StephenS

I seem to be getting more and more problems with my car. I honestly don't know where to start

I replaced my fuel pump on February 28th 2011 because my mechanic said the car was 'misfiring' due to starving for fuel and because it had a loud whine. We replaced it, it ran fine for a month, then a few weeks ago it started 'misfiring' again. Today i changed the fuel pump once again and it still continues to 'misfire' and not idle so well. Any thoughts on this? Or an explanation on why my car would be 'misfiring'.

Strangely it ran fine for a month with the new fuel pump, idle was great, no
major vibrations, fluent exhaust sound, and no fuel pump whine. But now, i have all those issues. Sparkplugs, Sparkplug wires, oil, and oil filter have not been changed on recommended time (they will be fairly soon however). Distributor, cap, rotor, coil, MAP sensor, and fuel filter were all replaced this year.

I'm fed up with having a bumpy ride EVERYWHERE i go. When I hit 45mph and i'm on the accelerator, the car feels like it's jolting back and forth, or like my mechanic put it 'misfiring'. I'm not really sure if theirs a name for it but: when the car is in Drive or Reverse it automatically roles, from 0 and it gets up to about 5 or 7 without touching the accelerator. Not sure if theirs a name for it. But aside from that, when it's at 0 and starts to role, it's the same feeling as when i'm at 45mph, but not as rough.

There is one sparkplug wire that is not creating electric contact with the distributor cap but it ran fine for that month.

What would you recommend I do?

I'm going in for a tune-up in the next week or so. I'll get plugs, wires, oil, oil filter, and whatever else you might recommend, to be replaced.

And usually when i leave my lights on, car is off, there will be a warning 'beeping' indicating my lights are on, it doesn't seem to do that anymore. Even when i have the key in the ignition it won't beep like it usually does.

Any help is appreciated, and i'm not that mechanically inclined so go easy on me with the explanations!!

camaronewbie

Fuel pump will not starve a car for fuel - the pump either works or is doesn't. Filter on the other hand can restrict the fuel flow and create this issue. You should have tried a fuel filter first.

This should have been done long before changing the fuel pump
99% of problems are simple easy fixes, but everyone wnat to do the hard expensive things first. Seems you fell into the latter category.

Well now - wonder why anyone wouldn't think this would be a problem?
Are we serious here? You have a known bad plug wire and you still ask what could be the problem? Anytime a car has issues, ALL the known issues nust be addresses BEFORE anyone begins to speculate on whether there are any unknown issues - that's basic common sense.

1) STOP going to "mechanics"! This last one obviously took you for a ride, whether intentionally or through his own ignorance (or both). Replacing a fuel pump is the 1st thing they all recommend - any mechanic that says "fuel pump" or "ECM" as their diagnosis should be shot on sight! You'll quickly learn 3 things in this world...

a) Mechanic will always say it's the fuel pump or the ECM
b) It always has 400hp (regardless of the fact that 99% of cars in the world do not have over 300hp)
c) no matter what it came out of, it's a "corvette" something

2) replace the plugs, wires, oil & filter

3) replace the fuel filter

4) Pull the codes You could have a bad CTS, TPS that needs adjusted, MAP, MAF might need cleaned, a IAC that needs cleaned - codes will tell you what the computer thinks is wrong.

5) You might have a bad ignition control module, bad coil - there's a ton of possibilities for misfiring. But we can't start to look at anything else until the wires/plugs/fuel filter have been replaced, and the fuel pressure verified.

6) test the fuel pressure - you get a tester at autozone for free rental, it plugs onto the shraeder valve driver side fuel rail (looks like a metal tire stem) - you should have 40+ psi with key on.

[qoute]....'beeping' indicating my lights are on, it doesn't seem to do that anymore. Even when i have the key in the ignition it won't beep like it usually does.[/quote]

Lucky you! I ripped that dam thing out years ago! Probably it's just disconnected itself from it's connector - under driver side dash if you insist on having it.

