3rdBird

iTrader: (1)

My question is which is better and why? BTW not trying to stir the pot.
Stock/Spohn Susp -vs- 4 Link or ladder Bar. Whats your 60' & what you got?

greezemonkey

iTrader: (14)

Depends on what the car is for, Stock suspension will limit your tire size... so for quick 8/16 and bracket racing you wont have the consistency at a competitive level. Will SS go fast and hook, yes but not as often/consistent as a big tire car. Most aftermarket stock suspension are very adjustable but are limiting compared to 4 links, obviously there are some exceptions, david wolfe comes to mind.

I`m stock suspen, spohn arm, dbl adj trailing arms, qa1 coil overs,mini tub and its been high 1.2`s and has settled between 1.30 and 1.35 this year with a nitrous converter 29 tires and 4.11

ZONES89RS

iTrader: (2)

Best 60 from a stock style 82-02 suspension is a 1.16 so i dont know if it really matters unless it is pure drag perhaps.

AlkyIROC

Stock style suspension retains all the factory sheet metal making it a direct swap. Ladder bars will require mild sheet metal work and a proper 4-link will require a complete back half.

The main differences are the adjustability. Not all cars run identical setups and not all tracks are the same so adjustability makes the suspension more useful.

With stock style suspension, there's very little adjustments available. Ladder bar isn't much different. With a 4-link, there are many different adjustments but only a small handful are useful.

All 3 styles are useful but as which is better really depends on how you want to use the car. I started with upgraded factory style suspension. I swapped in ladder bars when I installed a 9" because it was the easiest way to go. When I finally decided I wanted a big tire, I did a back half with 4-link. It took a few years to determine where the best 4-link setting was and now that I have a setting I like, I don't change it but I do play around with shock settings depending on track conditions.

There's no reason a 12 second car needs to be back halved with a big tire but doing that allows for future power upgrades. Just because someone brags about a small tire car running very quick times doesn't mean a whole bunch. It's usually done on a very well prepped track during a specific competition. For the average bracket racer, such a car wouldn't go many rounds.

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

better tell five7kid to quit going rounds in his 2 stock suspension thirdgens...and i think his 57 is still stock suspension too...

you can't say that a stock style suspenion car can't go rounds in a bracket racing situation when the MOST WINNINGEST member on this board is a S/S small tire car.

Shagwell

Easy now Matt. Being a good bracket racer doesn't neccessarily mean having the most consistent car. - A simple glance at this year's posts shows the big tires average to be noticably more consistent, though one may have better luck "judging the stripe".

I'll agree with what greeze and alky posted. Both can be fast, though one is more "user friendly" and is less suceptable(sp?) to changing tracks/conditions.

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

i will grant you, that if you're trying to do bracket/index racing where rules allow any chassis mods, that a four link/big tire will be far more consistent...especially in the 60'. alot of these big tire cars have a 60' spread of .005 or better. my drag radial/SS car isn't even that fast, and it's got a .05 spread on any given day. i'm trying to make it more consistent to the 60' markers now, but would rather not backhalf as it would limit what i could do with the car later.

xpndbl3

iTrader: (5)

yes all the 13 second and 12 second BIG tire cars have it locked down. Good for them Nothing more entertaining than hearing a cackling big block open headers from a mile away with a huge backhalf struggle to do a burnout then run a blistering 12.20 all day.

I'm glad there's a lot more 10.5 competition at our tracks and the big tire cars are disappearing besides the old time bracket guys. Tire technology sure has come a long way and most of them aren't needed anymore. Also more big tire cars crash in bracket races than small tire cars from the last statistics I saw on a local board. Harder to keep the tire loaded and not shove the car in the wall if you're stabbing the brakes on the big end, or lifting and getting back on it.

AlkyIROC

When I'm talking about going rounds, I'm talking about the small tire 7,8,9 second cars usually on a drag radial. Although they can be very fast, a typical bracket race track prep won't usually be good enough for them to go rounds. You race on the surface provided. If you can't hook up with a high HP, small tire because you're limiting yourself to a small tire and you feel you don't need a bigger tire, you're not going to go many rounds without a lot of luck.

