T56 swap - answers to questions that arnt normally covered.
05-01-2004, 05:28 PM
#102
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Car: transam, el camino
Engine: 415
Transmission: T56
What digital speedometers will work without a calibration box? I've tried cyberdyne and nordskog- calibration does not help and if i'm going to spend 150.00 I don't want to spend another 90 on an sgi box.
05-02-2004, 10:29 AM
#103
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Car: 1992 Z28
Engine: 5.7 L98 TPI 10 over stock
Transmission: T-56
Axle/Gears: 10 bolt 3.73 Richmond
Is anyone online at this time??? I need to find someone who still has their t56 out of their car. What I need to know is where the slave cylinder goes into the bellhousing there is a large spacer that goes on the two studs before the slave cylinder goes on. I need to know what the thickness of that spacer is. Basically the dimension from where the spacer mates to the bellhousing to where it mates to the slave cylinder. The trans that I got for the swap didn't come with this spacer so I need to fab one up. I just need to know how big to make it. Thanks for any help.
05-02-2004, 10:58 AM
#104
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Car: '86 Camaro, '02 WRX, '87 K5, '67
Engine: 350 TPI, 2.0turbo, 383 in the works, 289-4BBL, 232, A-head 4-cylinder
Transmission: T56, 5-speed, 700R4, C4, T176, semi-auto 2-speed
Axle/Gears: 3.73, 3.90, 4.88, 3.55, 3.54, 7.00
I used a stock starter and didn't have any clearance problems. I got one for an '86 Camaro with a 5.0TPI and a 5-speed. I had a 168 tooth flexplate with the auto (it is a crate motor, so that's why it had a 168, or so I'm told, as all cars that year should have been a 153). The T-56 only uses a 153 tooth flywheel, so I had to buy a new starter from the get go.
IMO those mini starters are a waste of money. If you have headers they are almost guarnateed not to fit, no matter how you clock the body to the housing. A stock starter should work without problems anyways.
chopper, you're better off buying the spacer. It isn't just a thickness issue, it also has a bore for the clyinder to register on. They aren't that expensvie and you can get one from a GM dealer.
IMO those mini starters are a waste of money. If you have headers they are almost guarnateed not to fit, no matter how you clock the body to the housing. A stock starter should work without problems anyways.
chopper, you're better off buying the spacer. It isn't just a thickness issue, it also has a bore for the clyinder to register on. They aren't that expensvie and you can get one from a GM dealer.
05-02-2004, 11:02 AM
#105
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Car: 1992 Z28
Engine: 5.7 L98 TPI 10 over stock
Transmission: T-56
Axle/Gears: 10 bolt 3.73 Richmond
Hey thanks TKO, I was unaware that I could buy one new. I thought that it could only be found used. Is that a dealer only item??
05-02-2004, 11:14 AM
#106
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Car: '86 Camaro, '02 WRX, '87 K5, '67
Engine: 350 TPI, 2.0turbo, 383 in the works, 289-4BBL, 232, A-head 4-cylinder
Transmission: T56, 5-speed, 700R4, C4, T176, semi-auto 2-speed
Axle/Gears: 3.73, 3.90, 4.88, 3.55, 3.54, 7.00
Any GM/Chevrolet/Pontiac dealer should be able to order one. It's actually a Tremec part though, wich means that any Tremec dealer than handles T56s can get one too. D&D Performance is probably the biggest T56 dealer around, so they are one source.
05-02-2004, 01:57 PM
#107
Originally posted by TKOPerformance
I used a stock starter and didn't have any clearance problems. I got one for an '86 Camaro with a 5.0TPI and a 5-speed. I had a 168 tooth flexplate with the auto (it is a crate motor, so that's why it had a 168, or so I'm told, as all cars that year should have been a 153). The T-56 only uses a 153 tooth flywheel, so I had to buy a new starter from the get go.
IMO those mini starters are a waste of money. If you have headers they are almost guarnateed not to fit, no matter how you clock the body to the housing. A stock starter should work without problems anyways.
chopper, you're better off buying the spacer. It isn't just a thickness issue, it also has a bore for the clyinder to register on. They aren't that expensvie and you can get one from a GM dealer.
I used a stock starter and didn't have any clearance problems. I got one for an '86 Camaro with a 5.0TPI and a 5-speed. I had a 168 tooth flexplate with the auto (it is a crate motor, so that's why it had a 168, or so I'm told, as all cars that year should have been a 153). The T-56 only uses a 153 tooth flywheel, so I had to buy a new starter from the get go.
IMO those mini starters are a waste of money. If you have headers they are almost guarnateed not to fit, no matter how you clock the body to the housing. A stock starter should work without problems anyways.
chopper, you're better off buying the spacer. It isn't just a thickness issue, it also has a bore for the clyinder to register on. They aren't that expensvie and you can get one from a GM dealer.
to be 153 tooth? Also, I don't understand why a mini starter
would not work with headers. I thought they were made to
just for that reason, clearance issues. I am buying a 1986-
up crate motor. It suppose to come with a manual flywheel
but don't know if it will work with a T-56 trans.
05-02-2004, 03:24 PM
#108
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Car: '86 Camaro, '02 WRX, '87 K5, '67
Engine: 350 TPI, 2.0turbo, 383 in the works, 289-4BBL, 232, A-head 4-cylinder
Transmission: T56, 5-speed, 700R4, C4, T176, semi-auto 2-speed
Axle/Gears: 3.73, 3.90, 4.88, 3.55, 3.54, 7.00
Yes, a 168 tooth flywheel won't even fit inside the T56 bellhousing. You must use a 153 tooth flywheel.
If you are doing an swap with a trans from a '93-'97 F-car trans you will need the LT1 specific 153 tooth flywheel. No other flywheel will work.
If you are buying a crate motor it will most certainly have a 168 tooth flexplate for an auto trans on it. They make good frisbees, but that's about it.
Every mini starter that I ever tried to use hit the headers. In truth, mini starters were designed to provide a gear reduction to make cranking an engine with very high cranking compression possible. I've never seen headers that fit so tightly in the starter area that the starter was a problem. I just stopped trying to use them, because they always seemed to hit, are expensive compared to a stock starter, and never had the need for the gear reduction to get the motor to crank. I'll stick with a NAPA lifetime remanufactured starter over the min starter any day of the week and twice on Sundays.
