So I'm looking around for a paint gun now, and I've heard good things about DevilBiss... they arent the best, but they arent the worst either.

I'm curious as to what size tips I would need. I see them with 1.3mm - 2.2mm. It seems like 1.3mm is the "best" one. Why is that? What exactly is the difference in size of fluid tips supposed to do?


The one that I'm looking at right now is the one in this auction http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...category=43987

Is that a good one for a good price? It comes w/ the case and regulator. I'm not completely sure what all excess tools I'll need to start painting, but I'm sure I'll need a regulator lol.


Also, which of these DevilBiss guns conserve the most paint? I figure the more paint I can conserve, the quicker this gun will pay itself off.



Also, another thing... what size air compressor would be needed minimally to shoot like a quick layer around the car w/o stopping for air? The gun in that auction said it used low CFM (22) but I've looked around and the air compressors that support 22 CFM are in the 400 + dollar range.

 

To get 22CFM last I checked would cost around $1200 for an air compressor. That's why I'm not going with a gun that takes ~20CFM, I think that's ridiculous, there must be a way to use a reasonable amount, and not need an industrial air compressor on 3 phase power...

Larger diameter tips, eg. 2.1mm are for thicker stuff, like your primers and what-not. 1.3 is very small, that's more of a clear coat thing. I think 1.5-1.7mm is good for base coat.
This is just going by what i've read, no real experience here.
I think it'll come with a few tips right? and you can interchange based on what you're spraying, or you could get a 1.7mm and use it for all.

You will need some sort of air drying mechanism, depends on how high quality you want the paint job to be.


EDIT: I am in no way an expert, but these are a few hints to get the ball rolling.

 

i base with a 1.3 tip and clear with a 1.4 tip everyday. ive never used DeVILBISS guns. i hear that there pretty good. i use sata jet guns. this is the gun i clear with http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...category=43987

 

Go with the sata. For the little bit extra money it is way way worth it. I just got mine a few weeks ago. It is is great.. I got the 1.4 and thats all I use. For clears, base, and primer. (i never use high build primer so I don't need the bigger tips) My compressor is 15.3 ( i think) CFM at 90 psi. It keeps up with gun just fine. I spray at about 25 PSI.

Get some kinda of fitler on the compressor. and I use them little ones that go on the gun.

I have never used a DevilBiss gun but I have not heard good things about them. There high end guns i would think are good. But them cheaper ones have heard bad things about. And another nice thing about the sata is there is no packing in the gun. So u can take it apart a ton of times and it will allways work good.

I don't know what one conserves the most paint.I know its not mine. But as long as the paint turns out good it does not matter to me.

 

I thought devibliss was up there with Sata as one of "the good ones".... the finishline series are supposed to be "good for the money" at least. (according to autobody.com )

Jay, could you explain that? I've never heard of packing in the gun... does it make it more difficult to take apart to clean? or rebuild or?

25psi, that's an HVLP right?

Yea, I heard it's common to just use about a 1.5mm tip... High build primers are the only ones that like the bigger tips?

Sorry to take over your thread there sellman, but some of these questions I was itching to ask for a while

 

Hi sellmanb, I too have just finished the long and hard study of "paint gun quality for the right price". If you are on a budget I would consider theSharpe Finex orDeviBiss Finishline III

I chose the Devilbiss F3 Master kit so that I would have all the tips I needed without having to compromise and they have many more accessories for later upgrades. I also heard from many people on forums, local paint shops, and my local paint mixer that they are one of the hottest guns on the market. Don't get me wrong Sata is one of the best names on the marked but highly overpriced as one paint jobber told me "it's kind of like comparing Craftsman wrench to a Snap On, it does the same damn thing you just pay more for one; if it shoots good, it shoots good no matter the name! nuff said". He also told me the gun is just the tool the way it looks afterwards is all on the person who operates it. I took this in to serious detail when I made my purchase because he is a highly skilled painter and a strait shooter. That’s just my info, I am sure some of the guys in here may disagree but that’s what my research has found (remember I am a painter rookie also). Please don’t be offended SATA ****'s haha just kidding!

