Lampropeltis

Curious if FIRST still gives discounts on group purchases and if anyone is in the market for intakes or is considering it. I've researched these boards and the last time I heard of anyone trying to do a group FIRST purchase was 2008. I'm in the market - definitely want the FIRST intake system and definitely wouldn't mind a price break

bwmcam

Are they ready for orders or still retooling?

89fast5oh

I emailed Ken at FIRST the other day and he said they are not quite ready for production yet. I asked him to notify me when they were ready.

I would be in for a group purchase for a FIRST intake.

88fastgta

iTrader: (9)

Id would go for it... its a great system..... definitely more bad *** looking for sure...performs a lot better too..

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

Isn't it just a TPI setup?

-- Joe

Johnny Blaze

iTrader: (15)

With bigger ports, and an LS throttle body.

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

What is the runner length ?

-- Joe

Johnny Blaze

iTrader: (15)

Not sure, close or same as stock from the looks.


From what I have been hearing, the production date has continually been pushed back weeks at a time for the last year.


I find it funny everyone is so excited over this intake, that has been around since 1990.

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

A lot of guys still put TPI in their street rods, even though it's anemic. I vaguely remember it from years ago - they had the option of the throttle body sideways too right?

-- Joe

Johnny Blaze

iTrader: (15)

Well, I can see the draw to tpi in general, one being its cheap these days, first is so expsensive tough.

Here is what I was talking about,
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/alte...something.html

88fastgta

iTrader: (9)

Also the first intakes flows more than a super ram....the mid range and upper range is VASTLY improved and honestly pulls much harder than a typical afterunit tpi. The only thing I really disliked was the Pos "ls" style intake.... caused me nothing but trouble and all four throttlebodies Ken sent me did the same thing.. so I had a conversion plate made to use the stock type throttlebody..
the intake is physically much bigger than the stock tpi unit looks more like an big block intake...its night a day difference compared to my ported edelbrock/slp combo... I have a 7 page thread about this intake on my car... ill dig up when I get off work...

dfarr67

iTrader: (2)

I got a few orders together last year 15% off I think- mines still in the box although gasket matched and some minor porting on the base ( I have the vortec version). I would get an agreement that if you aren't happy with the TB you can send it back for refund, With all the TB's available I wish Ken just made the plenum to fit the oe bolt pattern. I sent mine back and the fuel rails, I plan on making the stock rails fit as I see the least work in keeping the plumbing oe. I also welded up the sideways mount.

BadSS

I swear I hate to seem like the FIRST poster boy, but there aren't a lot of people running them and even fewer that's hogged out one. It's been around for a while, but the design is sound. The intake to head and runner to intake transitions are light years ahead of the stock type TPI. They are both long/longer runner intakes and that's about the only thing they have in common.

oldred95

I am very interested in a group purchase. I'm wanting one for a 400 small block turbo build thats going in a 6000 pound truck.

Method_z28

I have been trying to decide which route I'm gonna go. I would be in on this if it happens.

oldred95

Bump.

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

Well yeah, but the thing they have in common is what you don't want. The runner is way too long. Unless of course you wan't to keep the power under 5400 rpms.

Here is a good example:


Peak at 4500. I've seen a few peak at 5000 RPM.

How would you feel if last call was at 8pm ?

-- Joe

BadSS

LOL. Yep, using 165cc heads that don't flow much better than stock on a 383 with a bitty cam, is a really good example,,,,, of what not to do.

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

But the video was Ik200 heads on a 383 with a 230/236 degree roller cam.

I don't know why people spend twice the money of a singleplane to put an intake on a engine and go slow.


-- Joe

Johnny Blaze

iTrader: (15)

Great point. Would be interesting to see the same engine with a Hurricane intake.

the only draw to the First is the fact that it looks stockish, but not stock enough to pass as stock.

bwmcam

What is your suggestion/recommendation for the setup on the video?

BadSS

Hmmm,,, I guess you know more than the engine builder at Precision that I talked to. I tell you,,, you just can't get good information straight from the source anymore!!!

anesthes

iTrader: (12)

Well, a 383 that is less compression (9.5:1) with AFR 195 heads and an XR288HR cam makes 503hp @ 5500 rpm and 500 foot lbs of torque with a singleplane and a 4bbl throttle body, so I'd do something like that for a mild street car.

For something a bit more crazy I'd shoot for over 300 degrees of duration and a more compression, pushing the powerband to 6k or 6200.

You can get a real good rule of peoples max potential by looking at what injectors they are running on their combos. I see a lot of FIRST intakes on cars with 24lb injectors, which at 90% duty cycle and 50psi have a peak HP potential of under 400hp.


-- Joe

bwmcam

I would be interested in a group buy.

rongreen

iTrader: (1)

I am interested too lets do it soon.

oldred95

Bump. Did we lose interest?

