321FormulaGuy

I have a slight concept idea on what I want to do on my 1990 Firebird Formula. I would like some opinions and advice and whatever else I can get

I attached a photo of what my car looks like now.

To start off the ideas I had I will go with the external asthetics.:
-Switch to a Daytona hood with functioning louvers
-Tinted windows
-Foose Rims(not sure what ones yet, might even go with other brands if they catch my eye right.)
-Different front bumper with two openings that i can feed air filters to.
-Camaro Z28 High rise wing
-rear window louvers(already have)
-Change paint color to Tuxedo Black wit accents of Midnight blue.
- Exhaust com out the sides of the car. Kind of how the cars in FF6 had.
- lower front end a little and add biger tires to the back.
- Inside I will switch the steering wheel I have with a better Grant chain steering whell.
- No back seats
-Black carpet
-black headliner
- black and blue racing front seats.
-blue 5-point harnesses
- custom pedals(manul pedals)

Now more of the performance side.

-Swap my 350 for a Pontiac 455 with forged parts and bore it out to maximum potential.
-Swap to possibly a Muncie 4-speed or a 6-speed that will fit the engine.
-Performance drive shaft
-Limited slip differential
- 3.73 gears
Anti-lock brakes with slotted and drilled discs and big callipers
- Super charger
- two cold air intakes directly in the front bumber.
-electric fans for radiator.
-High quality radiator.

That's all I got at the moment. I had more ideas but I can't pull them out of my head at the moment haha.

So Lets here what peoe think and any part suggestions or advice or critisism or anything!

Bob88GTA

iTrader: (2)

So I guess for starters, looks like money is not an issue?
Don't forget to budget in all the suspension components/upgraded mounts/SFC's/steering components/ect.

PS: "steering wheel I have with a better Grant chain steering wheel"
NOTE: Gonna tear the he@# out of you hands and fingers when that puppy gets loose on ya and you try and save it!!!! Might want to stick with a smooth grip wheel.

Go for it

321FormulaGuy

Well with the chain I meant, I guess you can say the spokes of the wheel be chains but it actually be smooth.

And yea since this is just a concept, Money isn't exactly an issue.

And for the suspension I was thinking air ride suspension. What do you think would be good?

321FormulaGuy

Anyone else have anything to add?

NowhereFast

Yeah, it doesn't sound like a tasteful endeavor.

321FormulaGuy

Reason being?

Linson

i agree with _Nick_ - it doesnt sound like a tasteful endeavor. reason being that some of the choices in this concept, in the mind of this seasoned Third Gener (who is all about performance modifications) do not sound to be in good taste, nor do they seem to make financial sense. not trying to go negative on your ideas and i dont know what your Third Gen/hot rodding experience is, just want to offer my perspective based on my experience.

sounds like you might be new to Third Gens. a Formula hood is going to be very hard (impossible) to improve upon. there are some very high end Formula builds on this site and elsewhere, most of whom retain the factory Formula hood - and those who dont, a strong argument can be made that it is not an asthetic improvement.

now, i can see how (say, if you were to keep the flat black "murder" look, how the rear window louvers and Daytona hood could work. but, if you were to go with pretty paint... ya know, sleek is the montra when it comes to a Formula. bulky hoods and other accessories (louvers, high rise wings) detract from the car's sleekness.

i always tint my windows. personally, i stay away from the really dark tint, not because it is illegal, but because you feel stupid for having it when you are trying to back up at night or see in your periphery with the windows up.

. generally, Chip Foose wheels look like **** on just about everything i've seen them on. they detract from the muscle car attitude of every muscle car i've seen them on. they are always too tall, too skinny, and too...decorative. i dont know about others here, but my opinion - generally, Corky ,er, um, Chip Foose and his wheels suck a d!ck. so to generally (not specifically) state that you want his wheels on your car seems, well, odd.

. in the end, i dont think that sounds practical, tasteful, nor economical. although, if you remove the bumperets, you would have two elongated rectangular openings...

my opinion - probably wouldnt look good. judging from all your proposed asthetic modifications thus far, all indications are that you were looking for a Camaro and happened upon a Firebird Formula. if this is the case, it would make more sense financially and in the interest of your happiness with the end result that you bail on the Formula and find a Camaro project.

visually, i think these work better on a Camaro.

not sure where you'd be putting these accents, but midnight blue accents on a black car, i think, would be very hard to notice.

