6speedIROC

iTrader: (3)

I have seen many posts on here about the Astro van steering shaft swap.
Here's my rundown for a very simple swap, and it seems to be much easier than anything I have seen elsewhere.

Shaft is from a 97 Astro van. It took 10 minutes to pull in the rain. Bring a knife to cut the rubber boot that covers the shaft and a few wrenches, I think it's a 10mm or a 7/16" for the 2 bolts. You'll also need a small pry-bar.

This shaft has 2 universal joints that are much better than the OEM Camaro stuff (rag joint and a knuckle joint). Pictures are shown beside another Camaro shaft at the installed length for info. I originally thought I'd need this extra shaft for the upper shaft connection, but it is not required. Note the 97 shaft has no integral damper, that the earlier shaft have.

Mods:
1. The 97 Astro shaft has the upper 'double D' connector 90deg out of phase to the Camaro. This is easily fixed by grinding off the peening off the upper U-joint clevis, pound off clevis, rotate 90deg and re-insert. The parts MUST be re-welded together.

2. The through bolt for the upper connector (to steering column) passes through the center of the Camaro shaft. It passes through the side of the Astro shaft. I intend to install the shaft and re-drill the steering column output shaft to a side hole version when in the car.

3. Length: the 97 shaft has the slip joint (required for safety) and appears to be the correct length with no mods required.

I haven't installed this in the car as I'll be replacing the steering box in the spring. I'll repost info when I get it!

Post up your thoughts..seems easy.

6speedIROC

iTrader: (3)

More pics

jmd

iTrader: (4)

Any reason a bolt or rivet couldn't be installed to the 90-degree turned yoke (once it and the shaft were drilled) ?

FueledSoul

iTrader: (18)

Nice! get some pics of it once its installed

bradley23150

iTrader: (10)

Interested in seeing some complete pics as well.

6speedIROC

iTrader: (3)

I'd just weld it up from the U-joint side so as not to weaken the clevis with a hole..

I don't think redrilling the upper steering column output shaft to the side will weaken anything as it is fully encapsulated with the forged double D coupling.

grover85

iTrader: (1)

I did this mod about 5 years ago. It works awesome.

spade

iTrader: (3)

and how does this benefit over stock?

RBob

iTrader: (1)

Couple of hints with this set up. The upper u-joint flange is keyed to prevent it from being installed 180 out. See the picture, I added two red circles where it is smaller. To get the flange over the Camaro column this area needs to be opened up a little.

The f-body column isn't keyed. Can use a grinder with a smaller burr, or plunge mill with a small diameter cutter.

Instead of drilling that flange to match the hole in the Camaro column, I like to grind a notch in the column to match the new flange bolt location. Can use a course sanding drum in a dremel for this. Be sure to place a large sheet of newspaper under the column first. This is to catch the metal filings.

> I'd just weld it up from the U-joint side so as not to weaken the clevis with a hole.

A couple of small welds to take the place of the crimps works. BTDT, just as you mentioned, in the same location as the OEM crimps.

If the flange is closed up from being clamped to the astro shaft, can easy open it back up. Take a piece of steel that will fit in the flange slot. Then install a bolt from the threaded end, tighten against the steel piece to open the flange. Don't go too far, just enough to make it fit over the new column.

Also, get the lower bearing, clip & retainer from the Astro van. They are a ball bearing assembly while the Camaro one is a plastic bushing. Unless it was changed in the newer years they are a drop in fit to the f-body.

A note for f-body's with an air bag. Before disconnecting the column tie a rope to the steering wheel and then to the brake pedal. Or hang a brick on the end of the rope.

Then do not turn the column while under the hood. The air bag wires only have so much play in them. And can be ripped out of the ignitor assembly.

RBob.

Dartht33bagger

That's also what I was wondering about.

RBob

iTrader: (1)

A _lot_ less play in the steering with a much better feel.

RBob.

spade

iTrader: (3)

really? from a van steering system? i guess cause its a 97

92RS_Ttop

iTrader: (3)

No, its from the fact that its a steel U-joint on either end of the shaft instead of rubber.

You can also use the shaft from 90's Jeep Cherokees. You have to melt out the plastic in the middle that keeps the lower shaft from sliding up into the upper shaft. Once that's done you can adjust the length and it's a bolt in swap as well. Just have to notch the end of the shaft in for the retaining bolt, same as for the Astro shaft.



Rbob - I'm not sure what lower bearing, clip, and retainer you're referring to?

Dartht33bagger

Would this mod still work with tilt steering?

RBob

iTrader: (1)

This is where the column exits the outer housing under the hood. Not sure how to explain. Look at above where the intermediate shaft attaches to the column shaft. There will be a spring clip and a thin retainer that is a shell.

Along with a plastic bushing.

This is where the column that rotates exits from the column piece that doesn't rotate. The bushing is what allows one to rotate within the other.

