FlippindaBird

iTrader: (10)

sorry rider i forgot about you... so its only you and naf watching lol im wasted btw... halloween party i dont wanna pm atilla cause thatd be gay lol its just that ive been getting advice from him for like 2 years, and now hes gone lol ill get the pics up tomorrow... hows your build goin rust?

rustrider73

still rolling around on the stock junk 305 but the fresh vortec 350 zz4 cam setup is going in soon as I finish getting my blazer running

FlippindaBird

iTrader: (10)

man we should meet up sometime... i think island dragway is just about in the middle of me and L.I.

rustrider73

I go to e-town and atco atleast 3 time a year and island everynow an then. probably done for the season now but I'll check you out in the spring and following your build.

FlippindaBird

iTrader: (10)

cool sounds good

Doom86

Sounds like a fun build. Check this out it's a lot like yours. https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/carb...t-capable.html

I'm sure reading something like that makes the wait all the more "fun"?

Naf how trying was it to dial in the MCS dwell with that XE262 cam? I gotta ask because I'm about to try it with a XE268.

FlippindaBird those stainless full roller rockers you were talking about sound like the one's that I was planning to use too. Ebay is great for people like us who gotta put it together one part at a time.

naf

iTrader: (7)

No problem, although mine wound up only near 3 turns out on the idle mixture screws and 6 or so on the IAB. It wanted a leaner mixture than I would have expected. I even swapped another carb on and got near the same settings. Every motor's different.

I'm currently at 6 degrees advanced (according to the balancer mark anyway) with no pinging. Idles around 600-650 with just a little 'hunting'. I run 89. I've been driving it all Summer while I'm painting my TA.

FlippindaBird

iTrader: (10)

Doom thanks for that thread i will be following it, and yes ebay is... priceless(not to be cliche) for us budget builders

FlippindaBird

iTrader: (10)

i took the engine mounts off the block and sanded/painted them, i went to reinstall them today and they are a little different, just subtly, ill get some pics up in a min, im just not sure which side to install them on or if it matters... im planning on getting the engine in by next Tuesday at the latest so im doing all the little prep work thats left over today and i ran across this problem, hopefully someone can help... im also gonna post a pic of the sensors i have so you can tell me which one is the knock sensor lol i started this project out i was labeling everything but in my haste to get done when i puled the 305 i just got everything and threw it in the shed, so now im suffering the consequences of my quickie work

heres the mounts ill get the sensors up asap... the left one flares outward more then the one on the right are they interchangeable or does it matter?

Doom86

If you don't mind my why not just use the 305's mounts so the motor is exactly where it was?

FlippindaBird

iTrader: (10)

thatd work, if i had them... i didnt get them off the 305 when i sold it because the bolts were real stuck and the guy wanted to get going so i knew i had these off of a 89 formula 350 which should be exactly the same as the 305s... im gonna get solid mounts in the future just didnt wanna outlay the cash for them yet

here's the sensors... the one on the right i think is the knock sensor(came from a 350 tpi engine) i have no idea what the one on the left is, i think it came from a hole around the oil filter... btw does anyone know of an oil filter adapter to use for this engine? the one on my junk 350 tpi engine is for an external cooler and i dont have one of those(can i buy the adapter at autozone/napa etc?)... lastly, how many sensors are there supposed to be ?
1-knock sensor(next to dipstick)
2-fan switch(pass side head)
3-o2 sensor(driver side header)
4- temp sensor (on the thermo housing)

Doom86

No idea what the sensor on the left is. Is it from the vortec block or the TPI 350? I bet it's some kind of oil temp sensor. That connector is exactly like a coolant temp sensor.

The sensor on the right is a coolant temp gauge sensor, it goes in the drivers side head.

A knock sensor looks a lot like a fan switch for whatever reason.

You already have the carb sensors? Those are all you are missing that I can see.

Did you do away with the EVAP canister? No EGR?

No idea on the filter man hopefully someone can sort that out for you.

FlippindaBird

iTrader: (10)

thanks doom... the carb was taken off with everything in place,i hope the sensors are there, i got a new temp sensor from a GN (185*) and its installed into the head(thought thats where it went), i do wanna delete the egr, the manifold has no provision for it anyway, im hoping to be rid of the AIR as well... the evap canister is still there although i would love to do away with it to be rid of the clutter, i was told i need it there for whatever reason. so neither of those are knock sensors huh? ill get a pic up of the "fan switch" i put in the head... that sucks im gonna have to buy a knock sensor, is there a schematic somewhere online for all these sensors or does someone have one they could scan and upload?? im really at a loss here i thought i was in the ballpark but what your saying has me all messed up. will this thing run without those sensors at all? like just run and i can go from there, i know itll be needing alot of tuning before its right, i just wanna get it in and running so i can start... and none of the sensors are from the vortec block they are all from the 350tpi

Doom86

You don't need the evap canister I was only asking about it because if you use it there is a vacuum switch that goes next to the Coolant Temp Sensor in the water neck for it. It doesn't hurt anything and helps with emissions and mileage though.

