LT1maro

in summit i saw a universal 6 cyl kit from nos. What do u guys think about it. its part number 741-8006.if i hear soem good opinions, my pops will get it and than i will get it for the LT1

white89v6

I seen a univeras mpfi v6 kit made by nos in jegs
it costed $1210.99 and dosn't look like it comes
with a botle or a wot switch or any lines up to the soleniods.

RICHRAD

There's a kit from J.C. Whitney for the 2.8 and up(NOS) $300-$400 I believe. Check out their catalog or site.

LT1maro

yea, i guess that i should look into that for my dad because he has given me soem money to buy him stuff for his 3.1 and i am trying to get him to run a 15 in the 1/4, dotn know if it is possible

TomP

LT1Maro, why not buy the kit meant for the engine??? Why do you want to make a universal kit work? Seems like a hell of a lot of wasted time/energy to me.

Has anyone actually called Summit for a part #? Or talked to the guys at http://www.nosnitrous.com ? Too much work?

LT1maro

u do have a good point there TomP! maby i shoudl look into that, i was just going by what my dad said he wanted and i was going to get it but it makes sence to but a kit, thanks for the advice

LT1guy

iTrader: (1)

The "Noszle" kits look fine and dandy, except for the price...you could buy and plumb a fogger setup for the same $$$! Seems like a lot of money to me for cheap plastic lines. Call Mike Flynn at NOS...he's the main tech guy there, and he knows his stuff. He'll steer you in the right direction.

pontiacguy1

Hey guys, you could try a kit for a late '80s Mustang 5.0 liter. I have one of these on my 1992 3.1 liter V-6. It works well, and I installed it myself in about 6 or 7 hours. It comes with the throttle body mini switch, has two solenoids, A bottle, brackets, hoses, and it is adjustable by changing the nozzles in it. It pressurizes the fuel pressure regulator, so it will work over a range of bottle pressure. This kit was about $500 back in 1996 when I put it on the car. I guess I have run about 20 or more bottles of laughing gas through there, and have had no bad effects. You will want a good set of plugs, 93 octane fuel, and no aftermarket chips. From what I have heard from chip manufacturers, they usually advance the timing in the engine, and that would give you detonation with Nitrous. I might could take pictures if anyone is interested.

Gumby

pics plzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

85f-bird

i was looking at summitracing.com earlier, and noticed that they didn't have a regular kit for the 2.8L v6 with MPFI, the kit that was listed was for a TBI unit, which wouldn't work. Now, i did see this though, fiero 2.8L 1985-1988, so that's the MPFI version, not rear wheel drive, but don't know why it wouldn't work. Tom, what do you think about that version? oh, and it was like 500 i think , and adjustable from 100-125hp, they said it was also for near stock applications. So apparently, stock we can hold a 100hp. hehe.

LT1guy

iTrader: (1)

Not sure how long a 2.8 will last with a 100 shot, but it would at least give you a hell of a 60 ft time !

pontiacguy1

I will try to get pictures of my Nitrous install this afternoon. I used the 5.0 Mustang kit because after doing some research, the induction systems on our MPFI V-6 is very similar to Ford's 5.0 liter small block injection. At that time, I couldn't find a kit that said it would work on my car either. I have been very happy with the system I have. I set it up to be a little bit rich, and it is supposed to give me a 75 HP boost with the bottle pressure at 750 PSI. Sometimes when it is hot outside, the bottle will be on about 1100 PSI. It will really put down the power when that happens. I would guess that it is adding right at or maybe just over 100 HP at 1100 PSI. I haven't had any reliability problems, but I also don't use it too often. I probably load up about 1 bottle every 3 months. If you used two or three bottles per week, you would probably shorten the life of your engine at that HP level.

TomP

Well man, like I've said before, you really have to call Summit. They don't really waste their time mentioning the 2.8 V6 in their catalogs, not too many people are interested in it. You could use their website if you had a part #, say NOS-321651235 (not a real #) and it would give you a price, and tell you if it was in stock. But it won't list if you're browsing their online catalog. I think their parts department (one of the voicemail options off of 800-230-3030) is open 24-7, and you could always look at http://www.holley.com (NOS's site) to see if they have a catalog online!

