Monkie

If the TBI is stock and the 3.1L had some mods, the 3.1 is a manual and the TBI is auto...Who do you think would win?

------------------
1992 Camaro RS 3.1L
T5 Manual 5 speed
Open Air Intake
Z-28 Exhaust
8.5mm MSD Ignition wires
TB Coolant bypass

Brian K

I would guess the 3.1 if, you took him off the line, reduced as much weight out of your car as possible and are a much better driver.

dudelovett

Itll be close off the start, but I think the TBI would pull ahead when it hit 2nd.

------------------
1991 Firebird Formula, 305, TPI, Auto...stock till I get some money!!!
Former owner of an 88 2.8 Firebird....RIP

Monkie

Ok that is another subject. I am working on some weight mods. The ones I have done so far is taken out the jack, spare tire, and have no washer fluid (hey every ounce counts ). So do you guys have any other ideas? Im gettin a SS hood in spring if I dont sell my car. So, ideas?

------------------
1992 Camaro RS 3.1L
T5 Manual 5 speed
Open Air Intake
Z-28 Exhaust
8.5mm MSD Ignition wires
TB Coolant bypass

dudelovett

Start tossin out the seats!

Stereo equipment isnt a must, nor is AC or any of that emission crap.

Try ditching your power steering as well.

Then again, these things also wont let your car be a comfy daily driver...

------------------
1991 Firebird Formula, 305, TPI, Auto...stock till I get some money!!!
Former owner of an 88 2.8 Firebird....RIP

85f-bird

god i hope this topic doesn't start another civil war. Well, depends on how much you want to win the race. If you really want to win, you can do it. Let's see, once you get that hood on, ram-air!!! then of course theirs the exaust mods, ditch everything that's an extra on the car. Strip it down like you're a car thief, take out carpet, passeger seat, back seats, see if you can get a lighter front seat. Remove all sound deading materials, center counsel etc. in other words, anything that has a screw and can be undone, undo it, and i think you'll have the advantage by about 150lbs.

3.1 firebird

When my car was running 16.20's at 82 mph I raced my grandpas 305 TBI auto. WE both were dead even , neither one of us could pull on the other , then we shut off at 90 mph even. Now that I have 3.73's and run a 16 flat at almost 86 mph I;m confident I could take out the 305 TBI. Alot of it deends on the driver, if you spin off the line your dead.

ONEFINE8T9

well the 5 spd will really gice u the advantage. But if its in equal shape to yours than he would take it. It might be even through 1st but after like 30 he would walk. But that depends on the car......

------------------
1989 pontiac firebird
bright red exterior(just repainted)
grey interior
5 spd
305 TBI (stock)
WS.6 formula wheels
3.73 posi rear end
-------------------------
system: 2 10" MTX thunder 2000 in a Professionally done custom bandpass box.
Blaupunkt CD player
Blaupunkt 4x6 and 6x9
600 watt rockford fosgate 4.6 amp

http://members.aol.com/j007golden/Mikey89.html

Garmer

Monkie,

I personally think you could take him! Throw some octane booster in the previous tank, then when you get to about 3 gallons or so, race him! I heard some where that a full tank added like 70 pounds, so if you raced w/ very little you would shed some of those pounds! Is that a correct statement?

P.S. Tell us how it goes!

I raced a 305 TBI, and blew the **** out of him!

------------------
91 RS Camaro
3.1L
Cat Back System, K&N filter,modified air box, Fastchip Stage 2, 160 thermo, Rapidfires and Bosch Wires, soon to come: Homemade Ram Air
5 Air Horns

Kills: 89' 302 Thunderbird, 88' 305 Cutless Supreme, 90' 3.8 Bonneville

FAST RS

You wil beat him every time i race my friends 90 maro with a 305 TBI i waste him its a close race but hes aways at my back fender and you will kill this guy off the line

Monkie

The guy goes to my school and his car is in **** condition as to where mine is almost in perfect condition. Whats so funny is he says he has a 307 from 69 in his car but last time I looked it was a TBI 305 lol. He is pretty red neck, he put a Z28 badge on the dash but all the other outside badges say RS. Go figure. But we are gonna race monday. And I am sure if I dont spin and get him off the start I got it. So just to be cautious Im gonna pop it around 2500 maybe.

