i got a friend who recently bought a eclipse and he wants to put money on a race. from what i know its a 4 banger stick shift and a 96. i drive a 91 camaro RS automatic with the lo3 few mods should show up in signature. should i be able to win or advice on what to do. his car is lightly modded the lawn mower muffler and other lil stuff.
thanks
Shawn

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91 RS 5.0 TBI
14x3 open element
msd coil and taylor wires with split fire plugs
removed rear hood seal
coming soon 3.42's with slp posi

Clarion cd player 2 planet adio 6x9's 2 lanzar tweeters and one MTX sub in a bandpass running off 2 separate 200w amps

[This message has been edited by pimpintheRS (edited February 08, 2001).]

 

is he a GTS? if so then he is turbo charged and you are toast. but if he is not turbo charged you should wax him.TINFY

 

he isnt turbo charged yet but is in the process of buying a turbo engine out of a rolled eclipse. i'll race him before he gets it and after when i graduate college SOON!!!!
Shawn

 

Depends on what your friend has. Is it a turbo? Is it FWD or AWD? And are you racing from a roll or a drag type start?

If it's a NT (non-turbo), then you shouldn't have a problem as they only have 140hp or so stock. Even modded engines would only make a few more hp.

If it's a turbo, then it's a different story. All other things being equal (yes, this is a general statemet), it is far easier to make more power with turbo engines than NA engines. The reason is that any mods to improve intake or exhaust flow can yield a trememdous increase in boost, and in turn increase hp - especially in the DSMs. Therefore, you may or may not have a difficult time racing your friend.

AWD vs FWD - if you are doing a drag type launch and he has an AWD, unless you are running drag radials, you are likely to lose off the line. AWD DSMs run mid to high 1.x 60 ft times on STREET high performance tires, not drag radials. The average I've seen for f-bodies is high 1.x to low 2.x.

If he's FWD, you shouldn't have a problem because he would have to keep launch RPMs low to avoid wheel spin and DSMs don't make much power until higher RPMs.

Depending on the length of the race, you may pass him at the top end - more likely if he's AWD.

From a roll, you probably would win though it would be close against his FWD. If he's AWD, my money is on you.

I know there are a lot of general statments here and I'm not looking to argue with anyone. Ultimately, it depends on what you have versus what he has, and how your driving skills are relative to his.

Good luck!

Jack ****
95 Eagle Talon TSi AWD

 

thanks for all the info... he is a front wheel drive and right now has no turbo he is looking into buying a turbo engine though like i said above.he might also put a shoot of NOS in the engine too.We want to race before we both get into heavy mods then after since we both are looking into new engines. i thought i had a better chance at winning but just want to be sure before i put any money on it.
Shawn

 

I dunno. I have a 92 Bird w/ a 3.1 (stock 140HP) with only the mods below and beat 2 92 305TBI's (170 HP) on the street. My mom has a 97 (not sure if it's different than the 96 engine wise) FWD Eclipse that feels a HELL of a lot faster than mine. We haven't had time to race yet tho, and are never in the same spot. I'll get around to racing her sooner or later. I think you'll have a tougher time than expected, but if your car's cared for and has some mods, you should walk on him.

------------------
See pics @ Billy's Firebird
92 Bird 3.1L Auto
Best $750 I ever spent....
DRIVE IT LIKE YOU STOLE IT!
Kills:
93 Mustang LX (Before Mods)
98 or 99 Dodge Stratus (tough one, edged out at 40)
92 Camaro RS 305 TPI
97+ Honda somethin or another...modded....kept at my door the entire way
Close Calls
94 Grand Am 3.1 V6
92 Cavalier 3.1 V6
01 Porsche 911 Turbo (Had em till first gear)
Mods-Jet Stage 2 Performance Chip, Accel Cap/Rotor, Accel 8.8 MM Wires, Accell Coil, AC Delco Rapidfire Plugs, Dynomax Catback, K&N
AIM name OVRCLCK350

 

I hate it when people with slow cars talk about all the people they "beat" on the streets.. first because street racing is dangerous, and second because half the time they think they are beating someone, the person they are "racing" is just playing around.

