I was contemplating on if I should restore my engine to stock or not. I know it sounds crazy, but would it be worth it? I know the early 3rd gens aren't worth much mainly because of thier low HP engines. Not that I'm really looking to get a profit out of it anyway, I'm not looking to sell my car anytime soon. I don't really know how these engines are since I've never driven one, but I hear they were pretty weak and have lot's of problems or parts are getting harder to find for them. On the other hand I've read an article somewhere where this guy was running 12's with his crossfire corvette. Obviously those engines were a little bit bigger. Also it doesn't look like there is any aftermarket stuff for these engines. I'd have to get a wiring harness also and I'm hoping the wiring under the dash isn't all hacked up. I'm not looking to race my car or anything like that. Mainly I was just looking for stock apearance since these cars are getting harder to come by and mine is a first year 3rd gen...not that that really means much to the 3rd gen crowd. Just like the first year Grand Nationals aren't worth anything either just because of the engine combo...nothing like the '86-'87's. I even thought of possibly putting a 301 turbo in the car like Pontiac should have done...I know that's even crazier considering those engines, by some, could be considered worse than the crossfire. Again there are the parts issure with that engine also. Would it be best to just stick with my Pontiac engine? Will that do anything to the value...after all it is a Pontiac.

 

Id stick with the Crossfire setup. Its not a bad system once you get the hang of working on it. As far as stock performance, they arent anything to call home about, but I never had one problem with my 82 TA. If you are running a crossfire, your new best friend will be a water manometer, used to sync the TB's. There are however a few aftermarket performance parts out there. One being the X-Ram, which is supposed to yield great increases in power. You can also have the TB's bored to 2" and sometimes bigger. Once the intake is modified, all the other mods are the same as any other small block chevy would be. Just beware of possible PROM tuning, or swapping to the newer "7747" ECM, which is a lot easier to work with as opposed to the stock LU5 ECM. But then again, I like my cars to have an original appearance. So, the choice is yours. Either way, it sounds like youll havea good car when youre done.

 

I would pay more for a stock/ original car than a modified one.

Yes, if I were looking for an 82 T/A I would prefer a stock CFI car to one thats had the CFI removed.

But...thats just my opinion.

 

Go for it!

My blue '83:

 

82ta

I might still have a 83 trans am crossfire dash and ecm harness in storage if you are interested in it. should interchange with your 82 without a problem

 

Thanks for the reply guys I appreciate it....I prefer a stock appearance myself and while the 406 is nice, and the exhause sounds great, it does suck a lot of gas so I really try to stay close to home. I do like the ocasional street race though. Just thinking about getting my car back to stock seems daunting. I really haven't gotten an idea of the the previous owners have done to the car especially in the wiring department. I know the fuel lines are hacked because I had to fix one of the lines cause it was leaking...pretty sure the return line. but I do have the charcoal canister still hooked up, but I know it's not functioning. I'm pretty sure it still has the ECU hooked up, but haven't checked. He gave me the stock AC setup, not sure if it even works. He said I could have the original rear end too, it was sitting in his garage but I never picked it up!!! I wish I would have now and I'm almost positive it was disc! When I bought the car it was only the 2nd 3rd gen I looked at and bought it on the spot not really knowing alot about these cars, especially the early '82-'84's. Maybe I can write him and see if he still has it...don't have his phone number anymore.

I do know that the car had the Crossfire up until at least '91. After that I don't know when the new engine was swapped in. The original owner kept a log book and he seemed pretty maticulate with the TA. I supose if I need some money for the project I could sell the 406 and everything and the tranny. Don't know if I want the 700R4 or not.

 

Hmm, since there is already a different motor in there... I might have to say forget it, unless you are feeling adventurous!

I know in Chevy's you would have to move the motor mounts, but I'm not sure in Pontiacs... since technically there is no BBP, only BBC. Also, do you have the computer or any of the wires anymore? Or was that all hacked out?

I personally would just try and find another car if the fuel mileage is the reason that you are thinking about the swap! The swap will probably cost more than the fuel you would save anyway, so on second thought, keep the 406

 

I think he has a SBC 406, which would be the same as any SBC (including the stock type 305).

Now if you dont have the original motor, are you looking into putting a date-code correct 305 in the car?

If it is an SBC 406, Id say just swap the CFI onto that and tell people its a 305

 

That's what I was thinking (SBC), but in his description it's listed as a Pontiac 406... maybe a Pontiac 400 bored out?

