firebird1992

Ok I'm finally going to build my first engine myself a 4 bolt 350.
and when I took it to the machine shop the guy said so what poison you planning to run.

Now i did the research, but i want personal stories now what is a good street/track setup

3rd gen Will

iTrader: (8)

Daily driver, weekend track car, both? Budget has alot to do with N20 vs forced induction also.

Either way forged internals are a must. Staying away from hypereutectic pistons seems to be pretty common opinion when dealing with power adders.

firebird1992

Both, budget is 8,500 at this time depending on how i build the motor

skirkland1980

iTrader: (2)

i would go with a garret gt4088r turbo. costs about $1800. if your a good fabricator you can make a lot of stuff yourself. you'll still need the CAC, wastegate, and blowoff valve.

FSTFBDY

iTrader: (33)

8500 is a good chunk of change to play with.

Pick yourself up a complete LSx swap. 6.0 liter would come to mind 1st.
Get some nice heads and cam and intake.

Still have $ left over for a nice little nitrous kit. and the resta the $ to goto the suspention of the car.

what good is a ton of power if you can't hook up or take the twisty roads and have a good handling car.

firebird1992

mmm i like that idea of the lsx and i do like nitrous mm it just the idea of it blowing up in my face lol

FSTFBDY

iTrader: (33)

Just dont be stupid with it and your fine.
WOT switch, colder plugs, retard timing. etc...

a 6liter with heads , cam and intake will be potent enough on the street not to need nitrous. and be really reliable.

if I was to do it all over again. Id sale the 383 LT1 and blower I have and do a H/C/I lsx based motor with either a pro charger or a single turbo

firebird1992

mmm 383 that's a bored over 350 small block right with a blower mmmmm the whine of a supercharger

noboostnogo

iTrader: (4)

i like turbos and i'm in the process of building my ownt turbo setup for my car. Ive had supercharged and turbo'ed cars and the turbo car wass wayyyy more fun but the whistlin of the car was great.

Nitrous: cheapest, not street legal, everyone does it.

supercharger: not as common as nitrous, you can use it on the street consumes power to make power, you will always see boost at higher rpms

turbo: not something you will see on a regular basis. can get you some biigg hp numbers, lag is gone, overall great gas mileage if you stay out of boost, awsome feeling when you floor it and it goes from 0 psi to whatever. it can be a pretty cheap setup if you can make your own hot and cold side. just a turbo, bov, wg and lines 1500-2000

turbo is the way to go, you could get a forged rotating assembly with some afr heads a decent turbo cam and a comp of around 8.5:1 tune it at a specific psi then when u feel the need for more power just crank up the boost

will the engine be carbed or fuel injected?

firebird1992

I want fuel injected

but dad wants crabed

lol he hates computers

and im stuck on super or turbo now ....

noboostnogo

iTrader: (4)

a turbo is fun, get a blow thru setup, alot of guys run fuel injected but alot others run blow thru, fuel injection is really nice because of tunning capabilities and fuel curve and such. blow thru is more of a straight forward when it comes to tuning, but is not as precise, def. get a wideband o2. blow thru can make as much power and be as reliable as a fuel injected with the right tuning. you might want to get a beater car for the cold winter.

junkcltr

iTrader: (1)

What law person told you nitrous is illegal in a vehicle in the USA?

Supercharger does not consume a lot of power. Compressing air consumes a lot of power. The SC belt takes very little HP from the engine. This is a very common misconception.

My favorite is turbo only because it is a fun setup to build and it can be done cheaply and make good HP.

one92rs

iTrader: (5)

nitrous in use is illegal in street vehicles. i have run a few engines on nitrous with years of trouble free operation. but. with either boosted or nitrous motors you need to build it right. turbo or supercharger go lower compresion. nitrous can stand more compression.

firebird1992

MMM NITROUS lol MMM Supercharged

junkcltr

iTrader: (1)

It depends. What country and state are you claiming that is true? Let's see the RSA for it not being legal.

Most people like to spread the nitrous is illegal myth.

one92rs

iTrader: (5)

houston texas. has been illegal for years.

junkcltr

iTrader: (1)

Could you post the law (RSA) saying it is illegal for street use?
Most states have a law saying it is only illegal if trying to breathe it. Only a few states have it illegal for use as a power adder on the street and it is usually vaguely written in the law.

