Newbie here. I was looking at a low mileage '85 IROC and noted that it had the double pointer speedometer. That set off a red flag within me because my understanding is that this speedo disappeared after '84 and that Chevy went to a single pointer speedometer for '85. One of those little things I somehow recalled from my research (perhaps thankfully)!

Thoughts on this? You think someone switched out the speedometer at some point to make the car appear as though it has lower mileage than it really does? Or could this be an example of inconsistancy on GM's part (which wouldn't necessarily be unheard of). Thanks guys!

 

I can't recall ever seeing an 85 with the dual needle speedometer. Does it have the 'red line' above 55mph? If so that's a 82 only cluster, 83 and 84 just had the 55-85mph in a different color, without the 'red line' stripe. Generally, 85 should have the single needle 85mph max speedometer.

I wouldn't suspect a mileage change as quickly as I'd think about a previous owner just prefering a different cosmetic style. Mileage doesn't matter as much as actual condition anyway. You'll see low mileage cars in poor condition, and high mileage cars in exceptional condition. I'd probably run a Carfax or something similar to see if there's a mileage discrepency on file, but ultimately if the condition is good, I wouldn't nitpick over the gauge cluster.

 

It doesn't have the red line, the 55-85 numbers are just different color. Not saying the switch was to get lower miles, but it just seems odd to go from one 85 MPH speedo to another, and one that happens to have low mileage to boot. Its an online auction so whoever buys it will be paying for those low miles.

You're right though, who really knows? This could have happened any time over the past 25 years, for a variety of reasons. I just wanted to know if anyone had ever seen it before.

Carfax check is definitely a good idea. I will do that if I somehow become re-interested.

 

Something in the back of my mind is telling me I'd check the VIN's tenth digit to see if it's an "F" for '85. I'd also be looking the SPID (if it's still there and the VIN # on it matches the one on the car) for the RPO B4Z (to verify it's an IrocZ).

Whenever anything doesn't appear original to a car, I always like to checks the big things to make sure the car is as it's advertised. So many things can happen to these rides over time.

Good luck.

 

Definitely an '85 and an IROC. The VIN and codes all check out. Everything is 100% kosher except that speedometer. I just found it very weird that someone would switch that out on an otherwise original car. Maybe an owner at some point was commuting from Detroit to Windsor and wanted an easy km/h to mph system, I don't know. Still, it isn't sitting well with me.

Upon thinking about it, I'm going to pass. It's just too strange. And with the speedo reading < 50k miles, the price is already bid up pretty high, so those miles are definitely being baked into the price. Plenty of other cars out there.

 

My thought on it is that someone may have swapped it to sell the speedo. May have made an extra $100 off of it?
I'd also wonder what else may be swapped out like sway bars, wheels etc.

Can you ask them to see what they say?

 

Would pulling the dash apart in an otherwise good condition car be worth it to eeek out an extra hundo? I tend to doubt that, especially if the new speedometer raised the mileage (thereby lowering the car's value). And how much market is there for a stock 85 MPH speedo from an '85? If it was one of the later 140 MPH speedos I could see that. But the 85 MPH unit? Ehhhh...

It's true that this could cast suspicion on the whole works and maybe other parts were swapped. It sure is intriguing -- Hardy Boys' hat is on here -- but the car is near $6,000 and rising, so there's really no point in asking. I'm not going to pay that much if in my mind the mileage is questionable.

 

I have a sticker that has NCU on it attached to the back of my cluster. That corresponds to what is listed on my build sheet in the small section called no surprise, "instrument cluster". This is a possible way to test provided the sticker AND the build sheet are present.
And despite being a OCt 84 made car, no double needle in mine.
Maybe some assbly. line worker happened to find an older one laying around and decided, ohh what the heck

 

Possibly a very early production 85.

 

brochures are usually printed prior to production and the 85 brochure shows a single needle 85mph speedo. It has been swapped by someone along the way. There should definately be an odometer statement with this as it's illegal to tamper or change the odometer. If it was replaced, then a statement of the actual milage is required.

 

I was thinking the IROCs had the 140 speedo. I agree with Drew that it probably wasn't an attempt to trick anyone on mileage. You could tell by the cars condition and like you noticed, the speedometer itself creates suspicion on its own. Even when you transfer titles around here they don't care after a certain point. The titles say "not required" in place of where the numbers would be.

FWIW, they're not really difficult to swap though, so it wouldn't take much effort or time. I agree it is odd and contrary to what most people do, just trying to think of a reason for doing it. It may even be a case of someone having two Camaros and putting the parts they want in one and selling off the car they don't want. To be honest it's hard to say why people do the things they do. Just look at some of the customization threads online these days.

Some other things to note is that along the bottom there is a strip of indicator lights that vary from year to year and also depending if it's a stick shift or not. I'm looking at one that has an upshift indicator on the far right hand side. Another one has an emergency brake indicator in the same place along with a choke indicator that the other one doesn't have. It may be an early production fluke as well.

Do you have any pictures of this car/RPO sticker or a link to the auction? I didn't see anything posted here. Maybe others can pick out other odd things that might not be as obvious. IIRC, there were a lot of changes from '84 to '85, like the hood and front signal lights, etc. If you're no longer interested it might be fun to see it.

