Trying to break into 11's
01-06-2012, 12:38 PM
#101
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Car: 1984 Z28
Engine: SLOW carbed ls
Transmission: TH400 with brake, 8" PTC converter
Axle/Gears: moser 9" 4.11
Re: Trying to break into 11's
Remember he is trying for 11's with vortecs...thats not an easy task. Cam that big on small heads certainly isnt the best way to do it, but thats what he has and thats what its gonna take to make it happen. Now you just need to get a high stall speed converter and gear/tire to work in the high rpms that motor needs to turn to make power. 240 cam and stock vortecs isnt matched by itself...you need compression, gear, stall, suspension and tune to make it all accomplish the task at hand.
Its like the cam only LS1 guys running bottom 10's high 9's in race cars. LOADS of gear, 5000 stall or higher in some, huge 240 deg hyd rollers on stock heads. The cams are way big for the heads but its how you force them to make power to run those ET's.
Its like the cam only LS1 guys running bottom 10's high 9's in race cars. LOADS of gear, 5000 stall or higher in some, huge 240 deg hyd rollers on stock heads. The cams are way big for the heads but its how you force them to make power to run those ET's.
01-06-2012, 12:47 PM
#102
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Car: 91 Z28, 2000 T/A
Engine: SBC 355, LS1
Transmission: T56, T56
Axle/Gears: 10bolt 3.73, 3.42
Re: Trying to break into 11's
I guess I care about mid range power more than you guys. Since my cars are street driven and spend about 1% of the time at the drag strip.
01-06-2012, 12:48 PM
#103
Re: Trying to break into 11's
It doesnt take much power to move a car from a stop to 45mph for normal street driving. On the dyno I think maintaining a steady 60mph my car was making like 50whp 
Add wind resistance it doesnt take much more
EDIT: all my builds have been street driven....I just enjoy top end more than any midrange. The converter puts you on the torque curve so anything under that is pointless. Like said for normal driving it doesnt take much power to get moving. My 401 will putz around in high gear with 2.73's in the back with no issues with 4200 stall. I dont hate it
Add wind resistance it doesnt take much moreEDIT: all my builds have been street driven....I just enjoy top end more than any midrange. The converter puts you on the torque curve so anything under that is pointless. Like said for normal driving it doesnt take much power to get moving. My 401 will putz around in high gear with 2.73's in the back with no issues with 4200 stall. I dont hate it
01-06-2012, 12:50 PM
#104
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Car: 1984 Z28
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Transmission: TH400 with brake, 8" PTC converter
Axle/Gears: moser 9" 4.11
Re: Trying to break into 11's
mid range is 3500-5000rpm right? Or you mean you care more about making power below 2500 when you're moving from stoplight to stoplight and don't have more than 30% throttle opening? How anyone can tell it makes "power" at part throttle blows my mind.
01-06-2012, 01:43 PM
#105
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Car: 91 Z28, 2000 T/A
Engine: SBC 355, LS1
Transmission: T56, T56
Axle/Gears: 10bolt 3.73, 3.42
Re: Trying to break into 11's
Mid range is relative. What's your driving habits? What is your Redline? I spin my LS1 T/A to 6200 and my 3rd gen to about 5500(TPI). I'd consider mid range 2000-4500. I usually shift my Manual T/A typically around 2500 when I am driving normally, at about 3k-3500 when I am moderately into the throttle.
I have driven large cammed LS1's and SBC, to say no one can feel the mid range/part throttle power is ignorant. I personally can feel the car pull harder as you get into a setup's sweet spot. My T/A the car really starts to pull around 3000-3200 and will rip to 6200, part throttle or WOT there is a difference at what the car does below and above 3k. I drove an LS1 car with a G5X4 cam and it was doggish under 3000 (part or WOT) and didn't feel like it started to pulling hard till you got up to 4000rpm. My uncle has a solid roller 355 12:1 Victor JR intake 250ish duration cam with a 4500 stall 4:11 in a , 4200lb 82 chevy caprice. Again, part throttle driving thing is a slug, you have to get up over 4000 RPM to really feel it move. Mash the throttle from a dig, it takes second, but once it's moving yea it hauls ***, it's a straight toy though, not a cruiser.
We are talking different scenario's. You guys are telling him how to get 11's like he asked. I am talking about something more streetable because that is my mind set, because I daily drive both of my cars. I am not in line with his goal with my cam recommendation.
I have driven large cammed LS1's and SBC, to say no one can feel the mid range/part throttle power is ignorant. I personally can feel the car pull harder as you get into a setup's sweet spot. My T/A the car really starts to pull around 3000-3200 and will rip to 6200, part throttle or WOT there is a difference at what the car does below and above 3k. I drove an LS1 car with a G5X4 cam and it was doggish under 3000 (part or WOT) and didn't feel like it started to pulling hard till you got up to 4000rpm. My uncle has a solid roller 355 12:1 Victor JR intake 250ish duration cam with a 4500 stall 4:11 in a , 4200lb 82 chevy caprice. Again, part throttle driving thing is a slug, you have to get up over 4000 RPM to really feel it move. Mash the throttle from a dig, it takes second, but once it's moving yea it hauls ***, it's a straight toy though, not a cruiser.
