I never really liked the Holleys/Edlebrocks for street driving.

I mean, a late 70's M4MC Quadrajet flows 800cfm out of the box (I love the secondary air valve control), has an adjustable part throttle mixture control, can be had for almost nothing, gets better gas mileage than any aftermarket 4bbl I know of, and that seat of the pants feel when those HUGE secondaries come online is awesome!

 

This is just a starting point for the motor to get it in the car and running. Later i can change the carb,ign,cam, get headders etc.

This being my first carbed motor(all others have been some sort of injection) i should have gone with an easier edelbrock but the holley is brand new and i got it for cheap so ill give it a try.

 

1 and 1/4 inch primaries(sp) 2 inch mechanical secondaries.

 

posting the picture would help

Also so far heres the total. I bought the motor/trans for $300.

Sold the TPI stuff for $300.

And i've spent about $300 so far on all the nec engine stuff.

Alt bracket, uni throttle bracket, gaskets, carb adapter, oil , antifreeze etc, I still need to get some exhaust stuff and im waiting on summit to send me the afpr.

 

A spread bore holley I thought they tossed al of those in the trash can years ago.

Anywho up a few dozen posts it was asked why edelcrap listed 302-400 SBC heads in the same catagory. Well its simple a 302 has a 4in bore and larger valves will actually clear the bore. You can use those heads on a 305 but 1/8 of the intake valves will ontop the deck not the piston. There are few AM HP 305 heads out there anymore. A 305 will run quite well and from what I read for component choice for this one it should run very well.

 

Yeah i know , I either hear people who live them or hate them. I got it for cheap from the guy nest door so itll work for now.

 

I've got that spreadbore Holley, also.
I intend to use it for drag racing one year on the Corvette & Camaro, do back to back with Rochester (stock for both factory offerings of 350s) & the Holley (your selected 650 double pumper & a 3310 750) just to see if....
I paid like $5-ish or so for this 650cfm dbl pumpr Holley, swap meet.

 

this post is to ask have you tried to bolt up that intake yet
because from the pic it looks to be the old style with the 2 center bolts angled which works on engines up to 85 and if your motor is a 90 it wont work unless you get the angled washers or whatever they are to bolt to the straight up heads.

im talking about the 4 center bolts around the carb.

 

Im trying to see what you mean but i dont. The intake fits and bolts up ok. Maybe it was modded before i got it?
I did buy different manifold bolts.

Also it is a square bore manifold so i had to buy a adapter. (my carb is spread bore)

And then i was thinking of the pita it would be to link up the throttle and tv cable so i bought a uni throttle cable.

All together i must have spent $400 on little parts that you dont think of. It probably would have been alot cheaper if i went to a yard and bought the brackets i need instead of buying chrome ones from advance(chrome alt bracket,water neck,dist hold down.) but oh well. Also i ordered the Y pipe today.(no its not chrome)

Guy i got the motor from has headders and glasspacks
But id rather throw a y pipe and my friends old flowmanster on it for now then have to fab up some half assed dual exhaust.

 

Sounds like you are coming along pretty well in the swap...if you could some pics would be really nice...and keep us updated on any problems you run into...and maybe some dyno results later...

 

sorry i was unclear but just wanted to help you out didnt read that you already tried the intake i kow they fit but dont think the older intakes bolt on completely. here are the bolt holes i was trying to describe. Please excuse my poor photo shop drawing.

 

I see a toe! lol. I see what you mean now, thanks for the help. That would suck if i tried the manifold at the last minute and it didnt fit!

I'll try to get all the pics i can of the swap. Ita amazing how much the little things cost. All the crap you dont think about when you first think of doing the swap.

Im sure it'll be worth it in the end. Also thanks to a screw up with summit i had to go to a local speed shop(ben pilla) and order the afpr. Ill have the y pipe and the afpr tomorrow.

Friday ill put the manifold on the v8. Ill put the plugs in along with the new oil filter and fill the air holes in the exhaust manifold left from the air tubes i removed. I got pipe plugs from home depot to fill the holes with.

ahh, that reminds me i need to get a trans mount!

 

Okay. It's open again and being moved to its rightful place.

 

I want timeslips!

 

thanks tech.

Doward i cant wait to see what the car will do once im done with the swap. Right now id have a hard time beating a school bus!

I dont know whats wrong with the 2.8 but the little power it did have is gone!

 

The 2.8/3.1 seem to run outta steam after a blown head gasket.
It's aged & used.
Time to go.
Serious, I discovered this "aging quickly factor" after I did my "wasted time & parts" head swap on my Blazer due to blown head gasket on the original 2.8 at 211,500 miles.
Shoulda done a 3.4 swap then, but......
I attribute this aging quickly factor due to not enough "engine block meat" as in compared to a Small or Big Block Chevy, to absorb "high heat & expansion abuse of overheating enough to burst a head gasket".
My theory.
PS ya will need the spacer to get better & smoother fuel/air mixture due to the intake & carb combo. The 1" aluminum spacer, correct?
You are running an automatic, correct?
Consult Holley for advice how to tune carb for the drivetrain.
Automatics & carbs are set up slightly differently.
I would have to do same, if I swap this carb between my Old Vette/TH400 & the Old Camaro/M-21 4-speed.
What distributor you using?
Points or electronics?

