Speed Racer X

Well, I guess this thread can serve as both the introduction and on-going clean-up, restoration thread for this car. This is my son's car that we've worked on buying for the last year. Together, this will be our project to bring this baby back to life. My son is 16 1/2 so he is anxious to drive this car come May. I am trying to make sure this does NOT become his DD.

My apologies in advance for the crappy and dark cell phone pix. I will add better pix as we start to clean the car up and move forward with certain fixes.

About the car:

This car was owned by one person before us. The car has 30,418 original miles. The car was last registered in 1999 so the car has been sitting exposed in a driveway since then. Very few miles, if any, were put on the car in the last 12+ years due to some personal issues the original owner went through (which I will not post, out of respect). Also, from what I understand, when new, the dealer took the car to Atco, made a couple of passes, and it ran 12.89 right off the showroom floor.

Unlike the other Red VHO you've seen in the magazines, this is an '89 and it had the two-tone delete so this car is all Black. This car also had slightly different VHO badging which I am working on making sure it's accurate.

Condition: For the car being exposed to the elements, the car is in amazing shape. There is little to no rust anywhere on the frame, doors, panels, wheel wells, etc. The engine runs and purrs as good as my '09 G8 does. Once warmed up, it idles smoothly at 650 RPMs. No smoke. Owner had synthetic everything in the car since new. Trans fluid was perfect, oil was perfect, supercharger oil was perfect. I do need to get the old gas out of it or just run some new gas through it. Does not have T-Tops so the interior is clean and musty-smell-free. Interior looks like the car is 2-3 years old. No sag in the doors. So far, all the electronics work, all of the instrumentation, all the lights and signals, etc. Original muffler and tailpipe are off the car and are like new.

So what does it need at first check-over? First and foremost, it needs to be cleaned REAL BAD. I need to remove 12+ years of dirt from the exterior and under the hood and in all crevices. Second is the paint. The car was repainted by the original Pontiac dealer under warranty due to fade or clouding a few years after it was purchased. I am hoping I can bring the paint back up to a nice shine. Headlights are a little hit or miss as far as going up and down; headliner is perfectly clean and rip free but needs to be glued back up; rubber tail is shot; rear hatch needs new struts; one of the hood gauges needs to either have the wires reattached or the gauge replaced; meth/water tank needs a small crack epoxied so it can be filled; figure out how the Carroll optional stereo system hooks back up; needs 1 WS6 silver wheel cap and some lug nut caps; the rubber window trim at the door level is cracked from exposure; and there may be a few other minor cosmetic things to address. Needs some WD40 or Silicone Lubricant here and there. I need to go over the brakes. Owner told me to check them out. When moving the car, they did feel a little weak.

Oh, we have to put all the Carroll VHO badging back on. Fortunately, the owner kept most of it!

So, overall, not too bad. Just needs some TLC.

So, here are the cell pix. Enjoy and feel free to ask any questions you want.

Speed Racer X

More Pix...

Speed Racer X

More...

puma1552

iTrader: (1)

VERY cool car...closer pics of those gauges in the hood? Those look awesome.

If you haven't already, invest in a Porter Cable 7424 XP orbital buffer, some good pads, and some good polishes and you can really bring that paint back to life without damaging it (orbitals are idiot-proof and bog down if you press too hard, unlike a rotary). Do that and see where you are at with the paint.

KMK454

Damn, that supercharger looks beautiful up in there... any idea what boost they were running? Looks like the motor is near all stock save for the supercharger.

puma1552

iTrader: (1)

Wait, so is this car 1 of 3?

http://www.highperformancepontiac.co...d/viewall.html

Though if it is, I'm curious how that works against this paragraph:

And if it really is that rare, please don't give it to a 16 year old kid, in any incarnation...



Beautiful.

InfernalVortex

iTrader: (4)

So this wasn't a factory option but a dealer package, right? So it has nitrous, a supercharger, and water injection?

TTOP350

iTrader: (8)

No, this isnt one of 1from 87 or 2 from 88. Its one of one from 89 and has ALL the options.(from Carrol supercharging) edited*
It has alky/water inj for the blower .
Dealer sold them but it was installed by Carroll supercharging
no NAAAAAWWWWWZZZZZZZ
I took one of these blowers off of a 30,000mile 91 formy..

puma1552

iTrader: (1)

Reading fail on my part.