------------------
1992 Camaro RS 3.1L
T5 Manual 5 speed
Open Air Intake
Z-28 Exhaust
8.5mm MSD Ignition wires
TB Coolant bypass

Drew

iTrader: (58)

the MPFI 3.1's are setup better than the TBI 305's. I'd put money on a nicely tuned 3.1 taking a L03. Having owned one of just about everything the 3.1 definitely has the advantage.

Macgyver

Drew quit talking out of your *** .

Here's the truth, add an open element and a gutted cat, and bumped timing to an auto 305 TBI in good running condition, and it'll run high 15's. And since most 305 TBI Camaro owners have done that, save for Drew, I'd say you'll lose unless your car loses alot of weight.

[This message has been edited by Macgyver (edited November 25, 2000).]

Monkie

Both of yall shut the **** up I dont wanna hear another bitching post. The MPFI isnt better than the TBI. Its quicker, but not better. The TBI would last alot longer than the MPFI but it is slower. Nothing is better than another it is just set up differently.

------------------
1992 Camaro RS 3.1L
T5 Manual 5 speed
Open Air Intake
Z-28 Exhaust
8.5mm MSD Ignition wires
TB Coolant bypass

Garmer

OH YELL YEAH,

I think Monkie should be the new moderator! J/K



Monkie, also why do you say the TBI, is better?
------------------
91 RS Camaro
3.1L
Cat Back System, K&N filter,modified air box, Fastchip Stage 2, 160 thermo, Rapidfires and Bosch Wires, soon to come: Homemade Ram Air
5 Air Horns

Kills: 89' 302 Thunderbird, 88' 305 Cutless Supreme, 90' 3.8 Bonneville

[This message has been edited by Garmer (edited November 25, 2000).]

Monkie

Well, Im taking this from the TPI vs TBI acually. But Im thinking the MPFI would be more close to the TPI. So, Ive read it in alot of mags that the 305 TPI is alot faster than the TBI but the TBI will last alot longer than the TPI. Just what I read. And as long as we keep this post tech they cant close it

------------------
1992 Camaro RS 3.1L
T5 Manual 5 speed
Open Air Intake
Z-28 Exhaust
8.5mm MSD Ignition wires
TB Coolant bypass

FAST RS

monkie dont sweeat it you will stand a good chance your only downpoint will be 3rd gear he will begin to pull on you. Last nihgt i found out the long awaited question of 2 cars are raceing and a cop sees them who will he pull over.
i was raceing my frineds 70 maro with a 305 and 4 people in my little v-6 =) well i got upto 120 and slowed down cuz he was way the hell behind me well out of no were i see CHP hit there lights i wa sike oh **** well they got my friend stil havent talkedn to him yet then i figured i should get off the freewy cuz i was sure they would radio ahead... so i guess they go for the slower car lol

Monkie

I dunno. Ive got a mean 3rd gear. I dunno how his is the V8 background might kick in, but my 3rd last forever. I can get up to about 80MPH in 3rd. Thats pretty good for a V6. And Ive beaten a 2nd gen 350 which I am very proud of.

------------------
1992 Camaro RS 3.1L
T5 Manual 5 speed
Open Air Intake
Z-28 Exhaust
8.5mm MSD Ignition wires
TB Coolant bypass

Kills:

95 (****) Probe GT
94 4.6L Mustang
91 CRX (dont ask me why he raced me)
More to come

CaliCamaroRS

ok, TBI sucks...plain and simple. you couldn't choke a motor better if you tried. and about it lasting longer....whoop-de-doo.
let's see...'92 TPI 305 5 speed= 235 HP. '92 TBI 305= 170 HP. and TPI IS a form of MPFI.

