mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

looks like my season is done too unless i can come up with something (not that it really matters, i'm not racing much anyway right now).

was chasing a noise that sounded like a lifter noise. pin-pointed it to what i thought was the converter/flexplate after some investigation. turns out that it has some serious front/aft crank endplay...like a 1/4"...so i guess i'm done with this motor, lol!

with the block/mains already being repaired once and the crank having been cut twice, i'm not sure i'm going to reuse this block/crank...ugh...

Shagwell

Really sucks to hear this man. Car has run so well for quite some time, really makes it odd that it killed the thrust like that.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Lsx stock stuff is cheap enough find another crank. Hope block is ok but 6.0's can be found.

Sucks to hear man. I havent been problem free this yr myself

unknown_host

iTrader: (1)

That sucks do you think you have had it for a while but can hear it better with the full exhaust, or is it brand new?

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

I heard this very noise one time before at the track after I had driven it to the track. It only happened once after it was good and hot so I just assumed the oil was hot causing the lifters to act up or something. I didn't hear it again till this week. And since it came and went i wasn't too worried about it. Ugh, ah well....

DIGGLER

iTrader: (1)

you running a transbrake?

1gary

You know I am a cheap seats fan.Sorry to hear about your problem.With that much end play,you would think the crank pulley(s) would be throwing off belts like crazy. But it sound like your in a mode of nothing to lose,so maybe you keep racing until the end of the season...............

project89

iTrader: (1)

check out king engine bearings they make special main bearings with a thicker thrust area if the thrust area on the crank is worn this may get u to be able to finish out the season

ZONES89RS

iTrader: (2)

That is crazy, wonder what caused it? My stocker is still doing great, been 3 years of a **** whooping and now it is in the TA. With my luck, everyone having issues, hope the bad luck for me was wrecking the 89 RS and nothing happens to the TA.

You going to go ahead and pull it out?

GTA matt

iTrader: (1)

From some things I have seen, you arent the first person to kill the thrust bearings on an LS. Seems the most common cause is transmission pressure or torque converter related. A few good threads on YB a few months ago in the LS section about it if you do some digging. Sucks for sure.

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

hmmm....will be worth looking into.

i may be changing some stuff up as i really want to drive this thing more often. i'm done for the season for sure. i don't have time to fix it now. anyway, some of this stuff will likely be up for grabs

DIGGLER

iTrader: (1)

my first thought is transmission related. too much line pressure or something like that. buddy of mine went through 3 teardowns last year due to the same thing. wound up being too much pressure in the transmission if im not mistaken. the car would come off the line throwing sparks out of the flexplate area. i believe the flexplate was coming in contact with the block or some other thing.

ZONES89RS

iTrader: (2)

What may change Matt? The TA will be fun with the th400 at the track, but the want to drive the sob will have me looking into a 4l80 soon as possible.

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

i'm really thinking about slowing it down some (with like a jy 5.3) for a little while and putting a 6 speed or something in it, then fix the 6.0 and put it back in with the 6spd. do more driving and quick 8 type stuff, and slow down on bracket racing some.

zz17iroc

iTrader: (4)

Man I just replied to your exhaust post. Sorry to hear that, Matt. I finally purchased my block for my new big ci small block. How does 434 ci sound. Man I can't wait. Got to love NA motors. Oh yeah and some giggle juice every now and then!

ZONES89RS

iTrader: (2)

Sound like you are where I am Matt, love my 6 speed, but the 6.0 was getting old in a daily driver, maybe I am getting old, so the 4.8 with small edelbrock cam and ported heads will be easier on fuel an be a fun experiment for a street car. Not more drag racing in a camaro besides checking results and tuning, the TA will be the straight line car now.

Thought about having two third gens? It is easy to justify for the significant other if they are like my wife, she loves the TA, and doesn't care what I do to it really, lol.

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

well, i have a 71 chevelle that my wife and i are working on together, and that will be the "street cruiser".

i have a specific goal set for the car, i just don't know if i can get there from here:

-street drive as much as possible
-street drive to the track and beat on it
-130mph on motor
-street car quick 8 type events
-once i get comfortable with it i would like to be able bracket and index race some, but not every weekend kind of thing.
-complete drag week

i want to put something with less power in the car so i can get the car set up and so i can learn how to go down the track with a clutch type trans since the fastest thing i've ever driven down the track with a manual was a mostly stock lb9 car, lol. a jy 5.3 with my cam/heads/intake/carb would probably work just fine. then get the 6.0 fixed or do a 408.

again, i'm just bench racing right now...and i appreciate any input from my tgo family!

