insulation although any sound absorbing qualities will be a bonus. I read on some other websites that is has an acoustical NCR of 0.63, but I'm still not sure if this is the same stuff that I bought from jcwhitney since some of the stats match up, but some are left out (http://www.shadetreeonline.com/insul...heatshield.htm you tell me, is this the same stuff, http://www.jcwhitney.com/autoparts/P...lay/ss-10101??). I also plan on stuffing polyfill behind the plastic panels everywhere behind the driver's seats (not in the doors because they will just absorb water).
I will likely take pics, but unfortunately the project is on hold until the weather warms up and I have time to do this. I will still appreciate any suggestions in the meantime.

BTW: Sweet install, redraif. Do you have any pics of the FINISHED product that you can post on your site? Seems like a lot of work to do without showing off the end result. From the bits and pieces I saw in the photos, I bet it looks pretty good

 

what's wrong with dynomat... i just redid my entire floor in the ultra thin version. ran me $200 for the entire car, doors included.

 

Dynamat is a great product, don't get me wrong, but if I wanted to use a mat deadener, I would have probably purchased from b-quiet, since their Ultimate line is comparable to dynamat and less expensive. I may end up with some b-quiet by the time all this is over, but I honestly think that the spectrum will take care of everything (it is a damper AND an absorber).
If you know where to get enough dynamat for your whole car for $200 (about how many square feet was that, btw), you should let the rest of us know your little secret.
I'm certainly not paying to have the dynamat logo underneath my car panels.

 

i walked into a local audio shop and told them what i wanted and that's what it was.

i didn't know it was more expensive..

 

A few years ago, Dynamat was the only product that anybody knew about. It is very similar to other brands, but the prices are marked up higher due to its extensive advertising. Like I said, it's still a great product, but you just pay more for it.

We may end up with a decent review of spectrum on this forum from audioholic:

http://www.caraudio.com/vb/showthrea...light=spectrum

 

Well if you only do the floors and doors, nothing! But if you really want to quiet the car down, you need more then just that covered

 

Ok I'm mad I had this nice long reply ready to go and the blasted computer lost it and did not post it! Argh! here we go again! Going to break it up into multiple replies!

I used the Duplicolor Sound Eliminator and the Rubberized undercoating. The S.E. is definately better then the R.U.! I actually went back over the RU with the SE because it was so much better! The consistancy of the stuff is more like tar. It always stays a bit soft & tacky, but it is NOT water soluble (important for doors). I think that is part of how it works! I would recomend priming and painting over the stuff (use flex agent). That what is in store for the 82! It did not seal mine and it gets gooey if gas or any other car fluids get on it! I sprayed it on the backside of the outer most sheet metal (doors and truck area) Pulled out the sail panel speaker baffles so I could spray inside there. I sprayed both sides of the rest of the interior's sheet metal. I sprayed it all about a 1/16 of an inch thick. It kind of spray/ spits out! Don't get it on you or you have to wear it off, or cut out that part of your hair! I wore a plastic shower cap when I sprayed the underside of the car. when I got out from under the car, the newspaper I had down on the ground had stuck to my paper suit and shower cap. I had no idea till I walked inside and scared the crap out of Mom and the cats! I sprayed and let it dry overnight. It smells horrible and I had to wear a real mask to not end up high from spraying the stuff. Best way I found to do it was spray in an active prep station (body shop). Draws the smell away and you don't scare Mom and the pets!

 

Ok I only used the thermo shield mat on the floors and wheel wells. The stuff is similar to what the factory used. Recycled fabric fibers. Its good as insulation because it is loose and works as a barrier for hot and cold like house insulation. The problem I found with using it on paneling is the tendancy of the panel to move and flex. The constant pulling and weigh of the material it self seems to lend to falling off of verticle and upside down applications. The stuff will actually separted over time and tear off. Thats what my factory stuff did. The aftermarket stuff is denser and stronger, so it may not be an issue, but I decided to err (sp?) on the side of caution. I also found it to be too thick for most applications, like the backside of the door panels, the doorsills, kick panels, overhead plastic paneling, hatch plastic, dash pad... I think the tickness would be fine in the cargo area, but GM did just that and it did not seem to be enough to reduce vibration. Glueing a material that is so tearable/malable to the plastic seemed to not adhear well enough to really take the vibration out of the plastic paneling. So I went with what my install friend recommended, the box carpet. It was light weight, mildly stretchy (goes around contours well), but thin. It actually cleaned up some of the sloppy tolerances that GM left in the plastics where they meet up. PLus simply putting a thin later of fabric btw 2 plastic, will stop them fron vibrating against one another causing buzzing. You would be amazed what a well placed piece of felt will do! I still had to be careful and trim it back in some areas to be sure pieces would lay right! It glues very tight to the plastic with a simple spray glue. Now sticking what you have left over btw the rear cargo panels and the body would help, but I think the box carpet helped considerably as well! I plan to do this to all my cars!