The EGR solenoid can be left unhooked and it does set the SES light on long cruises, mines been doing it for like 5 years now . People claim putting a resistor in it's place will keep the SES from setting.

It sounds like you got it to me don't fret. That sensor on the right doesn't go to the ECM it links directly to the coolant temp gauge on the dash. I looked up the other one and almost certainly a Oil Pressure Switch. Check out the photos of the sensors on Autozone, they actually have some decent ones.

Fan switch is the one by number 8 and 6 cyl on passenger side head.

Knock sensor goes in the block by the oil dip-stick. If you can find the TPI 350's it should work.

Get a heated O2 sensor too while you at it. The ford truck one is $45, works perfectly.

rustrider73

Flip, Doom is right about the sensors,
left is oil pressure, goes right above oil filter
right is temp gauge, goes in drivers side head
ecm temp sensor goes in thermostat housing or intake right next to therm house
fan switch goes in passenger head
knocksensor goes in block between passenger side motor mount and dipstick, above oil pan rail.
oil filter adapter you can get off any small block chevy but only about $15 new
evap can vents the carb & tank, I would leave it there

FlippindaBird

iTrader: (10)

ok so i just have to take the one the right and put it in the drivers side head, looks like im missing a knock sensor then... im gonna go on autozone.com and check those pics out and i gotta search the shed... will this thing run if its missing a sensor or 2? i dont have the dough right now to go get them all, just want it to run for now...
you guys agree with this: "The stock chips in the ECM are calibrated for use with an EGR valve. If you delete the EGR and still run a stock chip, you can get part throttle pinging.

I've also heard removing the EGR on a Chevy CCC setup ( at least on a Monte ) will trigger the CEL. This doesn't happen with the Olds CCC setop. Go figure."??

Im off to work ill be back home to do more friday(5 days off woohoo!), thanks guys

naf

iTrader: (7)

My 87 doesn't ping with no EGR. The Vortec heads are less prone to detonation due to their design. It also doesn't trip the SES light with the EGR disconnected.

The KS goes into a block drain. Installing it later will require you to drain the coolant.

You can run without the KS connected you'll just have to be more careful setting the timing because it won't pull any out for knock.

FlippindaBird

iTrader: (10)

ok i def want to get it in there then, i dont even have a timing light lol

FlippindaBird

iTrader: (10)

naf could you get me a pic of where your egr is disconnected??

naf

iTrader: (7)

Disconnected the two wire plug that goes into the solenoid and tucked it back into the harness with a zip tie.

FlippindaBird

iTrader: (10)

ok when i get the engine in ill see if i can find it, we got freezing rain today with 30+ mph winds, set me back on the work i gotta do, luckily the engine and car are underneath nice comfy covers

nobody can ID those mounts for me yet??

Doom86

That's high tech stuff!

Mines laying on the intake manifold where the solenoid was.

It's strange you don't get a SES light naf mines been going off for years after cruising steady for a while on the highway.

FlippindaBird

iTrader: (10)

lol your cool doom

im guessing itll be easy to find once i get everythingelse plugged in

naf

iTrader: (7)

May be a difference between the '87 and '86 ECM? It's never set that code and seems like I'm ALWAYS hooking my scanner up to it for some reason or other, even if it's just to see how hot it's running (I'm on my third used temp guage now and it's pegged up).

naf

iTrader: (7)

Shouldn't be any difference between the motor mounts. One is probably just wallered out from lifting the motor up.

Doom86

naf I fixed that water temp gauge pegging problem (very common issue) by putting a black screw through it so it couldn't go so far, you can't see the screw unless your looking for it, it's right on the edge under the panel. The peg get's hung up on the outer edge of the gauge and gets stuck when you start the car. I even tried making the needle shorter but the only thing that permanently fixed it was the screw.

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

I can't remember now if the SES light was coming on on my '86 LG4, or if it just set a trouble code in the ECM. Whichever, I just hooked up the solenoid without any vacuum lines going to or from it.

Too late for me to go back and try it unplugged.