 

Yes, it is a Pontiac 400 bored .30 over. It's from a GTO, don't know the year since I haven't looked up the code on the engine. I would guess mid to late 70's.

 

I believe the ECU is still in the car, at least that is what the previous owner told me. He said the car has "minimal computer control" The only thing the ECU might be controling is TCC lockup. Although there does appear to be a knock sensor in the block. I wasn't thinking about the swap just for fuel milage gains...mostly to just have a correct 'Bird. I'm definatley not going to get another car just to get the crossfire. I could find an engine, I just wanted some opinions to see if it would be worth the time and effort to make this car factory original again. Everything is stock but the drivetrain.

 

Can you post a picture of the Pontiac motor in your car? I'd really like to see what that looks like.

And as for it being from a GTO, I kinda' doubt that.
The last year the GTO had a 400 in it was 1973.

And that Pontiac motor would not have a knock sensor in it either.

If that really is a Pontiac motor, you will really miss that torque, if you go back to a little 305.

But anyway you go with it, good luck, and lets see some pictures.

 

Here's a 455-SD engine in a '82 Trans Am at Trans Am Territory in 1984.

If the car has already had a REAL Pontiac engine swapped into it, I would leave it be and make it look "stock" like it came that way from the factory. The bottom line is that had the yuppies on the 14th floor not gotten their brand loyalty killing ways these cars wouldn't have come with a common as doggie doo doo Chebbie engines in 1982.

 

here's a pic of the engine. For all I know it could be an Olds engine. They were somewhat similar weren't they? I haven't had the car long so I haven't had a good chance to actually get all the details on everything under the hood. I know it's got a holley 3310-2 carb, Weiand intake, I think it's got hooker headers, unknown specs on cam but it's got a lope to it, don't know what kind of heads it has, if they are stock or not. Has edlebrock valve covers...I know, doesn't really mean anything could just be for show. You probably can't tell much from the photo. I can probably get some betters ones if you guys want to see some specific things.

 

another

 

Damn! Screw the CFI! That thing is sweet looking!

 

Thanks man. I didn't know if people would think I'm crazy to want to get rid of it. It was just a thought. I love the power of this engine although it probably needs some more tuning. I definately need a tranny rebuild.

 

That is without a doubt a small block chevy motor, not a Pontiac.

But it does look veery nice, as-is!

I would leave it in there, and make the best of it.

Thanks for the pics

 

Looks like a Chebbie engine to me. Olds have the oil filler on the front of the engine. Its definately not a Pontiac engine.

Are you sure thats not of the original engine with just some aftermarket parts put on it? It looks like its painted corporate blue which is correct for an '82.

 

I thought the front oil filler was on the intake, which would be gone since it has an aftermarket one??

So what makes you guys think it's a SBC? The headers and valve covers?

It's probably a Chevy 400 .030" over, making it a 406. That would still be a small block!

 

Just throw the CFI on top of that motor and you will be fine

 

The Chebbie intake, the Chebbie valve covers, the Chebbie headers, the Chebbie timing chain cover, the Chebbie water pump, and the Chebbie alternator and PS pump brackets.

 

Hi Dens71TA!
You left out the chebbie carb!
Pontiac and Olds feed from the center of the front of the carb, not off to the side like Chevy!

George

 

so you say it's a Chevy engine huh?? I'm kinda disapointed now. 1) because the guy I bought the car from aparently lied to me and 2) because I figured it would be cool to have a true pontiac firebird. Oh well...I guess I'll have to make out with what I have. Glad you guys could help me with figuring this out. Anyone know where any type of engine stampings might be so I can get some more info on the engine?

 

http://www.mortec.com/castnum.htm

 

I'd have to agree with Dens71TA, that the corperate blue paint on the block looks like a big clue, that it may be the original 305.

The smoke thickens, your 1st told it was a Pontiac engine out of a GTO, which has been proven wrong, and then your told it is a 406 c.i. engine. I wouldn't be surprised at some point, that you learn that it is really the 305 cross-fire block, still in there, with a few goodies thrown on, for good measure.

Your on the right track though, check the numbers, to see what you really have there.