EDIT: All the Texas law I come up with for nitrous is only the abuse law. Nothing is said about it being illegal as a power adder.

one92rs

iTrader: (5)

ill try to look it up. there was one written for it at one time. is not illegal to have it. just to be using it. it may be that they just want to mess with people. and it is a shame. i love it. and always will. and will be using it again. like i said. properly spec'ed engine will inhale it and run good for years to come.

daverr

iTrader: (1)

do not use a carb in forced induction. A carb is like painting a picture with a cup instead a brush.

u could go fast with either super or turbo. each will make whatever hp u like.

one92rs

iTrader: (5)

dont know why. i have seen plenty of cars from 12 seconds down to 7 or 8 seconds with a carb and forced induction. its all in tuning and setting it all up from the beginning. that is why the question comes up so much!!!! WHAT IS THE ENGINES USE GOING TO BE???? is it going to to be a boosted engine,street engine,race, or what. that is the way to build and engine. start with and build it around your ideas. if it is going to be used on the street and strip with nitrous then build the engine to handle the nitrous.

firebird1992

lololol "A carb is like painting a picture with a cup instead a brush." now that funny

firebird1992

well im going more to just a MEAN A$$ street car
and maybe at the track once and a while

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

8500 is good chunk of change but building a solid turbo setup may cost more than that. I have way more than that in my build and i did everything myself. granted I did twins but my two turbos cost as much as one good single

You figure the motor is gonna be a good 6 grand with forged internals/machine shop/heads/cam/etc
Good single turbo setup can be as cheap as 600-700 bucks if using MP T70-T76, could go S400 for somewhere in the same price range I believe

Fab up some cheap logs, 150-200 in piping and welding perhaps plus piping for coldside/hotside downpipes/crossover so add another 200 or so.

Intercooler, 150-250 or up to 1000 depending on what you get. most of the cheaper 150-200 ones do ok job for mild setups. All depends on the power you want to run

Then there is transmission/rearend/suspension./fuel system to worry about


its not an easy build either sometimes.. .lots of small issues that could happen depending on how you build it.

For that reason I like the nitrous approach. I ran it just fine on my 383 last year and it ran mid 10's all day long and could daily drive that car. Filling bottles up sucks however. Hope you have a fill station near by. Get 2-3 bottles to have backups to minimize trips

one92rs

iTrader: (5)

turbo--lot of fabbing and making things work-tuning-and setting it all up.

supercharger-installation kits-a little fabbing-tuning.

nitrous.-tuning and installation with complete kits. less money-easier to tune-only on when you want it.. buy a jet kit.

after owning all at one time-nitrous is by far the easiest and less cost.

and pushin that little button always brought a big smile to my face. and it would propel a 2002 chevy ext cab truck that weighed in at 5150 with me in it to 12.79@108. bolt ons-cam-gears-exhaust-tranny.

firebird1992

well there are 2 filling station for the nitrous not far form me

is going to be $5100 bored .40 over and with all the forged internals and the fully built transmission and he going to dress it up all nice for me A/C, PS, high output alternator and the EFI computer and components. But after that its all me
my dad's friend is doing it as a favor a big one.

I getting 3.72 gears LSD rear
disc brakes all a round
i was looking at some air-bag suspension but idk
got new A-arms and the car was painted glossy jet black

so i need to tell him in the next two weeks on the poweradder

junkcltr

iTrader: (1)

Good description. I think since it is the OP's first time doing his own engine then fabbing up a turbo setup would be beyond his means. The supercharger is expensive. Nitrous is a great way of getting something to go fast with not a lot of money and install time into it.

EDIT: Since the block is being prepped, I would drill the back of the block and make it so you could feed in the nitrous and fuel line under the intake. Well, depending on what intake you use. Some you can't hide the nitrous from going up from underneath.

one92rs

iTrader: (5)

one other thing to keep in mind. all boosted-nitrous,turbo,supercharger like really nice flowing exhaust. besides turbo-good headers and cat back.

firebird1992

well i called him today and he told me the block number and said for me to look around the internet know this is just some of the stuff i found for a pre 1987 350 4 bolt

and here's what i found

http://www.jegs.com/i/Edelbrock/350/...0002/-1?CT=999

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Twin-...QQcmdZViewItem

or

http://www.jegs.com/p/NOS/NOS-GM-EFI...49110/10002/-1

one92rs

iTrader: (5)

that seems like a really cheap price on that turbo kit. still a lot of work to do there. going to need a new hood for the supercharger. just need a really good day for the nos install. i like nitrous express myself.

junkcltr

iTrader: (1)

That is a ssautochrome turbo kit that is NOT going to fit you car and will require a lot of work to make it fit. Also, many of the parts in that kit are junk and you will throw away and have to buy from somewhere else.
It is over priced compared to the same kit offered by others on ebay. Do not buy that kit if you think it is a bolt on. It needs a lot of modifications to fit your car. The AD has false advertising.

firebird1992

well i went to the shop today and he liked the nitrous or the supercharger and if i get the super he's going to make me a shaker hood but we need to see he said it can fit even with out a new hood it's just going to be tight

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

blower+carb on top and air cleaner will be taller than the holley stealth ram intake which barely clears stock hoods.
You'll need a hood

FSTFBDY

iTrader: (33)

What exactally is the guy building you. Sounds like hes trying to push you into a power adder so he can rack ya up for more $$. Nitroud will be the cheapest right now. quick and simple install. Gonna cost ya aprox. $40 bucks a fill.

