I have 2 10" poehnix gold xs subs. They are in a pyramid dual bandpass box, I have a 300 watt kenwood amp powering these, the amp is on 3/4 power and bass is turned to -3 on the deck. People say that band pass boxes will wreck them, do they know what they are talking about, or are they full of ****?

 

Why would they sell them if they wrecked subs

 

They won't ruin the speakers, just the sound. Bandpass, or Isobaric boxes suck. Their frequency range is really limited.

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'82 Firebird, dead stock, 9 bolt disc rear, over 200,000 miles and still going strong, more to come...
http://www.spinfrenzy.com/stingerssx...easures.html#4

 

Bandpasses don't suck.

Now, if you dropped a set of subs into a one size fits all bandpass box, it will sound pretty bad. Bandpass boxes need to be designed for the woofers they are going in.

The other thing is, that a bandpass box acts like a filter for the top and bottom end (it naturally rolls off at the top end). So the noises you hear when you are abusing the driver (pops and what not) gets filtered out, making it harder to know that you are abusing your subwoofer, leading to an untimely death if you beat on them too much.

Juan

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Coming soon, CES report 2002 at Sound Domain www.sounddomain.com

 

hey, where did isobaric enclosures come in here? they are completely different than bandpass boxes. isobarics are actually very benificial, if you've got a bit of extra money.

 

Any style box can sound fantastic if it's built properly by an experienced builder. I've seen bandpass boxes do real well in SQ competitions. They just need to be designed properly, and you need a lot of real estate. Isobarac boxes are very EASY to make sound right. Design the box for a sealed enclosure, divide by 2, add a 2nd sub and you've got a great sounding, tiny enclosure. Isobarac enclosures are great. Not only are they small, but because you've got 2 subs moving as one piston, you maintain constant pressure on all parts of the cones, so you get a lot less cone flex, which reduces distortion. The only drawback to an isobarac enclosure is that you only get the efficiency of a single-sub enclosure.

Part of why people say that bandpass boxes ruin subs is that because of the natural filtering properties of the enclosure, no high frequency sounds make it out. Generally when you overdrive a sub, it sounds like *** , and that's partly because of all of the high frequency junk it spews. In a bandpass box you don't hear that, so you don't realize that you're overdriving your subs until it's too late. Add to that the fact that most bandpass boxes are sold to 16 year old pimple-heads that try to crank it with their 100000000 watt @ 200% THD Boss amp, and you start to see why that reputation exists.

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I have never heard a band pass box that sounded better, or even as good as a sealed or ported enclosure. That just can't happen.

 

Then you just didn't hear the right one. Bandpass boxes have some MAJOR advantages that can really sound great if you have a sub with the right type of T/S parameters and the box is built right. If you've got a sub with the right T/S parameters, you can get a wide, ruler-flat frequency response with a sharp high frequency rolloff. That high frequency rolloff filters out ALL upper harmonics, including the upper harmonics of the sub's resonation. With a regular passive or electronic crossover, those harmonics are still present. With a bandpass box, they are gone. This makes for a cleaner bass sound, a better integration with the mids, and most important, no audible clues to the sub's location. It's easier to get "front" bass with a good bandpass box. If you haven't seen a bandpass enclosure do well in IASCA, then I'm guessing you haven't ever been to an IASCA competition. There are always a few bandpass setups doing real good. It just takes the right subs and a talented installer to make bandpass sound great.

------------------

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<A HREF="http://www.rit.edu/~jli4307/camaro" TARGET=_blank>
View the restoration of an 85 IROC</A>
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"I didn't know a bored out Ford could go so slow" -Shenandoah

 

That's what I used to think too. Sorry jim, but I've heard many bandpass boxes, and none of them sounded as good. But you are right, they do sound flat, unfortunately.

[This message has been edited by stingerssx (edited November 29, 2001).]

 

Whatever floats your boat. Cars don't make it to IASCA Finals by sounding bad. Saying that you've heard a lot doesn't really qualify much. I've heard many hundreds, and the vast majority of them sound like junk. Bandpass boxes aren't like sealed boxes in that you can't just buy a box, slap some subs in and expect it to sound right. The box needs to be built for the sub. But when it is, it sounds every bit as good as any other properly built box. I guarantee that you'd never know whether you were listening to bandpass, ported or sealed in a properly built system if somebody didn't tell you.

------------------

The IROC Homepage
<A HREF="http://www.rit.edu/~jli4307/camaro" TARGET=_blank>
View the restoration of an 85 IROC</A>
Custom Thirdgen Subwoofer Enclosures
"I didn't know a bored out Ford could go so slow" -Shenandoah

 

Actually, I have heard some cars that compete, that didn't sound good to me.

I wouldn't think that you could just put any sub into any sealed enclosure and have it sound good, but I guess you think it would. I know many people that would tell you that the best part of a bandpass enclosure would be the versatility of them. IE: you can put any speaker into one and it will sound good. That's only one reason why I don't talk to people that work at any AL & Ed's.

And yes, I can tell the difference between enclosures just by listening to them. I may not have "golden ears" like some people around here claim to have, but I have a very well trained ear, and I have never heard a bandpass enclosure sound good.

 

I actually have a bandpass box in my winter car which is an 83 buick w/eclipse 10's and it sounds great. It has great frequency response and pounds w/the head set flat. I have a soundstream 300 watt amp powerin the subs. If the box is built for the subs i feel bandpass is the way to go. When i finish my installin my camaro i'm either gonna have a bandpass or ported enclosure.

 

That still doesn't mean much. Just because a car competes doesn't automatically mean it sounds good. I've seen cars with Becker boxes in the back seat compete.

I'll believe that when I see it. Soundwaves are soundwaves and nothing more. Whether they come from a bandpass or a sealed box doesn't change what they are. All that the ear can distinguish is amplitude and the presence or absence to upper harmonics, especially odd-order harmonics. The amplitude at all frequencies establishes the "frequency response" and there are plenty boxes of all kinds that can provide a ruler-flat frequency response within the bass range. The box design is going to have a minimal (if any) effect on harmonics except in the case of the bandpass box filtering all upper harmonics, but a huge part of the difference between a good sub and a cheap sub is the good sub's ability to not reproduce upper harmonics. Now I'm starting to talk in circles.

You're trying to put opinion up against fact. I've got plenty of opinions about different boxes and their capabilities in specific situations, but I haven't done anything except provide facts here. If you've got any facts that support your opinion, I think this thread could actually be of some value, unlike now.

------------------

The IROC Homepage
<A HREF="http://www.rit.edu/~jli4307/camaro" TARGET=_blank>
View the restoration of an 85 IROC</A>
Custom Thirdgen Subwoofer Enclosures
"I didn't know a bored out Ford could go so slow" -Shenandoah

[This message has been edited by Jim85IROC (edited December 02, 2001).]

 

Jim, all I ever see is you talking in circles. I stated my opinion, and that opinion doesn't need to be copied. Whether other people like the way soundwaves come out of bandpass enclosures or not doesn't bother me. With out difference of opinions, this world would be a boring place,(once again, my opinion).

As I've previously stated, IMO, bandpass boxes can't compete with sealed, or ported enclosures for my $$$$.

Once again, sorry that my opinion upsets you jim, or for that matter, anyone else on this board.

If anyone, especially you jim, would like to demonstrate a decent sounding bandpass enclosure, I would love to hear it. I have a very open mind, and would love to hear it. But I also would like to hear that same sub in a sealed or ported enclosure, that is built to specs, in the excact same situation. If I could be proven wrong, then I will retract my statement.