One area that drove ne nuts was the air relief panel in the door jam! that thing buzzed all the time. I ripped all the blasted rubber strips out and used adhesive felt btw the body and the panel! Buzzing gone!

Stuff I used came from Pep Boys and was 3/8 inch thick...aluminum on one side green insulation type material on the other. Itchy like house insulation! the 2 you have listed seem very similar...I would say the sound deadening properies would be the same!

 

The poly fill will slow the sound waves, used it in the sub box I built. I had not thought about what it would do for this application...

Whaen you say finished product what do you mean? I ahve pics of the process as I went. From the thermoshield to the speaker wires being routed. From there is was just throwing down the carpet and reinstalling the interior. I thought I ahd pics up of the car together...hmmm... check out www.cardomain.com/id/redraifinterior

 

I definitely was not aware that you had multiple sites, raif Is there anything in the car that is stock? hehe
Lookin good!

I will get back to waiting on the stuff to show up at my doorstep - the heatshield is taking its sweet time to arrive through the mail. The weather is also supposed to be crappy (more snow :P) and this won't allow decent curing of the spectrum, so it's probably best that I wait - leave it to Mother Nature to save me from being an idiot and tearing the car apart twice

Unfortunately, this means I will not do it until the end of March. In the meantime, I found someone who took pics of their spectrum, and it sounds like a great product!

http://www.realcaraudio.com/forums/s...light=spectrum

Steve

 

To whet your appetites, I just finished my last exam, and will be starting the project shortly, probably Saturday. I'm glad I didn't have time during school, because I would have been waiting inside for the weather to get better (it snowed the end of April - stinkin Cleveland). Hopefully, I'll be finished early next week and can upload pics!

Steve

 

keep us posted will be nice to know how the stuff works! I have plenty of projects that still need to be sound proofed!

 

So do you just work on cars for your day-job, or just enjoy the work and own a lot of cars?

 

I have some edead V3 and am pretty happy with it. It seems to dampen vibration a little bit more as it can get into cracks alot easier than a mat. I had the back of my camaro done in a standard mat which helped quiet it down but it smelled for a few days and added about 20 lbs to the back and was a pain to get into all of the dips bends and crackes in the back of the car. I did a friens doors in his blazer and it was a bit easier to get the hard to reach spaces with the liquid and it didn't add much weight at all which on thing like doors could mean alot. IMO the cleanup was easier the outcome was good. only downside was drips on the window track but if your careful is shouldn't be a problem.

 

Straight up hobby! I used to be a service writer at a dealership. But then we got an old school new manager who did not believe in women on the service drive. So that was the end of that!

I have entirely 2 many projects and no time!

 

OK, so the project is progressing nicely:
1. I put a gallon in the trunk so far, and it might weigh about 3 lbs muhahahahahaha. Hopefully it will be as effective. The smell isn't bad while working but make sure the area is ventilated. The garage smelled this morning after being closed up all night, but not all that bad. It doesn't smell too bad working with it, either.
2. Put another gallon under the carpet and firewall. I didn't take the carpet all the way out since I didn't think it was necessary to remove the center console (I don't have enough to do everything anyway - I would need another 2 gallons to cover the rest of the car).
3. I will be putting heatshield under the carpet over the top of the Spectrum, which will probably take the rest of my free time.
4. The third gallon is being reserved for the doors, but I'm not sure if I'm going to do that this time around.

Just waiting for the last few spots to dry - which reminds me: I'm using a giant fan to speed up the drying process. It's about 75-80 degrees out and the stuff is dry in about 20 minutes and ready for another coat. It's also nice the stuff turns from blue to dark gray when its dry.
Pics coming soon - I will probably just post them on my cardomain site. The tutorial won't materialize since I don't really have the time and it's nowhere near a professional job.