.

theres a right way and a wrong way...

mkay. terrible, obviously.


i'm just going to tackle this subject as a single item rather than line by line, but on swapping your L98? for a Poncho 455....why would you do that? who told you that was a good idea? you're talking about retrofiting an engine that hasnt been produced since the mid seventies. for the cost of a blown 455 (that aint gonna fit under a Daytona hood btw/might not even fit between the fender wells [Pontiac blocks arent as big and heavy as a Big Block Chevy, but they're wide]) with aftermarket forged internals, ect. and if your going to do all that, i would assume you want heads and a cam and everything else... you could get a modern LS engine. for the money, and performance, that would make a helluva lot more sense. bolting up a set of headers to Pontiac heads in a Third Gen engine bay...i shudder to think. for a street car, the supercharged Poncho, it doesnt make any sense. for a 1/4 mile track car, it might make some sense if it wasnt hard to retro-fit, but then for that, the 4-speed manual transmission doesnt make alot of sense.

if you are serious about this or any other Third Gen project, my advise to you is to heed the advise of people on this site (not me, necessarilly) but i think that nine out of ten people here would tell you that the approach you have in mind is not likely to end in success. also, if you are serious about this or any other Third Gen project, and you are serious about asking for advise and listening to that advise, people need to know how much money you have right now to spend on said project. its very important. otherwise, its all pipe dreams.

Joe Tag

iTrader: (4)

Harsh Linson, but the truth hurts sometimes. I agree with most of it except the need for dark tinted windows and louvers in Florida, I lived in Ft Lauderdale and it's brutal this time of year.

Bob88GTA

iTrader: (2)

cal30_sniper

iTrader: (16)

Daytona hood: Please don't. You have the formula hood already. If you just have to have something different, grab a factory T/A hood or a Ram Air I style fiberglass hood.

Foose rims: What? Overly priced, and like Linson said, ugh. Not for our cars. Judging by your post and your starting car, I'm going to go out on a limb and say your budget isn't quite as unlimited as you'd like to lead on. In the interest of funding, I'd look into some 4th Gen, Vette, or BMW rims in the 17-18" range with supporting rubber. Best value out there, hands down, and a lot of them look pretty good too.

Bumper: I get your drift here. I don't like the 85-90 Firebird bumper on 95% of the cars out there. I much prefer the 91-92 style. Should be a bolt on swap, and will clean up your looks some. You also already have two large openings to run cold air intakes. They are right in front of the front tires inside the fenders. Run it SLP style and relocate your battery to the trunk.

Camaro Wing? Again, the 91-92 spoiler is one of the cleanest out there. The key to these cars is sticking with what could have come from the factory.

Window louvers, look terrible on most cars. There's no real need for them either. Get a 5% tint on the back window and roll on.

Paint: I'm liking the black, not the blue. These cars generally don't do well with accents and other garbage. Keep it classy.

Exhaust: Don't even think about side exit. Looks amazingly stupid on anything other than a properly done C2 or C3 vette, or some other car that came with them FACTORY (Shelby Cobra for example). Get you a good catback and be done with it.

Lowering, good. Just don't go nuts.

Steering wheel. WHY would you want to put a chain style steering wheel on a 3rdGen!? Taste, Taste, Tasteful. The deluxe T/A wheel is the most comfortable thing you'll find out there for our cars. AND it won't look like garbage. They're frequently available on ebay for not too much.

Black interiors are sweet. Keep it black though. Don't jack it up with blue garbage.

Custom pedals belong mostly on ricers. With a black interior, hide those suckers down there with black rubber covers. Again, keep it clean.

Drivetrain: Back to the drawing board. The poncho is heavy, hard to find parts for, expensive, and going to be a real pain to shoehorn in. Not to mention manual trans options are limited and expensive.

LS Swap it. T56 will bolt right up. Light, powerful, and the ceiling is your limit for performance mods.

Pick up an aftermarket rear to go with it.

Run one of the brake upgrades from bigbrakeupgrade or flynbye front and rear. I went with C5 brakes, and I'm very happy with them. Anti-lock is not necessary, and would be extremely hard to implement in your car. Highly impractical.



Overall, I think your ideas need some serious revision. If you built this (which I really doubt you have the funds to do), you'd have something incredibly tasteless. I'm not saying it would be the most tasteless thing I've ever seen on these boards, but it would be close. Lets not have another Generation Y situation on our hands here, please. Our cars need all the help they can get to finally gain some respect in the collector car and muscle car community. Every attempt like this just makes that a little harder to obtain.

Benc1

iTrader: (10)

I just want to know how money isn't an issue. What does 321FormulaGuy do for a living and are they hiring. I have a pretty good job and don't owe anyone anything but still have a hard time finding money to fund my car hobby.