Get mechanically inclined, if you want to have a decent always working car - because every shop is going to just take you for a ride. Many many many mechanics, techs, whatever don't have a clue when it comes to these cars. They either know electrical computerized new stuff, or they know old school carbed stuff - no one can seem to bridge the gap on these 2st generation computerized cars that don't tell you exactly what needs repaired (like a new OBD2 system). $200 spent on ramps, a jack, a basic tool set, and a Haynes manual will get your car fixed faster, better, and cheaper than any other option.

I'm not trying to give you a hard time - it's just a plain fact - most everyone here at TGO has learned the hard way ... if you want to get it done RIGHT, you do it YOURSELF!

StephenS

It was stupid of me to not get a tune-up but i've had money issues for a while now but i have a few hundred saved up that WILL go directly to my car.

I will get estimates on tune-ups tomorrow.

The fuel filter was replaced, it's about 1 month old.

The issue with the distributor sparkplug wire hasn't been causing the car to do what it's doing. I will have my buddy, who is a mechanic, take a look at the entire car and post what he found.

jkrustchinsky

well you go on and get them estimates! good luck

fitojdj

usually the wiring get melted...

StephenS

Just called several different mechanics. The cheapest was $170 for sparkplug and wire labor. And thats IF i have both the plugs and wires for them to install. $300 if i don't have the parts. $34 for an oil change, standard oil. I also asked if they could check for leaks and they said they'll do it for $50. Thats outrageous! I might have to find a place that does $20 dollar oil changes, and another place that will install plugs and wires for cheaper then $170.

I have the plugs already and i'm looking on summitracing.com for wires. BOSCH wires for $25 bucks WITH coil wire

EvilCartman

iTrader: (1)

Already been said but STOP GOING TO MECHANICS. Plugs, wires, cap, rotor and oil changes should be something anyone with half a brain can do on these cars.

StephenS

I have all the tools but I don't want to take the chance of incorrectly installing sparkplugs. I can do all this stuff by myself but i don't own a lift to make it easy. I installed a lot of stuff on my own but these few things i'd like to have done correctly by a professional.

BillyTheGoat

iTrader: (2)

alright to change the plugs and wires you just have to mark where the #1 plug wire is on the distributor cap then if you want you can mark the rest 1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2. To find #1 cylinder stand in front of your engine and it will be the one to on ur right side or also know as the drivers side. If you want you can put the #1 cylinder at tdc to make sure the rotor is facing the #1 cylinder

Then just start taking off the wires and plugs. Sparks plugs 7 and 8 will be a bit hard to take off without lifting the car but it can be done (atleast I did).

Installation is the reverse order. thats pretty much it without paying tons of cash to do something that can be done without much knowledge

If you do that urself you save the cash from taking it to a mechanic and you can buy a decent jack and jack stands to do basic routine stuff

StephenS

Thanks. I'll try the sparkplugs myself and see what happens.

I was looking online today and found that engine sludge could be causing my misfiring and perhaps other issues. My car does smoke out of the exhaust. It's white smoke, not black. And it does leak oil. After i get a tune-up i'm going to tackle this little DIY project of cleanin sludge out of my engine. Any simple ideas on how to get some or most of the sludge out? Maybe even some sort of fluid? I could try to take the engine apart i guess.

BillyTheGoat

iTrader: (2)

White smoke is caused by coolant getting into the combustion chamber. You probably have a bad head gasket. does it smoke all the time? I wouldnt recommend putting some liquid to clean the sludge as it can cause the oil pump screen to get clogged.

Are you sure it has sludge? Pop a valve cover off and check. Also where does it leak oil

TNT_Z28

I don't even know where to start here...

You think you have sludge by looking at the outside of the engine? How? You think that has something to do with misfiring?

I'd be willing to bet that any motor with over 50,000 miles has at least a little bit of sludge. That's not something that has anything to do with your combustion chambers or problems with the plugs and wires that you have yet to address. If sludge was really giving you problems, you'd know. Like your rotating assembly would seize.