 

lizard skin... Ive used it befor and wont use anything but that in the future again. I have 2gallons I plan to use on my Z..

sandable,paintable,heat reducer,sound deadner,insulator.all in one

 

That lizard skin stuff does sound interesting, especially since its ceramic based.
The spectrum claims to do all that stuff too. You forgot waterproof

 

The good news is I'm done and it's much quieter. The bad news is I now have to re-tune everything (or at least I hear more problems that were already present) since the acoustic environment is drastically different.

The pics are posted on my cardomain site. Sorry, but there won't be a tutorial like I had originally planned since it seemed kinda silly to talk about applying the stuff. It was easy to apply, and easy to clean up mistakes. The bigger challenge was tearing the car apart and putting it back together (especially putting it back together, since it's not always easy to find those screw holes and get them to line up)!

As far as road noise goes, I hardly hear anything from the tires. The only noise I hear is coming through the doors (which I plan to cover with the last gallon of Spectrum). Engine sounds a bit quieter, too, but I would need to line the hood to make it better. This probably wouldn't be worth the effort since its quiet enough now.

The frequency response of the stereo is better all around, but I still plan on building a new sub box to make better use of the well, and perhaps improve SQ. You can hardly hear anything outside of the car with the stereo turned up, and nothing outside rattles when the bass hits (or at least it's too quiet to hear when the car is on).

I won't make a final analysis on the improvement until about a week from now, since it's supposed to take that long for Spectrum to fully cure.

 

Nice...its so nice to have your hard work really produce tangible results! I was so happy at how quiet the car became. I really appreciated it when I rode in other f-bodies!

Oh and the Duplicolr stuff I used is also paintable. The 82's interior is done and it was primed over! We will see how paint looks over it someday!

 

Feel free to hijack my thread to tell us about it!
If I ever turn down the music long enough, I will be able to listen for the last of the road noise. I think it will disappear altogether if I put it in the doors - it's already so quiet now!

 

The project started because Joe used to work at a paint booth company. They wanted project cars...thought it would be cool for interested parties to see actually work going on. So they told us to get some cars adn work on the body work there. So we did! I got the 82 for free...engine less...but it was a good platform for the LT1 we had sitting around from a car that had its title stolen and was undrivable. So the plan was to drop a 383 in the car and give it a full custom everything...built from the ground up! Well things ground to a halt when the company was bought out and the headquarters was being relocated out of state. So the projects we had in ful swing were tossed out adn we had to store them for some time. Then Joe got a place with a good size garage and we got them all out of storage, but then i lost my job and was unemployed for 9mo. So the projects stayed as they were. Hopefully we can get going again on something soon.

But the 82 was in full swing being primed over the soundproofing the weekend we had to leave the company and store it. Here are the pics of the last thing we had done to it!
82

 

I have one gallon of Spectrum left and three choices:
1. Find a way to get the rear quarter panels off and put it all over the rear wheel wells on the inside of the car. For this, I need to know how to remove the seat bolt that the top of the back seat attaches to.
2. Use it on the doors. I don't have speakers in the doors, but this would still cut out more road noise.
3. Take a shot at doing both (I might actually have enough since one gallon covers about 40 sq ft at 1mm thick).

 

The rear quarter pamnel plastic you mean...the back seat latch takes the same torx bit I think that the seat blets take! You need the kind that goes on a socket wrech...sell sets at Autozone!

 

Did they make every screw and bolt in the car a different size and shape so it's impossible to take it apart? I have a 6 piece torx set since there are other screws that need it, but apparently not one big enough
I might as well buy one since I need to replace the plastic cover for the front seat belt, otherwise, I'd say screw it (bad pun).

 

Sadly I have a tool kit in the car that grew and grew. I just said I will buy what I need and keep it in the car... Now the whole rear cargo well is full! I have all the metric and standard allens and every torx they commonly sell! Just wait till you have to go buy the safety torx one day! I about screamed! I learned quick at junkyards to take it all!

 

Haha, Wal-mart had metric and standard Allen wrenches for 88 cents - can't beat that.
I bought another Torx set to go on my 3/8" ratchet ($14 at Home Depot) - all just to take off the plastic coverings off the rear quarter panels. If anyone is wondering, the T-45 is the size needed.
After two more 5 hour shifts (I did the passenger side yesterday, and the driver's side today), I have now painted both rear quarter panels and rear wheel wells (the part inside the car) with my last gallon of Spectrum, making sure to seal off the area around each 6x9 speaker hole pretty well (to get rid of the rattling, buzzing, etc.).
After drying, I put heat shield over the top of all of it.
When I put the plastic panels back on, I also stuffed them with poly-fill.

