NO HANDLES, NO PROBLEM!!! (shaving the door handles)
01-03-2002, 03:17 PM
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Car: 91 Camaro RS
Engine: 305 TBI
Transmission: Pro-Built Automatic/Vigilante 2800
NO HANDLES, NO PROBLEM!!! (shaving the door handles)
There is a topic posted on the Tech board under(Any pics of 91-92 Camaro's with 1" lowering springs )that has led into the subject on shaving door handles. I felt that there would be a lot more feed back on this subject if it were posted here.
Mainly what I'm interested in is who is a good manufacturer to buy the solinoid kit from? I've been looking into Autoloc, does anyone know if they're good? Also on the matter of disconecting the locking mechinisim. Refer to the other board and post any questions or imput of your own. I'm sure I'm not the only one who's interested in shaving his handles.
Mark
Mainly what I'm interested in is who is a good manufacturer to buy the solinoid kit from? I've been looking into Autoloc, does anyone know if they're good? Also on the matter of disconecting the locking mechinisim. Refer to the other board and post any questions or imput of your own. I'm sure I'm not the only one who's interested in shaving his handles.
Mark
01-03-2002, 06:19 PM
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they're isn't really one brand that is above all the others. look in any lowrider or sport compact magazine and you'll get familiar with the names as well as what works and what doesn't.
mini truck magazine is also an excellent resorce for a particular project like this.
just look for kits that include more powerful actuators (can move heavier doors). this will be your key point. other than this most kits use the same equipment, just labeled different.
here is some reason's why i didn't put them on my car.
1. we have the heaviest doors i've ever run across on a sports car, this makes it very hard to find parts that have enough force to open them up enough. (not saying it can't be done, because it can.) it's just a little more difficult than say wiring up a toyota pickup.
2. shape of the door and metal work: the doors are curved quite a bit; this makes it difficult for the average body guy. sure most people claim they can do it, but 6 months down the road don't complain when you can see an outline in the sun.
3. reliability, sure they work; and if hooked up properly they work quite well..........for a while. eventually the doors won't open up as much or sometimes not even at all. (again, the heavy door thing). make sure you hide a external switch somewhere on the car to open incase of any other problems. make sure to have a hatch key handy incase you have to get in.
this can be most imbarassing when your on a date, i make sure to check everything twice a month so that this doesn't happen.
4. power; or the lack of. if by any chance and of course it's a slim one, your battery goes dead or your remote dies........you must refer to the hatch key. (again, not a major deal but still an minor setback)
along with these their are many others, but most are not really a concern to the custom car owner...........however if it is any sort of daily driver and not a "show" car; you will be hassled by it eventually.
personally, i think it's a great custom edition that can really clean up some vehicles; i don't think it looks right on 3rdgen's, but it can also depend on what else is done to your car.
if you've known someone who has done it and didn't mind with the little quirks.....then by all means i say go for it. but, if your just looking for something to make you stand out i think your getting in over your head.
if you do go through with it i wish you luck and make sure to post some pics!
mini truck magazine is also an excellent resorce for a particular project like this.
just look for kits that include more powerful actuators (can move heavier doors). this will be your key point. other than this most kits use the same equipment, just labeled different.
here is some reason's why i didn't put them on my car.
1. we have the heaviest doors i've ever run across on a sports car, this makes it very hard to find parts that have enough force to open them up enough. (not saying it can't be done, because it can.) it's just a little more difficult than say wiring up a toyota pickup.
2. shape of the door and metal work: the doors are curved quite a bit; this makes it difficult for the average body guy. sure most people claim they can do it, but 6 months down the road don't complain when you can see an outline in the sun.
3. reliability, sure they work; and if hooked up properly they work quite well..........for a while. eventually the doors won't open up as much or sometimes not even at all. (again, the heavy door thing). make sure you hide a external switch somewhere on the car to open incase of any other problems. make sure to have a hatch key handy incase you have to get in.
this can be most imbarassing when your on a date, i make sure to check everything twice a month so that this doesn't happen.