 

The ebay auction ended and someone's now the proud owner for just south of 6k, a pretty healthy penny for an '85. Hope I don't violate any TOS but here's the link.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...K%3AMEWAX%3AIT (Most recent auction)

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...K%3AMEWAX%3AIT (Prior auction)

The double-pointer isn't depicted in the photos from the auction which just ended. So here are few additional pics from a prior listing of the same car. I've been following 1985-89 IROCS for awhile to get a handle on prices and have been bookmarking links, so I still had it. Here you go, in the interest of science! About the only other off thing I notice, other than the speedo, are the silver wheel caps on the passenger side. They should be black on an '85 correct?

 

I think the 145 speedo first appeared on late '86 models. It's fun learning about these cars! I've owned several F-bodies in the past but never really studied their history as much as now.

Yes, clearly I'm not saying there was any attempt to trick anyone. Heck, we're still not 100% certain it isn't factory. It's not likely but American automakers are hardly known for their impeccible attention to detail. A neighbor once got a new AMC Hornet back in the '70s with upside down Gremlin emblems in the door panels, LOL! It spooked me but it could well be legit, who knows?

 

Very rare color... Wrong speedo though

 

My 85 IROC was equipped with an 85 MPH speedo. On a silver car, the wheel caps should be black with red lettering. Pic in my vbGarge. Also, the Z28 emblem on the pass side rear bumper on my car is silver, not red. Moreover, the emblem simply doesn't look right, though admittedly the pic isn't particularly clear. The fog lights are missing or so it seems.

JamesC

 

My honest opinion is the speedometer is wrong. The 140mph speedometers started showing up around 1986. It could be that a dealership had an unsold 84 Z28 on the lot, and someone wanted the later dash, so they swapped the parts to make the sale. Or it could be that something went wrong and they ordered the wrong service part. Or it could be the car was stolen and reassembled wrong when it was recovered. Or it could be that someone just liked the earlier needle. Or it could be that someone ordered a 140mph speedometer from the dealer, and when they went to sell the car they installed the speedometer out of their 84 Camaro. We don't really know why, and it doesn't really matter.

The 85-87 Iroc centercaps are black background with the "Irocz" script. But if the medallion falls off the backing is an aluminum disc stamped with the "Irocz" script. When that falls off they're just black plastic plugs with a couple holes.

It looks a bit rough for the supposed mileage. I don't see a bunch of red flags, but it just doesn't blow my skirt up like a true well kept, low mileage car would. I'd say it sold for a fair/average price. The rust proofing crap all over under the hood would kill it for me. I wouldn't be shocked to find the car full of drilled holes and rubber plugs all over.

 

Noticed the missing fogs too. Whenever something is missing off the front end, be it a grill, emblem or what have you, it always gives me a pause because that could indicate a possible front end collision (this particular car was being sold by a body shop).

Hard to tell without seeing it in person but we agree that it looks a tad rough for just 47k miles. Coupled with the double pointer (which I too tend strongly to believe was swapped out), that was enough to send me packing.

The maintenance records are in its plus column, as is its rare color and presence of original striping and rims.

 

Thanks for the info. I agree it doesn't look like a 47k mileage car. One thing that would make me nervous is the size of the images. Also, the rear deck lid doesn't line up and the seat belt doesn't appear to retract either. On a 50k car I would think that they would be in better condition. I don't think the grid taillights were available at the time either, but I forgot when they did come out. (Most of the info I've provided is from the Camaro White book.)

 

Note too that they changed the photos from the 1st auction to the 2nd. Not saying there's any impropriety of course but it's hard to gleen any meaningful details from the 2nd auction's photos. Still, to get $5,700 for a somewhat rougher 3rd Generation in this economy shows they did something right! They were asking for $6,200 in the original classified, and to get within $500 of any asking price is pretty good.

The grid taillights are ok. Those came out for '85 on Z28s (and of course IROCs). Good eye on the seatbelt. I didn't notice that initially. Retractors don't just wear out in 47,000 miles, though it could be that they just got out of the car and didn't activate the retractor. I'd need to see this in person before logging a demerit. Definitely noticed the spoiler, which is weird. No clue what would cause that. The paint burns are odd for a 47k mile car unless it lived outside for a substantial amount of time.

 

I'm a bit hesitant to say it but I was thinking the spoiler situation could be from an accident. The deck lid is removable, but it has quite a few bolts along with a pretty stout sealer along the glass. I don't think the upper mount/hinge is adjustable. Even if it is, IMO it should line up considering the mileage they're claiming.

 

The lid doesn't line up perfectly on my 85 either (on the pass side). Odd.

JamesC

 

The hatch components tend to slide around over time. There's a ton of adjustment in the hinges and in the decklid to glass joint. The hatch struts actually try to push the decklid off the glass. Many times you can actually see where the glass used to be before it creeped back. The other common reason they don't line up, is from the weatherstripping compressing with age.

I wouldn't worry too much about the seat belt. There was a recall in that time period for the retractors not retracting. It's not at all unusual regardless of mileage.

 

did anyone notice the foot pad on the carpet? That looks just like the early carpet. Did 85 still have the large foot pad like that? My 86 had the square foot pad and a separate pad on the tunnel for the gas pedal.

 

Huh, interesting. I never seen the deck lid off by that much before, but it makes sense though.

 

My seatbelts don't retract very well at all. If I'm driving and move around, the belt will loosen and I need to manually cause it to retract. My car only has 15k miles, so as Drew said, mileage isn't a variable with that issue.

 

Interesting, thanks for clarifying that.