500+hpta

I am working on a new hydroboost in my Trans Am. The following is where I am with it so far.
1 - got a used hydroboost from salaved astro van.
2- removed the old brake booster from car.
3- drilled the bracket from the old booster. This lined up perfectly with the new hydroboost bolts. now it will bolt in place without any problems.
4- cut the link bar off of both hydroboost and the brake booster and took the back half of the hydroboost bar and the loop side of the original bar and threaded them both. I used a 3/8" x 16 threaded adjuster to make the length adjustable.
5- mounted the old bracket to the hydroboost.

tomorrow I am going to get me a fourth gen master cylinder to install on the unit.
I will give more info as I get done and materials I used.
pictures are in my pics on my profile.

500+hpta

Went to the salvage yard again today and purchased a master cylinder off of a fourth gen camaro ( 13.00) fits perfectly. If you try to use your original master cylinder the boar size is larger than the hydroboost and will need to be turned down. not worth it just get a fourth gen master cylinder.

500+hpta

New pics are up on my profile I am having problems downloading them on the board.

500+hpta

Completed install of hydroboost other than the braided lines. The front hard line fron the matste cylinder to the proportioning valve had to be custom made the old one had the wrong fittings on it.

//<86TA>\\

iTrader: (14)

so how well does it work? how does the pedal feel?

houstonvett

iTrader: (2)

The Corvette guys have been doing this conversion for a long time. Speedway/Summit sells all of the of the braided lines and fittings to do the conversion. This was a list I compiled to make the hydroboost work on a couple of my Vettes. Russell I believe makes all of the fittings. There are pre-made kits out there for Vettes but it is a cheaper to make the lines yourself.

The C3 Vettes have 4 piston calipers and really like the Hydroboost upgrade. It will make the C3 stop on a dime and give you some change. It should be a great up-grade to the F body cars also.


From Pump To Hydro:

90 Degree 6AN to 3/8" - AER-FBM1343 - $23.95 (Red)

22" 6AN Braided Hose - AER-FCC0606 - $33.95

90 Degree 6AN Hose End - AER-FBM1122 - $18.99 x3

Male 6AN to 18mm O-ring Coupling - AER-FBM2609 - $13.95

From Hydro To Steering Valve:

6AN to 16mm O-ring Coupling - AER-FBM2608 - $13.95

90 Degree 6AN Hose End - See Above.

35" 6AN Braided Hose - See Above.

90 Degree 6AN Hose End - See Above.

6AN to 7/16" Coupling - RUS-697100 - $12.39

dennisbernal91z

iTrader: (2)

500 can you post more details about the setup you have? I want to copy it. I am looking for a hydroboost on ebay right now and want to make sure I pick up the right parts.

What year was the hydro you used?
Did you ned to make any custom brackets or anything?
What about pushrod length? Did it all work out?
What fittings did the master have to connect to the rest of the lines?

Any help would be great. Thanks so much.

houstonvett

iTrader: (2)

I got this setup last week. The bolt hole pattern for the firewall should be the same for your TA , if it comes from a 1.5 ton or lighter truck/van. GM didn't want to make a lot of different parts for brake systems including mounting brackets/plates. I will have this guy up and running in the next few weeks and will post some pics of the swap. You will have to make a custom length clevis rod most of the time to make the unit work in cars. Simple procedure to make the guy. Remember brake fluid does take off the paint as you can see by my pic.

dennisbernal91z

iTrader: (2)

Can you supply all details with your setup? I am looking at a HB from a 2000 chevy truck on ebay. I asked they seller if it will work since he sells them for people doing convertions. I am just clueless.