I drove around a little yesterday evening (afterall, it was Memorial day), having finished the passenger side, and I could already tell a difference (less road noise, and better detail from the sub, and definitely louder). I haven't changed the crossover of my 6x9's, but I'm guessing I will be able to run them lower.
I will wait a couple more days for it to cure before I make a final judgement. More to come....

 

I'm really impressed with this stuff. My car is quieter on the highway than my mom's 98 Cadillac STS and my dad's 2004 Cadillac SRX (the ride isn't the same, but not much I can do about that hehe). I haven't driven it in the rain since the install, but I can't wait to hear the difference (I'm wondering if I will hear the water splashing the rear wheel wells).

I pretty much sealed off the rear 6x9 area (this was much easier than fiberglassing although probably not quite as effective), and midbass has improved greatly - I was able to drop the crossover to about 90Hz (12db/octave) - this greatly improved the bass drum kick that I was lacking for certain songs (see my other thread on aiming subwoofer). It also allowed me to low pass my sub at about 70 Hz (12db/octave) rather than at 90, which improved its impact significantly.

I'm still considering the doors, but I will probably go with a mat of some type since the liquid stuff is too messy for that application (I don't want to gum up the windshield, the motor, or other mechanisms) - well, actually it would be easy, but I lack the patience to use a smaller paintbrush, and I don't have access to an electrical outlet, so I'm not able to use my fan to speed up the drying process. Which reminds me: I probably could have done both quarter panels in 5 hours with a fan (as opposed to 10 hours without). I will see how long I can last without doing something to the car

The downside: I can tell a difference between mp3 and CD quality recording.

 

Believe me the doors were the first and best thing I did...there is so much noise you get from the doors!

Quote:

The downside: I can tell a difference between mp3 and CD quality recording.

I could tell the dif b/w the copied cds and originals! Glad its going well! really get a sence of accomplishment from it don't you!?

 

Heck yeah! I'm actually a little happier with the sound deadening results than the stereo, itself! It's definitely the efficient use of money, since I'm getting the most out of the equipment. I used to not hear much bass on the highway, and I would have to turn the volume up 4 or 5 clicks. Now I don't have to touch the volume ****!

You're not supposed to tell me how good it is to do the doors! Now I'm going to have to buy more sound deadening stuff! I still have a sheet of the Heat Shield left, but I wouldn't take the door apart just to put that in. I also heard it's a good idea to put vacuum hose on the rods for the opening mechanism, since they clang around when the doors are shut - so I'll probably do that, too.

Is there anything else I should add to my task list??

 

I just sprayed the outer most skin...luckly I have manuel stuff, so I had less to worry about messing up, plus alot more places to get my hands in to spray the can. Vacuum hoses on the metal rods...hmmm...good idea i missed that one! I just took care when I sprayed and stuffed papertowels in the gap on the inside so the stuff would not get on the window. Tried to cover most of the window gearing with news paper. But now that I think about it, you could use aluminum foil. You can squish it around stuff and it will stay how you squish it! MAybe it you can get in there to wrap the tracks with it!

 

Some final ideas:
It's best to put Spectrum v2 on as thin as possible so it dries faster and stays on better. If you just slop it on, there is a good chance you'll get bubbles and it will crack and fall off more easily (and therefore not do you any good). I recommend the sludge since they say it is more effective, AND you can just slop it on without having to play around too much.

I'd be afraid to put paper towels in the doors since they will just get wet and rot after a while. The same goes for the poly-fill: I'm sure it would make a huge difference if it could stay dry and smell-free.

I'll say it again cause it's important: get a fan to help the drying process. Even a smaller one will make a HUGE difference.

I stayed away from putting Spectrum in the doors - I'll probably use some mat since the liquid stuff is messy, and I don't want to gum up the moving parts in the door.

I'm so glad I coated the rear quarter panels. I effectively sealed off the 6x9 holes from the rest of the car (and the places that weren't sealed with Spectrum were stuffed with poly-fill as much as possible to finish the job off). The polyfill just messes up the sound if its just spread out behind the speaker. I got much better results with most of the area open, except for plugging the holes. The result: I'm getting much better low end extension from them now, which has rounded out the sound quite nicely.

After doing all this work, I don't think I would trade the car for the world