If you are doing an swap with a trans from a '93-'97 F-car trans you will need the LT1 specific 153 tooth flywheel. No other flywheel will work.
If you are buying a crate motor it will most certainly have a 168 tooth flexplate for an auto trans on it. They make good frisbees, but that's about it.
Every mini starter that I ever tried to use hit the headers. In truth, mini starters were designed to provide a gear reduction to make cranking an engine with very high cranking compression possible. I've never seen headers that fit so tightly in the starter area that the starter was a problem. I just stopped trying to use them, because they always seemed to hit, are expensive compared to a stock starter, and never had the need for the gear reduction to get the motor to crank. I'll stick with a NAPA lifetime remanufactured starter over the min starter any day of the week and twice on Sundays.
05-02-2004, 04:58 PM
#109
Originally posted by TKOPerformance
Yes, a 168 tooth flywheel won't even fit inside the T56 bellhousing. You must use a 153 tooth flywheel.
If you are doing an swap with a trans from a '93-'97 F-car trans you will need the LT1 specific 153 tooth flywheel. No other flywheel will work.
If you are buying a crate motor it will most certainly have a 168 tooth flexplate for an auto trans on it. They make good frisbees, but that's about it.
Every mini starter that I ever tried to use hit the headers. In truth, mini starters were designed to provide a gear reduction to make cranking an engine with very high cranking compression possible. I've never seen headers that fit so tightly in the starter area that the starter was a problem. I just stopped trying to use them, because they always seemed to hit, are expensive compared to a stock starter, and never had the need for the gear reduction to get the motor to crank. I'll stick with a NAPA lifetime remanufactured starter over the min starter any day of the week and twice on Sundays.
Yes, a 168 tooth flywheel won't even fit inside the T56 bellhousing. You must use a 153 tooth flywheel.
If you are doing an swap with a trans from a '93-'97 F-car trans you will need the LT1 specific 153 tooth flywheel. No other flywheel will work.
If you are buying a crate motor it will most certainly have a 168 tooth flexplate for an auto trans on it. They make good frisbees, but that's about it.
Every mini starter that I ever tried to use hit the headers. In truth, mini starters were designed to provide a gear reduction to make cranking an engine with very high cranking compression possible. I've never seen headers that fit so tightly in the starter area that the starter was a problem. I just stopped trying to use them, because they always seemed to hit, are expensive compared to a stock starter, and never had the need for the gear reduction to get the motor to crank. I'll stick with a NAPA lifetime remanufactured starter over the min starter any day of the week and twice on Sundays.
93-97 LT1 be good? It's says it's the 153 tooth. Cost: $287
OR the SLP "lightweight" steel billet flywheel.Cost: $355!
Which one would be good, cause the stock one that came with
the trans is pretty much smoked!
Also, I will go with a reman. stock starter, and take your
advice. You have more experience than me about T-56
swaps. How much would they usually be? And I will be
using the SLP 1 3/4" headers for my motor. How come
FireRed91Z28 is having problems fitting his starter in?
Is it because he's using the wrong starter? Which starter
to buy? Do I buy a 1995 T/A with a T-56 starter? Or the
1991 Camaro 5.7 w/T-5 starter?
Last edited by Camaro_nut; 05-02-2004 at 05:02 PM.
05-02-2004, 10:32 PM
#110
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Car: 89 iroc-z 5.7tpi 350,
Engine: 5.7tpi 350,
Transmission: T-56 fully built WOOHOO
15 dollars plus shipping for anyones used 153 tooth flywheel dont care if its non usable or not.
05-03-2004, 11:54 AM
#111
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Car: '86 Camaro, '02 WRX, '87 K5, '67
Engine: 350 TPI, 2.0turbo, 383 in the works, 289-4BBL, 232, A-head 4-cylinder
Transmission: T56, 5-speed, 700R4, C4, T176, semi-auto 2-speed
Axle/Gears: 3.73, 3.90, 4.88, 3.55, 3.54, 7.00
The Centerforce or SLP flywheels will be fine too. I would stay with steel, and close to stock weight. I am currently running an aluminum flywheel that is less than half the mass of the stock unit and the idle is very unstable.
I bought a NAPA lifetime starter for an '86 Camaro Z28 with a 5.0TPI and a T5 five speed. It was around $95 I believe, but it has a lifetime warranty, plus limited tow coverage, so it's a pretty good deal. I've never tried to use an LT1 starter, but if my memory is correct they use a lightweight starter that is quite expensive, even as a reman.
I've read about starter clearance problems on a few sites, but never experienced any myslef. If he's trying to use a starter for a 168 tooth flywheel that's the problem. The two are incompatible.
I bought a NAPA lifetime starter for an '86 Camaro Z28 with a 5.0TPI and a T5 five speed. It was around $95 I believe, but it has a lifetime warranty, plus limited tow coverage, so it's a pretty good deal. I've never tried to use an LT1 starter, but if my memory is correct they use a lightweight starter that is quite expensive, even as a reman.
I've read about starter clearance problems on a few sites, but never experienced any myslef. If he's trying to use a starter for a 168 tooth flywheel that's the problem. The two are incompatible.
05-03-2004, 01:44 PM
#112
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Car: transam, el camino
Engine: 415
Transmission: T56
I don't really like my centerforce flywheel, compared to the LT1 flyweight that came w/the transmission. I am running a pre'86 motor so I had to get a diff. flywheel. Anyway, the centerforce I am using is a pig- I guess the extra weight is good for launch its gotta slow the engine a bit throwing the extra 15lbs around between shifts. On a 383 or a 400 it would be less of a problem, I'd like to see someone throw this flywheel on a V6 and see how slow the revs pick up!
Last edited by 1983Fbody; 05-03-2004 at 01:47 PM.
05-03-2004, 04:18 PM
#113
TKOPerformance,
I am using an '86-up SBC 5.7. So, the starter will have
to be for a 1991 Camaro with 5.0 and T-5, correct? (which is
basically my car now,or will be). I believe that 5.0 and 5.7
use the same starter. So, these starters will work with the
153 tooth LT1 flywheel? Don't mind me if I ask stupid questions.
I just need someone to tell me for sure, so that I don't get
the wrong starter. Any help always appreciated.
P.S. I was told many times to get a mini starter for this
problem. Mostly because like every T-56 conversion article
said to use that! Thanks for the heads up. I can now save
$100.