FlippindaBird

iTrader: (10)

naf im gonna just bolt them on and not worry about it then, it is def a different mount it wasnt tweaked even has different numbers on it, i guess ill know if its wrong when i get it in there

FlippindaBird

iTrader: (10)

FINALLY !! got the engine dropped in, had some trouble lining up the trans, had to get an extra set of hands(my wife) to help me and my friend, she worked the jack while we wiggled the engine around then got 1 bellhousing bolt in... put the 2 engine mount bolts in, then i jacked up a little on the oilpan and got the flexplate bolts installed while my friend was finishing with the bellhousing bolts... shes in there now, but my camera took a dump so i only got 3 pics, ill get some of the engine installed when i can borrow a cam... im going out now to start bolting on the accesories, wiring harnesses carb radiator etc... in 2 weeks im gonna see if i can get her started (my next weekend off) have to get a timing light first


first pick is my friend "Ricky Bobby" with the engine leaving the shed, second is of the rig we used to get it across my yard, theres no way the cherry picker would have made the journey, my yard is basically woods with big rocks, dirt and leaves lol

Grumbles

Quick question as I am looking to cam my l31 block as well. Does the LT4 cam have a proper dizzy gear?

Also, I know the valves can be removed without breaking the heads loose. Does anyone have advice on how to do this properly?

FlippindaBird

iTrader: (10)

it def drives the distributor but i think your talking about the mech fuel pump drive? if so then no but http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/HOTCA...spagenameZWDVW heres one you can get with the eccentric to drive your mech fuel pump for $175 on ebay... i got mine from them but i didnt get the eccentric cause im using a regulator and no mech pump... as for the valves you cant "remove" them without poppin the heads but you can change the springs seals and locks...

Grumbles

Roger that's what i meant. Need to upgrade to the vette springs so i wont be floating 24/7 and run much less risk of binding and breaking ****. If you're gonna do it, might as well do it right eh?

FlippindaBird

iTrader: (10)

vette springs arent gonna be enough for the hotcam unless its a 97+ vette lol and i dont know if their springs will work without machining for them maybe someone else can chime in?

heres a few pics my wife just took when i was starting to work, didnt get any after i got done working today but ill get some up tomorrow or later seems like my wife was taking more pics of me then the car lol

naf

iTrader: (7)

Reminds me of the 87 Z28 I did for my nephew two years ago. It was about this time of year and my 87 SC was in the garage. Engine going in (I was apparently concerned it may start raining):





Nearly finished:

FlippindaBird

iTrader: (10)

lol i just came in to look at a pic of how the wires are supposed to be routed and your pic is right here, thanks!

Grumbles

I meant these springs

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/NAL-12499224/

FlippindaBird

iTrader: (10)

is this the EGR solenoid or whatever?? i had it labeled "EGR" so im guessing it is... pluged into the front pass side of the carb... gonna have to get some vacuum plugs

FlippindaBird

iTrader: (10)

heres a pic of the progress so far... the old carb looks horrible on the new engine, but maybe ill get enough scratch for a SMI stage 3 rebuild black epoxy paint after xmas... deleting egr and AIR has helped clear some of the clutter, but theres still an amazing amount of wire under the hood lol got the carb installed and inspected all the plugs and vac lines... looks like ill be replacing a bunch of each... the weather has really taken its toll, but im happy with the progress i was begining to think i wasnt gonna get it in before the big snow came, cause once it comes its here for about 5 month and i sure dont wanna dig the car out to work on it lol

btw grumbles... those springs will work

naf

iTrader: (7)

EGR solenoid, yes.

Some of the clutter can be cleaned up by relocating the jumble of EVAP valves and solenoids over to the EVAP canister at the fender. Just run longer hoses from the carb to the canister and extend the wires going to the solenoid.

Tuck the connectors for AIR and EGR back into the harness somewhere.

Grumbles

Oh I know they'll work. I've been looking into it for some time. My question is more about how to go about removing them without cracking the block open.

FlippindaBird

iTrader: (10)

the valvesprings will come off without taking the heads off... you need a valvespring compressor tool, and some way to keep the valve from falling into the chamber... some ppl yous cord shoved into the chamber to pack it... there is also a fitting that connects to a compressed air line and air will hold the valve closed... do a search i know ive read several threads describing how other members have done it... i am def gonna tuck the extra wires into the harness, and ive already started, i mocked the wiring up to see where it went, and to see what i would be using and what was getting deleted, now its time to tuck and tape!! thanks for the advice for the vac lines... makes total sense ill def be doing it like that... happy holidays to all, no snow yet so the project isnt halted!!!!