 

The spacer is 3/4 inches, i needed it because the manifold is square and the carb is spread. Yes im going with an auto.
Ill try to ask holley about carb turning. I have been looking around on the web about them.

Im using an older GM hei vac advance dist with this motor.

While doing the swap im not touching the ecm at all. Ill disconnect the injector wires from back by the trans but thats it. No need to go wire hunting to remove the ecm.

I remember when my head gasket went people told me this motor would never be the same!

 

By not knowing the opposite, you'll not know how lousy it is to drive a stick & a single plane intake/carb set up on the street. I did that for about a year.
I'll offer a reply from Chevy High Performance that's a good answer for your situation.
The question was how to turn a 1983 305 carb Camaro into an "Off Road Car"?
Completly disable the vehicle computer system. This will allow you to remove the engine management computer and the harness that comes from the passenger side of the firewall. As was stated, you can connect the primary switch power directly to your new HEI and car will function properly
Also disconnect that pesky check engine light.
The speed shop should also have a book how to tune a Holley.
I'd find the Holley phone number & read them your engine/cam, intake & tranny & rear gear set up. Some of their answers will be real honest, but they know their stuff well.
There are tune up kits for distributors. I know I've used them with very good success. Hate loosing those tiny springs!! Boing!

 

I got a hei vac adcance dist today from a friend of a friend, it was all checked out ok. I also picked up the mallory 4309 and all the fittings. My Y pipe also came in from autozone. $80 with lt warr. Only thing thats left is a coil.

Sat it goes in!

 

HAVE YA REPLACED YOUR U JOINTS YET!
No mention of that detail so far, I recall!
You'll discover the U joints are original if ya take a torch to u joints & wax melts off the tips. That's factory sealing. I discovered that, too at 211,500 miles.
Tranny first, loosely attach the tranny mount for pivoting, holdup front of tranny, install T Convertor for your application, "insert engine" on swapped in V8 frame mounts.
I'd enjoy seeing a pic of the fuel pump arrangement ya created. How do you power yours? Auxilary fuel pump switch or keyed?

 

im the new kid on the block yall. yall sound cool in here. i want 2 know if some of u can send me pictures of ur camaros so i can get inspired by som projects that yall have done. i want 2 make mines look cool. send it 2 themory23@hotmail.com

 

Well i dont have a camaro i have a firebird but so far the only thing apperance wise i have done is shaved my ant. Took me about a half an hour and made a huge diff. The only other thing i have done is vinyl on the top of the windshield. Fixed some small dents and ripped off that damn bra that came on the car.

Biggest thing im doing to the car so far is the motor swap tomorrow. If done right it wont be apperance related.

 

thats cool. hope it works out 4 u. i see its a 350. i hope to get my dream engine 1 day when i get some better cash flow. does any one know how to change the weather striping on the doors of the 89 camaro.? mines is ok but i want 2 change it. it seems like i might need some kind of glue to make it stay. can i take it off another bird or maro or buy it new? what yall got 4 me?

 

If he has a tan interior get me the drivers side cupholder.

 

its gone already. Now hes selling some wheelie bars. Some tires and some older style rims.

 

I dunno Karl, I did that for quite awhile dident feel much different with the large Xcellertor and a Holley then a Stealth and the same carb. Not to mention that was in my 76 pu but then it weighs 400lbs less then our cars do.

As far as the fuel pump it doesent care what its feeding or what you have working as long as you leave the relay intact it will pump.

 

If you mean the stripping on the door on the outside you'll need to remove the door panel and remove the screws holding it in. You probably could find a better answer if you search. I havnt done door weather stripping so im not sure.



Tomorrow is the day! I have all the crap i need except for a coil, ill pick one up later. I have a new y pipe. mallory afpr etc etc .

Also i went to get some gas today and when i got home i reved the 2.8 up pretty high for the hell of it. ( motor is half dead anyway) and coolant shot out from the pass side of the block Not from a freeze out plug either. So i guess the block has a crack? I have smelled coolant before while driving so i guess its been like this for awhile.

 

Pontiac 400 is a big difference to a Chevy 350. Torque is a wonderful thing and Chevy 350s are very low compared to the Pontiac 400s.
Had a Pontiac 400 myself once and torque is a wonderful thing!

 

the 2.8 is now GONE!!!!!!!:lala: :lala: :lala: :lala: :lala: :lala: :lala: and it had a 6 inch crack in the passenger side of the block

 

he needs to clean the engine bay but hey its bolted in and almost ready to go!

 

Yeah and what a pita those motor mounts were. Only thing that got smashed is the wiper motor cover. That massive crack would explain me smelling coolant while driving and the coolant on the side of the engine compartment. Now i have to put in the mallory afpr, the alt, starter, y pipe, the flowmaster exhaust, carb,rad all the little stuff.

Thanks to everyone who has posted ideas and helped with the swap.