I am using an '86-up SBC 5.7. So, the starter will have
to be for a 1991 Camaro with 5.0 and T-5, correct? (which is
basically my car now,or will be). I believe that 5.0 and 5.7
use the same starter. So, these starters will work with the
153 tooth LT1 flywheel? Don't mind me if I ask stupid questions.
I just need someone to tell me for sure, so that I don't get
the wrong starter. Any help always appreciated.
P.S. I was told many times to get a mini starter for this
problem. Mostly because like every T-56 conversion article
said to use that! Thanks for the heads up. I can now save
$100.
05-03-2004, 09:21 PM
#114
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Car: 91 Z28
Engine: currently 350...BUILT 383 soon
Transmission: T56 w/4.10's
my starter when i had an automatic was a little bigger on the end piece that goes into the little hole on the bellhousing. as i was taking it out to grind it down i broke the automatic cap and just figured what the hell and went and got a new one which is a good amount smaller and is not a ministarter.
now im waiting on my Dak SGI-5 box to come in so the car will hold an idle and i can have a working speedo/tach again.
i cut the hole for the shifter a little oversized, any suggestions on what i can do to make it flush with the shifter plate? i would prefer not to weld anything as my welder is sadly broken. i was thinking getting some hard plastic cut it out to fit then seal it/hold it on with some of this autobody goop stuff i have?
now im waiting on my Dak SGI-5 box to come in so the car will hold an idle and i can have a working speedo/tach again.
i cut the hole for the shifter a little oversized, any suggestions on what i can do to make it flush with the shifter plate? i would prefer not to weld anything as my welder is sadly broken. i was thinking getting some hard plastic cut it out to fit then seal it/hold it on with some of this autobody goop stuff i have?
05-03-2004, 09:25 PM
#115
So did you end up buying a manual trans. starter motor instead?
Also, why would you need the Dakota Digital box to hold
an idle and tach for? The box is just for speedo converting/
recailibration.
Maybe I am misunderstanding you. But I would like to know.
Are you using the stock ECM? Even then, you do not need to
hook up anything to the ECM from the trans.
Also, why would you need the Dakota Digital box to hold
an idle and tach for? The box is just for speedo converting/
recailibration.
Maybe I am misunderstanding you. But I would like to know.
Are you using the stock ECM? Even then, you do not need to
hook up anything to the ECM from the trans.
Last edited by Camaro_nut; 05-03-2004 at 09:28 PM.
05-03-2004, 09:30 PM
#116
Originally posted by 1983Fbody
I don't really like my centerforce flywheel, compared to the LT1 flyweight that came w/the transmission. I am running a pre'86 motor so I had to get a diff. flywheel. Anyway, the centerforce I am using is a pig- I guess the extra weight is good for launch its gotta slow the engine a bit throwing the extra 15lbs around between shifts. On a 383 or a 400 it would be less of a problem, I'd like to see someone throw this flywheel on a V6 and see how slow the revs pick up!
I don't really like my centerforce flywheel, compared to the LT1 flyweight that came w/the transmission. I am running a pre'86 motor so I had to get a diff. flywheel. Anyway, the centerforce I am using is a pig- I guess the extra weight is good for launch its gotta slow the engine a bit throwing the extra 15lbs around between shifts. On a 383 or a 400 it would be less of a problem, I'd like to see someone throw this flywheel on a V6 and see how slow the revs pick up!
weights 7 lbs. less than a stock one. And no unstable idle like
an aluminum one.
05-03-2004, 09:58 PM
#117
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Car: 91 Z28
Engine: currently 350...BUILT 383 soon
Transmission: T56 w/4.10's
Originally posted by Camaro_nut
So did you end up buying a manual trans. starter motor instead?
Also, why would you need the Dakota Digital box to hold
an idle and tach for? The box is just for speedo converting/
recailibration.
Maybe I am misunderstanding you. But I would like to know.
Are you using the stock ECM? Even then, you do not need to
hook up anything to the ECM from the trans.
So did you end up buying a manual trans. starter motor instead?
Also, why would you need the Dakota Digital box to hold
an idle and tach for? The box is just for speedo converting/
recailibration.
Maybe I am misunderstanding you. But I would like to know.
Are you using the stock ECM? Even then, you do not need to
hook up anything to the ECM from the trans.
05-04-2004, 08:56 AM
#118
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Car: 91 Camaro Vert
Engine: 02 LS1, HX40
Transmission: 2002 LS1 M6
Originally posted by FireRed91Z28
well since the trans VSS isnt hooked up to my ECM the car thinks i have no transmission and cant get a signal for idle speed...or thats what i think from reading posts from ppl with the same problem. and yes it does convert/calibrate the speedo also. when u wire the box u are wiring it like in the diagram i believe MR Dude posted on the 1st page and it connects the T56 VSS to the original automatice wiring or something like that. sorry im not specific i dont quite get it but i know the driving without the box leaves the car "searching" for and idle.
well since the trans VSS isnt hooked up to my ECM the car thinks i have no transmission and cant get a signal for idle speed...or thats what i think from reading posts from ppl with the same problem. and yes it does convert/calibrate the speedo also. when u wire the box u are wiring it like in the diagram i believe MR Dude posted on the 1st page and it connects the T56 VSS to the original automatice wiring or something like that. sorry im not specific i dont quite get it but i know the driving without the box leaves the car "searching" for and idle.
when you downshift or slowdown in gear, the computer will see a high vac... it will realize that the car is moving, but its gettting no VSS signal. it will then throw the code for VSS.
in otherwords, the engine light will come on once you start driving it if the VSS isnt hooked up.
on the 1st page of the FAQ is the wiring diagram to hook the SGI to your 3rdgen. doesnt matter if it was orignally manual or automatic.
05-05-2004, 02:18 PM
#119
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Car: 91 Z28
Engine: currently 350...BUILT 383 soon
Transmission: T56 w/4.10's
Originally posted by MrDude_1
you can drive JUST FINE without the VSS.
when you downshift or slowdown in gear, the computer will see a high vac... it will realize that the car is moving, but its gettting no VSS signal. it will then throw the code for VSS.
in otherwords, the engine light will come on once you start driving it if the VSS isnt hooked up.
on the 1st page of the FAQ is the wiring diagram to hook the SGI to your 3rdgen. doesnt matter if it was orignally manual or automatic.
you can drive JUST FINE without the VSS.
when you downshift or slowdown in gear, the computer will see a high vac... it will realize that the car is moving, but its gettting no VSS signal. it will then throw the code for VSS.
in otherwords, the engine light will come on once you start driving it if the VSS isnt hooked up.
on the 1st page of the FAQ is the wiring diagram to hook the SGI to your 3rdgen. doesnt matter if it was orignally manual or automatic.