Your setup looks like it will work great, can you please fill in all details, I WANT TO COPY YOU!!!

houstonvett

iTrader: (2)

I'm like you Dennis, no sense in re-inventing the wheel if there is a good working model allready available. Here is a schmatic of a Hydroboost system. You have full pressure liquid running thru the unit to supply the power steering box with it's needed pressure/fluid. Then you have a low pressure return line back to the PS pump from the Hydroboost unit itself. When the Hydroboost is working there will be a drop in pressure, that is why you need the low pressure return line. The only real PITA is getting the right parts/clevis and making the lines.

dennisbernal91z

iTrader: (2)

Thanks for shedding more light on it the problem. I really hope people who have done this can chime in with a little advice on parts. I don't mind custom making a few things, like threaded rods or stuff like that. I just want to know what HB to look for on ebay! I found a guy who makes custom setups on ebay. I might work with him to make my car the test mule for him so he can start selling turn key setups for thirdgens. Wish someone had done this before me with this guy, but oh well someone has to be first!!!

houstonvett

iTrader: (2)

The list of parts are posted in my earlier post for the conversion. I would double check the line length for the F body. Speedway or Summit has the pieces. The 6AN guys cost but make it easy for the conversion. You really only need to worry about the high pressure side of things. Hose clamps in whatever form can be used to secure the low pressure hoses to their mounts/T connector.

I would double check the size of the Hydroboost's orifices before ordering. These units have been around for a while and if I remember right the earlier versions might have 2 different sizes orficies. I will check and make sure.

The clevis rod is easy to make. Buy a unit with the rod still attached to the unit. You then thread the clevis rod with a coarse thread and buy the brake piece from Speedway. The brake pedal bracket will thread on the the clevis rod. You then put 2 lock nuts behind it to secure it well to the clevis rod. You might have to cut some of the threaded clevis rod off to make it fit with your brake pedal setup. I can't remember if the rod is 3/8" or 7/16" diameter.

I have the K tools sockets that make it simple to make the HP hoses. Very hard to make the HP hoses up right without them, but it can be done by the right person. I am not that person, that is why I bought the K tool guy from Summit. Good investment if you plan on making up your own high grade hoses now and in the future. Check to make sure the studs going into the firewall from the Hydroboost unit are 3 3/4" center to center from NE to SW when looking at the bolt hole pattern. If so you should be good to go for the 3rd gen Camaro.

houstonvett

iTrader: (2)

Got this website today searching around. It has all of the parts you need and it looks like Tallon's speciality is the Hydroboost setups. Go to the store to find all of the parts. I will call them tomorrow and see what they have to offer. Nice front page to the website. I will volunteer to test drive that fast looking, well handling machine in the checkered paint job that appears there.

http://www.tallonhydraulics.com/

I was checking around the web site and the hose clamp/seperaters will make for a very sweet finished setup. That was the only problem with the Hydroboost is all of the plumbing lines. The clamps will give the whole system a nice clean finished look, IMO.

http://www.tallonhydraulics.com/stor...dex&cPath=39_3

dennisbernal91z

iTrader: (2)

What used parts can I buy to make a setup?

New is out of my price range these days. I hear of people using astro van HB units and 4th gen MC.

What year MC and what year HB is really what I am looking for so I can start to pick appart ebay/junkyards.

jstoltz

iTrader: (16)

you can use pretty much any year the one that I have is from a 2000 g series chevy van and the master is from a 2001 camaro. it fits together perfect. just make sure the hydroboost unit has the flat 4 bolt mounting plate. then grind off the rivets from the stock brake booster and knock off the mounting bracket and it lines right up and get some nuts that fit the 4 studs on the hydroboost mounting plate. and loctite them on there and there is the mounting part solved but you need to cut the rod with the eyelet off the brake booster and the one off the hydroboost unit and swap those. threading them both and using an adjuster is the normal way but it could be welded but you are better off having an adjuster so you only have to do that once.

TB2

iTrader: (1)

I did my conversion a couple years ago. Been great. Try the link.