Do youR plugs and wires yourself. Eliminate some problems before you start bringing in other random variables.

Don't worry about a lil bit of smoke right now. Don't let some of these terrorists psych you out by telling you head gaskets need to be replaced.

Take care of the little things first then go from there.

And NO f***ing mechanics. I hope that point has gotten across by now

Krik

iTrader: (4)

If you used an AIRTEX fuel pump you may have problems. I put 2 in my Blazer, in 3 months, before i realized what pieces of **** they are. Don't cheap out on parts for your car. They are cheap for a reason.

StephenS

Matter of fact it is an AIRTEX. Just today it started making the loud whining noise. Again. The first fuel pump did the same thing. Both pumps were the same, of course. I'm gonna spend the extra money to get a BOSCH fuel pump, i'm fed up. I'll also pop a valve cover to check how bad the sludge is.

It doesn't smoke ALL the time. Just on start-up and when i give it gas when it's in Park or Neutral.

Again i hate to say, my mechanic said i have major sludge build up and carbon build up. He recommended new heads but thats 800 bucks a can't afford right now.

Right down the street is an automotive/marine technical institute that has "bring your car in friday's". It's where they let only a few student's that know what their doing work on peoples cars. Or even their own. I asked a buddy of mine who goes there and he said he'd be willing to take my car and help me with the tune-up. Free. Oil, oil filter, sparks, and wires. All i have to do is get the parts. What oil/oil filter and possible engine treatment fluid would you recommend? I heard AutoRX is really good?

Once i get the tune-up, and the issue i'm having with the apparent 'misfiring' is gone, i'll work on cleanin the engine out a little bit. Then the fuel pump situation.

And as for the oil, while I was changing my fuel pump out on sunday i found a small puddle of oil. No idea how it came out in such a high quantity. I usually check the floor whenever i go for school and i don't see oil.

Could it be possible that junk is going through the fuel line causing the fuel pump to go bad? It seems like the bearings are bad which causes the pump to whine. Maybe the charcoal canister or the fuel pressure regulator are bad?

TNT_Z28

[quote=StephenS;4917219]
"Again i hate to say, my mechanic said i have major sludge build up and carbon build up. He recommended new heads but thats 800 bucks a can't afford right now."

thats what im talking about... how in the hell could dude know if you had major sludge or major carbon build up? Did he take the heads off? Did he even remove a valve cover? wtf?

"Right down the street is an automotive/marine technical institute that has "bring your car in friday's". It's where they let only a few student's that know what their doing work on peoples cars. Or even their own. I asked a buddy of mine who goes there and he said he'd be willing to take my car and help me with the tune-up. Free. Oil, oil filter, sparks, and wires. All i have to do is get the parts."

its sounding to me like youd rather have your car molested by others than get down and dirty yourself. plugs and wires are a basic procedure that everyone should know. you wont learn if you dont try.


"Once i get the tune-up, and the issue i'm having with the apparent 'misfiring' is gone, i'll work on cleanin the engine out a little bit. Then the fuel pump situation."

the way i understand it, you have a plug/plugwire that isnt making connection to the distributer. really? nothing can get done, diagnosed, repared untill that is fixed...
but no, your mechanics probably right... its sludge

"And as for the oil, while I was changing my fuel pump out on sunday i found a small puddle of oil. No idea how it came out in such a high quantity. I usually check the floor whenever i go for school and i don't see oil."

changing your fuel pump? the way i understand it is that the FI fuel pumps are in the gas tank. so your saying you dropped the rear end, dropped the tank, replaced the pump and pieced everthing back together, but you wont try to replace plugs and wires... doesnt add up


sorry for the negativity but this is killing me

please start by doing your plugs and wires by yourself. youll learn about how some stuff works, and hopefully see some results from your labor...
i know you can get it done. i have faith in you

89RESTO

iTrader: (5)

My guess is that he's calling his fuel filter his fuel pump.