1gary

Since you brought this thrust bearing to light,I have been doing searches to see what I can find.One thing that might apply to you is ballooning of the t/c applying pressure to the thrust bearing. Does that t/c have anti-ballooning plates welded??.

As you plan to repair or replace the current engine,I found that the O.E.M. aluminum blocks are good up to f/w 800 hp and then after that they experience block defection.

You defiantly got my interest/curiously going. Please do let me know what you found and the solution and I will continue with the searches.If I find a useful link I will post it.

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

it's an iron 6.0 block, started out as an lq4 but has forged rods and pistons, stock crank.

the torque converter is a Transmissions Specialties 9" XHD unit with a thick billet anti ballooning cover. i am not anywhere near the HP rating on that converter.

i have read something about trans line pressure being higher than oil pressure and causing a thrust bearing wipe out issue. something about the entire converter pushing against the crank due to high line pressure (as in, not just the front cover of the converter). not sure if that's my issue, since it seems to be more prevalent in turbo applications.

ZONES89RS

iTrader: (2)

Well Matt, if you score a t56 built, sweet, if you get a stock t56, go ahead and build it first. The 6 speeds built shift like butter and I have missed 3rd possibly 3 times in a the 3 years it was together. Never at the track though! Hardest part is finding the happy setup that does not big nor spin when coming off the 3rd pedal, wish I took the car to the track with the texralia 700, but the fluid would get hot on the street, the centerforce never did that. Double OD is awesome.

If you did the swap right now, you would probably with no choice, slow down, I'm sure you know. You would need more power to get the ET and mph you want, but the mileage and fun factor on the street is great.

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

i'm thinking of going with something straight from tick performance or liberty trans. i want to know more about faceplated stuff and how it is on the street.

87 t/a, any input from you would be appreciated!

built91Z28

Gett

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

?

built91Z28

Lol, sorry, stupid "smart phones". On the computer now.

What I was going to say is, getting the car to hook is more difficult with the manual, but so much more fun. As soon as I went from a TH350 with 3500 stall to the 6 speed, I had much more traction problems. But the car is 1000 times more fun to drive now. If you plan on doing more street driving with the car now, I would definitely go 6 speed.

built91Z28

Does really suck to hear about the motor though.

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

thanks man. yeah i'm in contact with a guy at Tick Performance right now and we're discussing options, but no decisions have been made yet....

sailtexas186548

iTrader: (2)

http://texasdrivetrainperformance.com/

was significantly cheaper than tick last time I looked into it

Shagwell

Yes he has a trans brake. Line pressure is under 200psi(iirc 140ish). I don't honestly remember if the converter feed is restricted or not, but it's a stock input shaft, stator, & bushings thus it's not a known need. - Converter is an XHD with a full-face anti-ballooning plate.

ZONES89RS

iTrader: (2)

Face plating is not needed usually, that is for getting into the 8-9 second world and makes street driving less fun. A rebuild like I did with carbon Kevlar syncros, billet keys, brass sliders and steel 3/4 fork made it stout to 750 hp. Beyond that, a viper input and output would have bumped it to 900, so face plating is in the high end and track only options 95% of the time. There are those street cars that rarely hit the track out here that are without face plating that hit well over 1000 rwhp, just to give you a idea. When consistency and the stakes are high, face plating surely has its place. Otherwise you double clutch you but off every gear driving on the street and kill your clutch leg.

86iroc2try

Sorry matt...always a shame when those damn engines make noises!!

I think youll enoy the 6spd...more fun on the street and better gas mileage. Win win!!

Im no streetcar guy though..swapping my 4.10 gears to 4.33s to try for a 9.9x or 9.8x pass. If it doesnt rain friday night im going grudge racing. ;-)

Good luck with the car!!!

InfernalVortex

iTrader: (4)

theres a lot of videos of guys running faceplated transmissions on the street. Seems like most say it's not a big deal once you learn how... and then they only drive the car on weekends. Seems like regardless of how easy it is to use or get used to it will affect your enjoyment of the car in commuting traffic. Plus I've heard a few things about them not lasting long in a daily driven car, but Im not sure if that was in reference to "Proshifted" or faceplated, as Im thinking there's a difference.