The Astro piece is a bearing. Inexpensive, but way better then the bushing.

RBob.

RBob

iTrader: (1)

Yes.

RBob.

92RS_Ttop

iTrader: (3)

Thanks, I know where you mean. I've never looked at that piece that closely before.

White'89

iTrader: (8)

Since 6speediroc hasn't posted an installed pic I think I will.
Mine is from a '96 so it has a steering damper. Not bad for less than $15.
Firebird003-4.jpg?t=1300588115

bradley23150

iTrader: (10)

How much would you charge to modify one and make it a bolt-in version and send it to me?

White'89

iTrader: (8)

To be honest it would not be worth me doing. Really the only thing that needs to be done is the first picture in post #2. Once you grind those off, remove the joint, rotate it 90 degrees, and reinstall. Its now bolt in ready. (right after a couple tack welds for safety)

bradley23150

iTrader: (10)

Yeah, but I don't have a welder yet, and the steering play I have in my car is getting annoying. It's okay if you wouldn't want to but it doesn't hurt to ask lol. Do you know what range of years of the Astro Van that have this type of shaft?

White'89

iTrader: (8)

Buy the shaft from a junkyard and take it to a shop. Tell them what you need and you will be good in no time. As for years, ebay tells me they fit '86-'99 Astro/safari vans but the one listed said it was from a '92 and it was a bit different. So I suppose as long as you stay in the mid to late '90s your good. But make sure all other steering components(tie rod ends, center link, idler arm, pitman arm, steering box) are all fine and dandy before looking into something more minor like the steering shaft. Saying the Ujoint shaft is a MAJOR improvement is a bit overrated.

bradley23150

iTrader: (10)

Yeah I just looked them up on ebay and there is one there and it says 86-99 but it doesnt look like the ones in this thread. I will stay in those years and try to find one that looks like the one posted and I should be fine. Apparently the P.O. replaced almost all of the steering components, but we all know how that goes.. lol

84 1LE

iTrader: (9)

Did my astro conversion about 7 years ago, no issues to date.Early years have the damper to isolate vibrations.

On the big end(firewall) you can swap to the 4th gen coupler.It has the bolt on the body, not on the outside.Like the Astro's.

White'89

iTrader: (8)

So 84 1LE where would you rate it on the bang for the buck list?

84 1LE

iTrader: (9)

Well it cost me around $6.
Has lasted 7+ years with no deterioration in performance/steering input, etc.
Cheaper still than just replacing the rag joint.
So i would say its a win/win & well worth doing.

I also swapped in the Astro's bearing at the same time, over the camaros plastic bushing.

Gibson

care yo walk use threw the bearing replacement?

6SIX6

iTrader: (35)

I just saw this post and Im so goin to the wrecker monday now for one of these. Anyone know what years to look for??? Also how I can tell as well what year the van is. Thanks guys

6speedIROC

iTrader: (3)

Use the VIN to tell the year.
You could also look at the year digits moulded into the plastic lights on the vehicle. North American cars retool this stuff almost every year..nice little trick.

6SIX6

iTrader: (35)

Call me stupid I know but how do I tell the year by the vin??? Never done it before

3rdgenmaro

iTrader: (9)

With the Cherokee swap, is that a Grand Cherokee or ?????

84 1LE

iTrader: (9)

What?

The bearing is on the tube coming from the firewall.The steering shaft passes thru the tube from inside the car.The bushing is on the end of the tube.Its held inplace by a metal cap & BIG c-clip.Remove the c-clip, pop off cap, pull bushing out.Use the same pieces from the astro van to replace.

All astro vans use the u-joint shaft.So year should'nt matter.Just pop the hood & look for it.Never mind what yr.The Cherokee deal looks like a straight swap though.So maybe that's an easier route.I think 97-up

White'89

iTrader: (8)

I like that idea with the 4th gen joint, having the bolt go through the center of the shaft seems like good insurance. So since it was so easy I think I will redo mine like that. I may grab a Jeep shaft this time around and dispel any gray area.

And if you would have read the WHOLE thread you would see what years they come from.

84 1LE

iTrader: (9)

I know what years....all of them!

Seriously, how hard can it be to look in the eng bay & check, its either there or its not.If it is, you should be able to tell the difference between a u-joint & a rag joint.

92RS_Ttop

iTrader: (3)

Grand or regular Cherokee, it doesn't matter. They both appear to use the same steering shaft. I pulled one from a 93 Cherokee for my Camaro, and one from a 97 or 98 Grand Cherokee for my truck. Both worked just fine one I melted the plastic out of the middle with my propane torch. Still had to put a slight groove in the end of the steering column in both vehicles for the bolt to fit to clamp the Jeep steering shafts in place. The ends that go on the steering gear slid on with no mods needed.