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/brak...ydraboost.html

houstonvett

iTrader: (2)

I just got done talking to Butch at Tallon Hydraulics. Great guy to say the least. To make sure Tallon has the correct mounting bracket for the 3rd and 4th gen Camaros I will be sending Butch my old vacuum power booster for a go-by. There is a slight upward angle of about 8 degrees it looks like in the mounting plate for the vacuum unit. Tallon will make the correct mounting plate for the 3rd and 4th gen Camaros if they don't have it allready in their stock. Tallon is a American company with complete machine shop capabilities on hand. All of Tallon's parts are made here in the USA and are high quality pieces. It will give your Hydroboost setup the clean finished look some of us like to have in our car's engine compartment. The old power booster will be on the way to Tallon today to get the ball rolling on this project. Tallon will get all of my HB business from now on. Butch sounds/acts like a straight up guy and was more then happy to help in getting the HB units to fit into the later Camaros. Hard to find that kind of service anymore in the aftermarket auto supply field anymore, IMO. Now if we can get him to make up some posters of those 2 fine machines that appear on the front page of his website.

All GM hydroboost units were pretty much the same Dennis. The mounting plate is about the only thing that changed over the years for different car/truck applications. Early model HB units had American sized fittings for the hoses and the later guys went to metric sizes for the hose fittings. The back mounting plate is held on by a large nut on the back of the HB unit and is a easy job to change over to a different mounting plate that will work with your Camaro. I will keep the Forum updated about the correct aftermarket finished mounting plates for the HB units going into the late model Camaros.

houstonvett

iTrader: (2)

Butch from Tallon recieved my old vacuum booster this morning @ his machine shop in Mi. Butch will be making up the Hydroboost plates for the 3rd and 4th gen Camaros, sometime this week and will be sending me a finished unit when it is finished. I will post up some pics of the plate when I get it. The stock units do have a slight upward angle which Butch will take into account when making up his aftermarket plates. Should be a great upgrade for the stock brake system in the 3rd & 4th gen cars.

89_RS

If you guys are into the idea of piecing together a hydroboost yourself, Summit lists remanufactured hydraulic brake boosters on their site. You can find the ones from the mid 90's Gvans on there for about $150-$170.

dennisbernal91z

iTrader: (2)

Not bad for a rebuilt unit. Still needs to hear back about the mounting plate.

houstonvett: any update.

houstonvett

iTrader: (2)

Last time I talked to Butch at Tallon he said it would be Monday or Tuesday (10/11,10/12) that he should have a copy ready to go. I will call Butch on Monday and let the Forum know what the results are.

dennisbernal91z

iTrader: (2)

Can't wait to hear this update!!! I need to update my brakes with a HB really really soon.

houstonvett

iTrader: (2)

I talked to Butch today (10/11) and was told he will be done with the plate either today or tomorrow. It will consist of 2 plates @ 1" a piece. This has to be done so the Hydroboost will have the right amount of peddle travel. The Camaro's firewall is indented for the OEM power booster and 2 plates are needed for this reason. I will post pics of the plates as soon as they arive here.

dennisbernal91z

iTrader: (2)

Great. Very happy to hear this is moving along.

Once you get yours I would be able to order one right behind you right?

houstonvett

iTrader: (2)

Yes indeed, Butch will have the plates ready to go for the 3rd and 4th gen cars once he knocks out this prototype. Butch is very hands on in this HB plate project which is a very good thing for the end user.

dennisbernal91z

iTrader: (2)

Any idea when you will be expecting the plates and all that?

Just trying to plan my built timeline. I got my motor getting buttoned up this week or next and I would like to have the brakes done before then.

Thanks again for any info. Really looking forward to this..... If you couldn't tell already!

houstonvett

iTrader: (2)

Butch said he will ship me the plates once they are done, so I am hoping for late this week or very early next week. As soon as I get the plates I will post some pics of what they will look like.