4. power; or the lack of. if by any chance and of course it's a slim one, your battery goes dead or your remote dies........you must refer to the hatch key. (again, not a major deal but still an minor setback)
along with these their are many others, but most are not really a concern to the custom car owner...........however if it is any sort of daily driver and not a "show" car; you will be hassled by it eventually.
personally, i think it's a great custom edition that can really clean up some vehicles; i don't think it looks right on 3rdgen's, but it can also depend on what else is done to your car.
if you've known someone who has done it and didn't mind with the little quirks.....then by all means i say go for it. but, if your just looking for something to make you stand out i think your getting in over your head.
if you do go through with it i wish you luck and make sure to post some pics!
01-03-2002, 06:58 PM
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1. All you have to do is buy stronger poppers, no big deal.
2. If you go to any decent body shop they will have no problem doing this. Stay away from Econo paint places, and ask around to see who is good. It doesn't take an artist or even a extremly skilled pro to do this.
3. Like anything else if you take care of it it will last for a long time. Everything goes after a while.....powewr door locks, power windows, locks freeze up.
It's a great mod and will definently set you apart. Go for it!
2. If you go to any decent body shop they will have no problem doing this. Stay away from Econo paint places, and ask around to see who is good. It doesn't take an artist or even a extremly skilled pro to do this.
3. Like anything else if you take care of it it will last for a long time. Everything goes after a while.....powewr door locks, power windows, locks freeze up.
It's a great mod and will definently set you apart. Go for it!
01-04-2002, 12:25 PM
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No, no, no, no, no... I pulled this directly from my website (which is down right now)
Some more pix to get an overall idea:
1) Actuators (I assume you mean the "solenoid") don't move anything. When they fire, they pull down on the latch mechanism. Weight of the door has nothing to do with it. Some guys have even used their electric door locks to actuate the solenoid.
2) Any competent welder can weld a piece of metal there and then grind it flat and smooth.
3) Reliability? Haven't had them not open yet. They aren't getting "tired". You should always have a hatch key with you. After all, you guys with door handles... What do you do if you break the actuator bar or handle? You go to the other door or you go in the hatch. Just like me.
4) I don't mind mine on my daily driver.
Steve
Shaved Door Handles
When you "shave" the door handles you are basically removing the actual handle and filling in the resultant depression in your door. You want to have someone weld in a piece of sheet steel over the depression - fiberglass or bondo would crack eventually under the pounding the doors get when being slammed shut. Solenoids (like those on your starter) are very small powerful electromagnetic "motors" that "actuate" when given a current. When you install a solenoid in your door and attach it to the un-latching mechanism you are basically giving yourself an automatic opener - you give the solenoid current, it actuates and, because it's an electromagnet, it "pulls" itself inside. As the un-latching mechanism is attached via steel wire to the solenoid, it un-latches the door, causing it to open. The whole schmeer is activated via a remote - like an alarm remote. Push one button the drivers door opens, push the other and the passenger door fires. Now I can hear you thinking, "What if your battery dies?" or something along those lines. Well, you're either crawling in through the hatch, or if you're like me you've moved the battery to the rear and can jump the car from the outside without having to actually get in the car.
When you hear the term "door poppers" think of basically a spring that gets squished between the door and the frame of your car. All it does is give a little push so the door opens up about 4 inches - making it a bit easier to grab to open. When you hear people talking about "how many pounds of pull does it give?" - this means the amount of pull that the solenoid exerts when it is actuated. I went with 50 pounders just to be sure, but was told that 35 pounders would do the job.
My decision to go with shaved door handles stems from my point of view that I want a smooth, line free body. I picked up my kit from AutoLoc at the cost of around $250. The install went pretty smoothly, except for a couple of points I'll mention down below. $100 got the door skins welded over and VOILA`! no more handles.
I put these in around 01Oct00 and have had zero problems or complaints about them.
Well, since I didn't check to make sure my first group of photos came out before slicking my camera I was cursed with the bad photo blues. These are the only shots of the solenoids that I have.
In this photo of the solenoid you can see the wire cable that runs up to the door release lever. That was the only snag in this entire installation. The directions say to "leave a little slack" in the wire - but you cannot. The release mechanism has some travel before it even starts to actuate the release. If you leave slack, the solenoid won't move far enough to actuate it. What's more, they only include four swaging locks for the entire kit. If you screw it up you're out looking for some more. On Sunday. At 5:30 at night. On a holiday.