StephenS

I know the difference between my fuel filter and fuel pump.

I don't know how the hell the oil got there, it just did.

And no i have a hatch for my fuel pump so i never have to drop the tank. I watched my fuel pump be replaced, once. It took the guy 3 damn hours. I did it over the weekend and it took me about an hour or less. So i'm a quick leaner as long as I see it done first.

I am NOT having someone else install my plugs and wires. I'm having someone assist me so i can do it the right way the first time and possibly give me pointers. And so I can use his lift

My mechanic did a complete engine look through. Even a compression test. 125 was the highest compression. I cleaned most of the carbon build up out of the throttle body but thats about it. I have seen the sludge and it's bad. I assume thats the least of my worries right now?

19camaro83

So you had your entire engine apart and visually inspected the engine, and diagnosed extreme sludge buildup, but you can't change plugs/wires by yourself?...

StephenS

It's obvious that my mechanic took my engine apart, not me. He did however call me when he had it all apart to come look at it cause I was interested in what was built-up in there after all these years.

19camaro83

I am calling a major b/s card on this thread.

Shadow Z

iTrader: (2)

I recommend that you just sell the car to me. I wouldn't mind a nice '91 Z28.

19camaro83

Okay, maybe not on the entire thread, but on your so-called mechanics diagnosis and skill level. Sorry if I insulted you, but this story just isn't adding up.

TNT_Z28

what he said....


and sell it to me first, ill out bid shadow, lol

Shadow Z

iTrader: (2)

I'll pay up to $2,000 for his non-running '91 Z28. There will be no out-bidding me.

EvilCartman

iTrader: (1)

This is me as I sit here and read this thread.

Shadow Z

iTrader: (2)

This is me as I hit VTEC in the Mustang.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X__x7uD9LJA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LSanFI4GTB8

StephenS

Seriously? Wtf. How can't you grasp that my mechanic took my engine apart? And it runs like a champ so i'm not selling it. Just let me get the damn tune-up and i'll get back to you guys.

19camaro83

Seriously, because your idiot "mechanic" already suckered you into spending a lot of unecessary money... I seriously doubt this guy's skill level. If your engine runs like a champ, then why in the hell would he pull it apart? This makes no f'ing sense... Either he is completely full of sh|t, or you are.

StephenS

Why the hell would i make this crap up? I'm fed up with my car right now and just want this **** box fixed so i can get to school without breaking down.

He pulled it apart because I asked him to see how long the engine will last. Besides sludge and somewhat low compression it's fine.

He didn't sucker me into anything. He recommended things. I chose to change the fuel pump cause it started to whine and caused my car to die. A new pump fixed the dieing issue. I trust my mechanic cause he's been a friend of mine for a few years now. He did the engine look through for free and the compression test for 20 bucks.

david.d

smoke when the motor starts is probably just the valve guide seal. when you shut the car off, the oil slides down the guide and sits on top of the valve. when you start it up, it burns and goes out the exhaust. its light colored because there isn't much of it. you and your buddy should be able to fix it in an afternoon

Krik

iTrader: (4)

I used autoRX and loved it for my DD. Use it exactly like it says to on the website. Do all your own work. Do it at a friends house if you don't have the tools. Stop wasting money paying someone for easy stuff.

The only thing I have paid for is rear end set-up, ball joints, and alignment. I probably could have done the ball joints but i wasn't going to do the Camaro for my 1st attempt.

StephenS

Tune-up on Wednesday! Plugs, wires, oil, oil filter, K&N Air Filters, a quick look at the distributor and fuel pump as well. I'm buying the oil, oil filter, and some fuel injector cleaner (the kind thats poured into the gas tank), any recommendations on what i should look for? My car has 168,xxx so I don't know if synthetic is good.