[This message has been edited by CaliCamaroRS (edited November 25, 2000).]

Macgyver

I agree that stock TBI chokes, and I agree that MPEFI is more efficient.

My RS has ~205 hp with basically free mods, I belive that's higher than the 2.8-3.1 number. Plus I had 255 ft-lbs stock, it's obviously higher now.

But pul-lease, a 1970 305, well, they didn't have a 305 in 1970, so lets assume it was a 307, 200 hp, 300 ft-lbs, but thats net hp, in reality, it was more like 170/255 with a 4000+ lb car.

And a 2ndgen 350, it obviously wasn't an LT-1 or you would have mentioned it, so lets assume it's a 1979 California emmisions LM-1 350, 165 HP, 260ft-lbs.

I think ya'll modding the V6's is great, but I'll be damned to have my car put down because of misinformation

------------------
Shane McConnell
macgyver@nethirdgen.org [*]Owner of a 1991 Camaro RS, 305 5-speed.[*]Owner of a 1979 Camaro Z28, 350/350.[*]Webmaster of www.NEThirdgen.org

Monkie

Damn I swear. LMAO you guys. Last time I checked we didnt put down other fbodies. So whats up with this? Damn.

------------------
1992 Camaro RS 3.1L
T5 Manual 5 speed
Open Air Intake
Z-28 Exhaust
8.5mm MSD Ignition wires
TB Coolant bypass

Kills:

95 (****) Probe GT
94 Mustang GT
91 CRX (dont ask me why he raced me)
2nd Gen Z28 (350) haha to you V8 guys!
More to come

Macgyver

Sometimes, I like stirring things up, no harm done

85f-bird

I honestly think you can pull it off. But, i don't want to see this post become a repeat of my I beat a 86-90 T/A, o.k., remember that if your car has been upkept (engine wise) and his hasn't than you'll most likely walk all over him. A 5spd, will give you a diffinent advantage against a auto too. So, I say, do what you can to reduce weight, and run it. I think you'll turn out o.k.

------------------
the 85 firebird, the first firebird that doesn't burn out....

It eats the pavement!!!

KILL LIST: (SHORT BUT GROWING)

Dodge Daytona (think a 2.2),Honda Acorda (2.0L),2000 Camaro (3.8L),1992 Mustang (V6),1987 Firebird (2.8L),80's probe (4 banin'),90's malibu,90's 4 door Saturn, (wow, that was a slow ride, even slower than me.),91 Celica GT conv.,Acura Integra, 5speed DOHC 4 cylinder. * 86-90 Pontiac T/A, 305ci. (might not have been running well, but i'll count it anyway.)
---came close----
1979 camaro (5.7),1981 camaro (5.7),1982 firebird (5.0) my tires spun, I coulda beat em!!! ,79 El Camino (350, lost by a door),96' Mustang, 3.8L stickshift. (caught him after my car downshifted.)

FAST RS

well my friend goot his ticket for doin 105 andhaveing a minor in the car some dumb cali law. He said thay asked who i was and radioed ahead to nab me for raceing also guess the couldnt find me i love having fog lights on there own fuse=) TBI does suck my friends 90 camaro has it and his car is awalys dead

Tas

you guys got it backwards. The 305 autos strong point is the 255TQ and steep first gear. I used to beat my friends 88GT 5-speed mustang all the way through first. I would powerbrake to right before the wheels would spin then take off. The 305 has no top end HP. The intake and exaust sucks along with the cam. the TBI itself is pretty good. There is a 305 guy running 14.3 on stock cam and almost stock TB. look for NJspeeder.

------------------
-Tas
'89 Formula WS-6
[soon to be Performace Red =) ]

305, TBI, auto, 14x3 chrome flat based open element with K&N, functional Formula hood, cross-flow Flowmaster, '99z28 rear pipes and tips....