WAY off. but then again the thing was off when i bought the car with 4.10's and an uncalibrated speedo. at idle its boncing around 1000-1100 but that definately isnt correct cause the car feels right around 500-600 as it is very quiet and sonds as if it would die if i turned on the heater or a/c.
05-05-2004, 02:25 PM
#120
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Car: 91 Camaro Vert
Engine: 02 LS1, HX40
Transmission: 2002 LS1 M6
Originally posted by FireRed91Z28
the SGI-5 box does correct the idle problem though right? thats what ive read. and does it affect my Tach cause that thing works right now and just seems
WAY off. but then again the thing was off when i bought the car with 4.10's and an uncalibrated speedo. at idle its boncing around 1000-1100 but that definately isnt correct cause the car feels right around 500-600 as it is very quiet and sonds as if it would die if i turned on the heater or a/c.
the SGI-5 box does correct the idle problem though right? thats what ive read. and does it affect my Tach cause that thing works right now and just seems
WAY off. but then again the thing was off when i bought the car with 4.10's and an uncalibrated speedo. at idle its boncing around 1000-1100 but that definately isnt correct cause the car feels right around 500-600 as it is very quiet and sonds as if it would die if i turned on the heater or a/c.
it should have zero effect at idle since, well the car is still at idle. on a no throttle slow speed the ECM might need the VSS for accurate idle calcs, but i doubt it.
it should not effect your tach at all.... your tach is probly just totally inaccurate like 99% of all other 3rdgens out there
your gears have nothing to do with the tach.
05-05-2004, 02:31 PM
#121
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Car: 91 Z28
Engine: currently 350...BUILT 383 soon
Transmission: T56 w/4.10's
well we'll see when the Dak box gets delivered and i instal it Via your wiring diagram. (not saying your wrong about anything idle wise, i just dont know cause i hear a lot of diff things in these forums). but thanks for all the info and this specific forum has helped a lot for my conversion.
05-05-2004, 09:46 PM
#122
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Car: 1982 Trans Am
Engine: LG4
Transmission: 200C
Axle/Gears: 3:73
Originally posted by MrDude_1
it should not effect your tach at all.... your tach is probly just totally inaccurate like 99% of all other 3rdgens out there
it should not effect your tach at all.... your tach is probly just totally inaccurate like 99% of all other 3rdgens out there
05-06-2004, 09:10 AM
#123
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Car: 91 Camaro Vert
Engine: 02 LS1, HX40
Transmission: 2002 LS1 M6
Originally posted by TransAm12sec
How unaccurate are thirdgen tachs?
How unaccurate are thirdgen tachs?
and it changes over time.
mine is roughly 18% off... 12% to 20% seems to be the norm.
edit:
they allways read high.
05-06-2004, 03:35 PM
#125
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Car: 91 Camaro Vert
Engine: 02 LS1, HX40
Transmission: 2002 LS1 M6
Originally posted by porkyzilla
usally 200rpm higher than what is
usally 200rpm higher than what is
but in anycase, this is off topic..
this thread is suppost to be a FAQ of how to do the T56 install... lets try to keep it there...
05-08-2004, 10:06 AM
#126
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Car: GTA
Engine: Bone Stock 350ci HSR T-76 Turbo
Transmission: T56 6-speed
Axle/Gears: Stock
T56 Swap Information
Here is some valuable information about doing a T56 swap. Maybe some things have been previously discussed in this thread, but more is not bad.
First I will put the part numbers of each and every part I needed to complete the swap, I'll try to remeber what part number was for and the price I paid for it.
<U>Description</U> <U>Part#</U> <U>Price</U>
1)Clutch Fork # GMC-12523312 $100.00
2)Clutch Fork Nut # GMC-12523313 $30.00
3)Flywheel cover # GMC-10241153 $7.65
4)Flywheel # GMC-10125379 $295.00
5)Bracket # GMC-12523315 $40.00
<FONT size=1>(I believe this an aluminum spacer that
covers the clutch slave and fork)</FONT>
6)DOR-14650 # GMC-14061685 $20.00
7)F-Bolt/SCRPC # GMC-12523314 $5.00
8)Bolt # GMC-10079898 $23.80
9)Bolt # GMC-12337828 $4.50
<FONT size=1>(This last four parts, I dont remember what they where for, but are part of the T56 swap, please verify)</FONT>
10)Clutch, Pressure Plate & Release bearing # RAM-88516 $309.99
11)Flywheel Bolt Kit # ARP-200-2802 $9.95
<FONT size=1>(This last two where bought at Summit's)</FONT>
The T56 custom K member I got it from Andris Skulte, moderator of the Power Adder Section.
The computer to correct the speedo is a SGI-5, information available thru Andris site. It is advisable to put a noise filter in the + positive cable of the SGI-5 to avoid noise getting in the computer and reduce the jumping of the speedo's vane.
The stock 700R4 drive shaft will work. Dont try to use 3rd gen Flywheels, wont work, use a 93-97 flywheel. The complete clutch and brake pedal assembly of the 3rd gen F-body is necessary, get also the cruise control and safety switch attached to the assembly. The starter motor housing may need to be grinded a little to clear the T56's bell housing, your 3rd gen starter motor will work. The auto shift plate can be modified to be used on the swap(what I did, and looks better that using a 5 speed shift plate which sits more to the front). I dont know if I include it on the part numbers above, but remember to put a new thrust bearing into the crankshaft for the T56 spline shaft.
I hope this will help to future swaper's.
Good luck!
First I will put the part numbers of each and every part I needed to complete the swap, I'll try to remeber what part number was for and the price I paid for it.