EXtra thanks to z28guy for all the help with the swap. :hail:


And to anyone thinking of going from v6 to v8? The motor mounts are a pita!!!!!!

Thats about the hardest part. We spent 2 hours on the damn mounts.

Also just in case anyone is wondering, my car doesnt sit any lower.

 

Car will settle once you get going. Should've cleaned that engine bay while it was empty, but then if the swaps almost done..........

 

Excellent!
Go celebrate at Pats & Ginos for me!

 

Project i really wanted to, i also wanted to paint the whole engine bay. But we were using this guys space and he was doing a trans and it was kinda tight.

Ill clean it up some this week and post some pics when im done.



Ked i wish i could but the cars not done so i cant get to pats ginos

Ill have to settle for one around here.

If anyone is thinking about this swap id only do it under two conditions.

1 you really like your car

or

2 you got a good deal on the motor and trans.


Its really much much easier to go buy a v8 car but if you like your car like i do then thats not an option.

 

Congrats on conpleteing,,,It will settle only about an inch lower, Im running 28" tires with no issues.

 

motor

 

Does that engine run an adaptor on the heads for using the older style valve covers?

What would work well on the engine bay.
Go get some Easy Off Oven Cleaner (the stinky one!) and spray and hose off with cold water. That will definetly help. WATCH out for chemical burns! I still got a scar from doing that Easy Off engine bay work on my Blazer swap. Use "thick" rubber gloves, too!
You'll be surprised what is removed by that stuff!
Go get a few plastic bristle scrub brushes with long handles (various head sizes) for cheap same grocery store visit. Get cleaning in your driveway using cold hose water & low pressure.
As much as I hate a light colored engine bay (my Firebird is same color) the cleaner light paint does aid in engine bay viewing (reflective light).

 

Thanks Riley. Only thing that might be an issue is my carb adapter and carb.We measured before and it looked like id have to get a drop base air cleaner. Afriend of mine has the same mani as me, (actually i got mine from him) but hes got a edelbrock carb, his carb is alot higher then my holley,that with a 2 inch reg base air cleaner and the stud is right level with the hood when his is closed. At leaste the hard part is over!

Ked theres some thingy under the vc's, i guess its what your talking about. The vc bolts are very shallow. They dont go down much at all. Ill be replacing the vc's soon to match the rest of the shiny stuff i bought.

The oven cleaner! I have been trying to tell people about that for awhile now. No need to go buy some over priced engine cleaner if you wanna clean the engine bay. I sprayed ez off on my old tbird. It had grease like a 1/4 inch thick all over the engine. Let it sit and it all came off very easily.

So now i have to clean, then sort the wires out, then start bolting stuff on the engine.

Cant do it today though, im sunburnt pretty bad and my arms are killing me.

 

When ya ready to remove those thingys under the vc, PLEASE GIVE ME A SHOUT!!!
To check hood clearence, use plumbers clay (easily available) or playdough & close hood very slowly!
Lots of options for hood clearence issue in Camaros, but not Firebirds. Fbird hoods tend to cost more.

 

Br()bert, What intake are you using? You can also remove the Liner for extra clearance

 

I will Ked. Good idea with the play doh. If i end up with clearance issues ill get a different carb. The reason for the spacer is the carb is spread and the mani is square. that adds 3/4 inch to it all. Me and a friend measured and i had 10 iches to work with, the carb with the spacer is 7.

Riley my mani is an edelbrock performer rpm.
and i removed that nasty grease filled liner the second week i had my car. Eww that stuff was nasty.

 

Yeah you are going to need the dropbase.....you might get away and make it fit, but that doesnt leave much room above the filter.

 

Also my speedo is cable driven,.this is a newer style motor /trans. My speedo doesnt hook up , Oh well i guess i'll need to buy some auto meter gauges in the future.

 

locate an 8 cyl gauge cluster, rewire, and use. That's what I had to do w/mine. Still need to figure out the tach lead, and when car gets tagged I can mess w/which of the 3 vss wires gets hooked up to the ecm.

I think Xophertony & myself have some threads on rewiring (for 6cylinder) older gauges to full VSS gauge pods.

 

CoOl , thanks, ill do a search and try to find some on it.

 

Well I got the power steering done today along with bolting on the carb and putting in the rad. I cant use my v6 alt, Even though its the same size from bolt hole to bolt hole the fins hit the bracket. Oh well im almost done! Also i need a serious drop base air cleaner! I have like 1/2 inch hood clearance!

 

yeah Wrong alt! If you are interested I have a 2" harwood scoop attached to my old hood I would let you have real cheap,,
Here is a pic

I rivveted it on took about an hour for the install

 

Yeah uhm, Unless theres a VERY low profile air cleaner out there ill have a problem, take a look at this. I really dont wanna have to cut my hood , plus imo firebirds look like crap with scoops or cowl hoods. Thanks got the offer ill keep that in mind in case i have no option.

 

see if anyone will trads your performerrpm for a regular preformer intake. You wont need the spacer, plus the carb sits lower anyway.

 

If ytou dont mind losing a bit of performance And about 50.00!