 

Well, I have never driven a car with a 400 in it, nor a 350. The biggest engine I ever had in a car was a V6 in my '86 Grand Prix, the rest have been 4 cylinders. Anyway, even though I've never driven a big cube engine, driving mine I have thought it should have more power. That made me start wondering, but I thought maybe it just needed some carb and timing adjustments. Granted I can smoke the tires with the best of them, but it just doesn't seem as quick as it should for a 400. My burnouts don't really last that long either. I've seen enough programs on the speed channel to know what a 400 can do. I'll tell you this...I raced my friend in his 5.0 Mustang (last year of the boxy look 92-93??) he's got some minor mods, headers, cam, just the basicsm and he's always talking up his car. Anyway we didn't really get a good race from a standstill just a rolling start and I could not beat him. He's got a 5 speed manual and I got a 4 speed slipping auto. For having a "406" in my car I thought for sure I would stomp on him. Granted he's lighter but that is when I thought it's got to be a combination of tuning and tranny slippage. Suposedly it's got a 700R4 in it too, but even that could be false. It seems to shift 4 times so I'm pretty sure, but until I get some numbers I won't know positively. Regardless what I have, I still love the car. I don't regret it at all for the condition and price I'm happy. I just want to know definately what I have under the hood.

 

"Regardless what I have, I still love the car. I don't regret it at all for the condition and price I'm happy."

That's all that matters! Do keep us posted on what you find.

 

Just something to think about the 700R4 trans.

Not original to an 82, but could have been installed later.

Shifting 4 times, may be mistaken as a 3 speed auto w/lock-up converter. At the point of converter lock-up, it will feel like a 4th up-shift.

Like I say check into what you have, and not assume anything.

Good Luck, and keep us posted.

 

Damn right!

for all the 305 slating they are good motors, and while they aren't as powerful as ater 305 and 350's, they aren't slugs either, i always feel people are a little too dismissive of the 305's, in good order a 305 should feel at the very least resonably punchy.

 

so lets say that the engine is the 305 crossfire, without the fuel injection and carbed. Is it basically the same block as other 305's? So headers and any other aftermarket stuff should fit right? Can you get good performance out of the 305 with bolt on's? If I really get on the throttle at a stop I can get the car to go sideways pretty good. Stock the hp and torque numbers are pretty low...with the stuff on my engine would it be possible to do this with the 305? I know it's not really a determining factor, but the engine seems pretty torquey.

 

Well, we really need to know that block number before we can say anything. Also, if you could pop a valve cover off and get the head numbers we could see if they are the stock LU5 heads!

 

Hello all,

I just took my 'bird out of storage yesterday. I cranked it over a couple times to get some oil flowing, and it had no problems starting up. I noticed some leaks on the floor though

It's not oil, but I have no clue what it is. It doesn't smell like anything really. It's in the right front. I did noticed that my fuel filter is leaking slightly at the connection end. Nothing major, just replace the hoses and the filter could be changed also. After pulling it in the driveway I noticed a little drip...antifreeze. I checked around the engine and found the vicinity. It's right by the front right motor mount. It's not coming from the heads...can';t really see where it's coming from. My neighboor said it could be the freeze plugs. When the engine warms it seems to drip a little faster.

I'll try and get some more photos up soon with better pics of my engine. The batteries in my digital cam were dead. I noticed that the heads had the word "DART" stamped into them. Also, my intake has the firing order stamped into it also. I don't know if it would be possible to narrow down an engine with the firing order. I still haven't found any engine codes, but haven't thoroughly looked either.

 

I wouldn't be able to sleep at night until I knew what engine I had. Get a drop light or a flashlight and a mirror and climb in there behind the drivers side cylinder head and look down there's a number cast onto the block. look up that number on the mortec site listed above. do it right now.

 

It's been a while but I got a code off of my engine block

It is 330817

Block: Chevy
Year: '73-'81
CID: 400
Low HP: 150
High HP: 180
Main Caps: 2
Type: Car, Truck

So it was a 400 all along, just not a Pontiac. I guess the guy had his cars mixed up

Still haven't found a VIN though.

Anyway, now that I know what I have I can look at some options on what I want to do. I really want to add fuel Injection. I was debating on going with CFI because I thought I had a 305 and wanted to make it stock again. But now that I have something with more power I don't know what route to go. CFI still

 

Stealth ram or mini ram!!

 

I'll have to look into it. Is it sort of like a TPI setup? I thought about going TPI

 

TPI... that can breathe much better! I wouldn't advise a stock TPI on a 400ci.

 

so I have heard. I would still need a wiring harness. What kind of ECM shoud I use?

 

Well, if you go Holley Stealth ram or whatever, you can use the stock TPI harness and ECU, and have a new EPROM burned for it.

 

Should I go with the '85-'89 harness or '90-'92? I know one is maf and the other is speed density. I would probably go the maf route.