I am not saying my car is fast.. but I'd much rather go to the drag strip then to dangerously and illegally race on the street...

After almost getting killed "racing" someone, I got a little sense knocked into me.

 

ovrclck350 he is a 305 not a six cylinder so no he shouldnt have any problems beating him unless he cant drive then who knows and the reason why your moms eclipse feels faster is becasue its a pocket rocket. or the whole go cart syndrome. it feels fast because its so small but it really isnt. and if hers is a five speed then yes it will feel better becuase of gear selection. i dont like imports but i love driving my friends 91 accord five speed. its peppy in every gear but if it was a auto it would suck.

89GTA i totally agree with you man. seems the ricers really like to talk about all the pony and muscle cars the beat on the street with there four cylinders NA. and i never race on the street, screw around and speed like hell i've done that a scant few times but i prefere not too.TINFY

 

Ok, #1, I hate it when the V8 guys assume that all V6's are slow. I'm not saying that I AM fast, but I did beat a 305, and it was my friend. Yes he was racing me, because we had planned it. And I have been beaten by a 305 too, tonight in fact. I'm not saying that I can beat EVERY 305, with ANY driver. And I'm not saying my car is fast, but you seriously need to get off your pedastal and realize that just because you have a v8, is not a reason to disregard the 6's.

 

Nicely said! I agree, I have put down V8s also. And I LOVE how no one believes us. But hey I got nothing to prove. Believe what u want guys.

------------------
1992 Camaro RS 3.1L
T5 Manual 5 speed
Cold/RAM air intake
Z-28 Exhaust
8.5mm MSD Ignition wires
TB Coolant bypass

Soon to be a 3.8L turbo RS

AIM screen name - Stopsign696

Kills:

95 (****) Probe GT,94 Mustang GT,91 CRX (dont ask me why he raced me),2nd Gen Z28 (350) haha to you V8 guys!,1992 RS 305 TBI (good race),First Gen Integra, Old Escort LX
More to come

 

i would most likely race my friend at the track either in phoenix or pomona. I do street race every once and a while when the road is clear but every since the cop got my going 95 in a 35 zone i really dont race to much on the street. yes my girlfriend kicked my *** .
Dude with the v6 thanks for your advice. oh wait jennifer lopez is on saturday night live i got to go.. thanks for the advice fellas. I will post the results soon though.
Shawn

 

all that was said is v8 has a better starting hp than a v6 usually. NOT ALL V8 are faster. come on guys. i like debates not flames
Shawn


[This message has been edited by pimpintheRS (edited February 11, 2001).]

 

Not matter what you drive and what the competition drives, DRIVER SKILL makes all the difference.

If you don't know how to launch, what your traction limits are, where you make your power in the RPM band, etc.... then you're probably going to lose. V8 vs V6, turbo vs non-turbo, NOS vs no-NOS, doesn't really matter. Know the limits of your car!

Oh, like someone said before, race at the track, not on the street.

Good luck!

Jack ****
95 Eagle Talon TSi AWD

 

The only fast V6 f-body was the TTA. V6 third gen fbodys are very very slow from the factory. I havn't seen someone post an impressive time slip with a non-turbo V6 3rd (i am sure someone will post one now though) gen, even with extensive modifacations.

Show me some time slips and it will mean a lot more. V8 3rd gen f-body's are so cheap. You can by a base model firebird or camaro with a V8 for practically nothing.

I am not trying to start a war or anything, but I never understood v6 f-body's. F-body's have poor reliability/build quality and are a pain in the *** to park without an 8 I would hate my car. Maybe i'm just upset at all the problems i've had to fix with my GTA and secretely want a 5.0 Mustang...

 

i always have nagging lil problems with my car but i dont think a mustang will fix it they break just as much unless you plan on buying a new one... why not a 5.7L instead of the 5.0L if i had money right now i would drop a zz4 into my car. but i'll have to wait to show tbi power.

