I want to get more power out of my 5.7 tpi. I dont want to go crazy and plus dont have cash for that craziness. I was wandering what porting the plenum, rails and lower would do for me. Would there be a noticeable difference in power? I am getting 373 put in next month and was planning on doing this as well. I looked around for other threads on this but no luck on finding something for just port and polish stock stuff. I am also new at this so could have missed something as well. Thanks for any input it is appreciated. Any other fairly inexpensive ways to get power out of this beast is great too thanks

 

I meant runners not rail

 

Without the benefit of other things (Cam, roller rockers, head work, headers.) I don't think you will see much gain. Worth a try, though.

 

I was thinking a LT4 cam and headers along with set up. Maybe then remanufacturing some LT1 heads. Correct me if im wrong but The cam is what will really set off the port and polish to give me more power past the 4500 mark. Any suggestions on cams?

 

How good are you at computer tuning? If you don't know how to do that as well, none of the things you have mentioned will do much if anything to the power. The only thing you mentioned that can be done without tuning of the computer is the 3.73 gears which I, personally, wouldn't do to an automatic transmission car.

Unless you plan on racing the car, the 4500 rpm point where the TPI starts to stop gaining power isn't really an issue. In street driving you are rarely at or above that point and the torque output in the low rpm range can make street driving at the stoplights a lot of fun.

Before you start modifying anything about the car, do a honest appraisal of how you intend to drive the car. Mods to make it a comfortable daily driver are a lot different from what you want to do if the car is a weekend toy that will see a lot of track time. And the type of track time will make a difference as to what to do as well since optimizing the car for drag racing requires different parts than optimizing it for road courses.

 

This all makes very much sense. Heres my deal this car it will be a daily driver until next tax season then it will be a weekend driver and get the LS swap. Until then I would love to have it be a mid 13 sec daily so if needed I can stomp on some of the poo stains that are all over phx. You dont see too many third gens that run around and can put those same generation mustangs dick in the dirt. I will definetly need to have the car tuned after these mods but me myself dont know exactly how but i understand the curves and and shifting points. I also dont have that equipment. I was hoping to find a good deal on this wanderful website. HINT HINT lol

 

Thank you for the input it is all appreciated

 

If that's your short term plan, throw a 50 - 100 shot of nitrous on it and call it good. This is a mod that can be carried over to the LS engine. Just keep a full bottle in the car when the weather isn't so hot you need to worry about it exploding.

if you're planning a LS swap, anything else is just wasted money for a limited time gain.

 

That is a good point I will look into this. Just can't risk messing up the engine until we get another vehicle. Never been a big nitrous fan but for my purpose right now definitely an option thank you.

 

a 50 shot on a stock motor should not be an issue. I've sprayed a 100 shot without adjusting timing without detonating anything on a stock motor. More than that and you definitely want to look at retarding timing when on the bottle. But a 50 shot should put you into the high 13's. I've seen stock 5.7 cars with 3.42 gears run a 14.1 on motor. And it keeps the car emissions legal which gets questionable as the cam gets larger.

When you get to the LS swap, remember the car will still have to go on the sniffer so plan on cats on the exhaust. From experience a good cat can get a lot of cam across the sniffer with a good tune. Tagging it out of county is also an option but is illegal and carries some interesting fines if they catch you and issue the ticket. Lots of people get away with it but that doesn't make it legal. Same with putting collector car insurance on it to avoid emissions and then driving it in ways that violate the terms of the insurance.

And a final piece of advice: If this is your only car right now, keep it stock. It is far easier to keep a stock vehicle running correctly than a modified one. Parts are easier to get, the tune is closer to correct, and it will tend to be more reliable. Save the mods until you can afford the car being down for days or weeks if parts don't fit, the tune isn't quite right, or something breaks as a result of another mod that went well. Remember, beefing up one piece of the drivetrain puts a higher load on the remaining pieces which can lead to failure. Adding a 100 horsepower to the motor might be enough to kill the trans or rear end depending on when they were last rebuilt and how hard the previous owner pushed the car.

 

Cool tahnks for the advise

 

3.73s + TPI = Zero Traction and Getting to 4500-5000(running out of RPM) much faster. I'd stay with the stock 3:23 gears unless you go with a different intake that gets you more top end. TPIs have no problem getting out of the hole if you hook.

I'd work on the suspenion, get what power you have to the ground so when you go LSx, your further ahea to putting that power to the ground as well. Cat back exhaust if you don't have it already. Upgrade the brakes cause the stock ones suck.

Opening up the stock stuff helps very minimal. You can go SLP runners and get a few extra RPM, Alot of effort (and/or $$) for minimal gain IMO.