 

About that devibliss. I talked to len about it over at autobodystore. And yes for the money its not bad he said. I have never used one. So I'm just going from what i have heard. But nothing like the sata. I paided 375.00 for my sata. Its the same one as the one on ebay. For 250.00 I would rather have that sata over the devibliss any day. I was going to buy the finsh line 3 only reasson i got my sata was i got a good deal on it. I don't think someone painting at home every now and than needs a sata. Hell i painted 4 cars with a cheap gun from matco. worked fine. So I'm sure the devibliss is good. and that finsh line 3 only needs 9.9 cfm @40 PSI. A husky compressor and home depot will keep up with that

Ok i was wrong the sata does have packing. Just looked it up. Its called the needle packing. Pretty much its what keeps the paint from just coming out. I don't know the break down on the guns. Just going from what i have heard. The painter at my work (30 years) told me that U can take apart a sata a ton of times and it will still work fine. I know I bought a 170 bucks shape I took it apart 2 times and it never worked again. leaks all over. Maybe the packing in that sata is made out of metal.

satas needs 15.3 cfm @29PSI So thats what I go by I use 25 to 30 PSI ... I think it has something to do with atomizeing the paint. Sata guns do it at a lower PSI. But need a higher CFM. I could be wrong On all this. But i think thats how it goes

 

hmm, yea, my motivation is I don't have 240V in my garage, so i'm stuck trying to figure out a way to get a compressor that takes 120V and gets the most CFM and find a gun that'll work with that....
pretty weak selection and all in the LOW end guns....
well, I think I might buy a "big" 120V compressor for an impact gun etc, then rent another 120V compressor and like a 60gallon tank if possible, hook them all up together, spray then return the smaller compressor and tank.... I think that's my only solution..


here is a question for anyone: (sorry to stray from the topic)
Has anyone painted a car with a 120V compressor? (and gun info perhaps?)

 

yep i have. I don't remmber the cfm and all that. But I know it was a oil less one and i thing it was a 3/ 3.5 HP 15 gal tank. It sucked. BUt it did work. Just make sure u have enuff air to paint the section u are doing than let it build up again.Might be able to get away with this one
sorry for taking over post

o well can not get link to work

 

this one from home depot

 

yea, the link didn't work for me...

EDIT: You mean the VT6315? 5hp, 26gallon, 5.8CFM@90, 6.4@40 right? hmm....

I was thinking of this:
http://www.sears.com/sr/javasr/produ...ab=spe#tablink

Or there is a 30 gallon one, but it's oilless (LOUD right?)
I figured almost 9cfm at 40psi is good enough for a decent quality HVLP gun... I'm doing black, so I can go panel at a time if I wanted I suppose....
Hope this helps sellman!

 

yep thay are loud. But all are Mine is loud and i have a 6 hp 60 gal 240v. I think that one would work. I would get the 30 gal stand up one. Its like the one from homedepot. But the one at HD is not the oil less one. But the cfm are lower. That should work the devibliss finishline 3. Should be able to do the hole side with out stoping.

 

Glad that I posted this... I'm milking info

I'm glad we're in the same boat Sonix... I dont feel the urge to spend an ungodly amount of money on a compressor that is industrial sized, or even have to have an electrician come out to install bigger volt outlets in my garage lol.

I think I'm going to go w/ the Finishline 3, and grab a 1.3 and 1.4 sized tips for them. I am assuming that any colors that any candy colors that I mix in w/ the clear to give it that colored glare will not make the clearcoat all that much thicker, and would still need a 1.4?


Loco Kano that was a nice little writeup you did, thank you very much I'm glad you were willing to share your findings with us

Jay thanks so much for your seasoned experienced advice, I am learning a lot and figuring out what I need to buy and what will "suffice for now" from you

 

haha, oh... my name is Jay too, but I figured since it's not my screen name, and I only sign my posts -J, you probably didn't mean me

Anyway, just wondering, the 30gallon that I mentioned was oil-less, and the 26 gallon (non-upright), was oiled, and put out a tiny bit more CFM @90 (6.8 compared to 6.4), and cost another $80.... Is it worth it for a decrease in noise and heat to go oiled? and longer life?

sellman, why get a 1.3 and 1.4mm tip? those are pretty close... If I was you i'd get a 1.4mm and 2.0 mm or something....