We are talking different scenario's. You guys are telling him how to get 11's like he asked. I am talking about something more streetable because that is my mind set, because I daily drive both of my cars. I am not in line with his goal with my cam recommendation.
01-06-2012, 02:36 PM
#106
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Re: Trying to break into 11's
You should brush up on some roots blown combination. I see dyno sheets regularly that will soil your pants. Last night a guy droped off a T-400 for me to build and wanted a converter. His car was a 100% street driven 69 Camaro with a 582ci BBC and a 1471 blower! This thing was good for 1300 horsepower and 1150 ft lbs tq at conservitive boost!!! The motor made 850 ft lbs tq at 2000 RPMs! Thats basicly off idle. The torque range was flat through the entire power range only increased to peak torque by 4000. I am building him a 10.5 inch, 6 pad, billet Cadillac Northstar Core with a hand fabricated steel 8 blade stator and Mechanical Diode for his "street car." This is a wild "shoot from the hip" effort at obtaining 2800 stall speed that he requires.
There are cars making power at part throttle!
01-06-2012, 02:59 PM
#107
Re: Trying to break into 11's
Mid range is relative. What's your driving habits? What is your Redline? I spin my LS1 T/A to 6200 and my 3rd gen to about 5500(TPI). I'd consider mid range 2000-4500. I usually shift my Manual T/A typically around 2500 when I am driving normally, at about 3k-3500 when I am moderately into the throttle.
I have driven large cammed LS1's and SBC, to say no one can feel the mid range/part throttle power is ignorant. I personally can feel the car pull harder as you get into a setup's sweet spot. My T/A the car really starts to pull around 3000-3200 and will rip to 6200, part throttle or WOT there is a difference at what the car does below and above 3k. I drove an LS1 car with a G5X4 cam and it was doggish under 3000 (part or WOT) and didn't feel like it started to pulling hard till you got up to 4000rpm. My uncle has a solid roller 355 12:1 Victor JR intake 250ish duration cam with a 4500 stall 4:11 in a , 4200lb 82 chevy caprice. Again, part throttle driving thing is a slug, you have to get up over 4000 RPM to really feel it move. Mash the throttle from a dig, it takes second, but once it's moving yea it hauls ***, it's a straight toy though, not a cruiser.
We are talking different scenario's. You guys are telling him how to get 11's like he asked. I am talking about something more streetable because that is my mind set, because I daily drive both of my cars. I am not in line with his goal with my cam recommendation.
I have driven large cammed LS1's and SBC, to say no one can feel the mid range/part throttle power is ignorant. I personally can feel the car pull harder as you get into a setup's sweet spot. My T/A the car really starts to pull around 3000-3200 and will rip to 6200, part throttle or WOT there is a difference at what the car does below and above 3k. I drove an LS1 car with a G5X4 cam and it was doggish under 3000 (part or WOT) and didn't feel like it started to pulling hard till you got up to 4000rpm. My uncle has a solid roller 355 12:1 Victor JR intake 250ish duration cam with a 4500 stall 4:11 in a , 4200lb 82 chevy caprice. Again, part throttle driving thing is a slug, you have to get up over 4000 RPM to really feel it move. Mash the throttle from a dig, it takes second, but once it's moving yea it hauls ***, it's a straight toy though, not a cruiser.
We are talking different scenario's. You guys are telling him how to get 11's like he asked. I am talking about something more streetable because that is my mind set, because I daily drive both of my cars. I am not in line with his goal with my cam recommendation.
You can have cars that are more "responsive" with the throttle at part throttle in the lower rpms. You will feel the power if you dont have a torque converter or you have a manual transmission.
With a torque converter however, one properly matched to the powerband, going WOT at idle-2000 rpms means it will flash to whatever stall speed you have and start pulling from there. Stall speeds are usually at or around peak torque rpm so there is NEVER a lack of power...ever
Its like when people complain about the torque loss of short runner intakes like miniram or stealth ram on stock L98's that were originally long runner TPI. Yes in a sense, there is torque lost at peak rpm and maybe a tad bit at lower rpms but above peak, the short runners develop more torque and hold longer in the upper mid range and top end range. it just shifts the curve. If driving on a stock converter, you may feel a different pulling sensation. However will torque converter in the 2800-3000 rpm range near peak torque rpm of a L98... you dont feel the low end. Case in point, my HSR car ran faster 60 foots than stock TPI....no other changes but intake swap. The pull was alittle different in the seat of the pants...smoother and stronger up top as expected but slips dont lie..it was quicker
Manual 6 speed cars are totally different.. Thats like a mild stall or stock converter car. yes you will feel the difference in low end there. I've been in my friends big cammed stock converter L98 and it was abit sluggish til 3600-4000 rpm. Once we added 3600 stall, car picked up and no longer was a problem. Actually it should have received 4000-4200 stall with that setup for best drag performance.