You can't run LT1 heads unless you want to run an LT1 intake as well, there are threads on this, there are a few other things that must be done to be able to do that. I am not to sure on specifics as i was never interested much in that.

As far as tuning, PCMforless has done right by me and there is a local guy that can burn chips for TPI cars.

What I recommend is either Go full SBC, IE Have a sold short block built get a matchign Intake, Heads, Cam combo. Build that on the side and swap it in when it's done. Don't forget about setting some $$ aside for a Tranny rebuild as well. Or just go LSx. Enjoy driving the car as it is in the mean time, if you try to peice meal it together you will have down time with the car. Potentially significant lengths of it depending on your financial situation. Ask me how I know?! haha

 

Ok thanks for advise I have been looking pretty heavy into breaks lately too because that will be a must. I read up on the LT1 heads deal and seemed like alot of work but it still seemed cheaper. You guys are right though not worth all work and time if I'm not going to do it all the way and the right way so I will do brakes then suspension and build motor on side. I would really like to get together with whom ever I can at get together a or whatever to talk about all this. I will be at the Downtown Glendale show Saturday hope I can meet you guys.

 

Not entirely true if you're willing to run slicks or near slicks at all times.... my 92 sort of hooks with drag radials on it full time with 3.73s in the rear..... but I don't recommend trying that one in the rain.

3.73's will also work if you do a manual trans swap into the car but TPI + auto trans + 3.73s will result in traction problems and low gas mileage on the street.

Start the mods with suspension. Those rarely take more than a weekend and almost never down the car. Brakes would be next. Stock brakes and lots of power don't make for a fun ride when it's time to stop.

Save the engine work until you can built a complete one or have all the parts for the LS swap. It is possible to do a motor swap in a single weekend if all the parts are available and you got the tools and hands to pull it off.

 

If my work schedule wasn't so nuts right now, I'd say come on over and we can go over all the available options from inexpensive to premium priced pieces.

Depending on your choice in brakes, you might also have to change to larger wheels and tires so keep that in mind when you're looking. A lot of your options require at least a 17inch wheel and some require 18's. There are some that work with factory wheels though depending on what you want to spend.

Until you add power, I'd check the suspension first. Putting good pads on the brakes will go a long way on stock power. But if the suspension and steering haven't been redone yet, the car probably needs that work before it needs brakes. The original bushings only last so long before the dry out, shrink, and let the car get sloppy.

 

Alot of my bushings have been replaced the car is in great shape and I want to eventually go with an 18*9 wheel. I did notice that the steering has a little play in it so I'm sure I will have to do something with that. I read alot on this site about breaks from Baer to corvette to just going with LS breaks. I would like to lower it just a little and I know it will need springs and shocks. I appreciate you taking the time here on the site to help out. I'm sure we will get together some time. I'm sure I could use a little coaching to save some cash. Thanks again

 

I'm probably not the right person to talk to if you're trying to the build without expending large amounts of cash on premium components. For example, I keep 20 extra tires in the garage so that we can change out to the correct tire and wheel combination for the event. I call Michelin tire design engineers to get advice on tire pressure settings from the Michelin racing team. I gave up trying to run the cars as hard as we do in the types of multi day events we run with less expensive components a few years ago.

Again, it all comes down to the type and level of driving you want to do. The most important mod you can do to the car is the driver mod. And the only way to do that is get out there and drive it.

As for how to save some cash, best way is to figure out exactly what you want and then watch the classifieds here and eBay to find a deal on a new or lightly used component.

 

Sounds like you do it right thats good I don't want to just go cheap on everything I want to do it right of course even if it is slower than I want to. I would love to get on a track just never had the chance to. Everyone likes to save money. Thanks for all the info I will take all I can get.

 

By saving money I meant doing it right the first time instead of trial and error. Thanks again for the info

 

Getting on the track is the cheap part (most of the time anyway), it's the "being competitive" part that gets expensive.
What kind of racing are you considering.
Setting up a road race car will be different from setting up a drag car, even when still keeping it in the realm of daily driver.

 

I have always done 1/4 mile stuff but want to build a road racers for the twistys. I have always wanted to do track stuff just never had time busy with life.

 

If you want to be truly competitive at either, you'll need a dedicated track car for each type of event. If you want to have fun but not set any records, you can build a car that can do it all. It won't be optimized for anything single event but it will do it all. And a race setup will be a little stiff on the street.

 

Ya would love to get more cars and do that but not realistic right now. I just want something that will handle and break real well I don't care about the ride really. Thank you

 

Is emissions required where u live?

 

Sorry to be a hater, but I swapped from cammed L69 to TPI (on the same engine and yes I tuned it) and then put a more moderate cam in to better match the TPI intake.