 

ok...i have a rebuilt tbi 305 w/no mods and a heavy @## stereo, I blew the hell out of a late model eclipse...'nuff said?

 

Back on subject, if 4 banger non turbo you will kill him. In EVER kind of race. At least you should. My friend has a 95 and it's slow as *****. It sounds like **** because the shift points are so high. The thing just isn't a race car. Also the handling is sloppy. I've driving it more than 500 miles (trips from school to home, school in Ohio, both live in NJ). The thing is a dog. My 305 TBI when it was running could kill his car and then some. No I'm not exagurating, I've been driving too long to be told that an eclipse is a fast car. It ain't. Also think this, one turbo but 4 wheels to turn. You need torque to get everything moving, thank god for the turbo. I haven't seen too many fast street turbo AWD versions. They never want to race even though I tell them what I have. It's like...okay...***** . :-) Oh well, that was a couple of years ago. I wonder if they'll race me after the "little" upgrade to the 380hp 415 ft.lbs. hehe

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, Jon (91 RS too many mods to list), getting new engine in summer

 

most importantly KNOW YOUR LIMITS! if you exceed what you know you can handle you WILL get hurt. just go to the track and battle it out there. hell....organize a meeting where a whole bunch of car enthusiasts and whoever wants to know how fast their car is and make a weekend get together at the track

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1991 RS LO3
mods: 14" chrome air cleaner, straight-piped after cat exhaust with one chrome dual tip on the left side.
future mods: headers, removing smog equipment, and as many cheap mods as i can find
aol s/n: budman8503

 

My friend has a 97 eclipse RS 4-banger manual. I got him good with my little 2.8. You shouldn't have any trouble.

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My only mod: Flowmaster 40 series

 

JPrevost,

I would have to agree that the NT DSMs are mostly dogs. The stock hp is around 140 in a relatively heavy car, especially the 1995+ models. Plus, if you friend's DSM is stock while your car is heavily modded, then I would hope that your car feels a lot faster.

Having said that, if you ride in a AWD DSM and the driver executes a good AWD launch, you would feel like you got shot out of a cannon. Yes, torque in definitely important, but so is traction. Plus, for whatever reason, it just even high hp DSMs don't 'feel' fast as compared with Mustangs and F-bodies because of the drive layout. That is different than saying that DSMs are slow.

I'm not familiar with where you are but I know that a lot of fast streetable DSMs run at Englishtown and other tracks in the mid-Atlantic area. If you are ever curious, check them out.

Good luck!

Jack ****
95 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
...helping a friend with his 87 IROC...

 

speaking of fast AWD Eclipses there is one back home in Savannah that runs at the 1/8 mi track not sure on mods but with the boost turned all the way up he runs 7.8. that is fast period.

Jack W what does DSM stand for i am assuming it referres to the Talon and Eclipses? TINFY

 

TINFY,

DSM = Diamond Star Motors, a joint venture between Chrysler and Mitusibshi from late 1980s to mid 1990s (Mitsu only venture after 1994). The cars produced were the Talon, Eclipse, Laser. Cars which share the same platform include the Galants as well as the Chrysler Sebring and Dodge Avenger.

The Eclipse today is still being produced in the Normal, Illinois plant though the 2000+ Eclipses aren't really considered DSMs because the car substantially changed and is only an 'Eclipse' in name only. Gone are the turbo and AWD options.

If I didn't live in snow country, I probably would be driving an f-body. But as my daily commuter car, I wanted the extra traction for the winter.

Jack ****
95 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
...helping a friend with his 87 IROC...

 

hey thanks. i dont blame you for wanting traction in the snow i live in GA if it snows or ices here i am not going anywhere. TINFY

 

OVERCLCK350 and MONKIE what is with u guys. I always hear about u guys talking about beating 305 TBI and carbs, but u always have the same excuse. "his car wasnt running properly" so thats y u beat him. The odd thing is u guys continue to brag about it like its something to brag about. No offence but i dare u to try challangeing a good condition 305 TBI. U will get walked All the way. I remember me and my friend driving around in our cars. He has a nice 3.1 90 firebird and i have a 305 TBI 89 bird with a 5 spd and when he was following me he tried passing me and all i had to do is toy with him. Dont get me wrong he has a nice car but by no means faster than a stock 305 TBI in n e worth while condition. I dont even see y this would even be a question. GM didnt desing the V6 to be nearly as fast as n e v8 especially in the same year.