Charlie out at Lee Man. in Calf. is re-building my stock PS pump along with my Z-28 steering box to 9:1 ratio. When re-building the PS pump Charlie will add a extra hose nipple to the unit for the Hydroboost return line. Very nice touch, IMO.

dennisbernal91z

iTrader: (2)

that is a nice touch, but it is not needed right? I can just run a T before the pump correct? I just want to make sure I don't need to get mine rebuilt to have that feature. Sounds like something I would like to do someday, but for now the motor is absorbing all my funds and I just need to get it drivable asap.

houstonvett

iTrader: (2)

Charlie & Tom @ Lee Man. are very dilegent in their work. Charlie explained to me the reason for the nipple on the PS pump is to make sure there is no back pressure @ the return line T. Many HB setups work fine with the T in the return lines. The extra return line nippple on the PS pump is something Lee does as an extra.

houstonvett

iTrader: (2)

I talked to Butch today (10/13) and was told the plate has been shipped off to me. I will check out the prototype and get back in touch with Butch regarding the fit of the plate. It should work out well.

Butch is an interesting person, he has worked for Kent Moore as a machinist and been in the machine shop biz for 30 plus years. I have no doubt the HB plate and HB services Tallon offers will be top notch.

dennisbernal91z

iTrader: (2)

Great to hear. My motor's pistons are backordered for some reason so I have some extra time. Maybe I will be able to get my brakes squared away before I drop it in. Keep us posted on the plate and HB fitment!!

houstonvett

iTrader: (2)

I just got the HB plates for the 3rd and 4th gen Camaros. A high quality piece made here in the USA, by Americans who know their craft. Very high quality machine work by Butch and the Tallon boys plus it looks great. I did a quick test and the plate fits right into the firewall with no problems. Butch rotates the HB unit so the canister sits on the drivers side fender, which is perfect. The boys @ Tallon have their act together producing high quality aftermarket pieces for HB units. Butch will now have all of my HB biz in the future. Tallon also produces the speciality socket needed to take off the backing nut that holds the factory HB unit on to it's mounting plate. Another great touch by Butch and the Tallon group, socket is pictured in photo.

89_RS

How much was that bracket and does it work with the Gvan HB's?

TB2

iTrader: (1)

I geuss I don't understand the need for the bracket. It's a nice looking piece. But is it only to make the engine compartment look better? Because the factory bracket from the vacuum booster bolts the Hydroboost right up.

dennisbernal91z

iTrader: (2)

TB2: Do you have proof of that?

TB2

iTrader: (1)

Proof is it's been on my car for a couple of years now. Very nice upgrade. Pedal feel is exellent. Check the link. Read it. Its all in there. pics included. Let me know if you have any questions. https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/br...ydraboost.html (hydraboost)

houstonvett

iTrader: (2)

I am sure there is more then 1 way to skin a cat. TB2's method should work with seperating the vacuum power assist from it's mounting bracket. Then making sure you have the HB unit positioned correctly when drilling/bolting the vacuum's power assist bracket to the back of the HB mounting plate. Also taking into the account that the HB unit has the correct amount of peddle travel it needs to do the job.

I see no pictures on the thread of the firewall, original vacuum assist bracket bolted to the aftermarket HB plate. It looks like in this setup you will have a hole to fill in at the firewall where the back of the HB unit sits in on the Tallon guy. For myself, since I am doing a large project on the Camaro, I don't have the time, or inclination to fabricate the setup TB2 has. I trade my money for my time in some cases, getting a quality made part ready to go to help move the project along and get completed. I also like a more finished product on my street cars. If it was a track car I wouldn't care at all about the looks and might use a setup like TB2 has in his car. You can see from TB2's post he likes the HB mod very much and for good reason, it works.

jstoltz

iTrader: (16)

the flat plate from the hydroboost pump is a direct fit to the bracket on the old vacuum booster just need to get the correct thread pitch nuts for the studs. not hard or time consuming just grind off or drill out the rivets on the back of the stock booster.