The long runner intake chokes the car. I have no better way to put it. Save your money for the LS swap and suspension parts that aren't going away when the swap occurs.

If your fuel tank or pump or sender go out, swap the LS1 tank & sender & sort out the fuel gauge. That carries over when you swap. Not much else does.

 

Right on good tip thank you will keep in my mind for the tank.

 

If you want to just have fun, autoX is relatively cheap, just don't expect to be too competitive with a stock ride....
PS once you start down that road, 1/4 stuff will get boring pretty quickly...

 

Emissions is required in all of Maricopa county and for everyone who works in or goes to school in Maricopa county. Yes, you can get away with tagging it out of county but, if you get caught, the fines can be pretty steep. Even if you actually do live outside of Maricopa county, it is still a violation of the Federal Clean Air Act to remove emissions equipment from a vehicle. Violation of this law carries a $10,000 fine if they care to cite you for it.

It isn't that hard to build a fast car that will pass the test and retain the emissions equipment. If you think it is, check the SoCal forum and see the number of 400+ rwhp TPI cars that meet California emissions. Modern catalytic convertors don't rob more than 1 or 2 hp so what is the point in not putting them on to keep the car legal.

 

Rather than mess with the TPI I would get the mini ram or stealth ram and switch your TPI stuff over.

 

That's what I was planning on doing. tagging it in Prescot.. I just think you're very limited to the mods u can do and still make them pass the smog... Yea I know Cali is more strict

 

I thought that mini or stealth went smog legal?

 

They aren't smog legal in CA but can pass easily in AZ. With a good cat and tune you can get a lot of motor to pass the smog check. We have a high compression 383 with a miniram that blows less than half the allowed limit with no EGR and a single high flow cat. Estimated power is around 400 rwhp. Even my blower car with a solid NA tune, no belt on the blower, and no emissions equipment managed to blow clean enough to pass the sniffer.

Point is, there isn't any reason to not keep it legal. Tagging it in Prescott can, probably won't, but can get you some serious fines. Unless you're planning on building something that won't run on pump gas, then why not build it so it runs clean enough to plate it where you actually live.

 

you sound like the person I need to talk to... I'm scared to spend my money performance parts for that reason.. don't want to find out later that I can't pass smog because my parts.. think you can help me build a list of things I can use to build a 355 Or 383 engine that will pass smog here in AZ

 

Depending on budget, there are lots of ways to build a a nice motor that will pass smog and still be fun to drive.

Take a look at the list of items in 3rd Gen Wills signature. His is a something you could duplicate fairly inexpensively that he still has a lot of fun driving. The 383 in our GTA still passes easily but was not built on the same kind of budget.

 

I have a miniram-II for sale with a holly 58mm TB.. fuel lines rails and regulator $1300

 

You sayin' my car is cheap?!

On a serious note, if you are patient and wait for deals and are flexible on what you want you combo to be, you can build a respectably quick car without killing your wallet.

 

Not at all. Just saying you look for deals on parts after looking at options.

The GTA wasn't assembled with the same level of diligence on looking for deals on parts though. It also draws a lot of blood from the people working on it to make sure I get to pay twice. Once in cash and once in blood.

 

It's not the car that's cheap (just kidding brother)
BTW Tom the GTA isn't listed in your sig... proof it is the redheaded stepchild....

 

I have 4grand budget... Third gen will u are my floor plan lol .. does your car pass emissions here in Arizona every year without a problem ?

 

Not really. You just can't throw a great big huge cam in there and not tune and hope it passes. Packaged modifications chosen to run properly together or "match" are the way to go, rather than "what looks good in the Summit catalog!!!1!!"

I agree with this.

Since the advent of OBD-II, the tendency for smog stations to check every last detail on an OBD-I car that sniffs fine is lower. I used to smog years ago and they'd depress the EGR valve, check the check valves on the AIR tubes and crap like that. Now it sniffs and passed fuel cap / evap. system vac. test, they mirror for the cat and wheee, we're done.

The other thing to consider is tagging it up North but keeping it smogged every 2 years will make you legal. Just keep your emissions certification with you and if ever pulled over, have a copy of the law that says you have to pass emissions just like everyone else if you work, go to school etc. in Maricopa County. So even if you miss a few months of coverage, keeping it pseudo current with emissions is going to cover you most of the time. And to be honest, it really is a good way to pick up on things the OBD-I systems miss. I just had a tiny pinhole leak in the evap. system steel line. Super easy to fix once I found it. And probably not that big a deal environmentally. But I'd have never caught it if not for the emissions station.