Speed Racer X

I'll get better pix of the gauges soon but you can see the beautiful pic of them in the older magazine article with the Red VHO.

Yes, PC 7424 XP is on the VERY short list.

6 psi. 400hp/475tq (at the motor).

The magazine article is inaccurate. I spoke to Greg Carroll less than 6 months ago and he told me he did make 4 total.

'87 Silver prototype that he used to get dealers interested, which was eventually taken apart, driven as a DD, and then gone from what Carroll told me.

TWO '88s were made. Red one from magazine and the totalled white one.

This '89 all Black.


Thank you guys for the nice comments. Can't wait to clean this maybe this coming weekend.

TTOP350

iTrader: (8)

What fail??????
1 87, 2 88s and a 89.(I missed it earlier as I was told the proto car was a 88 but it makes sense that its a 87)
Car has all the options from Carroll super charging co. its not a fully optioned car from GM.

NufNuffZ28

iTrader: (10)

Very cool car!

I look forward to you bringing it back to 100%!

Dusk2600

Not gonna lie im Dying to know what you paid for this beautiful 1 of 4 made car

85_ZED28

Cool car!!!

Speed Racer X

Thanks! There are a lot of cool cars on this site. I'm glad I found this Forum.

Speed Racer X

Update. She's slowly coming back. LOL. Got the crumbling rear spoiler off, cleaned her out, vacuumed her thoroughly, and gave it her first bath in 12+ years. Haven't had a chance to clean under the hood yet.

I will work on the paint in the Spring. It's going to take a couple full days for me to bring the paint back up to snuff.

In the meantime, I am going to focus on little parts here and there that need cleaning or replacement. I want her to be as functional and original as possible. I also need to spend some time re-connecting the Carroll sound system and checking under the hood completely as I see a couple hoses disconnected for who knows what reason.

puma1552

iTrader: (1)

Interior looks to be in good shape, a good buffing will go a long way on that car...can/will Carroll restore the hood gauges?

Twin_Turbo

iTrader: (25)

I sent this to Greg Carroll. Awesome car.

Andrew James

iTrader: (3)

This car will likely have an interesting fate in the hands of a sixteen year old...

Speed Racer X

First gauge (manifold pressure) works great.

Second gauge (fuel pressure) is disconnected under the hood. I was told I should replace the gauge but I want to do some investigating first to see if it's really the gauge or not.

Third gauge (trans oil temp) works great. It will not rise by much due to the Carroll package having an auxiliary trans cooler mounted under the driver side of the car.

Orange bulb - not sure what that is yet. I think the owner added that. Shift light?

Tiny little LED light to far right - works great. It indicates (lights up green) when meth is being injected and you can "test it" from a button inside the car.

Plus, they are dirty still. I'll get to these soon. Also, the gauge plate for this car was not black like the Red car. It was raw-looking and not painted so there isn't much to restore other than to clean it good with some 0000 steel wool or #1/#2 metal polish.

Thanks! I am meeting Greg on Friday to see if he can help me with some questions I have on the car.

I'll make sure it won't but I completely understand your concern. I've already decided that this will not be his driver.

Twin_Turbo

iTrader: (25)

Worries me too...no good can come of that, what a shame

Twin_Turbo

iTrader: (25)

Tell Greg Marck said Hi

Speed Racer X

Will do!

Jim85IROC

iTrader: (2)

Awesome car you've got there, and it's well documented as well!

That PPI amp is probably worth more than most thirdgens!

chevymec

iTrader: (5)

Nice find!!

DAVECS1

iTrader: (2)

Ehh my dad let me buy a hot car for my first car, while it got dicey from time time to time, it never got wrecked, and it is eventually what led me to be a mechanical engineer. Keep him broke cause that it what motivated me to learn how the car work so i could fix it with the little money I had. The lure of a cool car is very powerful no matter what age you are :-)

My old man would give me the money to make it safe only after I had put the work in, and I never anticipated the money, cause it was not a sure thing. I remember having my 400 pontiac strewn form one end of the grage to the other. It needed pistons and some machine work. I was ready to just replace the pistons with broken ring lands and use a honing brush, but when i showed my dad what I had found and learned he help me get the short block done properly. That was a life changing event in my mind.