That big acceleration feel you experience at 3200 rpm in your LS1 is same I feel in my 99 TA with stock converter. DOG til about 2800-3000 rpm it starts coming alive. It wouldnt even spin tire from a dig off idle since stock converter + 2.73 gears makes it a pig. But once around 3000 rpm, it will pull and start to break tire loose. Guess what I did? I added 3200 stall
NOOOO Issues with low end anymore. Thing flat moves outs for a daily driver in the low end. 1.67 60 ft now and more left in it with just bolt ons and 3.73s now but its been 1.71 with 2.73's.Like you said, some people have different expectations/tastes when it comes to driving their cars.
01-06-2012, 05:42 PM
#109
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Re: Trying to break into 11's
That's why I just said, my cam recommendation is not in line. How am I still being adamant when I haven't posted anything further.
01-06-2012, 06:01 PM
#110
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Car: 91 Z28, 2000 T/A
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Re: Trying to break into 11's
You can have cars that are more "responsive" with the throttle at part throttle in the lower rpms. You will feel the power if you dont have a torque converter or you have a manual transmission.
With a torque converter however, one properly matched to the powerband, going WOT at idle-2000 rpms means it will flash to whatever stall speed you have and start pulling from there. Stall speeds are usually at or around peak torque rpm so there is NEVER a lack of power...ever
Its like when people complain about the torque loss of short runner intakes like miniram or stealth ram on stock L98's that were originally long runner TPI. Yes in a sense, there is torque lost at peak rpm and maybe a tad bit at lower rpms but above peak, the short runners develop more torque and hold longer in the upper mid range and top end range. it just shifts the curve. If driving on a stock converter, you may feel a different pulling sensation. However will torque converter in the 2800-3000 rpm range near peak torque rpm of a L98... you dont feel the low end. Case in point, my HSR car ran faster 60 foots than stock TPI....no other changes but intake swap. The pull was alittle different in the seat of the pants...smoother and stronger up top as expected but slips dont lie..it was quicker
Manual 6 speed cars are totally different.. Thats like a mild stall or stock converter car. yes you will feel the difference in low end there. I've been in my friends big cammed stock converter L98 and it was abit sluggish til 3600-4000 rpm. Once we added 3600 stall, car picked up and no longer was a problem. Actually it should have received 4000-4200 stall with that setup for best drag performance.
That big acceleration feel you experience at 3200 rpm in your LS1 is same I feel in my 99 TA with stock converter. DOG til about 2800-3000 rpm it starts coming alive. It wouldnt even spin tire from a dig off idle since stock converter + 2.73 gears makes it a pig. But once around 3000 rpm, it will pull and start to break tire loose. Guess what I did? I added 3200 stall NOOOO Issues with low end anymore. Thing flat moves outs for a daily driver in the low end. 1.67 60 ft now and more left in it with just bolt ons and 3.73s now but its been 1.71 with 2.73's.
Like you said, some people have different expectations/tastes when it comes to driving their cars.
With a torque converter however, one properly matched to the powerband, going WOT at idle-2000 rpms means it will flash to whatever stall speed you have and start pulling from there. Stall speeds are usually at or around peak torque rpm so there is NEVER a lack of power...ever
Its like when people complain about the torque loss of short runner intakes like miniram or stealth ram on stock L98's that were originally long runner TPI. Yes in a sense, there is torque lost at peak rpm and maybe a tad bit at lower rpms but above peak, the short runners develop more torque and hold longer in the upper mid range and top end range. it just shifts the curve. If driving on a stock converter, you may feel a different pulling sensation. However will torque converter in the 2800-3000 rpm range near peak torque rpm of a L98... you dont feel the low end. Case in point, my HSR car ran faster 60 foots than stock TPI....no other changes but intake swap. The pull was alittle different in the seat of the pants...smoother and stronger up top as expected but slips dont lie..it was quicker
Manual 6 speed cars are totally different.. Thats like a mild stall or stock converter car. yes you will feel the difference in low end there. I've been in my friends big cammed stock converter L98 and it was abit sluggish til 3600-4000 rpm. Once we added 3600 stall, car picked up and no longer was a problem. Actually it should have received 4000-4200 stall with that setup for best drag performance.
That big acceleration feel you experience at 3200 rpm in your LS1 is same I feel in my 99 TA with stock converter. DOG til about 2800-3000 rpm it starts coming alive. It wouldnt even spin tire from a dig off idle since stock converter + 2.73 gears makes it a pig. But once around 3000 rpm, it will pull and start to break tire loose. Guess what I did? I added 3200 stall
NOOOO Issues with low end anymore. Thing flat moves outs for a daily driver in the low end. 1.67 60 ft now and more left in it with just bolt ons and 3.73s now but its been 1.71 with 2.73's.Like you said, some people have different expectations/tastes when it comes to driving their cars.
Last edited by 3rd gen Will; 01-06-2012 at 06:09 PM.