<U>Description</U> <U>Part#</U> <U>Price</U>
1)Clutch Fork # GMC-12523312 $100.00
2)Clutch Fork Nut # GMC-12523313 $30.00
3)Flywheel cover # GMC-10241153 $7.65
4)Flywheel # GMC-10125379 $295.00
5)Bracket # GMC-12523315 $40.00
<FONT size=1>(I believe this an aluminum spacer that
covers the clutch slave and fork)</FONT>
6)DOR-14650 # GMC-14061685 $20.00
7)F-Bolt/SCRPC # GMC-12523314 $5.00
8)Bolt # GMC-10079898 $23.80
9)Bolt # GMC-12337828 $4.50
<FONT size=1>(This last four parts, I dont remember what they where for, but are part of the T56 swap, please verify)</FONT>
10)Clutch, Pressure Plate & Release bearing # RAM-88516 $309.99
11)Flywheel Bolt Kit # ARP-200-2802 $9.95
<FONT size=1>(This last two where bought at Summit's)</FONT>
The T56 custom K member I got it from Andris Skulte, moderator of the Power Adder Section.
The computer to correct the speedo is a SGI-5, information available thru Andris site. It is advisable to put a noise filter in the + positive cable of the SGI-5 to avoid noise getting in the computer and reduce the jumping of the speedo's vane.
The stock 700R4 drive shaft will work. Dont try to use 3rd gen Flywheels, wont work, use a 93-97 flywheel. The complete clutch and brake pedal assembly of the 3rd gen F-body is necessary, get also the cruise control and safety switch attached to the assembly. The starter motor housing may need to be grinded a little to clear the T56's bell housing, your 3rd gen starter motor will work. The auto shift plate can be modified to be used on the swap(what I did, and looks better that using a 5 speed shift plate which sits more to the front). I dont know if I include it on the part numbers above, but remember to put a new thrust bearing into the crankshaft for the T56 spline shaft.
I hope this will help to future swaper's.
Good luck!
Last edited by BBSDesigns; 05-08-2004 at 11:12 AM.
05-08-2004, 06:34 PM
#127
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Car: 1992 Z28
Engine: 5.7 L98 TPI 10 over stock
Transmission: T-56
Axle/Gears: 10 bolt 3.73 Richmond
YEEEEE HAAAAA! I finally got my t56 installed and all I can say is HELL YEAH! I love it. What I thought was going to take 2 days ended up taking me more like 6 and a half but man was it worth it. My advice to anyone who plans this install, airtools make it much easier. You need any combination of extentions equaling around 30-36" in length. Also, a 9/16ths swivel socket to get at those automatic bellhousing bolts. I used all 3/8ths sockets and extentions with a reducer on my 1/2" impact and it all went pretty smooth. By the way the torque arm mount at the tailshaft housing will not work from a 700r4 setup. You either need to get one with your trans or order a 4th gen one from a Chevy dealer. I found that out the hard way
. Fortunately, my local dealer got me one in a day due to local availability. Third Gen pedals are a lot easier to install simply cause all the switches are the same so you don't have to splice any new plugs into your harness. Good luck to everyone who has yet to install their t56
. Fortunately, my local dealer got me one in a day due to local availability. Third Gen pedals are a lot easier to install simply cause all the switches are the same so you don't have to splice any new plugs into your harness. Good luck to everyone who has yet to install their t56
05-08-2004, 06:45 PM
#128
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Car: '86 Camaro, '02 WRX, '87 K5, '67
Engine: 350 TPI, 2.0turbo, 383 in the works, 289-4BBL, 232, A-head 4-cylinder
Transmission: T56, 5-speed, 700R4, C4, T176, semi-auto 2-speed
Axle/Gears: 3.73, 3.90, 4.88, 3.55, 3.54, 7.00
Yes, use the stock 5-speed starter for your car and it should work just fine.
Without a VSS signal to the ECM the idle will be unstable and the car will tend to stall when you push in the clutch at speed. You can compensate by adjusting the idle screw on the throttle body, but this is a half-@$$ fix. You need an SGI-5 to send an accurate VSS signal to the ECM, and if you want your cruise to work too. Trust me, I finally got the SGI-5 in the car and it made a world of difference. I drove the car with and without it, and I definately like it a lot better with the SGI-5. BTW, without a VSS signal I never got a VSS related code.
Also, don't ground the neutral park switch for the ECM. Leave the two wires unconnected.
I use a stock 5-speed shift plate on the console. It looks/works just fine. It's just my opinion though.
Without a VSS signal to the ECM the idle will be unstable and the car will tend to stall when you push in the clutch at speed. You can compensate by adjusting the idle screw on the throttle body, but this is a half-@$$ fix. You need an SGI-5 to send an accurate VSS signal to the ECM, and if you want your cruise to work too. Trust me, I finally got the SGI-5 in the car and it made a world of difference. I drove the car with and without it, and I definately like it a lot better with the SGI-5. BTW, without a VSS signal I never got a VSS related code.
Also, don't ground the neutral park switch for the ECM. Leave the two wires unconnected.
I use a stock 5-speed shift plate on the console. It looks/works just fine. It's just my opinion though.
05-08-2004, 07:10 PM
#129
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Car: 1992 Z28
Engine: 5.7 L98 TPI 10 over stock
Transmission: T-56
Axle/Gears: 10 bolt 3.73 Richmond
I second that motion on the 5 speed shifter console. Mine looks just like factory original. About the SGI-5. I have one and it's all hooked up but the green light flashes when I start to move and I cant figure out why. I've tried every combination of switch positions and output positions and I finally got got the speedo to read around 6mph off what it actually should be but the up and down buttons for adjusting the speedo do not work. Has anyone had this problem??? Can anyone help??? If not, I'll have to wait till Monday and call Dakota Digital, I was just hopin to get it workin this weekend.
05-08-2004, 07:28 PM
#130
Originally posted by TKOPerformance
Yes, use the stock 5-speed starter for your car and it should work just fine.
Without a VSS signal to the ECM the idle will be unstable and the car will tend to stall when you push in the clutch at speed. You can compensate by adjusting the idle screw on the throttle body, but this is a half-@$$ fix. You need an SGI-5 to send an accurate VSS signal to the ECM, and if you want your cruise to work too. Trust me, I finally got the SGI-5 in the car and it made a world of difference. I drove the car with and without it, and I definately like it a lot better with the SGI-5. BTW, without a VSS signal I never got a VSS related code.
Also, don't ground the neutral park switch for the ECM. Leave the two wires unconnected.
I use a stock 5-speed shift plate on the console. It looks/works just fine. It's just my opinion though.
Yes, use the stock 5-speed starter for your car and it should work just fine.