Skweezn87

I am curious as to WHY one would even consider this car to a new driver even when its not a DD...

91 Droptop

I have some nice 5 inch round PPI speakers to go with that amp

Speed Racer X

I had an awesome meeting with Greg Carroll yesterday. Truly a humbling event as I realized how much his car knowledge dwarfs mine.

I learned all about the history of these VHOs, how they function, pros & cons of various parts, how to check and diagnose various components, and exactly how they were created, including visually. I found out that mine had different exterior badging than the Red one. This black one also had mud flaps front and back. Fortunately, I now have just about every original piece needed to recreate it.

I saw some awesome original pictures of the '87 Silver Prototype, the Red '88, and the White '88. Then to both Greg's amazement and mine, we stumbled upon a picture of a Black Firebird. It's a close-up encompassing the A & B piller, top half of door to roof. It is brand new on dealer floor. We then noticed the "Carroll Supecharging Company, Riverdale, NJ" door handle insert piece that I have in my possession AND the window sticker is an identical match to the window sticker I have in my documents.


I'll keep you guys posted as we make additional progress.

DAVEY420

Awesome car with great history.

InfernalVortex

iTrader: (4)

You say you dont know what that "other" light is... maybe a shift light...

The invoice (?) sheet lists a "Concealed, Integrated, radar detection system"... maybe that's what that light is?

Speed Racer X

^ Thanks! It'll be cool when it's "done."

Long night. Just pulled out all the interior plastic so I can start properly rewiring the Carroll sound system. Original owner decided to do his own wiring and it wasn't pretty.

Took off the hood gauges for cleaning and to replace one. Took the disgusting hood liner off and threw it out.

Also started correcting some of the underhood wiring & hoses.

This is going to be a little bigger project than I first thought.

Speed Racer X

The original car didn't have that light so whatever it is, it's coming out shortly.

TTOP350

iTrader: (8)

Im wondering when you took the gauge plate off did you find black on the tabs that hold the plate to the hood?? Im betting the black has just faded off your plate. It happens to almost all of them.
I have a NOS plate if Carroll would make you a new plate. Also sent you a PM

Speed Racer X

Yes, it was black anodized originally. Saw it when I took it off and confirmed with Carroll.

Fortunately, Carroll gave me a couple gauge plate blanks from the original batch he made and backing plates that hold the gauges in place. They are shaped, anodized, and have the gauge holes already in them. I stopped at a local engraver on Friday. Will be bringing him a blank and the original engraved one to match exactly like the original MINUS the orange bulb hole that was not there originally.

Saw your PM. Be responding shortly! Thx!

Jason E

What a great story, and a great find. Enjoy. I've been selling cars for 11 years, and have sold more than my share of fast cars to young kids. If you put the fear of god in him, and have taught him respect over the years, he should take awesome care of that car, and have a lifetime of memories with it in short order.

Your car looks better than my 86 TA did when I bought it...and with a little time and effort (granted, I did have to repaint mine) it came out gorgeous. Looks like this one fell into the right hands...enjoy!

Speed Racer X

Update...

So the fuel pressure gauge was shot and I was wondering what to do about it and how I'd find something to match the originals. I got lucky and found a NOS VDO gauge on eBay exactly like the originals except it said "oil" instead of fuel. Turns out that Carroll also used an oil pressure gauge, opened it and blacked out the word "oil" and used it as the mechanical fuel pressure gauge. In the original gauge, I can see the paint where he blacked it out.

So I did the same. I received the gauge on Sat, opened it up Sat night, covered the "oil" word today and closed it up. Problem solved & exact match of the original.

Here's the pic.

1991Formula350

Wow, what a great story and an amazing car! Thanks for sharing this with the boards and good luck!

Bullydawg

iTrader: (7)

Sweet car! Are you going to upgrade to a fiberglass spoiler or find an original?

bradley23150

iTrader: (10)

Amazing car.

Subscribed.