Anyway, yes, thanks for the info Jay, very handy.. -J

 

Ahhh don't thank me. I could be all wrong than u 2 will get mad at me. I'm learning this paint stuff to. So alot of what i know is what i have picked the painters mind at work about. Now body work thats what I know and do for a liveing.

I think I would want the bigger tank one. But it would be better if it was a belt drive one. eathier one i think will work.


On tip sizes I make sure all my filler work is stright and there is no deep scratches before I prime. If u do that theres no reason to have to use high buid primers.So no need for them huge tips. Unless u are going to be spraying heavy metallics. Less paint on the car the better. I use the 1.4 works good

 

This is the compressor I just bought. You get craftman tools with it.My air compressor

I have not sprayed with it yet, but I think it should do the job.

It has a 6 hp motor, 33 gal tank and has 8.6 scfm at 40 psi.
I also got a $20 mail in rebate.

 

That is a great compressor for a great price! The only thing that I dont see on it is the drive time.

All compressors have a % of time that they can run at a certain PSI before needing to run. Some have a 50% run time, others have a 75% run time, and the more expensive ones have a 100% run time.

I am curious as to which one that one is, but I too think that it will do the job. Think I might be applying for a Sears card

 

i got the 30 gallon 6 hp oil free craftsman compressor. partially cuz I only have 120 in the garage. I only used it to primer my camaro, but it seemed to do fine.

 

Yea, the only reason I wasn't leaning towards that compressor that bluegrassz mentioned was because it was oilless, so I figured it'd be super loud...

belt drive? hmm, I don't know anything about that...
But since I need the tools, I think i'll be heading towards that craftsman one real soon... -J

 

My compressor really isnt that loud. I even have it inside the garage. I keep it on the oppisite end of the garage that I am working on, but the sound dosent bother me.

 

You may get additional discount if you put it on a sears card or open an account. I will check out the paperwork with the compressor and see if I can find the run time %.

Oh yeah, the tools are real nice and come in a case. Only drawback I found was that the air fittings are not great quality. They still work, but I might invest in some better ones later on. They are cheap, so no real biggie!


Oh yeah, Mine came with a 1/2 impact wrench!! The add said 3/8's.

 

sweet, thanks for the info Blugrassz

It's a craftsman air compressor, so are the tools craftsman as well? If so that is awsome because I love to break those things and get brand new ones for free

 

Yep, all the tools are craftsman.

 

Becareful with that 120 6hp craftsman, that is what I have and it's loud as hell and this being in a 30x60' shop on the other side. One of the other draw backs is it sucks about all juice from the braker its on so dont try to run anything else...I have to put my sterio and drop lights on another breaker. But besides that it is a good machine, work well...

 

Thanks for the warning I will have to keep that in mind about the breaker.

I am not too concerned with noise since I wont be using this compressor except when I need to paint something or I have a bolt that NEEDS an air tool.

Thanks again for the insight on that compressor

 

yeah my little CH compressor did that after it ran for about a hour.. Is there 220 any were on the out side off your house? Cuz what i did my mom had a hot tub out side. That did not work any more. I just ran a 8gauge 3 wire core to it. I still have it the same way at my house so I can move it around if need be.

 

You guys might want to be a little careful with those compressors. I was at autobodystore few weeks ago and caught one post where people discussed this type of thing.

Major problem with oil-less is not the noise, it is the fact that it doesn't have oil. Which means unlike oiled models, its duty cycle is not anywhere near 100%. So while it can keep up for a while (which is also doubtful. mine is rated right below what my gun wants), it will heat up and destroy itself if not allowed some rest time. My compressor (5.5hp 33 gal) was $260. For $190 more I could have gotten 7 hp, 2 stage, oiled 60 gal from Sears.

