So poly bushings "bind"... I currently have aftermarket LCA's and the poly busing in them was very hard. Not a problem for up and down, but I could see how twisting would be very harsh...

I know they make metal / rod ends / heim-joints, but I'm not racing... just want better than stock for street... Plus ride is the most harsh it can be, but free to twist! And they wear out faster, will not last the life of the car..

Founders...
They have a 3 piece poly joint, a hard round ball in the middle, which keeps it good for traction / launches... and soft outer poly which allow twisting, or no binding... The tested and posted results I think 5 degree turn was 26 foot lbs. vs poly, 124 foot lbs.... theory seems good...

Anyone have these? Another nice thing, they won't break the bank at about $85 (includes lower control arms too!

Should the panhard bar have these too?

Thoughts and opinions...

 

Poly joints, Johnny joints, roto joints, whatever thr company wants to call them are nice, and would probably be good for you

They will transfer more noise, harshness then poly bushings though.

Aldo, the big issue with rod ends and their couisins are keeping the lock nuts tight, and the joint clean. Which for a driver means more maintanince.

The world is full of compromises.

 

I was thinking this would be an upgrade, and would help with the twist / binding effect, which I thought was causing some of the harshness.

 

It would, butva lot of the harshness is because there is not a soft bushing to absorb it.

The joint will still transfer that harshness to the vehicle.

The binding issue should go away with those joints though.

 

The source of your harshness is likely not the LCA's regardless of the design. I would look seriously at your shocks and struts.

My car is very docile on the road with delrin lined joints. Delrin is quite a bit stiffer than poly but will move much easier. I am quite sensitive to harness, as I define it.

Good shocks + delrin joints is more comfortable than all stock suspension components.

 

Uh, maybe I was being too harsh by using the word "harsh"...

New Moog stock height springs all around
Bilstein Struts and Shocks
Global West Delrin A arm bushings
Spohn Subframe connectors
Alston's welded in yesterday...
Jamex STB
Wonderbar
Poly sway bar end links and bushings...
15" wheels...
Poly engine mounts, tranny & torque arm mount (T5)

Still running the stock torque arm, going to put in Spohn soon...

As for the LCA's and Panhard bar, aftermarket tubular, no grease fittings to lube (but I don't hear them squeak)... so i thought I would get the newer Founder's LCA's with 3 piece Poly Joint and improve the ride a bit...

As for the 3 piece for the panhard bar, Founder's said, "Panhard rods don't need to articulate like the lower control arms do. Panhard rods are in tension and compression only."

The car is night and day difference between stock and now... just wanted to help with the twist of the rear end... Car rides really nice...

Rafael

 

I just recently removed my LCA that had the sphericle rod ends and installed Founders new poly/swivel control arms. I did this because the sphericle ones made alot more noise than I liked. At first I didnt mind after switching from the regular poly but after awhile they get to be anoying. So far im very happy with the new style and recomend them for any hard driven street car

 

I ordered the 3 piece set, I will pass on my aftermarket set to my neighbor. He has an 89 IROC Vert that can use them.

 

I just installed the same deal the other night, poly bushings on one end and the roto-joint on the other. Great parts, and the only issues with the install were with the car and not with the parts. As for panhard bars go, my last car got a non-adjustable poly-poly bar, this one now has the poly-Rod End bar. The car drives great now and Founders makes great parts.

 

Those are the next step up from the three piece Polly ones. Mine arrived, doing a lot of work in January, rear end, torque arm, new clutch, etc...

 

The roto joint LCA and PHB are delrin lined spherical ball joints. No poly. This is good as the delrin is self lubricating. No squeeks to worry about. No greasing to worry about.

Poly isn't really any softer than a roto-joint setup. So I don't recommend poly as a way of having good performance with good ride harshness. I'd recommend the roto-joint setup to anybody wanting an upgrade.

luvofjah, how much difference did adding the Alstons to the Spohn SFC setup add?

 

Is Delrin a type of poly? It states it's poly on the roto joint on Founders website...

The 3 piece one, the "ball" in the middle is made of the same "poly" the roto joint is, but has softer poly cups on the outsides...

I guess i would liken it to having solid motor mounts or not... The 3 piece poly with softer cups would absorb harshness more vs the roto joint with no soft poly... as Founders stated in an email to me...

Again, I'm going for a street car, not drag...

I've had the Spohns for years, and while they made a big difference, the Alston's also helped... I have a big curb / incline at the beginning of my driveway, it's even quieter now with the Alston's added... plus, I have T Tops...

 

Founders makes a version of a ball joint that uses polyurethane instead of delrin. It's a different material but the basic design is the same. You have a ball within a cup that allows it to rotate. All are solutions to the whole "I dont want rod ends" problem. I just put rod ends on mine. I can replace the rod ends wtih rotojoints later (UMI sells a roto joint on a male threaded bar) and I even found a rubber bushing here...

http://www.howeracing.com/p-7603-rub...ing-joint.aspx

So I figure if I get tired of the rod ends later on I can change it. I heard the founders poly-ball joint design was really noisy. I can see that, but I think it's a good solution, especially for the money. Delrin in the rotojoints will wear, and you may at some point need to tighten up the cups to get them snug on the spherical bearing in the center. But that's not really a big deal in the big picture.

This is delrin:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polyoxymethylene

 

Alright, disregard what I said above. When I initially read this thread, I thought it was talking about the (UMI) roto-joint. And not the (Founders) poly-joint.

In terms of the Founders 3 piece poly-joint, I don't see any way of greasing the round poly ball in the center of the setup. And non-adjustable while OK, it's just nice to have the adjust ability of the adjustable LCA.

My suggestion is still going to be the Spohn full Del-shere LCA or the UMI full roto-joint setup (both products being essentially the same thing. A non-poly, spherical ball wrapped up with delrin)

 

It comes with grease, for the initial setup. But you're right, you can't keep putting grease in with a fitting. I just wanted an update from my aftermarket with a solid poly, and the binding. Again, not a full race car. And I'm running stock height Springs.