Even with my big tires, I've lost traction but it was also on a very poorly prepped and cold track. With moderate prep, I can pull the front wheels and stay in it all the way down the track. I have no idea what the car could do with a well prepped track. I've never had the chance to run on one.

xpndbl3

iTrader: (5)

Just stating what it's like around here, we're VERY fortunate to have 4 tracks within 3 hours driving and they all have a good prep system in place. Saturday morning I ran when it was 42 degrees out and hooked the entire way down the track. We had a few 8 second passes when temp hit 50 outside.

Shagwell

10.5w's are what I consider a big tire, though I have run bigger in the past. Even during a typical tnt/street night at my local track my 60 foot rarely varies more than .02, and that's when I'm changing the set-up and the power. If I leave the power alone it won't change more than .01. - We've got a local pro mod racer who has run in the 4.0x-3.9x range pretty consistently in pro mod trim with a clutch car. He made two 60' hits and then one full pass on 10.5w's and ran within .1 of his normal times on the 17x34.5's.

Tire technology has for sure come a long way in the past 10 years. Often, the comon "old school" sizes won't work as well as a newer smaller tire as the technology/construction/compound of the older size has not changed.

As noted by xpndbl3, in lowered power cars and especially with the old school 3-6psi of air, the big tires are considerably less stable on the big end. IMO after having run everything from a 275/50 DR to a 16x33.5 slick, if you're running less than 9psi of air in a door car you're not running the right tire and/or your converter/gearing isn't right for it. - I've run 15x33.5's and 16x33's on the camaro as well as the 10.5's; even with the same air pressure they're not nearly as stable at speed and even after trying a few different chassis adjustments they're not any faster either. Since I get 50+ consistent runs out of the W's, I see no point in the larger tires.

AlkyIROC

I usually run 8 psi in my 32 x 16's

DIGGLER

iTrader: (1)

1.312 is my best 60' so far on the goodyear 275's hitting it with a 100 shot right off the brake. stock style suspension, no minitubs. going to try and get the car out again this weekend so i can turn the 2nd stage on. might get into the 1.2x's finally!

if your local track prep sucks, go with slicks over the radials. when i was on 28x10.5's i could bomb it with whatever i wanted until it went on the bumper. the radials will go up in smoke MUCH easier. and they do not recover.

xpndbl3

iTrader: (5)

diggler what's raceweight? you obviously have it WAY lighter than I do. Running out of stuff to remove out of this car I supposed. Keeping heat and wipers/radio since it's my street car as well.

DIGGLER

iTrader: (1)

i havent scaled it recently, but its in the ballpark of 3075-3100ish. i think.
it still has the rear bumper support, doors are unmolested with power mirrors/windows/locks still intact, rear hatch pulldown still works, headlights still function like stock, and its got all the interior panels/headliner/carpet.

ZONES89RS

iTrader: (2)

I need to weigh mine as well, i was at 3450 with the stock 90 RS, this thing has less "stuff", AC and what not, but still heat and wipers, radio and then the T56 weighs more than the T5, the Moser 12 weighs more than the 10 bolt, so i have no idea where i might be, but i assume 3300, 3200 if i am lucky.

JesasaurusRex

iTrader: (3)

If u have an 8.50 or slower car you have absolutley no business on anything bigger than a 28x10.5 non W...none.

As for the question, 4 link > ladder bar > SS

Shagwell

I'd put a tq arm car over ladder bars any day. I've threatened to build a "pro mod" tq arm system for my car more than once.

83 Crossfire TA

iTrader: (2)

The fact is that I doubt that anyone can show any significant advantage in 1/4 mile time/launches with any of the 3 in the same vehicle with the same tires on it. Sure, you might have an easier time going consistently fast on more rubber, but if you're comparing the 3 there is no point in comparing them on rubber that you can't run on all 3 setups.

I would argue that everything else being the same, its easier to make a torque arm work well at that track and on the street (or even a road course) then the other 2, and that designed correctly, an aftermarket TA setup should be able to do anything at the strip that the others can, possibly better. Of course, the disadvantage there is that if you're going to go that far with it, the TA setup is more work than the other 2.

Shagwell

Agreed, especially when talking a street/strip car. If you set-up a 4-link for launch, it won't handle for crap, due to roll steer. - A properly set-up tq arm does not have that issue.

Forget ladder bars for street all together.

Forget ladder