TB2

iTrader: (1)

There's no alignment issues with using the boosters mounting plate. as well there is no open hole left in the firewall. You will have to make up an adjustable pushrod. But that's as far as you will have to go as far as fabricating. The 4th gen master is a bolt in to the hydroboost unit. I'm not trying to put down the aftermarket plate. Actually i'm very interested in seeing it all installed and what fab work is needed to finish it. I just want to make sure you realized that it is not a necesity to do this conversion. Either way, going to hydroboost(Especially if your running a big cam) is an excellent upgrade.

dennisbernal91z

iTrader: (2)

So from the looks of it I should look for:
- 95 Astro Van HB unit?
- 4th Gen Master?
- and chop up my booster?

If thats all I have to do, this is SUPER easy and I was making into a huge deal. Is there any "newer" HB units I should be looking for on ebay?

I want to make this look good, but $ is way to tight right now, so for now I will get it working with the old bracket and moving forward, maybe in the summer spend the $ to get the addapter plate machined.

But can someone please chime in on the HB unit I should be looking for? I want to get this ball rolling...

houstonvett

iTrader: (2)

I had to read the original thread once again to see how this HB setup worked. After reading the post I can see that you need to get a HB unit from a 85 GM van it looks like to make this setup work. I have never seen a HB setup with the bolt pattern the same as the stock Camaro vacuum power assist guy, but they do exist. It might be like finding hen's teeth to locate a HB unit from a GM van of that age. Here in Houston I can't find a passanger front fender for a 3rd gen Camaro in the boneyards. Since the cash for clunkers deal went thru, older cars are being crushed at a faster pace then ever before.

With Tallon's setup you can use any HB unit that GM made. You will have to take off the locking snap ring and take off the backing nut that holds on the mounting plate that is attached to the mounting stud on the back of the HB unit. This is why Tallon supplies the speciality socket needed for the backing nut with their aftermarket piece. Take the HB unit push it thru the Tallon piece, install lock nut and re-install the locking snap ring and you are done. GM made the HB units all the same, with the only differences being the mounting plate for different applications and the hose fitting sizes, which changed from standard sizes to metric.

Here is a link that shows how easy it can be to make up the SS hoses for your HB unit. Click on the see it work button. With these Koul Tools guys it is very easy to make up SS hoses with AN fittings. Very simple indeed and if you get the big set of Koul "sockets" you can Fab up just about any hose in your 3rd gen Camaro.

http://www.koultools.com/

85Z28NOS

iTrader: (2)

Is anyone running the hydroboost with 13" C5 brakes? How well do they work together? I was just getting ready to install them with a C4 master when I came across this thread

houstonvett

iTrader: (2)

It should be a great setup with the C5 calipers & rotors. I have the HB system setup on a few of my C3s and it works great. You can see from TB2's posts the HB mod works great in the 3rd gen F bodies as well.

jstoltz

iTrader: (16)

The hydroboost pump I have that will work is from a 1999 G3500 chevy conversion van. I will post a pic later of the mounting plate and the vacuum booster mounting bracket off the booster.

TB2

iTrader: (1)

What I used is from a 1994-95 Astro Van. They are avail from Rock Auto if you don't want to play around with used. If you use anything else I dont know if it will fit.

dennisbernal91z

iTrader: (2)

I will start looking for a 95 Astro van HB on ebay and compare it to a Napa reman'ed unit and rock auto as well.

Thanks.

89_RS

Pricing on Rock Auto:

1994 Astro Power Brake Booster Hydraulic: $187
1994 Camaro Master Cylinder: $63

houstonvett

iTrader: (2)

Picture of the rear, mounting plate for a Chevy 1 ton van, backing nut and snap ring lock for a GM HB unit. All GM are the same. Last pic is the HB unit inserted into Tallon's product.

dennisbernal91z

iTrader: (2)

What are you doing about the pushrod? Is that the right length? If so, how did you get it to be the right length without cutting, threading and all that?

jstoltz

iTrader: (16)

still have to do the cutting and threading it has the wrong end on it unless there is a bushing available to make it fit. but I am pretty sure the push rod is too short though.