01-06-2012, 06:40 PM
#111
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Re: Trying to break into 11's
You should brush up on some roots blown combination. I see dyno sheets regularly that will soil your pants. Last night a guy droped off a T-400 for me to build and wanted a converter. His car was a 100% street driven 69 Camaro with a 582ci BBC and a 1471 blower! This thing was good for 1300 horsepower and 1150 ft lbs tq at conservitive boost!!! The motor made 850 ft lbs tq at 2000 RPMs! Thats basicly off idle. The torque range was flat through the entire power range only increased to peak torque by 4000. I am building him a 10.5 inch, 6 pad, billet Cadillac Northstar Core with a hand fabricated steel 8 blade stator and Mechanical Diode for his "street car." This is a wild "shoot from the hip" effort at obtaining 2800 stall speed that he requires.
There are cars making power at part throttle!
There are cars making power at part throttle!
Since when was this thread about mountain sized motors with blowers off the space shuttle, or perhaps an early train engine. 
Buddies diesel cat motor in his boat makes more torque than that, but has nothing to do with this lol.
01-06-2012, 06:55 PM
#112
Re: Trying to break into 11's
Well his goals were to drive on the street as well. It will be an aggressive setup for sure but can be street driven. It all depends on your personal preferences
Another thing to note, is the motor a hydraulic roller motor? You mention GM crate 383 cam, is that a roller cam? Then you mentioned swapping to zz4 cam which is a roller cam.
This changes things abit as the similar roller cams with same durations will have more lift to them and require more spring pressure to work right. Need to be careful with the spring choice and guide to retainer clearance still, and hope you can get more lift room.
What my goal for the car was from day one was to be a street car that i can drive around for fun on nice days, but then be quick at the strip too. I think like 12.20 or 12.30 would be a good goal for that then?
This changes things abit as the similar roller cams with same durations will have more lift to them and require more spring pressure to work right. Need to be careful with the spring choice and guide to retainer clearance still, and hope you can get more lift room.
01-06-2012, 08:05 PM
#113
Re: Trying to break into 11's
try to turn it into an LT1. the vortec heads and LT1 heads are similar, so try and make the other stuff fairly similar. we went 11's with a stock LT1 a few years back with a 3,000lb raceweight. had electric waterpump, headers, and rockers.... prob. made 290-300rwhp. t56 trans, 4.10 gear, 26" slicks.
went 7.45 in the 1/8 with a 1.53 60'.
went 7.45 in the 1/8 with a 1.53 60'.
01-06-2012, 08:22 PM
#114
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Car: 1984 camaro z28
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Axle/Gears: Moser 9", 4.11 gear
Re: Trying to break into 11's
Well his goals were to drive on the street as well. It will be an aggressive setup for sure but can be street driven. It all depends on your personal preferences
Another thing to note, is the motor a hydraulic roller motor? You mention GM crate 383 cam, is that a roller cam? Then you mentioned swapping to zz4 cam which is a roller cam.
This changes things abit as the similar roller cams with same durations will have more lift to them and require more spring pressure to work right. Need to be careful with the spring choice and guide to retainer clearance still, and hope you can get more lift room.
Another thing to note, is the motor a hydraulic roller motor? You mention GM crate 383 cam, is that a roller cam? Then you mentioned swapping to zz4 cam which is a roller cam.
This changes things abit as the similar roller cams with same durations will have more lift to them and require more spring pressure to work right. Need to be careful with the spring choice and guide to retainer clearance still, and hope you can get more lift room.
And then check my clearance and grind away some if its not clearing.
But here's the cam just incase people dont want to go back and find it.
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CCA-08-433-8/
It's rpm range of 2500-6000 seems to be perfect because with my stall i get my rpm's to 2400 before take off, and i shift at 5900.
01-06-2012, 08:50 PM
#115
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Re: Trying to break into 11's
brake stall is not what the motor flashes to when you floor it and have traction, so that's not the true stall, it will be higher than that.
01-06-2012, 08:57 PM
#116
Re: Trying to break into 11's
adding another LT1 car as an example- (sorry)
bone stock '97 t/a full weight with a th350 swap
4.10 gear
26" slicks
3000 stall converter
that car went 8.00's all day long in the 1/8. can't remember the mph or 60's. it was stock down to the manifolds, exhaust, and air filter- only thing done was the th350 swap and gears. being a fully loaded t/a, it had to have been 3500lbs or more.
bone stock '97 t/a full weight with a th350 swap
4.10 gear
26" slicks
3000 stall converter
that car went 8.00's all day long in the 1/8. can't remember the mph or 60's. it was stock down to the manifolds, exhaust, and air filter- only thing done was the th350 swap and gears. being a fully loaded t/a, it had to have been 3500lbs or more.
01-06-2012, 09:19 PM
#118
Re: Trying to break into 11's
but i was adding to the convo on these 2 things:
300rwhp can go 11's in the right car/weight.
3000 stall converter can RIP with a stock cam and go mid 12's with 270rwhp in a 3500lb car.
01-06-2012, 11:37 PM
#119
Re: Trying to break into 11's
yes it is a roller cam, and the cam i posted earlier that seems to be the controversy here on whether it is "too big" or not is a roller cam. It's lift is .520/.540. I think because of budget im going to try these, http://www.alexsparts.com/valve-spri...oller/#reviews
And then check my clearance and grind away some if its not clearing.