Bob88GTA

iTrader: (2)

I agree Benc1, same boat here. I did plant one of those money trees you get at Lowes 25 years ago, but I guess it takes awhile before it "produces!"

Another thing I found out over the years.........

"As you age, your priority changes drastically and you change your lifestyle to accommodate that priority."

Just say'n

Joe Tag

iTrader: (4)

I think the idea behind the money is no object thing is dreams are free. The title does include the word concept. Reality sets in quick when the project really starts. Priorities change and ones standards are lowered.

Linson

not for nuthin' but should'nt his car already have a limited slip differential and electric fans?

before we scare FormulaGuy off, if we havnt already, i would say we've done him a favor. i think people here were rightfully critical of his ideas, but if he can handle the righteous critisism, then there is a bit of good news. the good news is that his idea for a project is in poor taste asthetically, and virtually unworkable mechanically, BUT there are alot smarter, better, and more workable ways to make something special out of a 1990 Formula - and for a lot less than the limitless money it would take to undertake his original idea.

speaking of money, i doubt that the OP has it in spades, and i think he mentioned in i prior post that this was all just in the day dreamin' phase.

judging by 321FormulaGuy's conceptualization of the mechanics of the car, i feel safe in saying that he probably is inexperienced or limited in his automotive experience. (it almost seems as though he got some bad advise from an older friend or relative who still believes that, for all intents and purposes, automotive performance died in the early seventies.) anyhow, i would like to point out that there is absolutly nothing wrong with being inexperienced or limited in automotive performance/maintenance - and FormulaGuy, you have come to the right place for the best advice on doing something with any Third Gen, because there are people here who a) have done it, and b) love Third Gens.

so, to FormulaGuy, i would say that if/when you are ready to seriously go from the pipe dream phase to actually doing something with your car there are people here who would be glad to help, and not to stifle your creativity and individualism, but also try to keep you from doing something that would look bad. when you're ready to do this, a snapshot of your financial situation, plus several detailed pictures of the car would be very helpful.

if you're gonna be in the day dream phase for a while, people can help with that too - and the help you're getting advises you to scrap the whole idea you came with and go back to the drawing board.

RedLeader289

iTrader: (2)

This animation made me laugh out loud, literally.

Bob88GTA

iTrader: (2)

Isn't that funny! First time I seen it, I did the the same; spit coffee every where! I said, "gotta have that!"

Then I found this one for the on and on arguments.....

OK............

RedLeader289

iTrader: (2)

fantastic! haha. ok, I agree,

321FormulaGuy

Thank you to everyone for all the advice and criticism! It did open my eyes and no offense was taken! So I will go off to the drawing boards again and yes this is just a "pipe dream" at the moment. But again thank you all for the advice!

Joe Tag

iTrader: (4)

Though I don't want to convince you any of your concept was a good idea, It all boils down to this, it's your car do what you want with it. NONE of us have to look at or drive your car every day. Make yourself happy with your build, not people on the internet. All of the posts telling you of the problems you will encounter are real. All of them telling you what looks best are opinions, and like @$$holes, everybody has one. I personally am a fan of the OEM and restomod approach. I think it's is difficult to improve on the looks of our cars off the showroom floor.

cal30_sniper

iTrader: (16)

Joe, while I agree with your premise, it goes a bit deeper than that. True, each of our cars are our individual creation, and if everyone thought the same way, there would be a very finite variations of 3rdGens that exist, which would be no fun for anyone. However, a large part of this hobby is the community enjoyment found through get-togethers, both small and large. The easiest way that I've seen to get laughed out of a local car club is to show up with something so heinous that nobody can take it seriously. While individual creativity is still the main goal, there are limits to what the majority of enthusiasts in the community see as acceptable or not. Staying inside those boundaries will ensure a much more enjoyable experience for ForumlaGuy when his car is finally finished.

As an aside, I too really like the idea of a 455 Poncho in a 3rdGen. In todays world though, it just isn't a cost effective or practical swap when 5.3s and 6.0s are out there a dime a dozen and can be made to make far more power with so little investment. Heck, it's really not even worth building a SBC anymore if you're starting from scratch.

Joe Tag

iTrader: (4)

Just saying if his plan is to please others, build the car to their suggestions. If he does this and it is not what his heart sings for, will HE ever be pleased with it? Possibly. He may grow to realize it was a bad plan from the start. He may always still be longing for what he first thought up. Only he can decide that. I felt pain for him with every negative comment here. People can be cruel, even moreso when they can do it from behind a monitor. I hate the Daytona hood, if I had the money to, I would buy every one of them up and kill them with fire just so I don't have to look at another. There are people that love them. Who are we to say they're wrong in what they like?