Theres a lot of videos of guys running facepalted transmissions on youtube. Seems like a PITA to downshift and rev match and double clutch and all that jazz. It can be done, even easily, but it takes away from the no stress cruising of a real cruising car.

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

well, i've been talked out of a faceplated trans by the guy at Tick.

i'm trying to figure out what clutch to go with, and the more i think about it, the less i feel like doing an "intermediate" engine, and i just want to fix my 6.0

ZONES89RS

iTrader: (2)

Junkyard 6.0 while you build the other...

Thinking out loud. Sure the car would be down longer converting to manual than fixing the engine?

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

Yeah, it'll be down longer probably, but worth it.

DIGGLER

iTrader: (1)

ive had a 6 speed for 13 years now. would do a 4l80. lol

1gary

Sure seems to me there is a cause of this problem and by just replacing the bearings is a temporary fix until that set wears down. Any chance this is a prime time to replace the crank/rods with a aftermarket??.

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

I have not made any decisions on the motor itself yet. I am going to fix it, whatever that may entail. The rods are forged h-beams already. Hoping they didn't take too much of a beating. The crank is stock. These cranks have been proven good to 1000hp. No need to go with an aftermarket crank. If this crank is bad I will replace it. If the block itself is bad AND the crank is bad, then I will probably put a junkyard 5.3 in its place while I come up with a long term solution.

1gary

Entertainment or information.Not sure.But a worth while read either way.

http://www.enginebuildermag.com/Arti...potential.aspx

Might be a safe way to go faster without take it to the limits.

87_TA

Sorry Matt, Just saw all of this and sorry to hear of your problems! That sucks, but its also the sport we choose I guess.. That is a huge amount of thrust, Have you cut open filter yet?

As for the faceplate - Well Liberty is the only on who faceplates, anyone else like Tick and others send gears to Liberty to get done.
I have no issues and like my faceplated trans on street - You just need to take care when shifting - So if normal driving either double clutch or shift very slow to allow more RPM drop.. Lately I don't even use clutch while slow street driving, when rpm are close it falls right in with no noise or effort..

Down shifting, Pull out of gear to neutral, release clutch, rev + 1500ish clutch and pull next lower gear.. +3k if going 2 gears..

That is nice smooth, noiseless shifting - Of you can just pull it like you are racing and deal with the clunk.

ZONES89RS

iTrader: (2)

Pita if you don't need it if you ask me. When I was younger I would probably give two sheots less.

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

well, it's not a daily, but i think jumping from very little stick experience into a faceplated trans might be a bit tough (as far as street driving is concerned) and it's an expensive upgrade so i'm going to hold off now. i can always get them to redo it later.

ZONES89RS

iTrader: (2)

Sure can, I you were closer to me you probably would have driven my car before I wrecked it and had a idea of how it felt with the mild rebuild. Smooth business.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Plus doesnt liberty take monthsss to get a trans done? Tommy werent you waiting awhile for yours?

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

yeah, i've heard/read that too.

oh, out...

87_TA

All true statements... But when you shift it you cant help but smile If going to Liberty, you WILL be their last priority.. Guess you can do that when you are in demand.

ZONES89RS

iTrader: (2)

Well, wish I had a hoist long enough to allow me to pull from the front...jelous.

1gary

That dead blow hammer is....................LOL

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

Well, I found the cause of the failure: the pilot adapter for the converter that tci includes with there flexplate broke in half right where it steps down to go into the crank. This caused the converter to become ever so slight offcenter and wiped out the thrust bearing. Well, that's my theory anyway, until I open the bottom end up. The converter and trans look great and are for sale!

Jim85IROC

iTrader: (2)

Don't overlook the t56 Magnum. That's what I'm going with. 700hp rating, and better high rpm shifts due to the triple cone synchros. They're cheaper than a built t56 too.

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

hmm, hadn't seen that one. looks like it may be an option. it falls between the stage 2 and stage 3 in price and in power capability. i'll keep it in mind! i haven't bought ANYTHING yet, as i'm still looking at what is going to best suit my application.

does this use a stock style bellhousing and clutch? (i'll be going with a quicktime bellhousing)