But here's the cam just incase people dont want to go back and find it.
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CCA-08-433-8/
It's rpm range of 2500-6000 seems to be perfect because with my stall i get my rpm's to 2400 before take off, and i shift at 5900.
And then check my clearance and grind away some if its not clearing.
But here's the cam just incase people dont want to go back and find it.
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CCA-08-433-8/
It's rpm range of 2500-6000 seems to be perfect because with my stall i get my rpm's to 2400 before take off, and i shift at 5900.
Ok for some reason I thought they posted about the flat tappet. The roller cam will be smoother operating than the flat tappet version of same duration so it should be abit more streetable.
That cam in a 350 will act not too much different than the cam I had in my 383...maybe just a tad bigger, and I drove that car on the street just fine. Could have gone bigger and been ok. It was an EFI car however which helps alot in the driveability.
Still think that cam is doable tho. I've seen LT1's run that cam just fine...make a crapload of power and turn alot of rpm but it has worked in the past. It will require a good carb tune and higher idle to get good vacuum signal.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7tiSjSLlUqg
Last edited by Orr89RocZ; 01-06-2012 at 11:44 PM.
01-07-2012, 05:28 AM
#120
Re: Trying to break into 11's
I had a 280h on my old 305, which is 230/230 so I don't think a cam in the mid 23x's in an engine with better heads and 45 more cubes will be an issue at all. I also had a 4000 stall lock up converter and a 650 dp on it. I managed 20+ hwy mileage on more than one occasion.
01-07-2012, 07:06 AM
#121
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Re: Trying to break into 11's
XPNDBL3....I made response to this. I'm sure my answer was relevant (or maybe not). It was a little off topic from this thread topic though.
I'm trying to folow this thread but my head is spinning. There's random info being thrown all over the place.
01-07-2012, 11:46 AM
#122
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Re: Trying to break into 11's
it's all good man. Just for a typical mild street/strip car, can you tell using the "butt dyno" if a motor is down 15 ft/tq at WOT when you're only at part throttle while slowly accelerating from stoplight to stoplight. Basically the only thing you're feeling is converter slip making it feel soggy, not the engine's HP/TQ.
01-07-2012, 02:44 PM
#123
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Car: 1984 camaro z28
Engine: sbc 383
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Axle/Gears: Moser 9", 4.11 gear
Re: Trying to break into 11's
Sounds good, looks like the cam will workout for me then. The only thing thats worrying me now is expanding the lift for the cam. I'm hoping alexs parts is a decent product.
01-08-2012, 06:02 AM
#124
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Re: Trying to break into 11's
I had a 280h on my old 305, which is 230/230 so I don't think a cam in the mid 23x's in an engine with better heads and 45 more cubes will be an issue at all. I also had a 4000 stall lock up converter and a 650 dp on it. I managed 20+ hwy mileage on more than one occasion.
01-08-2012, 05:43 PM
#129
Re: Trying to break into 11's
01-08-2012, 06:11 PM
#130
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Re: Trying to break into 11's
Here is one thread with some info
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/orga...wo-walter.html
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/orga...wo-walter.html
01-08-2012, 07:37 PM
#132
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Re: Trying to break into 11's
It's going to be a pain to find your thread with all the specs on that car and engine, being so old. Could you list the specs here?
Sorry about the threadjack Greggymac
01-08-2012, 08:40 PM
#133
Re: Trying to break into 11's
just search for threads started by my screen name in the organized drag racing board, and the tech/general engine board for more specifics, but here's a run down:
305 .030" over
113 casting al vette heads
280h cam, pro-mag 1.52 rockers
holley stret dominator intake p/n 300-36, semi-worked 650 double pumper
10" ati 4000 stall/700r4, 373's, 28" tire
3150lb raceweight (with me in the car, this was before the 9"/th400/rollbar, etc)
hedman longtubes, dual 2.5" h-piped exhaust with summit "fully welded mufflers"
305 .030" over
113 casting al vette heads
280h cam, pro-mag 1.52 rockers
holley stret dominator intake p/n 300-36, semi-worked 650 double pumper
10" ati 4000 stall/700r4, 373's, 28" tire
3150lb raceweight (with me in the car, this was before the 9"/th400/rollbar, etc)
hedman longtubes, dual 2.5" h-piped exhaust with summit "fully welded mufflers"
01-08-2012, 09:31 PM
#134
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Join Date: Jul 2011
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Car: 1984 camaro z28
Engine: sbc 383
Transmission: Th400
Axle/Gears: Moser 9", 4.11 gear
Re: Trying to break into 11's
This is weird... I saw this
http://www.camquest.com/
on comp cams facebook page and decided to enter in my information... It suggested...
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CCA-08-433-8/
same one!
http://www.camquest.com/
on comp cams facebook page and decided to enter in my information... It suggested...
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CCA-08-433-8/
same one!