 

Number 1, this kind of stuff should be taken to email.
Number 2, I don't go aroun "bragging" at all. I never claimed that my car is FAST. That's why I'm looking into an engine swap. The only thing that I've EVER said that can be considered bragging is my signature. And I've never used the excuse "his car wasn't running right".....EVER.

So in closing, don't go around posting false information. And next time email me if you have a problem with one of my posts.

 

my friend hasnt been showing up to cruise nights or friends houses so i am guessing he is puuting something in his ride... its all good he wants to put a shot of nos on the car we'll see.
Shawn

 

OVERCLCK im not gonna e amil u over some stupid arguement. WHo really cars. All i am saying is stop acting like ur lightly modded 3.1 can beat a stock third gen v8. It just wont happen. Thats the only point i am trying to make.

 

The AWD versions ONLY came in turbo. You could, however, get a front wheel Turbo.

An AWD turbo eclipse (or Talon Tsi for that matter), has the potential to be a very fast car.

The new ones and all the regular 4 bangers suck though.

 

Damn people! WAHNK! WAHNK! WAHNK! Some of you sound like Charlie Brown's freakin' teacher! Lighten up!!

 

Very, interesting!

I really dont think that it is worth getting all hot and bothered by all of this. Putting money on a race is for fools.

I drive two Camaros and an AWD Talon (same car as Eclipse). When the Talon was in its prime and stock, it would kick the *** of both of my Camaros on a wet road course like Mid-Ohio. On a dry dragstrip, when it was stock, my '87 Camaro could barely beat the Talon. Of course, the '99 SS is far superior to both cars in the dry.

A trick out AWD Talon at Norwalk dragstrip runs in the 10s, been there and seen it. I would have to throw alot of money at my Camaros to be in the 10s. I wish I know what that guy spent on his AWD Talon to get it in the 10s.

So it all depends on how much money is spent on mods and what the mods are (how effective).



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'87 L98 TPI IROCZ, AFR190 heads, 3.70 gears, ZZ9 cam, 2400 Art Carr TC, SLP 1 3/4" headers, SLP cat-back, no cat, no AC, no MAF screens, Accel manifold base & SuperRam, Edelbrock double roller timing chain, MSD ext coil & distributor, trans cooler, 52mm TB with airfoil, TB coolant bypass, AFPR(58psi), K&N filters, Hotchkis lowering springs, my custom chip, Lay Ind. ram air kit, SS Brakes 1LE upgrade 12" rotors dual piston calipers, 265/45R16 Kumho V700 tires.
ET 13.39sec @ 107.21mph
'90 Eagle Talon AWD, no rust thru 9 winters
'99 Camaro SS, red, 6-spd, T-tops, Mcleod clutch, Pro 5.0 shifter, MAF processor, Direct Flow airlid, K&N filter, next mod: 4.10 rear gears
313.7Hp & 320.6ft-lbf, ET 13.55sec @ 105.1mph

 

I've read some comments that the 90's N/A eclipse is quick while others said it not quick. Don't forget that there was more than one N/A 4cyl (for those who care) available. The optional DOHC N/A made 140hp. The standard econo eclipse/laser had a 98hp 4cyl. I have been in both and there is a big difference. Not picking on anybody, just giving some info.

Some of these posts were getting heated. Put some of that energy into helping each other go faster and we would all be in the 10's. he he Who cares what's under the hood? I have a 63 Comet with it's third modified I-6 (It's a Merc, Oh NO!! ) Let's just say if everone kept on telling me how slow it was, It would still be running low 20's in the quarter mile!!! :eek

Later,

Barry Izold
89 T/A, GTA
Modded 350/T-5