Without a VSS signal to the ECM the idle will be unstable and the car will tend to stall when you push in the clutch at speed. You can compensate by adjusting the idle screw on the throttle body, but this is a half-@$$ fix. You need an SGI-5 to send an accurate VSS signal to the ECM, and if you want your cruise to work too. Trust me, I finally got the SGI-5 in the car and it made a world of difference. I drove the car with and without it, and I definately like it a lot better with the SGI-5. BTW, without a VSS signal I never got a VSS related code.
Also, don't ground the neutral park switch for the ECM. Leave the two wires unconnected.
I use a stock 5-speed shift plate on the console. It looks/works just fine. It's just my opinion though.
Ok, so what if you are using a motor that does not use
an ECM, like a carbed motor? Or a motor that has it's own ECM,
like the Ramjet 350? I assume that you do not need to
hook up anything then? Just the power, ground and signal
wires to the VSS? Since the stock ECM will be eliminated,
there is no need to hook up the Dakota Digital box to anything
but the other wires right?
05-08-2004, 08:08 PM
#131
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Car: '86 Camaro, '02 WRX, '87 K5, '67
Engine: 350 TPI, 2.0turbo, 383 in the works, 289-4BBL, 232, A-head 4-cylinder
Transmission: T56, 5-speed, 700R4, C4, T176, semi-auto 2-speed
Axle/Gears: 3.73, 3.90, 4.88, 3.55, 3.54, 7.00
With a carb motor you don't need the VSS, unless you have a factory electric speedo you want to keep functioning, or cruise control.
With a stand alone EFI engine like the Ramjet you just need what they give you with the engine, unless you want a speedo or cruise as noted above.
With a stand alone EFI engine like the Ramjet you just need what they give you with the engine, unless you want a speedo or cruise as noted above.
05-08-2004, 08:23 PM
#132
So basically, to keep the factory elecronic speedo ( in
90-92 Camaros) just wire it like the diagram says
that Mr.Dude1 posted? I just want to make sure, cause
if it does not work out that way, I will just buy a new
aftermarket speedo. I don't even see a wire for the ECM
to go to anyways (in the diagram). If GM can custom build a
Camaro with a Ramjet 350 and a Corvette 6 speed, and still use
the stock 1991-1992 Camaro gauges, I don't see how it's any
different here. I am sure they had to use a conversion box as
well. I want to have a functioning speedo.
90-92 Camaros) just wire it like the diagram says
that Mr.Dude1 posted? I just want to make sure, cause
if it does not work out that way, I will just buy a new
aftermarket speedo. I don't even see a wire for the ECM
to go to anyways (in the diagram). If GM can custom build a
Camaro with a Ramjet 350 and a Corvette 6 speed, and still use
the stock 1991-1992 Camaro gauges, I don't see how it's any
different here. I am sure they had to use a conversion box as
well. I want to have a functioning speedo.
05-08-2004, 09:10 PM
#133
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Car: '86 Camaro, '02 WRX, '87 K5, '67
Engine: 350 TPI, 2.0turbo, 383 in the works, 289-4BBL, 232, A-head 4-cylinder
Transmission: T56, 5-speed, 700R4, C4, T176, semi-auto 2-speed
Axle/Gears: 3.73, 3.90, 4.88, 3.55, 3.54, 7.00
To make your factory speedo work you will need an SGI-5. Or you can just use an aftermarket speedo. I'm running a 5" Autometer speedo. I use the SGI-5 to send a VSS signal to my cruise and ECM only. The Autometer speedo can read right off the T56 VSS.
05-09-2004, 10:30 AM
#134
Originally posted by Clutch_Grabwell
a new slave unit
The tip of the slave plunger is strapped to the body with what looks like a Ty-wrap. This looks like something that should be removed before bolting everything together.
a new slave unit
The tip of the slave plunger is strapped to the body with what looks like a Ty-wrap. This looks like something that should be removed before bolting everything together.
05-09-2004, 10:36 AM
#135
Originally posted by FireRed91Z28
now what.....did anyone forget to mention i need a new starter???
im finished and was doin the last thing...boltin the starter back in and it doesnt seem to fit... 91 Z28 350 was an Auto.....
now what.....did anyone forget to mention i need a new starter???
im finished and was doin the last thing...boltin the starter back in and it doesnt seem to fit... 91 Z28 350 was an Auto..... You can also use an LT1 f-body starter, or a C4 vette mini-starter (1988 for application) which fits because it has no "nose cone" surrounding the pinion gear when the gear is engaged to the flywheel.
You can also grind the bellhousing. You can also grind the starter.
350 starter
305 starter
-Matthew
05-09-2004, 10:41 AM
#136
Originally posted by Camaro_nut
Ok, so the flywheel that I have to use on a 1995 T-56 HAS
to be 153 tooth?
Ok, so the flywheel that I have to use on a 1995 T-56 HAS
to be 153 tooth?
Last edited by jmd; 05-09-2004 at 10:45 AM.
05-09-2004, 11:53 AM
#137
Originally posted by TKOPerformance
To make your factory speedo work you will need an SGI-5. Or you can just use an aftermarket speedo. I'm running a 5" Autometer speedo. I use the SGI-5 to send a VSS signal to my cruise and ECM only. The Autometer speedo can read right off the T56 VSS.
To make your factory speedo work you will need an SGI-5. Or you can just use an aftermarket speedo. I'm running a 5" Autometer speedo. I use the SGI-5 to send a VSS signal to my cruise and ECM only. The Autometer speedo can read right off the T56 VSS.
THAT'S What I wanted to know! Thank you for clearing
that up for me. I would like to use a nice Autometer
speedo gauge, actually ALL new Autometer gauges.
But it's expensive, and will be time consuming to get
each one fit in the 91-92 gauges! So, $80 for a SGI-5
might be better for me then. However, the Autometer
self calibrating speedos makes it 10 times easier to
figure out the correct speed. Which is pretty much NO
guess work compared to a conversion box. But, it's
like $200+ for a speedo. So, I will be back and forth
with this for a while.
05-09-2004, 08:54 PM
#138
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Car: 1986 Monte Carlo SS
Engine: 1989 L98
Transmission: T-56
Axle/Gears: 8.5" 3.42:1 posi
Originally posted by Clutch_Grabwell
... a new master/slave unit ...
