seiplentz

iTrader: (2)

Looking for cam suggestions for my motor rebuild. Nothing crazy its a street car Needs to be easily tuned as well. Well mildly easy. Its flat tappet also and dont plan on switching to roller.

350 with 113 heads and an HSR. 24lb injectors and 58mm TB. 3k stall on 700r4. Was looking at the xfi268 but not sure about the max lift on the heads. Will run 1.5 rockers and switch to comp beehives or LT4 springs if needed.

seiplentz

iTrader: (2)

I was just recommended the Voodoo 268/276 from lunati. It just made top of my list based on not as extreme lift. May be a little tougher to tune. What do you guys think?

I'm gonna use comp Pro magnum lifters. Stock rockers and hopefully stock pushrods. Do the 113 heads use a different length pushrod?

Advertised Duration (Int/Exh): 268/276
Duration @ .050 (Int/Exh): 227/233
Gross Valve Lift (Int/Exh): .489/.504
LSA/ICL: 110/106
Valve Lash (Int/Exh): Hyd/Hyd
RPM Range: 1800-6200

86CamaroDan

close to my cam 502/520 224/236 but its on a 113 LSA. Your gonna need to measure pushrod length for any cam swap situation.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Yeah thats about as big as i would go on stock 113’s

Get them setup for the lift but keep duration around 224-227 and no more

seiplentz

iTrader: (2)

Lunati is just a tad more Im not sure what this does other then events?

Lunati recommended these springs for that cam
Type: Single With Damper
O.D. Outer: 1.260"
I.D. Outer: .876"
I.D. Inner: N/A
Coil Bind: 1.028"
Seat Load: 98 @ 1.750"
Open Load: 330 @ 1.250"
Rate (lbs/in): 462
Quantity: 16

NoEmissions84TA

iTrader: (1)

To me, those springs are a little stiff - you said street car.
These springs offer excellent fatigue life and load loss characteristics that are ideally suited for Saturday night oval track or drag racing.
You will want to do the break-in with your stock (softer) valve springs (if they will not coil bind with your valve lift).
I would like to see about 115 lbs on the seat and 275 lbs open for your running springs.
I would choose another spring.

seiplentz

iTrader: (2)

The heads are stock re-manufactured. So not sure if the springs can handle the lift. I am no expert with this but doing tons of research and asking a lot of questions. Are you saying I cannot break the cam in with the springs Lunati recommended? Is there a set you recommend to install once?

NoEmissions84TA

iTrader: (1)

Unfortunately, no there is not 1 spring that will work for break-in and running in your case. This is the problem:
Seat Load: 98 @ 1.750"
Open Load: 330 @ 1.250"
Rate (lbs/in): 462
If you were to use the springs Lunati recommends, set up as recommended, it's that 330# over the nose that is the problem. This is yet another reason why roller camshafts are easier in this scenario - rollers do not have to go through the break-in phase. Flat tappets do. 330# is too much pressure for break-in. It's actually too much for a daily driver. That's why Lunati's notes say ideally suited for Saturday night oval track or drag racing.
Now there will be other members that are going to chime in saying that they have gotten away with it in the past. And so have I, but it is still not recommended. Look at it this way, you are spending a lot of money to put your engine together, and I assume you want it to live a long, trouble-free life??? There are 16 lobes on that camshaft and you need ALL of them to make it through the break-in process. 15/16 won't cut it.
When failure occurs, the camshaft's lobes get machined away by the lifters. That super hard and sharp cast iron shrapnel gets circulated through your entire engine, destroying everything. EVERYTHING!
You have 2 options: low ratio rockers (1.3) used for break-in, or a softer set of valve springs used for break-in only. Then you switch over to your running springs after a successful break-in. Stock valve springs are INEXPENSIVE. It's just a little more work involved. It's simply what you have to do if you want to use flat tappets.
Now if you were using dual springs, for break-in you could just remove the inner spring and replace it after the break-in.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Thats why roller cams are worth it lol

seiplentz

iTrader: (2)

I wish I could just not in the budget this time. id like to go all out on a 383 build with AFR 195s. But I'm also repainting the car which is why the motor is out. And i found low compression on 3 cylinders from exhaust valves. Which is why the head and cam swap.

So I can use the stock springs on the heads now for break in? Then switch to the Lunati springs? I read somewhere about some Z28 springs being used on these heads for decent lift.

Thank you for the recommendations.

NoEmissions84TA

iTrader: (1)

So I can use the stock springs on the heads now for break in? Then switch to the Lunati springs? I read somewhere about some Z28 springs being used on these heads for decent lift.