01-09-2012, 01:15 AM
#136
Supreme Member
Re: Trying to break into 11's
just search for threads started by my screen name in the organized drag racing board, and the tech/general engine board for more specifics, but here's a run down:
305 .030" over
113 casting al vette heads
280h cam, pro-mag 1.52 rockers
holley stret dominator intake p/n 300-36, semi-worked 650 double pumper
10" ati 4000 stall/700r4, 373's, 28" tire
3150lb raceweight (with me in the car, this was before the 9"/th400/rollbar, etc)
hedman longtubes, dual 2.5" h-piped exhaust with summit "fully welded mufflers"
305 .030" over
113 casting al vette heads
280h cam, pro-mag 1.52 rockers
holley stret dominator intake p/n 300-36, semi-worked 650 double pumper
10" ati 4000 stall/700r4, 373's, 28" tire
3150lb raceweight (with me in the car, this was before the 9"/th400/rollbar, etc)
hedman longtubes, dual 2.5" h-piped exhaust with summit "fully welded mufflers"
01-09-2012, 01:29 AM
#137
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Car: 1991 B4C Camaro RS
Engine: 370 lsx ls3 heads victor jr w/carb
Transmission: TH400 w/brake coan 8"4500-4800 stal
Axle/Gears: Moser 9" locker w/ 4.11's
Re: Trying to break into 11's
01-09-2012, 06:42 AM
#138
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Car: '90 RS
Engine: 305 TBI
Transmission: 700R4
Axle/Gears: 2.73 Open
Re: Trying to break into 11's
just search for threads started by my screen name in the organized drag racing board, and the tech/general engine board for more specifics, but here's a run down:
305 .030" over
113 casting al vette heads
280h cam, pro-mag 1.52 rockers
holley stret dominator intake p/n 300-36, semi-worked 650 double pumper
10" ati 4000 stall/700r4, 373's, 28" tire
3150lb raceweight (with me in the car, this was before the 9"/th400/rollbar, etc)
hedman longtubes, dual 2.5" h-piped exhaust with summit "fully welded mufflers"
305 .030" over
113 casting al vette heads
280h cam, pro-mag 1.52 rockers
holley stret dominator intake p/n 300-36, semi-worked 650 double pumper
10" ati 4000 stall/700r4, 373's, 28" tire
3150lb raceweight (with me in the car, this was before the 9"/th400/rollbar, etc)
hedman longtubes, dual 2.5" h-piped exhaust with summit "fully welded mufflers"
Looks like I'll be in the 13's with my setup; the LT1 cam has a ton less duration and I'm running 3.23's with stock 26" tires (until I burn through them), but I'm running EBL with a modded TBI. What transmission mods did you need besides the converter.. shift kit, corvette servo, etc?
01-09-2012, 08:51 AM
#139
Re: Trying to break into 11's
This is weird... I saw this
http://www.camquest.com/
on comp cams facebook page and decided to enter in my information... It suggested...
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CCA-08-433-8/
same one!
http://www.camquest.com/
on comp cams facebook page and decided to enter in my information... It suggested...
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CCA-08-433-8/
same one!
Last edited by Orr89RocZ; 01-09-2012 at 08:55 AM.
01-09-2012, 10:02 AM
#140
Re: Trying to break into 11's
Im running a CS XR282HR-12 with a .510/.520 lift cut on a 112 lsa. Its in a stock bore/stroke/rods/bock L98 and I love this cam. I just one step blow the CS XR288HR-10. The rest of my setup and times are in my sig. I think a 12.01 should be close enough to 11's.
Oh yeah, that is with a 3400 lbs race weight. The car, me and a half tank of gas.
Im running 10.3 to 1 compression with stock deck height and stock flattop pistons that are in the 91-92 motors.
Oh yeah, that is with a 3400 lbs race weight. The car, me and a half tank of gas.
Im running 10.3 to 1 compression with stock deck height and stock flattop pistons that are in the 91-92 motors.
Last edited by bluegrassz; 01-09-2012 at 10:05 AM.
01-09-2012, 04:38 PM
#141
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Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Michigan
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Car: 1984 camaro z28
Engine: sbc 383
Transmission: Th400
Axle/Gears: Moser 9", 4.11 gear
Re: Trying to break into 11's
Im running a CS XR282HR-12 with a .510/.520 lift cut on a 112 lsa. Its in a stock bore/stroke/rods/bock L98 and I love this cam. I just one step blow the CS XR288HR-10. The rest of my setup and times are in my sig. I think a 12.01 should be close enough to 11's.
Oh yeah, that is with a 3400 lbs race weight. The car, me and a half tank of gas.
Im running 10.3 to 1 compression with stock deck height and stock flattop pistons that are in the 91-92 motors.
Oh yeah, that is with a 3400 lbs race weight. The car, me and a half tank of gas.
Im running 10.3 to 1 compression with stock deck height and stock flattop pistons that are in the 91-92 motors.
01-09-2012, 05:41 PM
#142
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Car: 91 Z28, 2000 T/A
Engine: SBC 355, LS1
Transmission: T56, T56
Axle/Gears: 10bolt 3.73, 3.42
Re: Trying to break into 11's
This is weird... I saw this
http://www.camquest.com/
on comp cams facebook page and decided to enter in my information... It suggested...