'87IROCZOWNER69

iTrader: (1)

Is your mechanic doing it for you or are you doing it?

camarosrock1989

iTrader: (1)

Wow way to give someone a bad time that needs help. My advice to you would be to get a few good manuals, research as much as possible. find a honest good friend maybe someone has a 3rd gen in your area that knows a lot about these cars. Don't get discouraged. I know it sucks when our cars are running bad, but they are older cars. They need maintained. It sounds like your doing the best you can. Not everyone is cut out to be a mechanic's. I love to work on cars, but hate to get my hands dirty! lol I hope everything works out and doesn't cost you a arm and a leg.
Best wishes!

StephenS

It's me and a buddy of mine who works on classic cars for a living.

Krik

iTrader: (4)

Topic is much debated, but i will give my opinion.
Plugs: AC Delco platinum tip (*they come with the gap preset, but buy the feeler gauges, or something, and make sure they are exactly right)
Wires: Accel
Oil: Mobil1, or Royal Purple
Oil Filter: purolator pure 1, Napa Gold, or Royal Purple (don't you dare use a regular Fram (orange) filter)
Air Filter: K&N isn't worth the bother unless you already bought them. Use a AC Delco
Fuel Injector cleaner: Sea Foam. Get 1 regular can for the tank, and 1 can of the Deep Creep to spray directly into the vaccuum line. Once you have done this use the Gumout Regain fuel additive once every 3 tanks of gas
Speaking of gas: 100% gas. Not hard to find. Costs a bit more. Will give better mileage and Horse Power. Your car was designed for the stuff
Oil additive to clean the internals of your motor: Auto RX. Follow the directions to the letter. My Blazer, with 120k miles, stopped leaking oil and gained 1-1.5mpg (somewhere in that area). Motor runs like a champ. Camaro will get it this spring.

Like I said, this is my opinion. I have been maintaining vehicles for 30 years starting in my fathers garage. My children are getting the same education I got from my father adjusted for technological improvements.

StephenS

I should buy non-synthetic motor oil, correct? I heard it was bad for high mileage vehicles.

TNT_Z28

if you go synthetic, you cant go back... also, youll probably find leaks if you use synthetic in a hile mileage engine.

10w30 conventional

Krik

iTrader: (4)

woah boy, the old synthetic rumor rears its ugly head again...
/facepalm

You can and should use synthetic depending on your personal habits. I am a well educated on the subject, and I will simplify it for you.

If you are going to change your oil every 3000 miles then conventional oil is the best choice for you, synthetic oil is not the best option.
If you prefer to drive 7500-15000 miles between oil changes then full synthetic oil is your best option and conventional dino juice is not.
If you fall somewhere in between then you should use a synthetic blend.

Please, please, please if you are going to push the limits of your oil you buy a PREMIUM oil filter.

Nay-sayers are sure to challenge me on this, but I am not wrong. If you care to follow my research I will point you in the right direction for having your oil tested. True synthetic oil (Castrol synthetic does not fall in this category) is a waste to be tossed out after 3000 miles.

StephenS

I will change the oil at 1500 miles because of the AutoRX so i'll stick with conventional or a high mileage oil for now. I heard from many sources that synthetic in high mileage engines is bad because it leaks more and causes the engine to decay even faster. I don't understand how that can happen but i've read about it so many times.

I do believe you don't get me wrong, but i'm not even sure my car has 15000 miles left in it. The engine is sturdy according to several mechanics and just what i hear/feel from the engine but i don't know anymore and since money is a HUGE issue.

Shadow Z

iTrader: (2)

I'm telling you, selling it to me would be the best idea ever.