So, in order to avoid having to wait, I just slotted the bolt holes where it is bolted to the door. Install the solenoid, watch the door release mechanism, and pull the solenoid down until the wire cable just starts to hit the area where it actuates. Lot easier to understand when you're looking at it than just reading about it.
Here's a shot of the wiring that I installed behind the passenger underneath the large plastic piece that covers the wheel well. The instructions were fairly easy to follow and wiring went fairly smoothly. My finger is pointing to the emergency button that is included in case the batteries in the remote die.
Here's a shot of the door, oh yeah, smooooth...
When you "shave" the door handles you are basically removing the actual handle and filling in the resultant depression in your door. You want to have someone weld in a piece of sheet steel over the depression - fiberglass or bondo would crack eventually under the pounding the doors get when being slammed shut. Solenoids (like those on your starter) are very small powerful electromagnetic "motors" that "actuate" when given a current. When you install a solenoid in your door and attach it to the un-latching mechanism you are basically giving yourself an automatic opener - you give the solenoid current, it actuates and, because it's an electromagnet, it "pulls" itself inside. As the un-latching mechanism is attached via steel wire to the solenoid, it un-latches the door, causing it to open. The whole schmeer is activated via a remote - like an alarm remote. Push one button the drivers door opens, push the other and the passenger door fires. Now I can hear you thinking, "What if your battery dies?" or something along those lines. Well, you're either crawling in through the hatch, or if you're like me you've moved the battery to the rear and can jump the car from the outside without having to actually get in the car.
When you hear the term "door poppers" think of basically a spring that gets squished between the door and the frame of your car. All it does is give a little push so the door opens up about 4 inches - making it a bit easier to grab to open. When you hear people talking about "how many pounds of pull does it give?" - this means the amount of pull that the solenoid exerts when it is actuated. I went with 50 pounders just to be sure, but was told that 35 pounders would do the job.
My decision to go with shaved door handles stems from my point of view that I want a smooth, line free body. I picked up my kit from AutoLoc at the cost of around $250. The install went pretty smoothly, except for a couple of points I'll mention down below. $100 got the door skins welded over and VOILA`! no more handles.
I put these in around 01Oct00 and have had zero problems or complaints about them.
Well, since I didn't check to make sure my first group of photos came out before slicking my camera I was cursed with the bad photo blues. These are the only shots of the solenoids that I have.
In this photo of the solenoid you can see the wire cable that runs up to the door release lever. That was the only snag in this entire installation. The directions say to "leave a little slack" in the wire - but you cannot. The release mechanism has some travel before it even starts to actuate the release. If you leave slack, the solenoid won't move far enough to actuate it. What's more, they only include four swaging locks for the entire kit. If you screw it up you're out looking for some more. On Sunday. At 5:30 at night. On a holiday.
So, in order to avoid having to wait, I just slotted the bolt holes where it is bolted to the door. Install the solenoid, watch the door release mechanism, and pull the solenoid down until the wire cable just starts to hit the area where it actuates. Lot easier to understand when you're looking at it than just reading about it.
Here's a shot of the wiring that I installed behind the passenger underneath the large plastic piece that covers the wheel well. The instructions were fairly easy to follow and wiring went fairly smoothly. My finger is pointing to the emergency button that is included in case the batteries in the remote die.
Here's a shot of the door, oh yeah, smooooth...
1) Actuators (I assume you mean the "solenoid") don't move anything. When they fire, they pull down on the latch mechanism. Weight of the door has nothing to do with it. Some guys have even used their electric door locks to actuate the solenoid.
2) Any competent welder can weld a piece of metal there and then grind it flat and smooth.
3) Reliability? Haven't had them not open yet. They aren't getting "tired". You should always have a hatch key with you. After all, you guys with door handles... What do you do if you break the actuator bar or handle? You go to the other door or you go in the hatch. Just like me.
4) I don't mind mine on my daily driver.