Don't know about anyone else. I am kicking myself for making that decision. So if anyone is still considering what compressor to buy, this is something to think about.

 

hey VILeninDM whats the cfm on yours. I have a 6hp 60 gal. oilless. But i'm looking for a 2stage. I looked at the one at homedepot but the CFM's were less than mine

 

that crafstman compressor is junk i have one. its fine for some sanding and running air tools but it did not paint the car without looking for more air, i could tell when primimng with the finish line 3 gun all of a sudden the paint would not lay right and the compressor was cranking away but not maintaining enough pressure. and oiless is way louder than i can take in my double oversized garage. i would not reccomend it or get another one.

belt driven is usually an oil filled compressor, when i painted the car i used a husky and the sear compressor tied together and i had no problems. so look for something 1/ 1/2 the size of the sear one and you will be good. one important point the bigger the compressor the cooler it runs the less chance of water in your air ruining your paint.

jeff

 

One other tip that no one thinks about( I did it to ) If u are painting in the grage make sure u have a some what desent exhust fan. U don't want a ton of paint(fumes) building up. With one of them little compressors kicking on and off.

And one more should have a good fresh air mask. So it won't be the last car u can paint.

 

What's a fresh air mask? That's something I don't know about...


Yea, the only "good" way to paint a car is with a 240V compressor... So i'm stuck...
I think i'll get that oiled 26gallon one, use it for an impact gun etc, then when i'm painting, I'll rent another pancake style one (5CFM or so..) and run them together, with a few long extension cords (one each) so the compressors are outside, to cut down on them being too hot and stuff, then paint inside... Or buy the 26 gallon oiled compressor, and buy another tank, like 40 gallon or something...
If I can do it in the winter (heated garage), the compressors probably won't be able to overheat.... -J

 

A freah air Respirator. Is a like a air pump that is far away from the painting area. That blows fresh air into your mask. They are not cheap. I paid like 500 for mine. U can find them cheper on ebay. I painted alot of cars with out one. And i'm sure i will be paying for it when I'm older. If u do not have a real good exhust set up I would not paint with out this. Even with a regular Respirator still going to breath that stuff in.

If u paint in the winter in the heat garage make sure the pilot light is not on . And I know U would not turn the heater on. In the winter i will heat up my garage really hot that shut every thing off. All I can do is prime. It gets to cold to fast to spray base coat or clear

 

compressor I have is rated at 7.8cfm @ 40 psi and the gun says it needs 6-9 cfm @ 30-40psi. I actually have a second compressor (borrowed from a friend) which is 6.5 cfm @ 40 psi and was thinking of hooking booth of them up.

I am painting solid black, so I might get away with doing panel at a time, but still thinking of just buying one decent unit. Or maybe I should just borrow another one and have 3 work in parallel . I have 150 Amp service in the garage, so finding a circuit wouldn't be a problem.

Those fresh air systems are nice, but I think they pay off only if you do more than one or two cars. Len said that the only problem with respirators is that you have to change the filter cartridges often (only good for 40 hours or something after you open the package), so doing a lot of painting simple respirator will also get expensive (either in terms of money or brain cells), but for one car they should work fine if used properly.

So now that we are on general topic of spraying in your garage, what do people do about filtering air going to the gun? I'll probably use the ice bucket Jeff mentioned a while back, but still don't know what air filter to go with. They range from 20 to 500 bucks.

 

for filting water I have the piping going up hill, Have a filer paid 35 bucks for it. And I put them little through away filters on my gun.. I don't have a prob with water.

simple respirator will not filter out ISO. Thats what f's up your brain. But i know the fresh air ones are alot. I painted cars with them .Allways felt crappy after. But what len told me that 40 hours is cut way way down if u don't have good venting. The painter at are work uses them but we have a good downdraft booth, U can go in there with no mask and not smell anything. I saw the fresh air mask on ebay for 250. After u buy a good respirator and about 2 or 3 sets of filters. U are not going to be that far from 250.