GenX'Motorsport

Id like to see a boosted FIRST. We should all know by know TPI + Boost goes really well together. Ive seen 800+ RWHP with boosted TPI's. Would love to see a well matched motor with a FIRST and a turbo or blower.

jim86

iTrader: (1)

i'd be interested as well

fozzi58

bump

dfarr67

iTrader: (2)

I had a FIRST TPI group buy last year (mine was vortec)- got 5 orders together.
A few things that could be improved (in my mind), use of more oe compatible components- I don't buy the fact that one TB is substantially better than another except in build quality and cfm- I ran ran screaming from FIRSTs TB- I made an agreement with Ken that I could return it if unsatisfied- I did. With all the TB's available I don't know why they don't just use a oe style (or even a GM LS TB- don't confuse FIRSTs TB with what I'm trying to say- no trans provision either). This is billed as a stand alone unit- but I think the majority of buyers would be ex GM TPI or at least going on GM tech vehicles- I would like to see more compatibilty with other GM TPI components like fuel rails and FPR- I returned the fuel rails as I plan to follow anothers lead and make the oe fit instead of replumbing everything, this would cut costs even further. I ended up welding the 90deg hole to look a little more factory- I just can't see the sales numbers that high to justify keeping that option, it's ugly. And will fab a clean adapter for the TB. Spent some time cleaning up the casting, port matching to vortec- I do have some issues with mounting bolt locations being off.
So it's been sitting for some time as I'm have issues with the current 355 and am comsidering a 383 built on the same foundations- can anybody suggest a good roller (not Comp) that would work with this intake, AFR vortec heads, with a possible 4/7 swap. This is in a '89, 4x4, 700r4 (stock conv), 3:73. I'm considering the 4/7 purely for better cooling of certain cylinders and supposed running smoothness.

rongreen

iTrader: (1)

A question for FIRST users. Are the issues that dfarr67 is having with the TB and trans compatibility an isolated case? I am considering getting on board with a group purchase.

dfarr67

iTrader: (2)

After what I wrote- the TB wasn't a deal breaker, there aren't too many options for me for the torque offered in this manifold. I'm not dis'ng Ken, he put's some effort into machining his TB, oem can always be improved but it is definitely the benchmark here and I don't believe that monster is as good as my ported GM TB for all things considered. If you do a little search I can think of one good thread where 2 customers have made adapters, I think if someone came up with an elegant program (that doesn't look so blocky installed) they could sell to existing FIRST owners and even supply Ken (I wonder how many move on after seeing the TB)- I believe he hand made a few adapters but gave up as too labour intensive- a 3/4in plate with two bores is all that's needed, not a ported out unit. Order a kit, just make sure the TB is returnable- I'm sure the trans linkage can be set up, my preference is for rock solid installs, not cheesy ones- you'd understand why- it's my luck and Mr. Murphy.

rongreen

iTrader: (1)

The trans linkage is a serious concern due to the sensitive shift adjustment of the 4l60/700r. How do you fine tune your shift adjustment?

dfarr67

iTrader: (2)

To make matters worse for me, I am using Bowtie OD's EZTV conversion which I am happy with- which is mounted onto the modified oe throttle linkage assembly. I am not willing to abandon this. I've found the best setting so far is with the cable off the linkage at idle ??psi, cable on the linkage at idle set ?? +2psi

bwmcam

So does the bowtie OD piece allow you to run the First Injection TB? And what are the problems, if any? Thanks!

dfarr67

iTrader: (2)

The FIRST TB is totally different. I sent it back as I will mod an oe TB to fit.

88fastgta

iTrader: (9)

I am one of those guys who had an adapter plate made for the FIRST throttle body.... ken made Me the only plate free of charge that uses the stock throttlebody... the the throttle body that ken provides I could not get it to run right.... car would idle down and at one point the car was locked at full throttle because the linkage was locked up.. I've tried for months trying to get that throttle body to work right so I asked ken if he could send me Another throttlebody.. so I got another throttle from ken and it did the same thing as the one I shipped back.. I was upset spending so much time and effort into this intake.... I insisted that it was a defect issue in the throttle body with its poorly designed linkages and boring plate issues... the throttle body plates didn't close right and often times got stuck when the plates were closed which would explain why the car never idled down all the way... so he made a a adpater plate free of charge and said the he would never again make this because of the time involved into making it... when it put the plate on and used my stock tpi throttle body all my problems went away... I has ran perfect ever since

here is my thread I made about two years ago regarding the issue and fixing the issue

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/tpi/...onversion.html

dfarr67

iTrader: (2)

My TB has been bored and ported- 800cfm. Ask me about touchy throttle blades- took me a long time to get them to seat properly and not have that little stickiness at tip in. I just wish instead od bushings bearings could be installed.

Guest

Is their going to be another group purchase?

86redIROC

If I do the first I too will make an adapter plate and run the stock TB. Did you dyno the car with the First or run it at the track?

Guest

Bump-

jim86

iTrader: (1)

Is Ken back up making these? I've checked his website periodically and haven't seen any change ...

Guest

Yes, they've been backup for a bit now.

Tony89GTA

iTrader: (7)

I phoned about a month and a half ago, they are running again but at the time he was waiting for some castings and told me a two week wait.

peterc005

I'm interested too, any more updates?

Guest

Bump
-anybody else

Metal Tech

I'm another that is in. I watch this thread and the one in the GP forum.

Guest

We need a group purchase 2014!!! Everyone save your money up.

REBSTA

iTrader: (1)

EVGAX58,

Give me a call at 256-714-6819. Building a FFI Procharged Roller 383 with 215 canfield heads... Thinking of upgerading my procharger from p1sc to d1sc.. Tried to send you PM but no luck. Considering ordering Ken's larger TB or moding up for other BBK or TPIS monoblad TB

Robby

Guest

What do you want to know?