Steve
01-04-2002, 01:30 PM
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Car: 92 Z, 91 Formula, 04 CTS, 01 Tahoe
Engine: 355 forged 4 bolt, SuperRam, 58mm t
Transmission: T5, looking for t-56
This will be my fourth personal 3rd gen that I've shaved the handles.NEVER had any problems with any of them. You just have to do it right the first time. Be sure to have an "emergency button " connected to spare 12v battery(one 12v lawnmower battery or two 6v lantern batteries,etc) in case the car battery or remote goes dead. The connection of the solenoid cable and door latch release rod needs to be tight. You may even want to spot weld the junction point to ensure reliability,once everything is adjusted and working correctly. All wiring should be soldered rather than crimped,again for reliability.It is highly recommended to have the door handle and lock cylinder recesses welded and finished professionally. I welded all mine and never had problems,even years down the road.
01-04-2002, 06:23 PM
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thanks for the pics.......i'm sure everyone who is interested will really benefit from them. 
i wish i had taken some pics of mine. i still stand behind everything i said though................
and as far as the door pannels, wait til it's painted before you comment on it. body work and painting is an art, sure any competent body guy can do the necessary work, same as a paint guy. but not everyone can make it perfect; point is make sure the guy doing it knows what he's doing.........obviously it can be done.
i wish i had taken some pics of mine. i still stand behind everything i said though................
and as far as the door pannels, wait til it's painted before you comment on it. body work and painting is an art, sure any competent body guy can do the necessary work, same as a paint guy. but not everyone can make it perfect; point is make sure the guy doing it knows what he's doing.........obviously it can be done.
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01-04-2002, 07:04 PM
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Is that not the tightest ride you've ever seen. That thing is gonna be killer, what color will it be?
Since I've been smacked 3 times and my paint is now ruined, I'm gonna do everythign i wanna do cuase i got an accuse to primmer it!
01-05-2002, 07:16 AM
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I'm glad I could help with some of the questions.
Well yeah, in my case this is true (though I'd still be able to tell if it was jacked up) but: RSpeed has a bit better idea than either of us...
Yeah, I've heard that before. I think it's kind of a joke, but hey, whadda I know. I mean what do they do if you side swipe something and jam your door? I guess they'd have to go through your window, right? By the way, why do they make you roll your windows up? Is that so you're not "flung" out if you roll? Crap, isn't that what seatbelts/restraints are for?
Thanks brother, when the money tree blossoms again (Go<x>d knows when that'll be) it'll eventually get a pearl white paint job with light ghost flames up front. I may see if it's possible to get some of that reflective material added (like Police cars have) so the flames reflect at night. However, like yours my car is a work in progress (and looks it right now) and isn't done yet. I've had to redo the smoothed seams a couple of times now (fiberglass is finally working), and I need to have the frenched antenna area welded over. It'll get there.
But then I get to thinking about the guys running twin turbos on a carb for less than $1000. Hitting 9 and 10 seconds in the quarter. In a street car. That's when I stop thinking rationally.
Steve
and as far as the door pannels, wait til it's painted before you comment on it.
This will be my fourth personal 3rd gen that I've shaved the handles.NEVER had any problems with any of them.
Just a FYI. You'll fail tech at the race track for shaved door handles. The EMT's like to grab onto them to get you out in case of emergency.
By the way, why do they make you roll your windows up? Is that so you're not "flung" out if you roll? Crap, isn't that what seatbelts/restraints are for?
Is that not the tightest ride you've ever seen. That thing is gonna be killer, what color will it be?
Since I've been smacked 3 times and my paint is now ruined, I'm gonna do everythign i wanna do cuase i got an accuse to primmer it!
Since I've been smacked 3 times and my paint is now ruined, I'm gonna do everythign i wanna do cuase i got an accuse to primmer it!
But then I get to thinking about the guys running twin turbos on a carb for less than $1000. Hitting 9 and 10 seconds in the quarter. In a street car. That's when I stop thinking rationally.
Steve
01-05-2002, 08:58 PM
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certain classes won't allow you to run; basically any class your car would be in........
no handles, no times.
that is unless you get lucky and the guy lets you go at tech inspection.
no handles, no times.
that is unless you get lucky and the guy lets you go at tech inspection.
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