On a nicer note, (yes I'm bitchy lately so I apologize) the NOS kit seems fine. Guys on the power adder board are running ~100 shots with factory cast pistons and have no problems. I asked that a while ago when I found out forged 2.8 pistons are $300 extra- so a rebuild could use cast 2.8 pistons and still handle a small NOS shot.

pontiacguy1

Here are some pictures of the 5.0 Mustang Nitrous kit installed on my 1992 Firebird 3.1 liter. This kit has worked very well. I set it up to give me 75 HP, but when the bottle is hot and at about 1100 PSI, I am probably getting just about 100 HP. The engine has no other modifications, other than using Rapidfire Platinum plugs. I might be able to answer any questions that you might have. Like I said, the 5.0 Mustang kit is readily available from almost anywhere, and I think it cost me somewhere around $500.00 back in 1996.

pontiacguy1

Here is a picture of the bottle mounted in the back of my car. I ran all of the hoses under the carpet. I would like to put an automatic bottle opener on, but have never gotten around to doing that. BTW. I have been reading and surfing this website for a long time, but have recently decided to register and actually participate some.

white89v6

I was going threw PAW and found a nos kit for
3.4L camaro/firebird (nos-05175) for 549.95.
I also found 5.0L stage 1 75Hp (nos-05115)
for 489.95. This is what I think pontiacguy1 has.
All the 2.8L kits I found where for tbi cars.

TomP

Nice clean install, Pontiacguy1! One question though, you said you ran all the lines under the carpet- is the NOS supply line inside the car or underneath? If you go to a track that enforces NHRA rules, like Englishtown in NJ, tech inspection would fail you; they want the nitrous line underneath the car!

pontiacguy1

The lines are underneath the car. I ran the hoses under the carpet, and out through the spare tire wheel well. I then ran them under the floor of the car to the engine bay. Thanks for the compliments. I actually think that mine was a NOS cheater system for the 5.0, although the other system would work fine. Mine is adjustable, and came with several different size jets to adjust the amount of fuel and spray given. I called the Tech line at NOS and got them to reccomend the proper jetting for the kit. I also have a secondary switch located under the dash. I have to do three things. I open the bottle a couple of turns. I then have to flip the switch under the dash to arm the system. Once those are done, whenever you put the pedal into the carpet, the solenoids open and you get the spray.

The system really woke this engine up! It is really fun to drive with the bottle open. One guy has his wins in his signature. I can tell you a few of mine: 1991? Daytona Shelby Turbo, 1988 Mustang GT 5 speed, 1996 Impala SS, and a few others. Let me say that my car will beat a late '80s GT mustang if the car is not modified. If they have added chips, flowmasters, pulleys, or anything like that, then I will lose. The convertibles you can put a hurtin' on unless they are heavily modded. I guess that this would put my car in the low 15 second time frame in the quarter. I have never taken it to the track, so I don't know. Anyway, it has made the car a lot more fun. Anyone that wants any specifics can e-mail me.

OnixV6

you don't want to be running nitrous with plats. nitrous eats plats like candy.

AFrikinGoodTime

NOS eats everything like candy, especially pistons.

The only safe way to run NOS is with a secondary fuel supply and solinoid to boost fuel pressure and not lean out the motor when on the juice. Even then its not going to give you much life.

pontiacguy1

I have not had any reliability problems with my car at all, and I have had the nitrous kit on the car since June of 1996. I do have to change the plugs more often than I think should be necessary (every couple of years, which is about 40K miles), but the rapidfire plugs seem to work fine with the nitrous. The extra fuel comes through the stock injectors. The system has a line to put pressure on the fuel pressure regulator, and thus raise the fuel pressure on the injectors themselves. The good thing about our V-6 cars is that we got the same fuel pump as the 305(and probably the 350)Tuned Port cars, at least I think the 3.1 cars did. The pump is capable of putting out more pressure and fuel than is required at this HP level, so I have not had to change anything else. I think that if I was running more HP, I would probably have to add an auxiliary fuel pump to the line.

I used a lot of nitrous when I first got it. Now that the car is not my daily driver anymore, I don't use that much. At the time, this car was putting me through college, so I was pretty nervous about adding the nitrous. I had a bunch of people tell me I was crazy for doing that to a V-6, that it would simply self destruct, still wouldn't make any power, etc... Well, It has been 6 years, and I can say that all of those guys were just wrong. I have had a lot of fun with it. I cannot speak for the 2.8's, especially the older ones, but the 3.1 can handle extra power, as long as your expectations are realistic. If I ever decide to tear into the motor, I will be using some stronger parts in the rebuild, but the stock ones have done well. Oh, the car now has 166,xxx miles on it, and I can still get nearly 30 MPG on the interstate. I think it is an all around good performer with the Nitrous.