Super GRK_Taz World
EFI & Intake Options
AOL IM: superGRtaz
ICQ 82881207

Monkie

Well tomorrow is the day... Right after school. I will let you guys know how it turns out when I get home. I would say wish me luck, but Im pretty sure I wont need it.

------------------
1992 Camaro RS 3.1L
T5 Manual 5 speed
Open Air Intake
Z-28 Exhaust
8.5mm MSD Ignition wires
TB Coolant bypass

Kills:

95 (****) Probe GT
94 Mustang GT
91 CRX (dont ask me why he raced me)
2nd Gen Z28 (350) haha to you V8 guys!
More to come

Jason E

Am I the only V6'er that seems to believe that in a straight line, there's no substitute for cubic inches???

Monkie, the torque will kill you 0-60. I don't mean to disrespect the 3.1, but its true. He has 70 ft/lbs more, and weighs only about 100-150 lbs more...not offsetting the torque increase nearly enough. If you get a good jump on this guy, and his car isn't tuned, then yeah, you can take him. But the point I'm trying to make is you SHOULDN'T be able to...see the difference?? My biggest problem is I have too many road test stats floating in my head

Macgyver,
Since when did a 2nd gen weigh 4000 lbs? Uh, no. The fattest 2nd gen I have a test of is a '79 400 TA weighing in at 3700...older 2nd gens weighed even less, as the 2nd gens porked up through the years.

And BTW, only an idiot guts a cat. This is getting to be really old on these boards...the cat is the LEAST restrictive part of an exhaust system!! You gain NOTHING but smell and pollution by gutting a cat...thats it!!!

I wish you luck Monkie. Anything can happen on the street, and so while I know you SHOULD lose, that doesn't mean you will I've beaten cars that should have creamed me...so good luck!

------------------
Jason E
'89 Camaro RS 2.8
Hypertech chip/K&N filters/Accel 8.8 wires,coil/RapidFires
Eclipse CD and 100x4 amp/Boston plates and 6x9s

JasonEE98 on AOL IM

[This message has been edited by Jason E (edited November 26, 2000).]

Macgyver

The 74 Camaro weighed 3840lbs, close enough.

Add a driver and boom, over 4000 lbs.


"And BTW, only an idiot guts a cat."

I won't respond to that level of immaturity.

"This is getting to be really old on these boards...the cat is the LEAST restrictive part of an exhaust system!!"

Possibly, but nevertheless a RESTRICTION!


"You gain NOTHING but smell and pollution by gutting a cat...thats it!!!"

You gain alot cooler sound, MPG, ET, HP and Torque, I thought I just explained all this, geeze..

You are just jealous that the smog ***** are around in your state, you can't brainwash me into putting a cat on my car.

3.1 firebird

no flames Macguyver, but gutting your cat is illegal. I;ve seen several magazines say you gain between 1-3 hp from gutting your cat, and I;ve talked to a couple performance people who also generally agree gutting the cat is minimal in performance gains. Now if we had race cars, not street driven cars, I could see gutting the cat to knock off .04 from your ET. I;m not saying not to do it, but considering that if you get cuaght and fined it doesnt seem worth it.

Brian K

Well by now we should know, did ya win? On gutting a cat I once did it and my car had a poor exhasut smell that everyone noticed.. I would never do it again.. I feel solid high flow converter is the way to go and you are keeping the environment happy or at least trying to..

Macgyver

Who cares if it's illegal if your state has no inspection?

That's like saying snowblowers are illegal in The Sahara Desert, who's gonna check?

dudelovett

Theyll catch ya up here in BC around Vancouver. We have to pass a stupid thing called Aircare and part of the test is checking to see if you have a proper and functioning cat.

Plus, around here if you have a car that even looks fast, the second you get pulled over by a cop, they'll bust you on anything they can. I had a friend get pulled over in his Stang and he got busted for no front lisence plate, a leak in the exhaust manifold, bald tires, no cats and a bypass of the mufflers (side pipes). Now he cant put the car on the road til all this gets fixed and checked by a certified mechanic.