The tip of the slave plunger is strapped to the body with what looks like a Ty-wrap. This looks like something that should be removed before bolting everything together.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Thanks, Matthew. I had to fish the socket out of the trash, but at least it didn't made it to the dump.
... a new master/slave unit ...
The tip of the slave plunger is strapped to the body with what looks like a Ty-wrap. This looks like something that should be removed before bolting everything together.
Originally posted by jmd
Leave it there. It'll pop the first time you hit the clutch. The centre round part has to stay on the slave rod anyway.
Leave it there. It'll pop the first time you hit the clutch. The centre round part has to stay on the slave rod anyway.
Thanks, Matthew. I had to fish the socket out of the trash, but at least it didn't made it to the dump.
05-09-2004, 09:05 PM
#139
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Car: 91 Z28
Engine: currently 350...BUILT 383 soon
Transmission: T56 w/4.10's
alright i need a part # for the male VSS connector that goes into a 94 T/A T56 transmission. and while im askin...the part #s for the reverse lockout connector and backup lights connector
need this ASAP thanks a lot
need this ASAP thanks a lot
05-09-2004, 10:04 PM
#140
T56 swap - answers to questions that arent normally covered.
Originally posted by FireRed91Z28
alright i need a part # for the male VSS connector that goes into a 94 T/A T56 transmission. and while im askin...the part #s for the reverse lockout connector and backup lights connector
need this ASAP thanks a lot
alright i need a part # for the male VSS connector that goes into a 94 T/A T56 transmission. and while im askin...the part #s for the reverse lockout connector and backup lights connector
need this ASAP thanks a lot
- this is covered. normally. do a search.
- See sig.
- Quit taking this thread off-topic.
05-10-2004, 06:41 AM
#141
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Car: 91 Z28
Engine: currently 350...BUILT 383 soon
Transmission: T56 w/4.10's
ive looked locally but no dealership has any instock and forgot to ask for the part #. didnt mean to throw this off topic
also Dak Digital has a new SGI-5 box its the "B" version. they are a little different, instead of having a whole bunch of little on/off switches it only has 4 and then 2 switches (up/down) you press to adjust the speedo while driving beside someone at a set speed.
also Dak Digital has a new SGI-5 box its the "B" version. they are a little different, instead of having a whole bunch of little on/off switches it only has 4 and then 2 switches (up/down) you press to adjust the speedo while driving beside someone at a set speed.
05-10-2004, 07:41 AM
#142
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Car: 91 Camaro Vert
Engine: 02 LS1, HX40
Transmission: 2002 LS1 M6
Originally posted by jmd
T56 swap - answers to questions that arent normally covered.
T56 swap - answers to questions that arent normally covered.
- this is covered. normally. do a search.
- See sig.
- Quit taking this thread off-topic.
im working on stripping out only the FAQ part.. then we can unsticky this thread and i'll have another one to put up... with a reminder that its a FAQ for questions that arnt covered by other install articals. this is DETAILS ONLY. not a T56 how to. or discussion.
athough by the time i saw the thread again, it was already a page and a half away...
05-14-2004, 05:16 PM
#143
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Car: transam, el camino
Engine: 415
Transmission: T56
Well if anyone doesn't want to spend 200.00 on an autometer speedo,
Dakota digital says that all of their digital speedo's work with the T56's vss signal. Prices are:
150.00 for the "mini" speedo/odometer and
180.00 for the 3 3/8" speedo/odometer this also has a highbeam indicator and turnsignal indicators which might be nice if your doing a custom dash.
Nordskog's will not work without a calibration box.
150.00 for speedo
90.00 for cali. box
Cyberdyne might work without a seperate box, jury is still out as they have not answered my email. price
150.00 for speedo
calibration box??
Dakota digital says that all of their digital speedo's work with the T56's vss signal. Prices are:
150.00 for the "mini" speedo/odometer and
180.00 for the 3 3/8" speedo/odometer this also has a highbeam indicator and turnsignal indicators which might be nice if your doing a custom dash.
Nordskog's will not work without a calibration box.
150.00 for speedo
90.00 for cali. box
Cyberdyne might work without a seperate box, jury is still out as they have not answered my email. price
150.00 for speedo
calibration box??
06-25-2004, 01:18 PM
#144
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Car: 91 Z28
Engine: currently 350...BUILT 383 soon
Transmission: T56 w/4.10's
its been quite a while since i installed my T56 in my 91 Z and now i finally got around to hooking up the VSS, BUT!!!! my local GM parts dealer keeps giving me the wrong VSS plug. my tranns is a 94 Trans Am T56 i clearly wrote that down on paper and handed it to the guy at the desk and he gave me a VSS plug that plugs perfectly into my 700R4 VSS but will not go into the T56. this has happened twice, first time was when i just got the tranny in and later i read the return policy and if packages are open they are not returnable so $25 in the trash... and once again got the wrong plug....same as the first one i got.
where can i get the right plug? is there something special i need to plug it in? i am really getting aggravated.
where can i get the right plug? is there something special i need to plug it in? i am really getting aggravated.
06-25-2004, 02:33 PM
#145
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Car: 91 Camaro Vert
Engine: 02 LS1, HX40
Transmission: 2002 LS1 M6
Originally posted by FireRed91Z28
its been quite a while since i installed my T56 in my 91 Z and now i finally got around to hooking up the VSS, BUT!!!! my local GM parts dealer keeps giving me the wrong VSS plug. my tranns is a 94 Trans Am T56 i clearly wrote that down on paper and handed it to the guy at the desk and he gave me a VSS plug that plugs perfectly into my 700R4 VSS but will not go into the T56. this has happened twice, first time was when i just got the tranny in and later i read the return policy and if packages are open they are not returnable so $25 in the trash... and once again got the wrong plug....same as the first one i got.
where can i get the right plug? is there something special i need to plug it in? i am really getting aggravated.
its been quite a while since i installed my T56 in my 91 Z and now i finally got around to hooking up the VSS, BUT!!!! my local GM parts dealer keeps giving me the wrong VSS plug. my tranns is a 94 Trans Am T56 i clearly wrote that down on paper and handed it to the guy at the desk and he gave me a VSS plug that plugs perfectly into my 700R4 VSS but will not go into the T56. this has happened twice, first time was when i just got the tranny in and later i read the return policy and if packages are open they are not returnable so $25 in the trash... and once again got the wrong plug....same as the first one i got.
where can i get the right plug? is there something special i need to plug it in? i am really getting aggravated.
the only thing i can tell ya is to bring your current ones in with the bags that have the part number... have him pull up the diagram on the screen.
make sure its the right one..
then compare what it says as partnumbers to what he gave you.
if diffrent, get the new, correct part.
if the same number, look up a diffrent car.. like a 95 or 96.
most likely, hes looking it up wrong.