TomP

Are you sure about that? I wonder... hm. The TPI V8 pumps flow more than the MPFI 2.8 V6 pumps, but have the same pressure. A guy on the TPI board found this out. I wonder... 3.1 isn't that far from 2.8, if the pumps are the same, maybe a 2.8 could handle the extra flow of a V8 pump. Or, if the 3.1 pump is different than the V8, I wonder in which way. I'm intrigued...

Frickin' has a good point though, although I wouldn't add a secondary fuel system. If I were you, I'd add a fuel pressure gauge. If your pump decides to take a crap while you're on the squeeze, you want some kind of indication that you should shut the system down.

Thanks for the info on how the pressure regulator adds extra fuel; I always wondered about that.

Isn't it fun when that happens? It's a great way to find out who knows what they're talking about.

LT1guy

iTrader: (1)

A booster pump, or a bigger than stock in tank pump, should be fine on a small shot like this. For a larger system, esp a fogger, a dedicated (nitrous system only) fuel system would be a good idea. NOS won't eat anything when its properly set up.

pontiacguy1

I hear what you guys are saying. Like I said before, I set the system up to be fairly conservative... 75HP, and I wanted it to be a little on the rich side. I know that the pumps they put in these cars are able to put out more fuel than the engine requires. Extra fuel is simply returned to the tank. I also know that it is a lot cheaper to manufacture 1 pump and make a lot more of them than it is to make 3 different pumps in smaller quantities. I do believe that the 305 and the 3.1 pumps are the same. They may have added a bigger one on the 350's, but those were a small percentage of the cars sold. Oh, I know that the throttle body engines were a different pump, since they only run at 13-15 PSI, and out cars are at about 45 PSI.

Oh yeah, when I first hit the nitrous I get a very small puff of black smoke from the tail pipes, then it gets clear as the nitrous comes on. I would rather set it up a bit rich and then not have to worry about it leaning out. I also believe that Nitrous in reasonable amounts doesn't do any damage as long as the mixture is right.

pontiacguy1

Hey TomP, I have still not found out one way or another if the Fuel Pump is the same for the 3.1L and the 305 V-8 in 1992. I can tell you that if you look up the replacemnt pump from any of the auto parts websites like www.autozone.com, they have the same replacement pump for the 2.8 liter, 3.1 liter, 5.0 Tuned port, and 5.7 Tuned port engines. I will try to find out through GM what really came in the car, and I'll let everyone here know. I thought that I read somewhere that the pumps are the same from the 3.1 and 5.0 TP engines. I will find out for sure.

OnixV6

no, not everything and especially not pistons.

here's a couple of post from the Power Adder forum you might be interested in reading:
https://www.thirdgen.org/techbb2/sho...s+AND+platinum
https://www.thirdgen.org/techbb2/sho...s+AND+platinum

good luck.

AFrikinGoodTime

Are you kidding me with this comment? Have you ever seen a piston for a car that someone hooked up NOS and used it repeatedly without any fuel pressure boost? It eventually leaves a hole inthe top of some pistons the size of a quarter.

I stated above that it can be safely done with extra fuel. Most people do not take these precautions when adding a large system for the first time.

OnixV6

did you actually read what i wrote? nitrous effect on plats are different from nitrous does on the pistons. read those 2 threads i posted regarding nitrous with plats and tell me that's what nitrous does to pistons.

AFrikinGoodTime

Did I contest what you said about platinums-NO. what I did was re-posted your comment in agreement and then added other info adjacent to the topic of nitrous. So what is your frikin trip buddy?Then you come at me with an ignorant comment like "not everything and especially not pistons". If anything ever blows as a result of nitrous its generally the pistons first under the sinerio I gave- or did YOU bother to read my post. If you would take the time and relook everything above, I would hope we could come to a peaceful understanding that this was a minor misinterpetation on your part that I will gladly dismiss.

joezero

I'm a little confused, is a 75-100 shot o.k. for a 2.8? Tom, you mentioned adding a fuel pressure gauge (I believe there's something on NOS' website about doing that as well). But where would that connect into the fuel line? I guess it'd just be an electronic sender and then you could put in a gauge pod in the pillar or something. And yeah, if your engine leans out while running the nitrous it will eat through the pistons.