But thats what happens when 4 ppl die in one year from street racing....

------------------
1991 Firebird Formula, 305, TPI, Auto...stock till I get some money!!!
Former owner of an 88 2.8 Firebird....RIP

Grim Reaper

I hear you Dude...but some of the people working at AirCare are not exactly the shiniest penny in the fountain.

I know people that have replaced their cat(s) with a glasspack so it looked like a cat but wasn't. The problem with the BC system is that all you have to do is "blow the number", which for most cars is quite easy to do without a cat if your engine is in a good state of tune.

But, there is another warning for BC drivers and that is, if your car was built in 1992 or later, you can't get an "waiver" by only having enough work done by a certified AirCare mechanic (another joke) to a certain $ limit based on the age of your vehicle. Cars built in 1992 or later have to spend whatever is necessary to get the car to pass. Pre-1992 cars have a graduated limit based on the year the car was built.

Another good reason to get a pre-1992 car.

dudelovett

Yeah, Ive had a few friends run a pipe through a hollw cat so it looked like a cat. One guy got busted though, so most ppl i know stopped doing it.

------------------
1991 Firebird Formula, 305, TPI, Auto...stock till I get some money!!!
Former owner of an 88 2.8 Firebird....RIP

Jason E

Macgyver,

You won't respond to MY immaturity? Right buddy...gutting a cat and helping to wreck the environment is very mature. And I am right...only an idiot guts a cat when it is the LEAST restrictive part. Is it still a restriction? If you had straight pipes, I'd say yes, otherwise no!! The flow taken away by a cat is far less than the restriction that the rest of the bends in the exhaust make. Therefore, taking a cat and gutting it, if not irresponsible, is just dumb and a waste of time.

And since when does a '74 weigh that much?? I'd be interested to see where you got those numbers seeing as how I have a '73 Motor Trend road test with a 350 coupe weighing 3,336. I highly doubt the car gained 500 lbs for '74 when the aluminum bumpers added only 40 lbs to the car!

Even though you don't have emissions standards to meet, use a little common sense. And don't lecture me on maturity when you're the one acting foolish. To have your car harm the environment much more to get 1 lousy HP isn't mature. Want better sound? Get a friggen Flowmaster..if that isn't loud enough for ya, you're deaf

[This message has been edited by Jason E (edited November 27, 2000).]

94Camaro

hey macguyver...

who cares if its illegal for me to shoot you, and all of your family if your state doesnt trace guns?

same principal. you are seriously f***ing up the environment. remember dumbass, you have to breate the **** you put into the air, including all the carbon that comes out of your car. and when you breath that crap, you get lung cancer..and you can die too..just put your mouth right on your exhaust pipe..and take a big wiff...we'll see how long you live. get the idea?

Monkie

Ok here is what happened.....

Today didnt start out like I had planned. I was late to first period so I had after school detention. So I got out of after school at 4:05 where as school gets out at 3:30. I figured the guy that wanted to race had already left and he did. But as I was pulling out of the Jr. lot I see an Aqua color RS fly by me almost ****ing tearing my nose off because I was sticking out in the road a little. So I catch up to him and guess who it was... Mr. TBI. So it was on. The first light that we came to was the only light between school and where I turn off to go to my girl friend's house. So I had to make it count, wasnt gonna be a second chance. Well he got to the light first then I pull next to him. Bitch is revin his engine before I even get to him (whats so funny is his car isnt as loud as mine is. I dont understand that). So we get side by side, no cops for as far as I can see, radar isnt picking any up, so it was gonna happen. We both watched the other light turn yellow and so we get the green and he spun his tires and so did I cause I didnt get the jump I had wished for. But I did get a little jump on him and after that what can I say....He never got the jump back. I beat him by a good half a car. It had to have been the best race I have had yet. And dont let anyone tell you that the TBI is slow because if I hadnt had my mods there is now way I would have beat him I dont think. But thats that and thats another kill...