FlippindaBird

iTrader: (10)

dam snow, i spoke too soon, has me dead in the water... should be getting up to 40 on friday but i have plans, maybe some of the snow will melt and i can dig out a work area on sunday... got some vac caps, i wanna get rid of the stock ac bracket that holds the PS anyone here know if i can just find a 87ish gm truck or car w/o ac and use that?? or is there anyway around using that dam bracket, i really dont wanna have to pull a header bolt for it... the sensor on the pass side of the thermo has 2 vac ports on it, 1 of mine broke... what does that sensor do and can i get away with deleting it completely or will i have driveablity issues? i figured since its broken why replace it if its not really helping with anything vital, i can just put a cap in there and do away with some vac lines

naf

iTrader: (7)

If you're working around headers with this bracket:



It can be trimmed to still fit, attaching to the first header bolt only. A spacer may need to be used for that front bolt.

The TVS (Thermal Vacuum Switch) on the water neck controlled the EFE (Early Fuel Evaporation) valve, which was in the pass side y-pipe and closed in order to direct exhaust gas through passages in the intake manifold. It warmed the fuel-air charge during cold weather warm up. You don't need it, obviously.

Oh, and I'm complaining about weather here in the 40's and 50's. Supposed to be near 70 this weekend and I need to take the just painted TA out in the sun to do the final polish with the buffer.

naf

iTrader: (7)

Random pic of current progress:



It should be warm enough tomorrow for me to complete the final buff and polish.

FlippindaBird

iTrader: (10)

lol @ 40/50... it was around 35 yesterday and today, and that is quite warm but weve been celebrating the new year... tomorrow if it doesnt rain im gonna go out and delete that tvs and do some other stuff ill get some pics up after, as for the bracket i didnt want to cut it because i will be reinstalling the AC in the future, and i really didnt want to just stick it on there as is, i think ill get to the JY and see if i can find something without ac that will work, but if i cant i guess ill just have to use the bracket as is... can i delete the PCV and just put a breather on it?? i got a cap for the carb and i think it would just look alot nicer... thanks again for everyones help

naf

iTrader: (7)

Nah, don't try to delete the PCV. It's a good thing.

FlippindaBird

iTrader: (10)

lol ok, i just thought it would look better without it, good because it keeps crankcase pressure down right?

btw naf, that black and gold beast is a sexy bitch

FlippindaBird

iTrader: (10)

SCORE!!!!! my wife is the best... i got 200$ saved up towards car parts, its complicated i got money for the bills, and money for my toys, i get it from side work and i havent had alot of side work lately... anyway i found a 02 SS 6spd 3.42 rear, with a girdle and aftermarket soli lower control arms for 375... talked to the guy and got hime down to 325, my wife gave me the extra 125 as a late xmas present!!! ill get some pics up when i go get it(its 5 hours from me)
havent gotten anything done to the car because its under 5" of snow and counting, hopefully ill get to finish up the engine bay before springtime ... either way i know ill be driving in the summer!!!

now for a question, since i have the aftermarket control arms, what would be the next item to be replaced in the rear suspension? panhard bar or torque arm? im planning WS6 sway bars all around in the future, and probably new stock replacement coils and shocks/struts all around in the future, i dont want to lower it i want a little clearance for street driving and i want to keep th stock geometry and just use stronger parts, im guessing just the better LCAs will be a big improvement over the stock 87 base model suspension... i will be buying these items piece by piece thats why the questions... ill probably bet getting LS1 front brakes to match the backs before any of that stuff though lol, just wondering what the next weakest link is in the rear after the LCAs...

btw anyone have an idea of what it should run with a proper tune with the new gears and posi, given that i can afford some decent tires by the time i hit the track lol im hoping low 13s high 12s with traction

Doom86

Respect for working on your project still Flippindabird, my pansy *** is hiding from the cold with half a motor under the hood. I went out a few days ago popped the hood, noted everything was still there as it was, and left it at that ..

Everyone who's tried them almost always recommends sub-frame connectors as a first/early suspension upgrade. I'm not a suspension guy but figured I would throw that out there for sake of discussion.

FlippindaBird

iTrader: (10)

lol i think im done for a little while now 7" of snow, but thanks lol yeah i got a good deal, included the LCAs for the cost of the rear $325 wasnt gonna say "no i need sfc first" lol so you think the next mod should be sfc? duly noted, the cheap ones are pretty reasonable but i want the hotchkiss or umi ones that are bent for the exhaust, def gonna get them used though lol im not paying retail !