AFrikinGoodTime

On the MSD NOS system I tested years ago for Centerforce, we aligned a second fuel supply line and regulator that tied into a solinoid. The solinoid was routed into the primary fuel line after the primary regulator. When the NOS went active, the solinoid jumped the secondary boosted fuel pressure line to override the primary and void any lean condition. The entire system was monitored and any fluctuation in air/fuel mixture or fuel pressure drop would imediately render the system inactive. It was state of the art, but a bitch to work around all of the excess plumbing. I don't exactly know where you could fit such a system cleanly onto the MPFI, there is already so much cluter and sensors on these engines

OnixV6

AFrikinGoodTime - sorry, dude. i didn't explain myself better. there were no flames intended. definitely no disrespect, either. i just like short posts. i was referring to how the extra heat from using N2O would melt/erode plats. N2O doesn't melt pistons. like you said, it breaks them. hope we agree on that.

AFricanGoodTime

No hard feelings here Onix, I could see we were on the same page. Just a little misunderstanding. This Overcck mod guy is on a power trip. He locked me out/ like that is going to keep me away?

pontiacguy1

I found out today about the fuel pump that came from the factory in our cars. I was wrong about the pumps being the same. GM put three (!) different pumps in these cars in 1992. The pump for a 3.1 liter is GM part # 25116162, the pump for a 5.0 liter Throttle body is #25166252, and the part number for a 5.7 liter AND 5.0 liter Tuned Port is #25116163.

Apparently, the larger pumps will work fine in our motors, since all of the parts houses only carry the one pump. The main reason that they only carry the one pump is to save on cost and inventory. Makes me wonder why GM didn't do that in the first place. Anyway, I still think that the stock pump flows enough for a 75 to 100 HP shot without any auxiliary mods, other than boosting the pressure on the injectors via the fuel pressure regulator. Hope that this clears up the pump issue once and for all. I guess a good pump upgrade for any of us would be to simply get the 5.7 liter pump from the local auto parts store and put it in. It would be a lot of trouble, though.

stinger74

I've got a silly question. I'm new to the concept of NOS, and I always thought that it was only to be used at higher rpm's. Is that one of the myths about NOS? Can it be used throughout the rpm band?

bad82camaro

can any one tell me how to load a pic of my car on the sreen.

mw66nova

iTrader: (13)

well, if you say so, i have seen many a burnt and melted (slightly) pistons out of the 14.5:1 compression 632ci and bigger big block chevy's

joezero

NOS recommends that you not use Nitrous Oxide below 2500 RPMs, and only at full throttle. Although really, you'll pretty much always be above that threshold while racing. Of course, that's just what NOS says, I don't know about the other manufacturers.

pontiacguy1

I haven't had any trouble with my car, and I hit the nitrous from a dead stop right off the line (really good torque!). Of course it being an automatic, the car's converter will flash to well over 2000 RPM, so that really doesn't put me in that category. I think that they mean that you shouldn't use the nitrous if you are 'lugging' the engine because it would cause bad detonation problems. I have heard of people bending the rods in their engines by hitting a heavy shot at low speeds, but I don't think that with a 75 or 100 HP shot you would have to worry about that. Detonation is the main enemy for us. The full throttle is for the purpose of always having the same amount of fuel, air, and nitrous going into the motor. That's just my $.02 worth.

OnixV6

i didn't really want to post the obvious but to see this in a better perspective and so that we're all in the same pace, first, we have to realize a few things:

• this is a V6 forum
• we're talking street-legal cars
• we're talking mild shots between 75-100 in this thread

now, tell us if your post above applies.

Gumby

But will the stock fuel pressure regulator be able to deal with the 5.7 pump???

I was think about adding a extra 16lb inline pump onto mine for a tad more pressure and I have nothing else to do with it.

pontiacguy1

I believe that it will be fine with the larger pump. The fuel pressure regulator keeps the pressure at a certain level for the amount of vaccuum that you have. All extra gets returned to the tank through the overflow line. That line is the same size on my car as the inlet line is. I believe that the only thing that will happen is that 95% of the time, you will simply be pumping more fuel through the loop. Remember that flow rate and pressure are not the same thing. A bad restriction can increase pressure, but I don't believe that will be a problem with this fuel pressure regulator. I know that if my pump ever starts giving me trouble, I am putting in a bigger pump while I am at it.