------------------
1992 Camaro RS 3.1L
T5 Manual 5 speed
Open Air Intake
Z-28 Exhaust
8.5mm MSD Ignition wires
TB Coolant bypass

Kills:

95 (****) Probe GT
94 Mustang GT
91 CRX (dont ask me why he raced me)
2nd Gen Z28 (350) haha to you V8 guys!
1992 RS 305 TBI (good race)
More to come

Jason E

Congrats Monkie! Now just don't blow the motor, ok??

85f-bird

nice kill bud. real nice.

------------------
the 85 firebird, the first firebird that doesn't burn out....

It eats the pavement!!!

KILL LIST: (SHORT BUT GROWING)

Dodge Daytona (think a 2.2),Honda Acorda (2.0L),2000 Camaro (3.8L),1992 Mustang (V6),1987 Firebird (2.8L),80's probe (4 banin'),90's malibu,90's 4 door Saturn, (wow, that was a slow ride, even slower than me.),91 Celica GT conv.,Acura Integra, 5speed DOHC 4 cylinder. * 86-90 Pontiac T/A, 305ci. (might not have been running well, but i'll count it anyway.)
---came close----
1979 camaro (5.7),1981 camaro (5.7),1982 firebird (5.0) my tires spun, I coulda beat em!!! ,79 El Camino (350, lost by a door),96' Mustang, 3.8L stickshift. (caught him after my car downshifted.)

Monkie

LMAO, If what Im thinking about is what you are talking about.....LMAO, I wont!

------------------
1992 Camaro RS 3.1L
T5 Manual 5 speed
Open Air Intake
Z-28 Exhaust
8.5mm MSD Ignition wires
TB Coolant bypass

Kills:

95 (****) Probe GT
94 Mustang GT
91 CRX (dont ask me why he raced me)
2nd Gen Z28 (350) haha to you V8 guys!
1992 RS 305 TBI (good race)
More to come

Macgyver

Good kill, now gut your cat and beat him by a whole car length

Oh, and you should read this: http://www.junkscience.com/news2/catalyt.htm

And for the other side, sort of... http://www.junkscience.com/dec98/catcon.htm

MY car is in perfect tune.

I got my weight numbers from nastyz28.com The Thirdgen.org of second gens, HIGHLY accurate info. The 74 Camaro didn't have aluminum bumpers, it had A steel one, same as my 79, and they are heavy as ****. The 77 Camaro also weighed around 3800 lbs.


It's spelled M-a-c-g-y-v-e-r, call me Shane if you can't spell.

I guess I'm a dumbass cause gutting my cat DID make a difference on my car, and I don't buy into the catalytic converter hype. If Catalytic converters are so great, how come nearly all non-stock restored cars don't use them? Restorers have the option, yet they still don't take it.

I know gutting my cat made a big difference, so does everyone else that has done it. It may be a small restriction, but it's still a restriction, so it's out the door You can't feel a 1 hp gain, I FELT the gain from gutting my cat.

Macgyver

Calling me an idiot is immaturity, I haven't called any of you any names, save for Drew, Drew and I go way back, so that's allowed, I'm not the one being immature here.

Tas

gutting your cat isn't the only part of the exaust. You need some backpressure for torque. When looking for and exaust for my friend 88GT we chose a Hooker no cat H pipe. The alternative would have been high flow cat H pipe and Magnaflows or borlas. Since the Hookers are chambered we got the backpressure from there. Sounds good as hell.

If anyone's so pissy about the environment they better be a vegitarian. You know how much cows fart?


------------------
-Tas
'89 Formula WS-6
[soon to be Performace Red =) ]

305, TBI, auto, 14x3 chrome flat based open element with K&N, functional Formula hood, cross-flow Flowmaster, '99z28 rear pipes and tips....