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CCA-08-433-8/
same one!
http://www.camquest.com/
on comp cams facebook page and decided to enter in my information... It suggested...
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CCA-08-433-8/
same one!
settings I used:
2-valve hemi/canted heads, stock ports 1.94/1.5 valves, 10.5:1
domestic dual plane high flow intake, 750 cfm carb, small tube headers, muffler w/o cat.
The most recommended cam in this thread and the first that comes up,
433 cam, (236/242)
396.5 hp @ 6000
400.6 tq @ 4500
avg hp 233.8
avg tq 262.9
recommended 3-4000 stall
The cam I recommended.
423 cam (224/230)
397.9hp @ 5500
422.6hp @ 4000
235.1 avg hp
282 avg tq
recommended 2500-3500 stall
Or this cam, which seems to have the best power numbers in your lift range.
432 cam, (230/236)
397.5 hp @ 5500
413.1 tq @ 4000
avg hp 242.4
avg tq 281.7
recommended 2500-3500 stall
So the larger cam makes less peak and less average hp and tq. most considerablely over 20 less avg tq and about 10 less avg hp than the 432 (230/236) cam. Just sayin'
Last edited by 3rd gen Will; 01-09-2012 at 05:48 PM.
01-09-2012, 06:26 PM
#144
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Car: 1984 Z28
Engine: SLOW carbed ls
Transmission: TH400 with brake, 8" PTC converter
Axle/Gears: moser 9" 4.11
Re: Trying to break into 11's
LOL that program won't spit out real world numbers at all and using hemi heads or canted valve angle heads....really?
01-09-2012, 06:50 PM
#145
Re: Trying to break into 11's
Heres another look at it in Desktop dyno2003. Not the most accurate...bigger and bigger cams wont necessarily push hp peak out high in the rpm range, they would normally peak near same since the heads wont support it, but the power numbers made would change and the rpm where power starts to drop off would change.
423 cam 224/230.
HP/ Tq at various RPMS
4000 rpm 321 hp 422 tq (peak)
5500 rpm 393 hp 375 tq
6000 rpm 378 hp 331 tq
6500 rpm 358 hp 289 tq
432 cam. Not a bad choice here 230/236
4000 rpm 319 hp 419 tq Peak was at 4500 with 423
5500 rpm 406 hp 387 tq
6000 rpm 399 hp 349 tq
6500 rpm 379 hp 306
Comp's choice 433 cam 236/242
4000 rpm 314 hp 412 tq. Peak was at 4500 with 420.
5500 rpm 392 hp 391 tq.
6000 rpm 412 hp 360 tq
6500 rpm 396 hp 320 tq
7000 rpm 372 hp 279 tq.
Last cam on there is the bigger 443 cam, 242/248 just to show what happens.
Continues to push peak to 422hp at 6000 and holds more power higher in the rpm range. Torque below 4500 suffers.
Designing this combination on a 6500-6700 rpm shift point and 4000-4500 stall, the 433 cam definately does good work. Making more average power in the 4500-6500 rpm range where he will operate than the 423 and 433 cam. I dont expect the 242/248 cam to actually make more power as the heads just wont support it and the torque should suffer more than it already does with this program.
By 4500 they are all very close in torque but after that, the bigger cams carry more power out further and thus will accelerate faster.
423 cam 224/230.
HP/ Tq at various RPMS
4000 rpm 321 hp 422 tq (peak)
5500 rpm 393 hp 375 tq
6000 rpm 378 hp 331 tq
6500 rpm 358 hp 289 tq
432 cam. Not a bad choice here 230/236
4000 rpm 319 hp 419 tq Peak was at 4500 with 423
5500 rpm 406 hp 387 tq
6000 rpm 399 hp 349 tq
6500 rpm 379 hp 306
Comp's choice 433 cam 236/242
4000 rpm 314 hp 412 tq. Peak was at 4500 with 420.
5500 rpm 392 hp 391 tq.
6000 rpm 412 hp 360 tq
6500 rpm 396 hp 320 tq
7000 rpm 372 hp 279 tq.
Last cam on there is the bigger 443 cam, 242/248 just to show what happens.
Continues to push peak to 422hp at 6000 and holds more power higher in the rpm range. Torque below 4500 suffers.
Designing this combination on a 6500-6700 rpm shift point and 4000-4500 stall, the 433 cam definately does good work. Making more average power in the 4500-6500 rpm range where he will operate than the 423 and 433 cam. I dont expect the 242/248 cam to actually make more power as the heads just wont support it and the torque should suffer more than it already does with this program.
By 4500 they are all very close in torque but after that, the bigger cams carry more power out further and thus will accelerate faster.
Last edited by Orr89RocZ; 01-09-2012 at 09:26 PM.
01-09-2012, 07:39 PM
#146
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Re: Trying to break into 11's
Bigger is always better, you just may not have enough Head, Converter, Gear, headers, fuel system to support It exposes your other downfalls..
It exposes your other downfalls..