3rdgenmaro

iTrader: (9)

The reason I ask is that I bought a shaft (supposed to fit early-mid 90s Grand Cherokee) and the Column side looks a ton smaller then the camaro. The rectangular opening just doesnt look big enough.

does anyone have a column out of their car that they could measure the rectangular connection for me? I cant get to mine right now.

bigals87z28

Where is the dampener? And swapping out for the 4th gen side, is it a matter of removing the whole ujoint from the end?

84 1LE

iTrader: (9)

The damper is the big section just behind the lower u-joint.
The 4th gen piece requires pushing/pressing out the bearing cups.Not the whole u-joint.

bigals87z28

Ahhh, gotcha. Intresting. I was at work today and was looking at a steering shaft for I believe an Astro, and wondered if this could replace the factory unit in my 87. Sure enough...

91 1LE

iTrader: (1)

Picked up a steering shaft from a 2000 Astro this weekend. The thing looks brand new. The newer (the ones with the wide rectangle headlights) have the shafts without the dampner and seemed to be better protected from the elements. For some reason, though, all the newer ones didn't have the bearing you guys are talking about. The only place the shaft was supported was way under the dash. The older vans that had the mechanical column shifters and 4X6 headlights had the bearing with the big C-clip underhood. On the few I took apart the plastic housing that the bearing goes in was brittle and cracked and the bearings were very rough. I would have pulled a few Cherokee ones (there were about 15 there) but the bolts were too recessed for my adjustable wrench.

I think that the Astro shaft looks better but some may prefer the Jeep ones. The upper u-joint on the Jeep ones is cylinderical but the lower one has a stamped look. And the Grand Chreokee shaft will work too but it again looks different.

3rdgenmaro

iTrader: (9)

I just finished installing a jeep Cherokee shaft. NOT Grand Cherokee. XJ Cherokee. Grand Cherokee shafts do not fit. They have a much smaller column shaft.

Mine was from an 89. Direct bolt in.

Hardest part of the install was with getting the old shaftn to collapse. The jeep shaft uses two plastic bushings inside. Once I got it to slide, it wasnt hard at all to get in. The upper joint does not attach like the stock column. It has a pinch bolt, not a through bolt. The column will require just a touch from a file or dremel to give enough clearence for the bolt to slip through easily.

I'll post some pics later. I need to pull it back out and clean it up. I'll do that when I adjust the box.

JamesC

iTrader: (5)

Back to life. Very interested in pics, 3rdgenmaro.

JamesC

3rdgenmaro

iTrader: (9)

Forgot all about that. I'll try to remember to get some pics. It will be a couple of weeks. I had to leave the car up at my parent's house this weekend with mechanical issues.

It is a direct bolt in. (well a slight touch with a dremel for the clamp bolt) You dont even need to cut the shaft. You can increase the crush space by cutting it if you wish. IRC I have about 4" of crush space.

If I dont get pics in a couple of weeks pm me. It will be atleast the first of october before I can get pics.

RBob

iTrader: (1)

Be careful of which Jeep shaft you get. As 3rdgenmaro mentioned there are different ones, some of which won't fit.

There is also a difference in the durometer of the rubber isolator. The newer ones being higher. I have a Jeep shaft here that the isolator is really soft. Easy to twist it by hand so ended up not using it.

RBob.

JamesC

iTrader: (5)

It appears that the Cherokee XJ models will fit. The inside working diameter of the coupler that attaches to the column is approximately 7/8". Some Grande Cherokees apparently have that diameter and some don't--their diameter is smaller.

JamesC

JamesC

iTrader: (5)

Some comparison pics of the Jeep and Astro shafts. This latter has had the upper coupler clocked 90*.

Pic #1, upper coupler; Pic #2, lower coupler; Pic #3, set-screw.

JamesC

JamesC

iTrader: (5)

The fit is perfect. I feel/hear no more noise with the Astro shaft than I did with the Jeep and its damper.

JamesC

6speedIROC

iTrader: (3)

Can someone clarify what year Astro's have the bearings located in the lower column shaft?
I went to pull some at the wrecker off the 97 I got the shaft from and it didn't have roller bearings in there. Whatever bearings it had were part of a steering position sensor.

Also, anyone have info on how much and what part numbers to buy the lower column bearings/retainers new?

JamesC

iTrader: (5)

Info below that may be helpful:

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/susp...g-bearing.html

The link below shows a Safari shaft that is apparently a bolt-in:

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/susp...y-u-joint.html

JamesC

dads old blue 9

the year astro you need is 1996 whitch has damper or 1997 and up w/o damper .as for you people who say theres no bearing on some of the astros WRONG there all just hidden by plastic cups . after you get the boot covered shaft off look inthe firewall grab the plastic cup with linesmans pliers and pull/wiggle , give it some help from inside the van under the dash once the cups out look for the bearing in the cup . its there I promise use a piece of a wood dowel and a small hammer to tap it free from the retaning tabs (4)