I've taken my nearly stock '01 Mustang, swapped in a T56 6 speed, have a Vortech waiting to be bolted on, aiming for 350+ RWHP in the next couple weeks. I transform cars. But on a more serious note, good luck with it man.

tylercamaro

iTrader: (1)

high mileage **** is really not considerably that awesome, its basically the exact same thing for more, for plugs big thing is when you take them out make sure they arent oil fouled, my had that and it ran rough, make sure plugs are gapped properly, and firing order is correct, i usually do one plug at a time. keep wires away from the manifolds they will melt and then youll have more trouble.
accel and msd is all ive used for wires and theyve served me well, and ive always used mobile, or royal purple, with a good napa, or ac delco filter. white exhaust is coolant, make sure you trace that down cause thatll cause internal problems because oil and coolant arent best friends, usually its a head gasket.
i suggest if you dont know i thing about these cars and insist on driving one, then get yorself a hayes manual for it, and start studying up. these cars are ridiculously easy to maintain once its functioning properly

tylercamaro

iTrader: (1)

and seafoam, read the directions it helped mine alot

StephenS

Would if i could but this car has personal value to me because my dad drove it for 13 years and i've NEVER seen one like it on the road where i live. And because I need a car for school.

tylercamaro

iTrader: (1)

havent your dad and you spent any bonding moments just working on it together, or did he not take car of it at all?

Krik

iTrader: (4)

Follow my advice in post number 36 for any used car bought with over 100k miles unless you are positive that the maintenance was done correctly (receipts receipts receipts). Auto RX can, will, and has fixed leaking seals. Don't throw away your motor without giving it a chance to live.

I just tossed around my 118k mile RACE car today like it was just rolled off the line. It runs and drives so sweet. I can't quite give it justice with words, but when it shifts from 1 to 2 its like someone kicking me in the butt.

Do some maintenance
Do some freakin' light work
Spend $200 on parts and supplies
All of that stuff can be done in 1 day, or stretched out casually across a weekend. Bond with your dad (or your kids if you are the dad now) while doing it. Don't be afraid to ask questions, but read directions first. This website and the search feature are a godsend for us lucky few that have fortune of owing a car that was built by a GM that cared about what they built. These cars were designed to be easy to take care of if you just give a little effort.

Heres to hoping you try. If you just drive her into the ground like so many before you then its your car to trash.

Krik

iTrader: (4)

Apologies for the double post, but something just came to me that doesn't belong in the previous post.

Pull all your fuses and relays one at a time so you know where to put them back. Check them and their mounting contacts for corrosion. If your not getting good contacts your voltages will be low or inconsistent. This is free and easy to do. Just get a good flashlight and a pair of needle-nosed pliers, or fuse puller if you have one. Unhook the battery first if you think you need to but you should be fine.

Any corrosion you find needs to be cleaned off with light sandpaper. Coat the now-sanded areas with a conductive corrosion prohibiter.

StephenS

Tune-up tomorrow. I'm going to Advance Auto for all my parts after school today. I am not sure if they have AutoRX. When i checked the website it came up with unknown search results. Unless you HAVE to buy it from the AutoRX website? I wrote down what you recommended Krik and i will most likely buy whats on the list. Anything else I should look for?

Krik

iTrader: (4)

Auto RX is sold on their website. If you are going to use it may as well buy cheap oil now. If you buy premium oil now your just going to have to dump it out when you do the Auto RX treatment.

The only other thing I can think of is a fuel pressure gauge. I think you have to remove the upper plenum to attach it though. Maybe change out your fuel filter if you don't know how long its been since it was done last.

Good luck and feel free to ask any questions along the way.

StephenS

Got my car back from the tune-up. They got the oil, filter, engine treatment, 5 sparks, 5 wires installed. Last 3 plugs and wires will be done tomorrow. Not much of a difference so far, it still feels like it misfires when i accelerate. Idle is a lot better and not as much vibration however. On my way to school i'll see how it acts at 45-55mph. Lets hope it doesn't have big vibrations when it reaches 45mph like usual!

EDIT: I did buy Sea Foam also. Motor treatment and a bottle of the carbon cleaner. I used the carbon cleaner yesterday, followed the videos instructions. I'll be using the motor treatment when my car is low on gas. I do want to put some in the vacuum line and fuel line but i'm not entirely sure where they are located. I can't seem to find it in my Haynes manual.