IF, AND ONLY IF, they will not coil bind at full valve lift!!!!!
But I would use a slightly weaker spring for normal running.
I can help you choose a spring. But I will need the measurements of what diameter spring will fit in your spring pockets, what retainers & locks you are using, target installed height, etc.
It sounds like you need the needle-in-the-haystack spring that took me a lot of time searching for my combination. I am using an ISKY camshaft (264-MEGA HYDRAULIC FT) in my engine and ISKY Quiet Power 202HY Anti-Pump-Up lifters. I ended also using ISKY valve springs.
Here are the notes from my build:

Camshaft new ISKY Grind No./Type: 264-MEGA HYDRAULIC FT**
Application: Tremendous torque & good mid-range power.
9-10.5:1 compr., good idle, stock converter.
3.23-3.70 axle ratio. Up to 625 CFM Carb.
RPM-Range: 2000-5800
Valve Lift Int/Ext: .450/.450 (1.5), .480/.480 (1.6)
Valve Lash Hot Int/Ext: .000/.000
ADV Duration Int/Ext: 264/264
.050 Duration Int/Ext: 214/214
Lobe Center: 108 108° LSA /108° ICL = straight up

Lifters new ISKY Quiet Power 202HY Anti-Pump-Up
Hydraulic flat tappet Superlifters (2 oil holes)
Manufactured by Johnson/HyLift/Topline

Springs ISKY 235D
Type/MatL: OUTER W/DAMPER (CHROME SILICON)
Color Code: BLUE
Individual Spring Part Numbers IN/O: N/A
O.D.: 1.260
I.D.: .886
Seat Pressure: 130 lbs @1.750
Open Pressure: 320 lbs @1.200
Rate Per Inch: 350 (I calc 345.45#)
Coil Bind: 1.150
Max Net Lift: .550
tip conditioning on both ends, including dampers, by me

Heated ISKY valve springs in oven to 220°F and soaked them in the drained and strained break-in oil before dumping it back into the engine.

Using Alex's (extra clearance – retainer to seal) 99100-1 retainers (16 gm) and Crane Machined STD locks for an installed height of 1.800" (calc 112.5# seat, 278# open), measured with my spring tester – 124# seat, 304# .480" lift

.900" – bottom of retainer to top of valve guide
.750" – retainer to valve seal (Alex fixed-body .558")
.270" clearance retainer-to-seal (.750 - .480 v.l.) (.090" min preferred, .060" min)
.170" clearance before coil bind (1.150") (.060" min preferred)

**With this camshaft, ISKY recommends:

ISKY - VALVE SPRINGS 205D
Type/MatL: DUAL W/DAMPER (CHROME SILICON)
Color Code: YELLOW
Individual Spring Part Numbers IN/O: N/A
O.D.: 1.260
I.D.: .886
Seat Pressure: 115 lbs @1.700
Open Pressure: 268 lbs @1.210
Rate Per Inch: 310
Coil Bind: 1.160
Max Net Lift: .490　

Camshaft broken in with SSI VS-380 springs (267#/in)
VS-380 2.0300 1.222/1.238 0.868/.884 0.177 76-84 @ 1.70 194-206 @ 1.25 6.60 RH 1.1500
At 1.715, approx. 75# on seat, 173# valve open
KMotion retainers, locks, and no valve seals to ensure oiling of the valve guides.

I ended up using the ISKY 235D springs, but my installed height was 1.800". Notice the clearances I have because of this.
You will probably have to use the 205D springs, but because you would end up so close to coil bind, you would want to set them at a greater installed height.
But you could also copy the setup I used - that is why I posted it.

I just did a little searching - this might be a good choice : https://www.speedwaymotors.com/Speed...Set-16,88.html

NoEmissions84TA

iTrader: (1)

Are 113 heads Vortec?

seiplentz

iTrader: (2)

No they are the 113 L98 vette heads. Again I appreciate the info. I called Lunati again yesterday and asked them about break in with those springs. They said it would be ok. But I am def reconsidering this.

My only concern with proper break in is the EFI and a tune that can safely run my setup for the 25min break in period. My car will also be remaining in the shop for the rest of the paint work after the engine goes in and will only be started to move it around and a 3 mile ride home.

I did not do any of this with my last cam swap 15 years ago. I started the motor adjusted the rockers and off i went. lol

NoEmissions84TA

iTrader: (1)

Read this: http://www.cranecams.com/userfiles/file/334-343.pdf
Then look at Crane's 96887-16 spring.

Alex's Parts has a spring kit just for your L98 heads: https://www.alexsparts.com/lt1-valve...seat-pressure/

Just set them up for an installed height closer to 1.800" and your spring pressures will be great for your camshaft.

seiplentz

iTrader: (2)

So it looks like the heads have brand new LT4 valve springs installed. Atleast there is green paint on them like GM says there should be. Can anyone confirm this?

Tuned Performance

iTrader: (92)

Not 100% positive but looks like lt4 springs with the green stripe.
The instal height should be checked as well as retainer to guide for lift over .470

seiplentz

iTrader: (2)

Machine shop checked the heads and springs today. They said I would be good for the lunati cam with a rocker change as the stocks will bind at that lift. Springs will be fine according to them as long as rpm is kept under 6k. Thanks everyone for the time to help and educate me with this..

Spring specs as they tested.
Installed height 1.790
seat pressure 100 lbs
open pressure 290 lbs

mmadden55

Use a high zinc break in oil like Amsoil or Joe Gibbs Racing oil.