 

I agree on the emissions. The plan with my IROC has always been to keep it emissions legal. The IROC has never been a drag car and never will be. It's my "handling" car, so the mods have been mostly to the suspension. (KYB AGX adjustable shocks/struts, Eibach Pro-kit springs, Adjustable track bar with rod ends, etc.) The ride is somewhat punishing, but I can live with that. Next on the list are adjustable torque arm, Adjustable LCA's (Offset bushings) ,SFC's and Del-alum bushings. I am running 245's on the front and 255's on the rear (BF Goodrich G-force soft compound.) It handles well like it is and brakes are next. Then paint and Brakes. In a year and a half I'm going with forgeline 18" and 19" wheels. I'll consider that car "done" at that point.
I also agree with beater79T/a on the cat. No reason not to run one. (Smells better too!)

 

I'm not cheap, I am selectively frugal!

 

My combo passed with the stock TPI intake. I had quite some trouble the first year (2009) getting it through, the car sat for 9+yrs prior to me owning it and I had to put it back together as well as repair the wiring harness. In the end it had an injector that wasn't firing and I still got it to pass. Drivetrain wise the motor was stock, just had headers and exhaust.

In 2011, with my current combo but with the TPI setup it passed the rollers the first time but failed because my tank purge valve was stuck open and I failed the evap test. So I had to go back.

I now have a miniram on it so we shall see. Tags are due in March, but I plan to go through in Jan so I have some time to massage the tune if need be and potentially build a EGR setup if it comes to that.

If you are patient you could potentially build something similar to my setup for 4k, you will have to find a good deal on a set of AFRs though. FWIW Standard machine did my short block for about $2200. I got my LT4 Hotcam for $100. Beater79TA hooked me up in trade for AFR 180s I have for doing some work for him, the heads needed rebuilt which standard did for $600, new valves, guides, seals. opened up the spring pockets, flat milled them to true them up. I picked up the extras here on TGO. Hardened push rods, ARP hardware and other small odds and ends. Bought a set of Comp 1.6 roller tips new from summit, probably the only part I paid full price for, haha.

 

I have the TPIS EGR setup for the miniram if you need it. The GTA passed with the EGR turned off in the tune so you shouldn't have a problem getting yours through. And I doubt the station will do enough of a visual to notice it isn't there.

And I'm calling BS that you paid full price for any of the parts. Admit it, you worked some kind of deal on those rockers. ;-)

If you're worried about emissions, the GTA went through clean. Build is 10.5:1 compression 383 with forged internals, AFR 195 heads, TPIS miniram, stock throttlebody, cam is a Comp 220/230 LSA 114 at .510 lift, full roller rockers (1.5 ratio), 1 3/4 inch headers to a single cat. Still running the stock ECM witha Ford MAF and the EGR tuned out. EGR was physically installed though for the visual effect.

The other important point Will kind of got to is you can emissions 90 days in advance of the tags expiring. You don't have to wait for the notice in the mail. If you're like me and have a couple that are due in the summer, going in for the test in April or May is less brutal than waiting for June or July to do it.

 

I have the reciept for proof on the rockers!

Yea, I am glad I initially registered the car in March so I can get it through during the cooler weather!

Depending on what happens i will let you know if I need to borrow the EGR setup. I kind of want to build a remote EGR setup and then just leave it on the car, not like it effects WOT performance anyway and it could net me better freeway gas mileage.

 

Having had the TPIS version on the car, building a remote unit wouldn't be that hard. Only part that really sucks about EGR on the miniram was losing a vacuum port to the EGR when the manifold only provides 4 to start with.

I should be more worried about gas mileage on the car but the 383 is temporary until the LS1 goes in and, let's be honest, that motor with 3.42 gears and a 3600 stall isn't exactly set up to be a high mileage combination. Almost 18 on the highway was kind of nice though on the way back from LA in February though.

 

Yea vacuum ports are at a premium on the MR, My plan is to tap a new hole into the intake for the remote setup, as well as tap the base of the manifold by the EGR cross over on the heads. It all sounds good in theory...in theory..HAHA.

I got 21-22 coming back from LA with my setup, so you weren't that far off mine. My guess is going from the batch fire to some kind of sequential setup would make the biggest strides toward fuel economy although I might be

 

On the tuning end, get a moates.net ostrich if sticking with gen 1 stuff. Way easier than burning chips. If I remember right, he also makes a functional equivalent for the ls1 PCM.

 

That's what I would like to see on a gen 1 motor: LS1 PCM! The sequential fire injection system would be worth it! I think an Accel Dual-sync distributor would supply the crank signal needed for this. Don't know though, could be buying a big headache with this swap...

 

Or you could just buy the setup from EFI-Connection that provides everything you need to run a LS1 PCM on a Gen 1 SBC. The Dual Sync is nice but only works with the Accel DFI ECM.