06-27-2004, 10:12 PM
#146
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Car: '86 Camaro, '02 WRX, '87 K5, '67
Engine: 350 TPI, 2.0turbo, 383 in the works, 289-4BBL, 232, A-head 4-cylinder
Transmission: T56, 5-speed, 700R4, C4, T176, semi-auto 2-speed
Axle/Gears: 3.73, 3.90, 4.88, 3.55, 3.54, 7.00
GM Part Number 12101899 is the correct VSS pigtail number
BTW, never tell a guy behind the counter that you swapped the T56 into a 3rd gen, because they instinctively want to look up the part you need for your 3rd gen and not the car which the T56 came in originally. Give then just enough information to look up the part, or they always seem to screw it up.
BTW, never tell a guy behind the counter that you swapped the T56 into a 3rd gen, because they instinctively want to look up the part you need for your 3rd gen and not the car which the T56 came in originally. Give then just enough information to look up the part, or they always seem to screw it up.
06-28-2004, 12:10 PM
#147
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Car: 1991 Z28
Engine: 383
Transmission: T-5
Axle/Gears: 3.08 10 Bolt
just wanna say im contemplating a t56 swap....ill need it to be able to handle my new engines power and ive always wanted 6th gear (plus my t-5 doesnt shift for sheet now). this thread has helped immensly so thanks Mr dude and everyone else that has contributed.
i have a question but if this is too off topic then it doesnt need to be answered here.....i have a 383 that has been balaced to accept a 350/305 flywheel and i was going to reuse my 305 flywheel...
my question, is it necessary to use the lt1 flywheel or can my 305 work. if the 305 wont then will the lt1 flywheel still be balanced correctly for the 383?
thanks in advance
i have a question but if this is too off topic then it doesnt need to be answered here.....i have a 383 that has been balaced to accept a 350/305 flywheel and i was going to reuse my 305 flywheel...
my question, is it necessary to use the lt1 flywheel or can my 305 work. if the 305 wont then will the lt1 flywheel still be balanced correctly for the 383?
thanks in advance
06-28-2004, 12:35 PM
#148
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Car: 91 Camaro Vert
Engine: 02 LS1, HX40
Transmission: 2002 LS1 M6
Originally posted by CamarosRUS
just wanna say im contemplating a t56 swap....ill need it to be able to handle my new engines power and ive always wanted 6th gear (plus my t-5 doesnt shift for sheet now). this thread has helped immensly so thanks Mr dude and everyone else that has contributed.
i have a question but if this is too off topic then it doesnt need to be answered here.....i have a 383 that has been balaced to accept a 350/305 flywheel and i was going to reuse my 305 flywheel...
my question, is it necessary to use the lt1 flywheel or can my 305 work. if the 305 wont then will the lt1 flywheel still be balanced correctly for the 383?
thanks in advance
just wanna say im contemplating a t56 swap....ill need it to be able to handle my new engines power and ive always wanted 6th gear (plus my t-5 doesnt shift for sheet now). this thread has helped immensly so thanks Mr dude and everyone else that has contributed.
i have a question but if this is too off topic then it doesnt need to be answered here.....i have a 383 that has been balaced to accept a 350/305 flywheel and i was going to reuse my 305 flywheel...
my question, is it necessary to use the lt1 flywheel or can my 305 work. if the 305 wont then will the lt1 flywheel still be balanced correctly for the 383?
thanks in advance
if your 383 was machined to accept any 305/350 one piece rear main flywheel or flexplate, then you can just bolt the LT1 flywheel on without any additional machine work.
06-28-2004, 12:59 PM
#149
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Car: 1991 Z28
Engine: 383
Transmission: T-5
Axle/Gears: 3.08 10 Bolt
nice....i just wanted to make sure the weight would be okay for the 383 since balancing one of those is a little tricky. anywho...id be doing the t5 swap so it shouldnt be too difficult (but we all know about that). i have no clue how to install a clutch but what better time to learn? btw i read someone had problems with the upper bellhousing bolts, does that just apply for the 700-r4 or for the t5 as well? and are the tranny conversion plates for floorjacks are worthwhile investment when removing and installing the actual tranny? i might need to invest in one if they help out.
06-30-2004, 08:37 AM
#150
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Location: Newark, DE
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Car: '86 Camaro, '02 WRX, '87 K5, '67
Engine: 350 TPI, 2.0turbo, 383 in the works, 289-4BBL, 232, A-head 4-cylinder
Transmission: T56, 5-speed, 700R4, C4, T176, semi-auto 2-speed
Axle/Gears: 3.73, 3.90, 4.88, 3.55, 3.54, 7.00
The upper bolts on a T5 are easy to remove, because the trans will already be out of the car when you go to remove the bellhousing. The problem with the 700R4 is that the trans and bell are one piece. The upper bolts are hard to get to because there's a trans in the way. Personally I don't think they're that bad. You just need a u-joint and some 3/8 long extensions. Then I use a 1/2"-3/8" reducer so I can use my impact gun.
A trans jack adapter isn't a bad idea. The thing is to make sure that there's enough room under the car for the jack and adapter so that you can still physically get the trans out from under the car. This means getting the car up in the air pretty far. Typically I jack the car up as far as it will go and set it on jackstands. Then I use a couple of blocks I've made up to jack the car even further up, and just keep raising the stands to suite. Getting a 3rd gen up on stands is a chore, especially an IROC Z28 (1" lower ride height than a regular Camaro). Be sure to do everything safely though. Take your time and do it right.
A trans jack adapter isn't a bad idea. The thing is to make sure that there's enough room under the car for the jack and adapter so that you can still physically get the trans out from under the car. This means getting the car up in the air pretty far. Typically I jack the car up as far as it will go and set it on jackstands. Then I use a couple of blocks I've made up to jack the car even further up, and just keep raising the stands to suite. Getting a 3rd gen up on stands is a chore, especially an IROC Z28 (1" lower ride height than a regular Camaro). Be sure to do everything safely though. Take your time and do it right.