Super GRK_Taz World
EFI & Intake Options
AOL IM: superGRtaz
ICQ 82881207


[This message has been edited by Tas (edited November 27, 2000).]

orange rocket

Well to all, I must say thanks to Jason E to
pointing out this site. First to the 3.1 vs.V8. Torque is a must and 305 definetly has more of it. I only will drive a stick but how much do you guys think the auto brings down 305, not enough! To the more importaint subject, cats. Why don't I just hollow em out on my 2000 T/A? OHHH it might add a few horse power but is it worth the enviroment or the 86 camaro what the hell why not! Why do we even need em... I mean a few ponies on every car think of the power!!! Ony time you should have no cats is on the track besides that get more power out of motor other ways that little power isn't that hard to get unless you are a very very cheep ... Why even have a exaust? Thanks

Pablo

iTrader: (1)

backpressure is always bad, people confuse backpressure with scavenging

a cat could probably increase scavenging slightly inthat it gets the exhaust super hot to where its "eager" to get out of the tailpipe, but then again, its still a restriction. This is why you sometimes see catless motors make more hp but slightly less torque

Pablo

iTrader: (1)

and cats helping the environment

their existence increases NOX emissions and a few other things (sulfur?) basically trade one pollutant for another i think the biggest improvements in pollution is better engine management. Back when my 305 TBI was stock I passed emissions with no cat whatsoever, you arent gonna end the world if you drive without a cat

Jason E

I didn't call YOU an idiot, but I do feel it is idiotic to gut a cat. I am not the only one on this board who feels this way either. I was wrong for implying anyone here is an idiot though, and for that you have my apology.

Overall, there have been several posts here about gutting cats, and more often than not, people don't think its a good idea, or that it gives you that big of a gain. When Hot Rod can test a 502 for christ sakes and note it doesn't make much of a difference performance wise with or without a cat, I tend to believe Hot Rod. I've seen several sites say that gutting a cat yields no benefit...so thats where I gather my opinions from. You have yours, I have mine.

As for the weight issue, I have a period road test that says one thing, you have the website. Hard to say who is right.

As for Tas, LMFAO at the cows!! Dude, I live near a cow farm...yeah, cows suck As for me being a veggie?? Quite the opposite...WAY too many BK visits!! The point I am trying to make is, the environment is in ****ty enough shape as it is. For those of you who don't believe me, go take an environmental sciences class if you're in school. Cats are integral to an emissions system...period. I know there are other people here who agree with me too.

Chevy267V8

Ok first of all, cats DO NOT increase NOx emissions. Around 1981 dual bed cats were introduced. One bed is the oxidizing side, the other is the reducing side. One reduces your HC and CO, while the other reduces NOx, along with your EGR valve (incase you ever wondered what your EGR valve actually does). Currently in massachusetts and california, NOx emissions are tested along with HC and CO. PABLO, your from Florida? bring your cat-less TBI305 up here and watch yourself get laughed right outta the inspection bay. As for back pressure, cats are about the least restrictive part of your exhaust system. You want power? your better off losing your mufflers, until you get stopped by the sound pollution patrol. So for all you f**koffs out there who wanna gut or lose your cats, I'll be laughing my a$$ off in 20 years when there's no gas and no blue sky to take your precious t-tops off and cruise under. Happy tuning a$$holes. And if your wondering about my credentials, I'm a technician with a Buick dealership. My 82 Impala just passed a 2000 emissions tests with the new cat I put on it in August.. And it's 3 years out of having to pass tests anymore!

orange rocket

hands down to pablo.I must say back pressure is bad huh? So run your exaust, manafold out with nothing after them. Red line it and lets see what you do to your valves, because I am sure your stock motor won't be doing to much when you suck a valve.With out major head mods and stiffer valve springs the motor, stock uses some of that pressure to operate the heads and timing. With no pressure they will float and end up sucking one.Especially now with cars that adjust so much of their mixtures based on exaust what will no pressure or exaust do??

Macgyver

Belive the hype, spend your money on cats, I'm gonna be polluting my *** off all the way down the track....

I'm surprized they don't make every Top Fuel dragster have a high-flow cat on every header outlet in CA, wacky-*** state man.