Interesting observation
12-01-2006, 05:28 PM
#1
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Car: 71 Nova
Engine: Superramed 383, Topline heads
Transmission: 700r4
Axle/Gears: 8.2 posi 3.08
Interesting observation
I was on another board and someone pointed out something interesting. You know how you never see an even comparison in magazine articles. Well someone on another board pointed out something interesting. Here is a quote he made and maybe someone here can confirm this out if you have some back issues.
Trickflow
AFR Eliminators
Dont forget to check out the average numbers. Then check the flow on each head.
Yeah I've always wanted to see a heads up test between AFR and other good aftermarket heads on the same motor and combo. But actually, I *think* we've got one already. Take a look at the picture of the 383 that CHP used in the cylinder head test back in the August issue and then take a look at the 383 (it's actually a 388) in the December issue where they test the new AFR 195 Eliminators. It looks like the exact same engine. The dampner is the same, timing cover is the same, even the little paint chips on the front of the block (just above the timing cover are the same). Now that's not exactly scientific evidence, but there's a decent chance it's the same motor. If not...the comparison between the two at least shows some trends since they used the same cam and intake manifold for oth (and I believe Westech did both dyno tests).
I know this is just bench racing...but it's fun to look at.
If you plot the Trick Flow 195's against the AFR 195 numbers from the two articles (both with a Comp 274 cam and an RPM Airgap manifold)...the Trickflows make a little more HP and TQ up to 4500 RPM than the AFR's and they keep up really well until about 5500 RPM and then the AFR's start making more HP and TQ.
I know this is just bench racing...but it's fun to look at.
If you plot the Trick Flow 195's against the AFR 195 numbers from the two articles (both with a Comp 274 cam and an RPM Airgap manifold)...the Trickflows make a little more HP and TQ up to 4500 RPM than the AFR's and they keep up really well until about 5500 RPM and then the AFR's start making more HP and TQ.
Trickflow
AFR Eliminators
Dont forget to check out the average numbers. Then check the flow on each head.
Last edited by shaggy56; 12-01-2006 at 10:29 PM.
12-04-2006, 02:09 PM
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Car: projects.......
HAH!!! - that's awesome. If you read the articles, you'll can be almost 100% assured that it's the same short block, as they claim it to be their dyno test mule 383.
- Imagine that, as I have tried to say many times, AFR's can be beat, especially for the money. The lift #'s remaining the same at higher lifts on the eliminators suggest they may not be too great of a large cam/high rpm head.
This is not to say they're not a good head, just not "THE" head as so many seem to claim.....
- Imagine that, as I have tried to say many times, AFR's can be beat, especially for the money. The lift #'s remaining the same at higher lifts on the eliminators suggest they may not be too great of a large cam/high rpm head.
This is not to say they're not a good head, just not "THE" head as so many seem to claim.....
12-04-2006, 06:22 PM
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Car: 71 Nova
Engine: Superramed 383, Topline heads
Transmission: 700r4
Axle/Gears: 8.2 posi 3.08
I went ahead and plotted both dyno charts. I see that the AFR heads actually show more data points than the Trickflows but I corrected that in the charts. The run is almost mirrored except for the Trickflows have more low end and the AFRs have more high end. I believe the difference is mainly the lightweight bigger 2.05 valves on the AFR heads. Not a huge difference. I wonder if the Trickflows would benefit from some lightweight valvetrain.
AFR Int Exh
0.200 143 115
0.300 202 162
0.400 246 196
0.500 278 217
0.550 278 220
Trickflow
0.200 125 86.5
0.300 173.6 116.7
0.400 215 144
0.500 239 162
0.600 243 175
AFR Int Exh
0.200 143 115
0.300 202 162
0.400 246 196
0.500 278 217
0.550 278 220
Trickflow
0.200 125 86.5
0.300 173.6 116.7
0.400 215 144
0.500 239 162
0.600 243 175
Last edited by shaggy56; 12-05-2006 at 08:52 AM.
12-07-2006, 07:08 PM
#4
FYI. I have TFS 195CC Kenny D's.
.200 138/98
.300 190/130
.350 212/144
.400 230/156
.450 245/165
.500 253/174
.550 260/180
.600 260/185
My heads flowed the above. Out of the Box! Those #'s you have published are a little week for a 2.02 valve TFS 195CC head. Seems like the TFS head held its own.
.200 138/98
.300 190/130
.350 212/144
.400 230/156
.450 245/165
.500 253/174
.550 260/180
.600 260/185
My heads flowed the above. Out of the Box! Those #'s you have published are a little week for a 2.02 valve TFS 195CC head. Seems like the TFS head held its own.
Last edited by 88BlackZ-51; 12-07-2006 at 07:17 PM. Reason: info.
12-07-2006, 10:22 PM
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Engine: sbc
heads afr - tfs
If you have had a lot of time around the dyno, you will know that based of the flow figures posted on the two heads if they are accurate it will result in the AFR,s making 50 to 70 + more horsepower no doubt, consult a non bias professional shop for verification.
12-08-2006, 07:39 AM
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Car: 71 Nova
Engine: Superramed 383, Topline heads
Transmission: 700r4
Axle/Gears: 8.2 posi 3.08
With a little cleanup and minor porting I could see getting very close to the AFR numbers with those Duttweilers.
Last edited by shaggy56; 12-08-2006 at 07:53 AM.
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