Thats all that 2 stage puts out? I have a bluepoint single stage and it puts out 15.3 cfm at 50 psi.

Can u hook all them compressors up? Would suck if one went out or something in the middle of painting

 

forgot pics... This is the set up of my blower and comprosser. When I'm paint i crack that valve open a little to let water drop out.

 

cheaper filter

 

The rating were for the compressors I have now. Larger one was the "garbage" 5.5 HP from sears and the other one was campbell-h[something] from a friend.

I was thinking of getting this one: http://www.sears.com/sr/javasr/produ...ab=spe#tablink . Rated 12.4 @ 40 and it's oiled so you don't have to worry about duty cycle.

Here's few pictures of my booth:
http://dxm004.homeip.net/gallery/vie...mName=09-15-04
http://dxm004.homeip.net/gallery/vie...mName=04-21-05

I decided to put intake on top and exhaust on the bottom to create poor man's version of down draft.

 

about water... the problems I've read about is that you can have water vapor in the air lines and as long as water is gas it will not drip out. When the air leaves the nuzzle of the gun, it depressurizes and instantly cools which can potentially transform this water vapor into liquid form because of cooling right at the worst possible time as you are laying material onto the surface of the car.

This is why I was going to use the ice bucket before the filter to try to cool down some of that air but I don't know if that's enough and I am concerned because here in the summer humidity is very often 90-100%.

Btw, that's nice drainage setup, I'll have to try to do something similar.

 

Thats pretty cool . I was thinking about building something like that. But did not feel up to (my wallet) Have u sprayed anything in there yet. I was thinking about useing them kind filters but i think they will clog up to fast. I'm not done with mine i have to make a box go around it with filets on the outside of it.
yours is more like a across draft booth.. down draft booths suck air from the bottom.

 

I have never heard of the ice bucked way. I think the air would be moving to fast for it to really do any good. I need to get a better filter. Them blue ones from sharp are good. but there like 50 bucks... U can spend tons and tons of cash to get the air dry. At work we have a rotary compressor all the driers, filters,even a refridgerated system. And we still get water on them real hot days.... Was going to ask U going to cover the top of your booth

 

wasn't that a pic of your booth? Or is that the garage wall with insulation foil type of thing?

I finished covering all the walls 2 days ago and today friend is coming over and we'll cover the ceiling. Yeah for one car it seems like a lot, but I figured if I do it once (or hopefully few times), I want to do it as right as possible. This is the first car, so no, haven't used it yet.

Yeah it's not down draft but there is about 6 feet where air has to go from top to bottom, so I am hoping it will help a little.

 

Thats the walls in the garage. Its the insulation. Well i know that filter is going to give u probs.. I have the cheaper ones that u can see through. and that thing cloged up in no time.

 

this is why I have a lot of filters and its also why I took extra 6 hours building all filter boxes so that filters are easily interchangable

Plus I am hoping that putting the intake over the booth will further minimize amount of dust it sees since most of crap does tend to lower to the floor.

I got the whole thing covered today. Looks very sweet: http://dxm004.homeip.net/gallery/vie...05&id=IMG_1010.

Still work in progress. Have to tape up all the seams but it is getting there

 

looks good. Let us know how them filters work out. I'll give u a A effort. Are u venting the overspray into the garage?

 

all exhaust filters are along the 2 garage doors, 1-2 feet away. When spraying I will keep the doors open about 3 feet and I'll put some plastic so that overspray is forced out rather than around the booth and back into the garage.

oh yeah, I convinced my girlfriend to open a sears card (I already opened two). With the sale, the card and some coupon I might actually get a good deal on that 7hp compressor. We are going tomorrow to get it .

 

thats cool. Than u can set up all the piping filters ect. more money. lol... I don't know if u have people liveing real close to u. But I do what i do were the overspray is coming out. I have a hose there spraying water. The water traps most of the overspray and smell. So u don't turn your nebs house a differnt color. When i paint at my moms they got real mad when they saw the side of there garage had differnt colors on it lol.