01-09-2012, 07:50 PM
#147
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Location: Michigan
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Car: 1984 camaro z28
Engine: sbc 383
Transmission: Th400
Axle/Gears: Moser 9", 4.11 gear
Re: Trying to break into 11's
Did you happen to click on the dyno link.
settings I used:
2-valve hemi/canted heads, stock ports 1.94/1.5 valves, 10.5:1
domestic dual plane high flow intake, 750 cfm carb, small tube headers, muffler w/o cat.
The most recommended cam in this thread and the first that comes up,
433 cam, (236/242)
396.5 hp @ 6000
400.6 tq @ 4500
avg hp 233.8
avg tq 262.9
recommended 3-4000 stall
The cam I recommended.
423 cam (224/230)
397.9hp @ 5500
422.6hp @ 4000
235.1 avg hp
282 avg tq
recommended 2500-3500 stall
Or this cam, which seems to have the best power numbers in your lift range.
432 cam, (230/236)
397.5 hp @ 5500
413.1 tq @ 4000
avg hp 242.4
avg tq 281.7
recommended 2500-3500 stall
So the larger cam makes less peak and less average hp and tq. most considerablely over 20 less avg tq and about 10 less avg hp than the 432 (230/236) cam. Just sayin'
settings I used:
2-valve hemi/canted heads, stock ports 1.94/1.5 valves, 10.5:1
domestic dual plane high flow intake, 750 cfm carb, small tube headers, muffler w/o cat.
The most recommended cam in this thread and the first that comes up,
433 cam, (236/242)
396.5 hp @ 6000
400.6 tq @ 4500
avg hp 233.8
avg tq 262.9
recommended 3-4000 stall
The cam I recommended.
423 cam (224/230)
397.9hp @ 5500
422.6hp @ 4000
235.1 avg hp
282 avg tq
recommended 2500-3500 stall
Or this cam, which seems to have the best power numbers in your lift range.
432 cam, (230/236)
397.5 hp @ 5500
413.1 tq @ 4000
avg hp 242.4
avg tq 281.7
recommended 2500-3500 stall
So the larger cam makes less peak and less average hp and tq. most considerablely over 20 less avg tq and about 10 less avg hp than the 432 (230/236) cam. Just sayin'
But in respect to everyones opinions i decided to send a 6 page cam suggestion into comp cams to see what they say is best for my motor, in which i included everything that i have and want to do with the engine. They said they'd respond in 1-2 business days and ill let you guys know what they say!
01-09-2012, 09:27 PM
#148
Re: Trying to break into 11's
dont know why my chart didnt load up first time.... reloaded
Remember, pulling to 6000+ with those cams will require spring with 150lbs seat pressure atleast, closer to 400 open.
If your install height is closer to 1.75-1.8", i'd recommend Patriot Extreme Gold spring kit with titanium retainers for about 280 bucks. Its a great kit and american made
Remember, pulling to 6000+ with those cams will require spring with 150lbs seat pressure atleast, closer to 400 open.
If your install height is closer to 1.75-1.8", i'd recommend Patriot Extreme Gold spring kit with titanium retainers for about 280 bucks. Its a great kit and american made
01-10-2012, 03:03 AM
#149
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Re: Trying to break into 11's
The reason why i did not do the dyno is because it did not have accurate options for me to choose for my engine. Why waste my time? Also, you have to remember i am getting new springs and arranging my clearance to hold .550 lift, where those heads you chose are not that, and also are nowhere near the vortec heads. Also the intake you chose is nowhere near what im running, edelbrock performer rpm was an option to choose. Also, like previously stated, those dyno sheets are the last thing i should base my cam decision on.
But in respect to everyones opinions i decided to send a 6 page cam suggestion into comp cams to see what they say is best for my motor, in which i included everything that i have and want to do with the engine. They said they'd respond in 1-2 business days and ill let you guys know what they say!
But in respect to everyones opinions i decided to send a 6 page cam suggestion into comp cams to see what they say is best for my motor, in which i included everything that i have and want to do with the engine. They said they'd respond in 1-2 business days and ill let you guys know what they say!
Fond memory's come streaming back when you say you want to break into the 11's.Not that we are that big time either.Just old.So from the cheap seats we'll be watching cheering you on.
01-10-2012, 07:37 AM
#150
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Location: Michigan
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Car: 1984 camaro z28
Engine: sbc 383
Transmission: Th400
Axle/Gears: Moser 9", 4.11 gear
Re: Trying to break into 11's
dont know why my chart didnt load up first time.... reloaded
Remember, pulling to 6000+ with those cams will require spring with 150lbs seat pressure atleast, closer to 400 open.
If your install height is closer to 1.75-1.8", i'd recommend Patriot Extreme Gold spring kit with titanium retainers for about 280 bucks. Its a great kit and american made
Remember, pulling to 6000+ with those cams will require spring with 150lbs seat pressure atleast, closer to 400 open.
If your install height is closer to 1.75-1.8", i'd recommend Patriot Extreme Gold spring kit with titanium retainers for about 280 bucks. Its a great kit and american made