Id run it N/A for now. How offten you going to be at the track to use the nitrous? save your $ for a Procharger or turbo setup.

Have the engiine built to handle the boost and add it later.

firebird1992

well he's charging me 5433.67 if i go super and 5000 and some change if i go nitrous he and that 5000 is for everything he already bored the block and built up the transmission i just need to tell him what i want to so he can order the heads intake and some other stuff and set it up so i can run what ever power adder with no problem
he's a family friend him and my dad was in the army so idk what he making out of this lol he's doing over 9000 in work and parts so lol this is just a favor for an old friend.

and i got a A 357 now connected to a 4L60E trans with trans brake and 2500 stall converter(i think its 2500) so that what i have now we need to order all the other stuff

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Only problem with n/a now, boost later is the n/a motor will suck since it will be lower compression and feel sluggish especially with any larger camshaft designed for boost at higher rpms.

But atleast you can work the bugs out on motor first and then add the blower kit.

Shouldnt be any price difference going blower or nitrous. Mainly the compression wil be different (meaning different piston dish but pistons are generally same price just different spec'd dishes) and possibly the camshaft grind depending on how much spray you want to run. Blowers and nitrous cams are somewhat similar alot of the time, but you dont need a nitrous cam to run mild shots under 200hp. over 200-250 a nitrous cam is generally recommended

firebird1992

well for under 6000 im not complaining i was thinking i was going to spend the whole 8500 on the motor alone so with what's left i got the car painted and a full black interior and tires. i hope this car is done before the winter -.-

junkcltr

iTrader: (1)

Since you are buying good heads then I would build it with a 9.0:1 compression ratio. It would make good power without the power adder and make great power with nitrous.

It will work great later on if you put the supercharger on it. Also, if you put a nitrous cam in it that will work great with the supercharger later on. You can put a fair amount of boost on top of 9:1 compression. If you really wanted to go big with boost (15+ PSI) at the track then you put some race gas in it or methanol spray.

firebird1992

yea well i'm on the fence because yes this is my first motor by myself and i just wanted something and a small block i wanted a power adder but once I'm out of college (next year this time) im getting a big block and that's going to be all motor. YAY

one92rs

iTrader: (5)

actually you can run nitrous with low and high compression. so you have a great choice with it. i have run it on 9-1 and run it on 13-1 compression engines. it helps atomize fuel expotentally not force air in to the cylinders.

junkcltr

iTrader: (1)

I agree. I mentioned 9:1 being a happy medium in case he wanted to go supercharged later. He wouldn't have to tear it down. If he wants a max. effort N2O setup then go higher with the compression.

If you are planning on going big block NA then I would take a hard look at superchargers and turbochargers later on. If you make 400 fwhp with you small block and stick a turbo or supercharger on it you could make 800 fwhp. It would have the torque and HP of a big block and much cheaper than building another engine. Find someone with a turbocharged or supercharged small block before you build the big block. Go for a ride in that car. If it was done right then you will probably change your mind about building the big block.

firebird1992

well its like a right of passage in my family everyone a gear head my 89 year old grandmother got a ticket for 139 in 70 in her Corvette and once the cop told her she was like "was that how fast i was going this thing a piece of ****" lol
but this is how the car thing is.
your first car is a 4 cylinder then
(17-18 age) a v6
(19-20 age) you build your car
(21+)big block now your a man grab a beer

but i just wanted to run a power adder for me and for the price i can afford to pass up a chance to get it done right for this cheap. and the big block is not going to be for a while that's going to be my baby going to find a 1969 charger shell and work on that.

FSTFBDY

iTrader: (33)

x2 this is what I was saying above. a 9:1 motor shouldnt be no slouch n/a for now.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

x3, i think it will do ok for now and hence why i built my 401 to 9:1 compression

FSTFBDY

iTrader: (33)

my 383 is 9:1 also. An all around good CR for while not under boost and running a TON with a race fuel and meth injection.

firebird1992

ok now here's what i wanted
550 HP be street able now it between the supercharger or all motor

daverr

iTrader: (1)

i would go with all motor for 550hp.

firebird1992

but if i supercharge it later I'm not going to have a problem right ? because if i go all motor i will save the money for a better supercharger next year sometime.