Speed Racer X

My pleasure, thanks!

I'd love to say original if one can be found in decent shape but I'll probably just do the fiberglass.

Thank you Sir!

UPDATE: I'll try to get some pix on Sunday.

Interior plastic is out but on-hold until I finish up the engine compartment.

Engraved gauge plates should be done on Monday. I had the engraver do both blanks that I received from Carroll since once I paid for the "setup", the cost per piece to engrave was minimal.

Finished going over the engine enough to know what all the hoses and wires do and where they go. I can see where the "cut" ones go and which ones need to be refreshed. Also vaccumed out 12+ years of leaves and acorn nuts from the crevices in the top of the motor from chipmunks that lived in and destroyed the hoodliner.

Front bumper and most of the front sheetmetal pieces are off. A few rusty pieces are being either replaced with originals or refinished. Battery box is shot. Need to replace it.

Most of the supercharger piping and Carroll pieces are off the car for cleaning and polishing. Some of the Carroll add-ons are going back to Greg to be inspected, i.e. the meth injection valve and pump. Some other original parts will be ordered from Carroll too.

A few parts here and there are being replaced with originals. My goal is to make the car and its Carroll package as untouched and original as possible. People will tell me that there are better ways of rebuilding a car with all the knowledge we've accumulated since these cars were new. I get that but for this, my son and I are going for originality. There maybe 2 or 3 pieces that I can't avoid i.e. the front and center speakers but we'll see.

Once I get the car mechanically sound (which really isn't that far off since it ran well anyway); I'll move on to cleaning the engine bay, then rewiring the sound system, putting the interior back together, addressing some rusty parts in the rear-end of the car, then seeing if the paint will shine back up, then getting all the VHO badging back on.

We have a long way to go - maybe April/May till this is "done." Is it ever really done? LOL.

SKELITOR117

iTrader: (3)

WHAT!!? and I repeat, WHAT!!? This pretty much like the old yenko cars isn't it? Have anymore history in this car?

Speed Racer X

Update:

Had the spare original black anodized gauge blanks from Carroll engraved.

Just have to drill one little hole for the meth LED light.
The larger, non-original, shift light hole is gone.

TTOP350

iTrader: (8)

Reeeeal nice Clark, reeeal nice..

locutus918

did you make the plate to put gauges in i would like one for my formula to monitor diff things but cant find it i had my solid ones i put led lights in for on off indicators but gauges could give better info

TTOP350

iTrader: (8)

Just find a screen from a 82-84 RA T/A and build a bracket on the back side to hold the guages..

Speed Racer X

Happy Holidays Everyone!

Small update. I finally found out where the water injection module and low level warning buzzer are in the car.

Pretty cool design for 1988-89 and neat placement.







As far as the rest of this project: I've been accumulating any needed parts and my nephew did some media blasting of some of the front hood/bumper area pieces that were rusty (I should have them back this week). Have to wait till it warms up till I do any painting.

I am really at a standstill until I get the rusted battery tray out and the new one in. I've read threads here about how to do it but not sure if I'm up to that or not - I've never really welded anything. My Brother (who has all kinds of welding equipment) said I could borrow his 115/120V MIG welder that is all self contained (doesn't need gas and runs on household power). Maybe that'll work for this little job. I wish I knew where the OE tack welds were. Might make is a hair easier - at least as far as getting the old one off.

BlackenedBird

iTrader: (5)

The G in MIG is gas. If it doesn't use gas, then it is just a wire feed arc welder, not a MIG. My 120 MIG is all "self contained" but has a small bottle on the back of it & a special type of wire is used for those non-gas wire-feed welders.

Speed Racer X

So then, in Top Gun style, "the data on the MIG is inaccurate." LOL.

Sorry, I know next to nothing about welders(ing).
I do know it's wire-fed and needs no gas - something used & cheap my Brother picked up at a yard sale that he fixed, it works, and given that we won't be driving this car till April/May, I only have household voltage, and it's a fairly thin, simple piece - this might just do the trick.

TTOP350

iTrader: (8)

I have a battery tray that I cut out and have the surrounding metal spotweld drilled. Ill try and take pix of the spot welds 2maro 4 ya..